EPTScary and underused Immortal micro - Page 3
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squintz
Canada217 Posts
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stalking.d00m
213 Posts
 . Yeah, that micro is amazing and it works like magic against crawlers. Before they can hit you ZOOM your immortal is bank in transport. Though this can be done with any unit with good range and dps like hydra but immortal are the best for it. But I don't think it can be normally pulled off. Remember, NexSickness was fighting this battle on his term. He had whole army of opponent contained in the main and has only to deal with only a couple of roaches from nydus. In normal game the opponent will have hydra and/or mutas so it not that big of a deal, Think about it terrans can do blue flame drop in opponent base. One medivac carries 4 BF Heli and can take out entire min. line in ten seconds but it almost never happens as opponents have stalkers/hydra positioned. So this game is more of an exception and I don't think this is going to happen in a competitive game. Well, rarely perhaps. But not more than that. | ||
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Pandu1986
72 Posts
I believe all races can do it, though if its actually useful or not I dont know. As most said, protoss seemed to have this won already at the 10:52 mark. | ||
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Deleted User 39582
317 Posts
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TheRealzz
150 Posts
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gr8ape
Canada302 Posts
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Blyadischa
419 Posts
This has been done in brood war and SC2 before, and in BW, shuttle + reaver micro was a standard protoss build. This skill ceiling is just as low as it was before. The 10 more apm it takes to do this doesn't bridge the gap between the skill level of BW and the skill level of SC2, and also the immortal is not as much of a game turning unit as the reaver was, and thus this will result in sadly, nothing. | ||
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gr8ape
Canada302 Posts
On December 26 2010 04:10 Blyadischa wrote: Don't understand why this is causing the "OMG SC2 MICRO OMG/SKILL CEILING SKILL CEILING etc." stupidity in this thread. This has been done in brood war and SC2 before, and in BW, shuttle + reaver micro was a standard protoss build. This skill ceiling is just as low as it was before. The 10 more apm it takes to do this doesn't bridge the gap between the skill level of BW and the skill level of SC2, and also the immortal is not as much of a game turning unit as the reaver was, and thus this will result in sadly, nothing. Lets just specify some things here: Brood war requires more technical skill. More apm dedicated to actually playing the game. NOT DOING MORE ELABORATED STRATEGIES. Simply making units, using buildings, and using units. What does this effect have? It means no one can be good before a certain technical mastery of the game. Theyre not "good" at the game, they dont have complex strategies, deceptive tactics or anything like that, they are simply ABLE TO PLAY THE GAME. In sc2, it is easier to play the game. WHAT THIS MEANS IS THAT THE ACTUAL PLAYER WITH BETTER STRATEGIES, MINDGAMES AND TACTICS WILL WIN because technical mastery has been removed toned down. Nonetheless, technical mastery in sc2 will be rewarding as with every game. | ||
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Xanbatou
United States805 Posts
On December 26 2010 04:16 gr8ape wrote: Lets just specify some things here: Brood war requires more technical skill. More apm dedicated to actually playing the game. NOT DOING MORE ELABORATED STRATEGIES. Simply making units, using buildings, and using units. What does this effect have? It means no one can be good before a certain technical mastery of the game. Theyre not "good" at the game, they dont have complex strategies, deceptive tactics or anything like that, they are simply ABLE TO PLAY THE GAME. In sc2, it is easier to play the game. WHAT THIS MEANS IS THAT THE ACTUAL PLAYER WITH BETTER STRATEGIES, MINDGAMES AND TACTICS WILL WIN because technical mastery has been removed toned down. Nonetheless, technical mastery in sc2 will be rewarding as with every game. I disagree. Very rarely can on the fly strategies win you the game. In brood war, eventually everyone discovered the most standard build orders that were standard for a reason. This game is not dynamic enough to reward creative and clever playing. I really wish it were the case that the most strategic players would win the most, but most tournaments so far haven't displayed that. Correct me if I'm wrong. | ||
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Faze.
Canada285 Posts
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Twaxter
Canada190 Posts
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gr8ape
Canada302 Posts
On December 26 2010 04:29 Xanbatou wrote: I disagree. Very rarely can on the fly strategies win you the game. In brood war, eventually everyone discovered the most standard build orders that were standard for a reason. This game is not dynamic enough to reward creative and clever playing. I really wish it were the case that the most strategic players would win the most, but most tournaments so far haven't displayed that. Correct me if I'm wrong. cant really correct you since im not in tune with bw metagame however what youre saying applies to sc2, maybe because its new, or maybe because its the essence of the game, but i dont know that | ||
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junemermaid
United States981 Posts
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Evoshadow
United States88 Posts
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ScythedBlade
308 Posts
Aka, blink stalker micro has 8 frames against roaches where you can take 0 damage. So if you can pre-empt which roaches are focus firing your stalkers, you can just basically save yourself like 80 hp from blink micro. The immortal micro on the other hand isn't that bad (or impossible), but doing it screws up macroing for me =X. | ||
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Blyadischa
419 Posts
On December 26 2010 04:16 gr8ape wrote: Lets just specify some things here: Brood war requires more technical skill. More apm dedicated to actually playing the game. NOT DOING MORE ELABORATED STRATEGIES. Simply making units, using buildings, and using units. What does this effect have? It means no one can be good before a certain technical mastery of the game. Theyre not "good" at the game, they dont have complex strategies, deceptive tactics or anything like that, they are simply ABLE TO PLAY THE GAME. In sc2, it is easier to play the game. WHAT THIS MEANS IS THAT THE ACTUAL PLAYER WITH BETTER STRATEGIES, MINDGAMES AND TACTICS WILL WIN because technical mastery has been removed toned down. Nonetheless, technical mastery in sc2 will be rewarding as with every game. Watch a brood war game, then watch a SC2 game. In a brood war game, there are multiple stages in one game where one player must use the timing of the matchup to assert their position over the map, then the timing of the matchup allows the other player to assert their position over the map. Then, when both players have their higher tech, they must strategically expand and attack expansions and strategically place units in the map to counter attack, catch drops, drop themselves, catch reinforcements, etc. In SC2, it's either 70 food expansions with one player constantly attacking and either breaking the front and winning or getting denied and losing, 1 base all in vs 1 base all in, or it's fast expansions into midgame 1a's from both players to see who comes out on top. Rarely is it a long game, but if it is it's essentially just more of the same thing, more 1a's. It's not a matter of less APM, the game is made easier by inject larva, mules, chronoboost, which make most economic damage negligible and one base all ins more potent then ever, the stupidity of some units (high templar TTTTTTTTTTTT I just won the game), and the terribleness of the map pool, where the expansion path is explicit, the attack path is explicit and the rush distances are all incredibly small compared to BW maps. I remember watching BW Day9 dailies, where I actually learned something each time. Now I watch Day9 dailies of SC2 and just think, wow I would be miserable if I had to play BW, then switch to SC2, and had to throw away knowledge and be limited by the terribleness of the game. | ||
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SubtleArt
2710 Posts
On December 21 2010 17:41 Zoltan wrote: That was some impressive force-fielding by NS, instant timing and perfect placement. It dosen't make me depressed, just impressed at how powerful and useful sentries still are. I feel like i haven't seen sentry micro like that since beta; good show. You can figure placement out by opening a 1v1 with a friend / practice partner and just screw around for 15 - 20 minutes, its really not that impressive. As for sentries, the idea was really good but nothing particularly impressive about the micro itself, its just point and click. Really clever build though, I'll give him that | ||
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Deleted User 3420
24492 Posts
im sorry to say it, but it seemed to me like during a lot of that both players played terribly the zerg decisionmaking especially seemed really bad. maybe this was like the first cannon block the zerg's ever faced or something? yeah i just made a lot of enemies didn't i? well w/e | ||
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Psykologen
Norway16 Posts
Although, I think the micro was Warp Prism micro was amazing! Made the game entertaining. But I also have to agree a bit with Travis. | ||
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gr8ape
Canada302 Posts
On December 26 2010 05:16 Blyadischa wrote: Watch a brood war game, then watch a SC2 game. In a brood war game, there are multiple stages in one game where one player must use the timing of the matchup to assert their position over the map, then the timing of the matchup allows the other player to assert their position over the map. Then, when both players have their higher tech, they must strategically expand and attack expansions and strategically place units in the map to counter attack, catch drops, drop themselves, catch reinforcements, etc. In SC2, it's either 70 food expansions with one player constantly attacking and either breaking the front and winning or getting denied and losing, 1 base all in vs 1 base all in, or it's fast expansions into midgame 1a's from both players to see who comes out on top. Rarely is it a long game, but if it is it's essentially just more of the same thing, more 1a's. It's not a matter of less APM, the game is made easier by inject larva, mules, chronoboost, which make most economic damage negligible and one base all ins more potent then ever, the stupidity of some units (high templar TTTTTTTTTTTT I just won the game), and the terribleness of the map pool, where the expansion path is explicit, the attack path is explicit and the rush distances are all incredibly small compared to BW maps. I remember watching BW Day9 dailies, where I actually learned something each time. Now I watch Day9 dailies of SC2 and just think, wow I would be miserable if I had to play BW, then switch to SC2, and had to throw away knowledge and be limited by the terribleness of the game. Your post is so biased its not even funny. Im not gonna say anything except that bw is 10 years old with dozens of patches along the way and sc2 is a couple months old with no expansion. Also try to watch some good sc2 games. Youre probably watching shitty games on purpose so you can just QQ | ||
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