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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/fmyA5.jpg)
Hello TL,
Ever since I started playing Terran, I've repeatedly run into one build that constantly shuts me down. I typically open with a 2 Rax Expand, but 3 Gate Proxy Stargate just destroys me. There isn't any way for me to scout it, and once it's arrived at my doorstep I don't know what I can't do to prevent myself from losing.
Is there way I can recognize this is happening? If not, is there a proper response so that i don't immediately die? I realize that I didn't micro very well since I went into a panicked state, but I'm not sure if focus firing the Void Rays with my Marines would have been enough?
Also, please excuse the awful BM at the end of the game. This build has occurred to me multiple times recently and I kind of lost it there. =/
Thanks in advance for any advice 
http://www.sc-replay.com/replay/12-05-11/38053-Kelmqtlol-VS-SunYiQun.html?justUp=1
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I agree, scouting it is actually one of the hardest things to do since all build orders for protoss typically look the same. Your best bet is to look for the expo timing (keep a scv at his natural or close to it and look out for when his expansion is coming). If you don't see an expansion by the 5-6 minute mark then you know some protoss shenanigans is going on. DT's, 4 gate, or 3gate stargate. Also if you choose to scout his base see if he throws down his 3rd pylon. If you don't scout his 3rd pylon then you know hes going to proxy something
Hope this helps you
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scout
At the front for instance, if you see he has 3 gates, but is only making one or two units at a time, you can assume he is about to or has just spent money on something else. Whether it be an expo, or a stargate, or a robo facility.
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scan it up. 2 gas and only 3 gates means he's up to something, especially if he's low on sentry count or looks like he has a low army value.
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Wouldn't a 3rax stim push simply roll over it completely?
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I spit my water out when i saw the pic in the op
With your scv scout, check when the 2nd gas goes up. 3wg star has a very early 2nd gas going up before the usual 20 so keep an eye out for that. Thats your biggest clue that some kind of tech attack is coming whether its star or DT so get your ebay going right away. Make sure that the rax with your tech lab researching stim is not in a place that can get sniped easily. Throw down bunkers and focus the voidray with your bunker. Make sure to a-click the void ray ( DO NOT RIGHT CLICK THE VOID RAY THE BUNKER WILL NOT ATTACK IT)
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As people have said, more scouting is needed. You can at least see that your opponent is one-basing, and improve your defenses accordingly. You also need to avoid just spaming marauders when you have no idea what your opponent is doing. They may be uber units, but they still can't shoot up.
Targetting the void rays is important, but as mentioned you simply hadn't bothered to build enough marines.
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i do this strat because i hate your little trollface marauders.
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On May 13 2011 16:36 closey wrote:
Wouldn't a 3rax stim push simply roll over it completely?
Yes but this fails against most other protoss builds (I am a Master League Terran)
Any decent toss that sees you do this will hold it, then you are behind either on tech or bases depending (normally tech though)
No use saying "Well won't this build beat it" The OP said he likes to open with a 2rax FE which is a pretty good eco pressure build and one I favour myself.
Dear OP
I personally deal with this by if I see really fast double gas... Keep an eye on sentry count and his expo timing. Then I get an ebay so I can get turrets (This stops DT and Stargate tom foolery) Then I would build my expo In my base! and turtle up with bunkers etc... That way when his push fails. You are ahead.
I am writing this at work so I will admit I did not watch the reply these are just general comments. I hope this helps you out.
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I watched your replay and this is the things i think you should improve.
When your scouting scv reaches his base your first job is to look at gas 2nd job is does he have a second pylon 3rd what is his nexus doing is he cronoboosting something and 4th what comes from the gate.You saw a stalker most of the time that means 4gate or some sort of pressure so you should be prepere for it.One more thing your decision making was poor always build your CC in the base make it a OC make 2rounds of scvs and 1 mule and then land it on expo 2nd thing why did your rush for stim insted of combat shiled when you are not planing on attackin soon.Combat shield helps rly good vs voidrays and you can beat this small pushes with Combat shield and shells pretty ez.Another thing is that you didn't stim your guys in the bunker and last but not least 2rax expand is a pressure build you attack the toss and expand on it you didn't do that you had no idea what was he doing so if you feel afraid attacking just don't do that build i suggest doing the oGsTOP build with 1rax CC into more raxes with lots of marines.Here is a Replay of TOP doing it vs MC
If you want to stick with your 2 rax expand then watch some qxc replays he does pretty nice stuff and well executes this opening another variation to be extra safe is the SeleCT style just build a reaper after your rauder and scout around.
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The last time I did this build the Terran blind thor rushed me T_T_T_T_T_T.
I couldn't do anything with my pro void ray 
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On May 13 2011 18:46 Jakkerr wrote:The last time I did this build the Terran blind thor rushed me T_T_T_T_T_T. I couldn't do anything with my pro void ray
I a not 110% sure here.... But would a charged voidray not beat a thor 1v1? What with the extra damage against Massive....
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On May 13 2011 18:46 Jakkerr wrote:The last time I did this build the Terran blind thor rushed me T_T_T_T_T_T. I couldn't do anything with my pro void ray
pretty sure 3WG+ VR counters thor rush
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On May 13 2011 18:48 Slyce wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2011 18:46 Jakkerr wrote:The last time I did this build the Terran blind thor rushed me T_T_T_T_T_T. I couldn't do anything with my pro void ray I a not 110% sure here.... But would a charged voidray not beat a thor 1v1? What with the extra damage against Massive....
The problem is that Thor rush builds pump out a fair few marines as support. Still, if you are going to run into an unscouted Thor rush, 3gate star with voidrays gives you a better chance than most other builds.
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1 rax FE with lots of marines and a few missile turrets holds pretty well.
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On May 13 2011 19:17 CecilSunkure wrote:
1 rax FE with lots of marines and a few missile turrets holds pretty well.
The OP said he opens 2rax FE...
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With your 2 rax expo, if you keep pumping units, you should have enough to hold this push. When I face this push on ladder, I find that I have more than enough units. Stim is usually done before the push for me and I just focus the voids with my marines. I'm not home right now so I can't check the replay yet, but I personally don't think you need to "scout" to counter this strat if I see two gas and not many sentries I'll get a preemptive ebay which I use for upgrades soon afterwards anyways. I'll add more once I'm able to see the replay!
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Actually as a Thor rusher, I'm fine against a void rusher. The 2 rushes tend to cancel each other out i feel. I Usu stop at 2-3 thors if i get void harassed and then switch to mass marines and get starport tech asap.
The main thing about the thors supporting marines is that void harass can't kite the thors+ marine army on defence like they can kite pure marines. I can't really attack properly either as thors auto target voids instead of targeting stalkers.
Usually both just end up expanding and the game goes on.
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You need to see how fast he gets his gas and how many sentries that he makes, I know that when I do those kinds of builds against my friends I am always making much less sentries due to the fact that I had to build a star gate and VRs. Another thing would be don't wall off if you are, really easily harassed by these types of builds.
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I don't have any trouble against this build at all. I play a 1 rax reaper fast expand and build mostly marines at the beginning. So with 1 or 2 bunkers you can shut him down pretty easily. A 2 rax expand tends to be more marauder heavy at the start which might be the reason for your problems against this build. A lot of terrans like to get marauders fairly early which isn't really a solid way to open in my opinion.
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EPT
