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Youre so right I just think you cant kill the Deathball when the Toss has got blink Stalkers 6 Colosses and sentrys. Your baneling drops will not work, ive the Protoss has a little bit of micro.
So what im doing a lot right now is the roach drop inside his base. Its about he 11 oder 12 Minute mark i think. Just open up with fast expo. When you opponent is going for some 1 Base play. Just scout and look what he is doing. But ive your opponen opens up with forge first then epo and right techs to Colossis just kill him with a drop. Its so effective. Since moon has schown the potential of zerg Drops. And remember you cant just drop you can creep your opponents base. It is awesome.
Btw. Mr Bitter: <3 your stream 
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On March 22 2011 03:17 babysimba wrote:
Zerg drops are slight different from Terran's. Zerg drops need to come in a huge wave to deal any damage. 1-2 OL drops doesn't work at all, it does not have the dps of 8 stimmed marines.
Two Zerglings has greater DPS than one stimmed marine, so in fact two overlords of Zerglings does have greater DPS than 8 stimmed marines. Not to mention you can carry banelings.
I do agree it seems odd to drop with less than 3 overlords, unless you're directly bombing the mineral lines. It's not as if 24 Zerglings (600 minerals, 12 supply) is a huge investment, and it's enough that a warp-defense is probably insufficient.
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This seems more like QQ than strategy tbh. Everyone knows that you can't let Protoss build a death army, the same way you can't let Zerg build a big economy.
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On March 22 2011 20:24 ExoD wrote:
This seems more like QQ than strategy tbh. Everyone knows that you can't let Protoss build a death army, the same way you can't let Zerg build a big economy.
You seem to have some problems reading and understanding text.
Nowhere in the article MrBitter complained about the protoss death-ball, he just analyzed it and came to the conclusion that you cannot engage this army directly in a fight.
He then proceeded to explain a way with which you can stop the protoss death-ball from reaching its critical size, through said multi-pronged attacks. This sounds very much like a strategy to me.
If you think that everyone knows this, it doesn't change the structure and content of the post. It's still no qq and explains a strategy against the protoss death-ball.
Please get out of this forum 
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On March 22 2011 03:06 Oboeman wrote:
I agree with this post.
I've been trying to get drops in every match-up once the game stabilizes (ie not going to die to a simple timing attack). In my mind, it's like burrow. Get it every game unless you will immediately die by spending that gas.
For me, it works wonders, partly because of what you say about protoss army working less efficiently when split.
But the number one reason it works for me is that most people I play with on the ladder (high diamond) completely choke when they're multi-dropped by a zerg player. It's almost as if it is just not in the playbook they learned from. Sometimes it's comical just how badly people fall apart if you are in an even game then you drop them in 2 spots while carefully pressuring their front. Presumably better players will respond better, but hey you can probably execute it better as well.
My rule of thumb is to drop enough to easily deal with static defense in addition to one round of warp-ins at the target location. This forces them to move their army, and that's when they screw it up. I had a game where I dropped a guy once, and he overreacted, so I sniped his third. I dropped him again, and he underreacted, so my drop took out his double robos and other miscellaneous damage.
By giving your opponent opportunities to screw up, you are giving yourself, as the more skilled player, more opportunities to capitalize on his mistake and kill him. Macroing to max is like crossing your fingers and hoping his macro is sufficiently worse than yours. If it works for you, great, but it stopped working for me.
It synergizes very well with infestors. In ZvZ if it goes to roach infestor, I drop their main (drops means 2 fewer infestors, so that's the disadvantage I have to catch up from) and most diamonds 1a back to defend, then I can trap them on the ramp with infestors while I kill expansions. Again, just another example of how poorly people react to drops.
In ZvT I play muta/ling/bane but with more upgrade focus (fewer mutas I guess), and let me tell you that crackling drops just cut your average diamond terran to pieces. It does not matter how many tanks he has sieged at his PF or how many turrets he has in his main.
In terms of tech investment... you should get speed anyway, and drops will pay for itself on its first use if you compare it to what you would lose attacking a fortified position dealing equivalent damage. It also opens up many possibilities. They may not be worth the investment by themselves, but if you have drops anyway, you've got a whole new toolkit at your disposal, and if you've got apm to spare, why not?
- baneling bombs
- drop on tanks
- doom drops
- that offensive creep spread queen drop strategy that we all thought of while in bronze league but never executed because we never got drops
- air lift micro. Hopping over forcefields, saving hurt units, elevatoring high ground.
- fake drops + mind games. Once you've revealed drop tech, they have to respond anytime they see an overlord flying through their airspace. Keep them busy. Keep them paranoid. If they suck at stopping your fake drops, then they will suck at stopping your real drops too.
- islands/difficult expos or risky drone transfers
- hiding units. Maybe you don't want to reveal your ultralisk count when he scans.
Personally I hardly ever use any of those. I get drops for multi-prong harass, and I use it for multi-prong harass. but the other options are available if the time comes.
I suggest watching Squirtle vs Moon on shakuras from IEM to see some great zvp drops. Yes moon, had a commanding lead from his opener, but the drops just keep him in the lead. Great demo of relentless multi-pronged harass.
I think drops are the future of zerg.
It's actually easier to multi-drop than it is to respond to multi-drops.
On March 22 2011 20:24 ExoD wrote:
This seems more like QQ than strategy tbh. Everyone knows that you can't let Protoss build a death army, the same way you can't let Zerg build a big economy.
You deserve a warning. Can you please learn to read?
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Great post Mr Bitter love your stream btw.
I think encorporating a nydus worm at the back or even somewhere off to the side of your 2nd prong attack is something ive been toying with; you can do maximum damage with your drop inside his base; pick up and get out; while saving your 2nd prong attack as well if your killing his expo.
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Nothing sweeter than Mr Bitter. Great post, keep up.. well. Everything!
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Good post, maybe people will finally listen when a zerg tells them to do this kind of stuff. When I (toss) write this, regardless of the forum or chat-channel I always just get flamed since I "don't know anything about playing zerg".
As a matter of fact, even a well timed drop without all the multi-pronged-stuff can severely hurt toss. The key factor is, that your wall at the main will work heavily against you. All the units are funnelled in a perfectly streamlined position to get picked apart by the zerg concave waiting at the top.
All people have to realize is, that toss units are terribly cost-inefficient in battles without forcefields. Trading roaches for stalkers is just great for zerg. Also, even if the drops cost zerg more money, since zerg can (and should) constantly expand behind these things, keeping the deathball small is definitely worth it.
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On March 22 2011 22:52 sleepingdog wrote:
Also, even if the drops cost zerg more money, since zerg can (and should) constantly expand behind these things, keeping the deathball small is definitely worth it.
There's certainly something in mult-pronged attacks, but SC2 economies never go beyond 3-bases. Once zerg and protoss both have 3 bases, the economic advantage for zerg is over. The only good part about innefficiently trading roaches for stalkers is that zerg production is usually higher than protoss. Trades have to be cost-efficient unless bases can be denied.
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would like to see Z use more of this type of play against my P. like many have mentioned, i do hope P can respond with something other than a base race.
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Countering FF is one of the hardest things for Zerg to do, going to your site now to check it out!
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I believe I saw a coaching session between InControl and Mr.Bitter where they go through this. It was really impressive to see the strength of these attacks. Protoss was behind the facts constantly, losing probes and structures everywhere.
Now that straight-up ball vs. ball play has more of less matured, thing finally start to get more interesting for Zerg. I like the idea of drop play and will be messing around with it more since I hate that deathball.
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I have a question: once in the Protoss main with a drop or a sneaky run, what should be my higest priority? pylons? gateway? nexus or probes?
and for the expansions? nexus and pylon or probes?
it seems i cant ever make a good decision to what attack first and what sould be my priority.
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On March 23 2011 02:23 BalZer wrote:I have a question: once in the Protoss main with a drop or a sneaky run, what should be my higest priority? pylons? gateway? nexus or probes? and for the expansions? nexus and pylon or probes? it seems i cant ever make a good decision to what attack first and what sould be my priority.
If you can cripple his eco, he can't build a deathball
If you can cripple his tech, you will delay the deathball
If you cripple his supply, he'll just throw down 10 pylons and carry on as usual a few seconds later
I'd prioritize things in that order.
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It's actually easier to multi-drop than it is to respond to multi-drops.
I agree 100%, which is why there is no reason not to be dropping.
Good post, maybe people will finally listen when a zerg tells them to do this kind of stuff. When I (toss) write this, regardless of the forum or chat-channel I always just get flamed since I "don't know anything about playing zerg".
After my success with drops, I told all my protoss friends to try it out and just get two warp prisms for the sake of having warp prisms. The value of drops is not race specific.
But most of them are very clingy about their robo time.
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In light of the recent neural parasite nerf, I've started to use this strategy. Considering the amount of QQing I see from Zerg players, I think this thread deserves another look. This is really straining my multi-tasking abilities, but ZvP is pretty fun with this strategy and it doesn't feel like such an uphill battle as the traditional ZvP used to.
Thanks Mr. Bitter!
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On September 28 2011 03:17 Xanbatou wrote:
In light of the recent neural parasite nerf, I've started to use this strategy. Considering the amount of QQing I see from Zerg players, I think this thread deserves another look. This is really straining my multi-tasking abilities, but ZvP is pretty fun with this strategy and it doesn't feel like such an uphill battle as the traditional ZvP used to.
Thanks Mr. Bitter!
The funny thing is that multi-pronged attacks are now my PvZ style: prism harass in the main while attacking the front with with army. It strains my multitasking as well; but I always remind myself that I am straining my opponents through the harass and forcing them to make decisions about army allocation.
As a P, I definitely fear this style from Zerg. It doesn't even need to be drops. Simply engaging my army at the front and running roaches or lings into the main makes me pull my hair out. That said, I often see Zerg overcommitting when they do this--sending too many lings into the main, for instance.
My advice, coming on the receiving end of these multi-pronged attacks, would be to have a concrete goal with your harass. Are you trying to snipe the nexus? Kill workers? Kill tech? Kill pylons? Pick one and focus on that.
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EPT
