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On October 07 2012 07:09 Autofire2 wrote:Hey guys. So I'm trying to use filters Macro style series to get better and to a great extent, I have. My macro, compared even to high points before I stopped playing SC2 a long time ago, is incredibly better. But MutaBling continues to be the bane of my existence. Particularly the Bling part. The replay below is actually me beating one of the zergs (top bronze now, used to be gold in earlier season like myself so probably, like me, working his way back up) but, my slipping macro notwithstanding (should have had about 10 more supply at 10:00) it felt...urghhh. I feel like I had to outplay the guy twice over to BARELY eke out a win, and even that would have been really tough had I not scouted his baneling bust coming. Is bio without MarineKing micro just completely bad against zerg? I've been told to go marine tank but I really want to stick with this build and filter seemed to make it work all the way through platinum. Anyway any comments on the rep would be incredibly appreciated. Is macro still my main problem, or the build, or micro or what? I'd much rather finish working on my macro before doing other stuff. Here's the rep: http://drop.sc/262045
IO responded to you already.
Muta ling bling you need tanks, and probably a few thors if his muta flock gets up high enough to zone out the mutas off your tanks. Muta ling bling hard counters bio, and marine hellion marauder styles. You need tanks for splash on the lings, but more importantly the banes.
And no, just having a shit ton of marines against ling bling muta means you have a shit ton of blood on the ground if you don't split, and target fire
Just not microing wont work against banelings. Mass marine vs mass bane is gg
The game is multi facted. Just macroing will work if you get tanks and spread your units out. Can't go pure bio against zerg and expect to win... it doesn't work like that. Bio is very micro intensive style.
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I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins...
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On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins...
...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio.
Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult?
You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech.
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On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech.
Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have.
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On October 07 2012 08:03 kollin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech. Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have.
Positioning is much easier for someone complaining about inability to target fire banes with tanks, or split marines.
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On October 07 2012 08:11 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 08:03 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech. Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have. Positioning is much easier for someone complaining about inability to target fire banes with tanks, or split marines.
Well maybe, but marine splitting can be done beforehand no targeting is used in mech as well so I'd personally say mech is harder for a low level player than marine tank.
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On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins...
Practice your micro. Hotkey your units so that you have separate control groups for your marine-medivacs and your tanks. That way you can focus fire your tanks on all the banes. Micro is just as important as macro in TvZ against ling-bling-muta.
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On October 07 2012 08:14 kollin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 08:11 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:03 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech. Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have. Positioning is much easier for someone complaining about inability to target fire banes with tanks, or split marines. Well maybe, but marine splitting can be done beforehand no targeting is used in mech as well so I'd personally say mech is harder for a low level player than marine tank.
How? He's bronze, playing bronze. Bronze zergs don't know how to flank, hit from multiple angles, how to tech switch effectively, how to macro properly, how to deny hellion run bys, how to abuse mech immobility...
In bronze, you can 1a 25 tanks, and just siege them and destroy mass ling armies as they run into you.
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On October 07 2012 08:44 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 08:14 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:11 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:03 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech. Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have. Positioning is much easier for someone complaining about inability to target fire banes with tanks, or split marines. Well maybe, but marine splitting can be done beforehand no targeting is used in mech as well so I'd personally say mech is harder for a low level player than marine tank. How? He's bronze, playing bronze. Bronze zergs don't know how to flank, hit from multiple angles, how to tech switch effectively, how to macro properly, how to deny hellion run bys, how to abuse mech immobility... In bronze, you can 1a 25 tanks, and just siege them and destroy mass ling armies as they run into you.
I guess, but if he can't even get out of bronze with the filter method then it's really not army composition holding him back.
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On October 07 2012 08:44 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 08:14 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:11 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:03 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech. Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have. Positioning is much easier for someone complaining about inability to target fire banes with tanks, or split marines. Well maybe, but marine splitting can be done beforehand no targeting is used in mech as well so I'd personally say mech is harder for a low level player than marine tank. How? He's bronze, playing bronze. Bronze zergs don't know how to flank, hit from multiple angles, how to tech switch effectively, how to macro properly, how to deny hellion run bys, how to abuse mech immobility... In bronze, you can 1a 25 tanks, and just siege them and destroy mass ling armies as they run into you.
Well I did restart in bronze because I wanted to practice macro but ive beat gold leaguers and gone toe to toe close games with platinum MMR tankers (you can see what their real leagues were in previous seasons and how often they lose games within 5 seconds of starting them). I did well in terms of Macro-pretty much kept up- but my micro concepts are silver at best.
Still, you hear so often on TL and these guides that if you get your macro up to par, you'll autolevel to diamond. Guess its not true, though I would still like to sharpen my macro since everything else is kinda pointless without it.
And I'm not looking for an easy fix...I wouldn't be trying to get back into this game and focus on macro if I was. I'm just looking for an effective use of that macro without having to take my focus away from it, because i've far from mastered it "in the bones" even though I do have 90+ supply and 50 scvs and a third on the way by 10:10 often (those are roundabout filters' benchmarks.)
Besides, I didn't mean "does marine tank have no micro" i meant I heard it was MORE micro intensive than bio. Guess I was wrong?
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Any high master terran (1000+) knows a good way to handle HT into third? When I go ghost, they spread out so well that I always eat a storm. I can't drop vs ht's (feedback). most of the time I snipe a few HT's, but then I start catching storms.
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On October 07 2012 08:52 Autofire2 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 08:44 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:14 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:11 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:03 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech. Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have. Positioning is much easier for someone complaining about inability to target fire banes with tanks, or split marines. Well maybe, but marine splitting can be done beforehand no targeting is used in mech as well so I'd personally say mech is harder for a low level player than marine tank. How? He's bronze, playing bronze. Bronze zergs don't know how to flank, hit from multiple angles, how to tech switch effectively, how to macro properly, how to deny hellion run bys, how to abuse mech immobility... In bronze, you can 1a 25 tanks, and just siege them and destroy mass ling armies as they run into you. Well I did restart in bronze because I wanted to practice macro but ive beat gold leaguers and gone toe to toe close games with platinum MMR tankers (you can see what their real leagues were in previous seasons and how often they lose games within 5 seconds of starting them). I did well in terms of Macro-pretty much kept up- but my micro concepts are silver at best. Still, you hear so often on TL and these guides that if you get your macro up to par, you'll autolevel to diamond. Guess its not true, though I would still like to sharpen my macro since everything else is kinda pointless without it. And I'm not looking for an easy fix...I wouldn't be trying to get back into this game and focus on macro if I was. I'm just looking for an effective use of that macro without having to take my focus away from it, because i've far from mastered it "in the bones" even though I do have 90+ supply and 50 scvs and a third on the way by 10:10 often (those are roundabout filters' benchmarks.) Besides, I didn't mean "does marine tank have no micro" i meant I heard it was MORE micro intensive than bio. Guess I was wrong?
The thing about the filter benchmarks is that they are actually the bare minimum of what you should be getting. Really if you are not getting over them, no need to worry about micro. And yes bio is more micro intensive than marine tank, because infestors are ridiculously cost efficient against standard MMM.
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On October 07 2012 08:59 kollin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 08:52 Autofire2 wrote:On October 07 2012 08:44 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:14 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:11 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:03 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech. Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have. Positioning is much easier for someone complaining about inability to target fire banes with tanks, or split marines. Well maybe, but marine splitting can be done beforehand no targeting is used in mech as well so I'd personally say mech is harder for a low level player than marine tank. How? He's bronze, playing bronze. Bronze zergs don't know how to flank, hit from multiple angles, how to tech switch effectively, how to macro properly, how to deny hellion run bys, how to abuse mech immobility... In bronze, you can 1a 25 tanks, and just siege them and destroy mass ling armies as they run into you. Well I did restart in bronze because I wanted to practice macro but ive beat gold leaguers and gone toe to toe close games with platinum MMR tankers (you can see what their real leagues were in previous seasons and how often they lose games within 5 seconds of starting them). I did well in terms of Macro-pretty much kept up- but my micro concepts are silver at best. Still, you hear so often on TL and these guides that if you get your macro up to par, you'll autolevel to diamond. Guess its not true, though I would still like to sharpen my macro since everything else is kinda pointless without it. And I'm not looking for an easy fix...I wouldn't be trying to get back into this game and focus on macro if I was. I'm just looking for an effective use of that macro without having to take my focus away from it, because i've far from mastered it "in the bones" even though I do have 90+ supply and 50 scvs and a third on the way by 10:10 often (those are roundabout filters' benchmarks.) Besides, I didn't mean "does marine tank have no micro" i meant I heard it was MORE micro intensive than bio. Guess I was wrong? The thing about the filter benchmarks is that they are actually the bare minimum of what you should be getting. Really if you are not getting over them, no need to worry about micro. And yes bio is more micro intensive than marine tank, because infestors are ridiculously cost efficient against standard MMM.
I haven't played much lately, and I'm almost positive I wouldn't reach many of these benchmarks... but I spent many a season at high masters beating a lowly GM here and there. So while these benchmarks are a great thing if you're trying to get very good, they're not all important and win or lose marks. Infact I can probably look at my last couple of games recently and I won't have a third by 10 min, or be above 55 scvs... but I'm be in such an amazing lead due to aggressive openings and unit control.
Solid statement, just tacking on what you said, my friend.
Edit --- errr bio does very well against ling/infestor. It flops vs ling bling muta. You can stim box marauders ahead and snipe infestors, or giant huge concaves with big arcs of splits do deal with infestor ling, or infestor ling bling. It's the mutas eating up your medics, and stopping drop play that hurts the bio.
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bare minimum? I don't see too many people get far beyond the 50 scv and 100 supply mark by 10 mins at all...especially with stim finished and combat shield and +1 on the way. Is there a better guide of that sort than filters' out there?
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On October 07 2012 09:08 Autofire2 wrote:
bare minimum? I don't see too many people get far beyond the 50 scv and 100 supply mark by 10 mins at all...especially with stim finished and combat shield and +1 on the way. Is there a better guide of that sort than filters' out there?
The thing is, that's all good and well...but you have no splash damage and just marines, with what.. 2 medics? That's good in the hands of a player that goes out on the map and pressures and does multiprong attacks with medics and clears creep and doesn't lose the entire army.
But having all that, and not being able to use it is another thing. It's like having a sweet Lamborghini...but not knowing how to drive a manual. Ya, you got a great car, but it's worthless in your hands.
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On October 07 2012 09:06 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2012 08:59 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:52 Autofire2 wrote:On October 07 2012 08:44 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:14 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:11 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 08:03 kollin wrote:On October 07 2012 08:01 iAmJeffReY wrote:On October 07 2012 07:47 Autofire2 wrote:
I always heard marine tank was more micro intensive? It seems that way to me, especially if even with marine tank I need to tank shot individual banes?
Still, if this build is an autolose, its an autolose. I almost lost to a guy who was playing off 2 base and barely came within 50 supply of me at some points.
Is there another build that keeps my general structure (1 rax FE bunker, good supply count by 10 mins) that I can execute here? How about if i go 2 rax, no reactor, so that I can afford factory a little earlier and THEN build reactor?
Or can I just my normal 3 rax with 2 tech labs and get factory at which point I swap a tech lab onto it and get a naked starport for 1 medivac at a time? Somehow that seems like it would leave me with not very much supply by 10 mins... ...bio requires full on splitting, multiple times as banes come in. Not to mention ling bling muta is said the be the build counter of full bio. Marine tank you have to micro, yes, but is hitting 2 and a shift hold AA A A AAAAon banes, then stim and run marines back REALLY that difficult? You're looking for an easy fix. There isn't an easy fix. You want no micro? Play mech. Even then mech isn't no micro. You better be pretty fucking positionally aware as well as confident of your defensive abilities in th early and mid game to play mech, something which a low level player may not have. Positioning is much easier for someone complaining about inability to target fire banes with tanks, or split marines. Well maybe, but marine splitting can be done beforehand no targeting is used in mech as well so I'd personally say mech is harder for a low level player than marine tank. How? He's bronze, playing bronze. Bronze zergs don't know how to flank, hit from multiple angles, how to tech switch effectively, how to macro properly, how to deny hellion run bys, how to abuse mech immobility... In bronze, you can 1a 25 tanks, and just siege them and destroy mass ling armies as they run into you. Well I did restart in bronze because I wanted to practice macro but ive beat gold leaguers and gone toe to toe close games with platinum MMR tankers (you can see what their real leagues were in previous seasons and how often they lose games within 5 seconds of starting them). I did well in terms of Macro-pretty much kept up- but my micro concepts are silver at best. Still, you hear so often on TL and these guides that if you get your macro up to par, you'll autolevel to diamond. Guess its not true, though I would still like to sharpen my macro since everything else is kinda pointless without it. And I'm not looking for an easy fix...I wouldn't be trying to get back into this game and focus on macro if I was. I'm just looking for an effective use of that macro without having to take my focus away from it, because i've far from mastered it "in the bones" even though I do have 90+ supply and 50 scvs and a third on the way by 10:10 often (those are roundabout filters' benchmarks.) Besides, I didn't mean "does marine tank have no micro" i meant I heard it was MORE micro intensive than bio. Guess I was wrong? The thing about the filter benchmarks is that they are actually the bare minimum of what you should be getting. Really if you are not getting over them, no need to worry about micro. And yes bio is more micro intensive than marine tank, because infestors are ridiculously cost efficient against standard MMM. I haven't played much lately, and I'm almost positive I wouldn't reach many of these benchmarks... but I spent many a season at high masters beating a lowly GM here and there. So while these benchmarks are a great thing if you're trying to get very good, they're not all important and win or lose marks. Infact I can probably look at my last couple of games recently and I won't have a third by 10 min, or be above 55 scvs... but I'm be in such an amazing lead due to aggressive openings and unit control. Solid statement, just tacking on what you said, my friend. Edit --- errr bio does very well against ling/infestor. It flops vs ling bling muta. You can stim box marauders ahead and snipe infestors, or giant huge concaves with big arcs of splits do deal with infestor ling, or infestor ling bling. It's the mutas eating up your medics, and stopping drop play that hurts the bio.
Oh no, it's specifically with filters build that you hit those benchmarks. If you do anything else, then you may go above them, may go below them, it does of course depend on what you do. And when I said infestors being cost efficient against MMM, I meant when combined pretty heavily with ling bane, maybe even some roaches mixed in, like Hyun does.
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On October 07 2012 09:08 Autofire2 wrote:
bare minimum? I don't see too many people get far beyond the 50 scv and 100 supply mark by 10 mins at all...especially with stim finished and combat shield and +1 on the way. Is there a better guide of that sort than filters' out there?
lol I'm pretty sure most people could hit those benchmarks if all they did was sit in their base and made marines.
Like iAmJeffrey said, its nice to have 50 marines and whatever, but do you know how to use it?
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I see. It was pretty tough to hit those benchmarks for me, anyway, but I think the point was more to teach good macro habits in an easy build. Any good guides out there for marine tank?
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When going hellion banshee 3CC into bio-tank is it better to suicide your hellions for drones or keep them as long as possible to deny creep?
Is getting cloak worth it if you are going bio-tank?
Any general advice on how to control the Zerg's creep spread?
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On October 07 2012 09:31 xPabt wrote:
When going hellion banshee 3CC into bio-tank is it better to suicide your hellions for drones or keep them as long as possible to deny creep?
Is getting cloak worth it if you are going bio-tank?
Any general advice on how to control the Zerg's creep spread?
You generally want to keep the hellions alive as long as possible for map control as well as creep denial of you are going bio tank, because they are the only unit you will have for a while that can reliably do that. Whether or not you get cloak is up to you really, though I think for the double ebay build you don't get it (you might need to check that yourself). To deny the Zergs creep spread, generally you want to use those 6 hellions for as long as possible, then when they get killed off try sending small packs of around 8 marines and a medivac to clear out creep every so often.
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EPT
