| Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy |
|
Shamaya
Japan65 Posts
I decided to start trying out drop play. My drops were pretty decent but I feel as if I'd have gotten just as far if I hadn't dropped at all. My opponent was still ahead of me in food the entire game. When he brings his army to my base I figure I must engage it before he gets too many colossi, and I engage and just get rolled over. Help! ![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-164666.jpg) | ||
|
MadisonStreet
United States161 Posts
On November 10 2010 21:49 Floundering wrote: Thanks muchly for doing this. Making for some fascinating reading. Was wondering what your philosophy on +Attack/Defense upgrades was? When is the 'right' time that you aim to get them? For me specifically ASAP. I have a general sense of what I need to survive - units / expo / detection. After I cover those bases I start looking at upgrades. | ||
|
MadisonStreet
United States161 Posts
On November 11 2010 00:47 papaz wrote: OMG!!!! And here I am practicing the hell out of my micro the last couple of weeks, trying to click faster so that my marines don't attack on their own after I press the S button and now I see that I should have used H instead *sigh*. And now that I am googling I learn that S does only cancel the current commands but your marines will do what they do in default mode (chase close enemies). No wonder I never could get my marines "in synch" nor my hellions when harrasing the enemy mineral lines. There were always some marines donig their own thing or hellions starting to fire on nearby enemies and I get pissed about them not being in synch. I thought I should practice harder/ click faster so that the units never gets the chance to run away. *sigh* This single post will change my micro forever =) thx You can also utilize the "A" command to attack - then right click for movement. As long as enemies are within range the "attack" command serves as a H to stop movement. | ||
|
Carefoot
Canada410 Posts
Per expansion how tech buildings can you support feasibly? The only science I know is that on 2 bases I can support 10 barracks if I am going for all barracks. Hypothetically if I am going 1-1-1 opening against Protoss with marines/tanks/raven->banshee/drops when I expand behind my first push. What should I add on? 1 of everything? ie. 2-2-2 This feels too gas heavy for me so reasonably I can say I can double my barracks per expansion, and add 1 more advanced building per expansion to support constant use out of it. Like an armory, like a Starport. What is your rule of thumb? I am on a laptop and can't watch your replays. | ||
|
BEARDiaguz
Australia2362 Posts
Rule of thumb is to practice a build order and find out what works to what gas timings, to what timing you want to do. Ok, that doesnt' help. You can maintain 1 starport production, 2 tank factories and 3/4 raxes off of 2 bases with ~50 scv's. That helps. And you can throw in upgrades too! With a 3rd base and set of gases running, you can throw in another reactor starport and another tech lab factory, possibly another rax or two. After that it gets a bit weird, what with SCV amounts, muling, golds, mineral saturation whilst they start to run out etc. Just add more structures as you keep expanding, and practice, practice, practice. (incidentally, after a 50 min TvT on LT today, I learnt that a 12 gas economy can support 12 fac's pumping tanks and thors. And upgrades) As for upgrades. There are two ways to view upgrade theory. The first is straight up mathmatics, ie, "it takes 21 marine shots to kill a mutalisk without upgrades, but 18 with +1 attack." or also something like "thors with +2 attack kill mutalisks in 2 shots instead of 3". The second is overall DPS spread, like "if I have +1 tanks along with my +2 infantry, I will kill this clump of enemy units so very quickly. It's ridiculous.". Bottom line is that upgrades are extremely useful and you should add them into your play, no matter how you slice it. As for specifics, I find +1 vehicle upgrade extremely important for TvT, as tanks will 3 shot enemy tanks and 2 shot stimmed marauders. This is quite noticable! Marines benefit insanely well from upgrades, not because there's so many of the little shits but because they spread DPS very effectively, unlike Marauders. I usualy only get 1 point of armour because it's cheap. Most things will rip through marines so quickly regardless of your armour, so what's the big deal? No amount of armoru upgrades will stop colosi, tanks, psi storm, fungal or banes from killing them. Do consider getting more then 1 point if the Zerg has got more then 1 of his melee attack ups, as ultras and lings actually do considerble damage themselves, and marines are ever so brittle. +1 tank upgrade also helps 1-shot zerglings, but that's fairly obvious. And the way to actually apply it is to find a timing in your build that can exploit upgrades in one of two ways. The first is part of a timing attack. If I have a 4 rax +1 attack timing push vs Zerg, I want to build that Ebay and get the upgrade finished at roughly 9:30, just when mutalisks will pop (assuming a ling opening, with roaches or banes out the mutas come out a bit later, closer to 11-12 sometimes). The second that upgrade finishes coincides with when my infantry hit the front, maximising damage potential. The other way to apply upgrades is identifying part in your build order where you can confidently state "ok, I have all the units and production I need right now.". Then build an Ebay/armoruy and start cranking ups. For example, you can do a 2 rax ghost FE, start teching to tanks or Vikings and get an Ebay for some upgrades with only those 2 raxes out. You're quite safe (well, assuming the Protoss isn 't going for a 1 base bust build. Scout, scout, scout!), so why not? | ||
|
Carefoot
Canada410 Posts
off two bases becomes 3-2-1 Off more bases is totally dependent on SCVS & if gases are saturated. Once two base is stable and saturated one should see to making an engineering bay (or earlier for this one) then an armory. Which comes first vehicle ups or Starport ups? Are starport upgrades something I should look into after a 3rd, or can I support double armory OR is a single armory safe all game? Obviously it depends on what I am getting, what they are getting and how the upgrades can be intergrated into timing attacks. I am curious if anyone has any approach like that, where they start +1 at the engineering bay and armory succinctly then when they are 75% done push out for a bust and if the bust isn't cutting through the opponent like butter pull out (assuming you were expanding behind this) and then on +2 roll around again, during the downtime however one should be harassing - scouting and dropping constantly if not during the push's or busts themselves. In essence Terran is an aggressive race if I am not mistaken? Even in the mirror I feel the aggressor has a huge advantage. I feel if in TvP I don't attack as Terran I am giving up the game so to speak. I also feel that in TvZ I do not pressure or threaten constantly the Zerg has an ability to sprint ahead in economy. If I don't force him to make fighting units then he has the freedom to just drone. If I threaten him and he doesn't make zerglings with a round of larvae I can feasibly do damage to him in that timing window in which he cannot attack. It sounds like I just need to play a lot more with Terran to get a sense of these timings. As a random player its hard but I'll give it my all. | ||
|
Tianx
United States1196 Posts
I've been experimenting a bit with TvZ, and I'm curious - is there any reason not to bunker rush a hatchery first build on a small map when going for a 2-rax or even 1-rax opener? I've found that if I get the bunker up I can pull ~6 SCVs for a guaranteed hatch kill and a free win, and it seems to me the worst case scenario is that I come out even if I lose my first two marines + scv to drones, but I never see good players trying this. | ||
|
Meldrath
United States620 Posts
 keep up the good work. | ||
|
Benshin88
United States183 Posts
What are your weaknesses? Talking about high level play. I'm 1940. zerg How well do you do against a zerg player if all your harasses fail? IE banshee, helions, drops? The zerg player obviously has the advantage but I'd like to know how big this advantage is. Is your main army capable of wreaking havoc or do you have to play defensive/expo. | ||
|
Excellent
United States124 Posts
 | ||
|
Benshin88
United States183 Posts
On November 11 2010 23:38 Excellent wrote: After watching the replays posted by OP I have been grossly underutilizing tanks in my TvZ since the patch. I forgot that they still oneshot banelings yeah once you get to upper level. Terran units are grossly OP. Positioning - Terran players almost always have the better position. Countering - Even if a zerg player gets a countering unit, the terran player can still fight decently and can win the battle with good positioning/micro. If a terran gets a countering unit, zerg almost always loses no or forces the zerg to build/tech to the counter unit. Macroing - They are pretty bad early-mid game but late game they easily have the ability to macro. zerg will probably macro slightly better then terran but not by much if the Terran gets a couple reactor units IE the cheapness of Marines!!! Most retarded units in the game. After foxer replay a lot of terrans are now learning to actually micro there marines properly agianst banes. There are so many terrans now spreading marines out. Infestors and banes are not having as much of an impact as they used to. This is the core of my army  Microing - so much harder to micro zerg units compared to terran. You almost always have to surround a terran army to win. You have to also Time the surround PERFECTLY to destroy an army. Terran players just don't know how hard this is. To calculate the movement speed of a diverse army is so hard even when you are using 3-4 different control groups | ||
|
HalfAmazing
Netherlands402 Posts
| ||
|
MockHamill
Sweden1798 Posts
Vs Zerg I win easily if I do not make any major mistakes. Vs Protoss I lose almost no matter what I do. Is this something that still holds true higher up in the ladder? | ||
|
KiNGMoNSteRkeN
Belgium22 Posts
| ||
|
Phrencys
Canada270 Posts
Mid-Late game I have a tendency to forget mules. So what happens is I slap 5-6 mules at once, get a huge mineral spike, feel obligated to add several barracks to catch up... but more often than not it means I'm already several tens of food behind. Is there anything else than "practice more" that can be said? Are there tricks to develop the macro instinct as terran? | ||
|
TheGrimace
United States929 Posts
On November 12 2010 00:44 Nanouz wrote: I saw in a replay you bind all your production buildings to one key. But what if 2 units have the same hotkey? Is it better to bind them all together? Could you explain this bit more pls. When you have buildings of different types on the same key, you can only build from the active building in that hotkey setup. Pressing tab switches what set of buildings is active. For example, if you have your Factory and Starport on 4, pressing 4 will only allow you to build from one, I believe it's the last one added to the key group, so in this case, the Starport. Pressing tab would then make your factory active, allowing you to build from it. Note: tabbing switches between building types. If you have 3 barracks and 1 fact on your hotkey, you can issue build commands to all 3 barracks at the same time, you don't tab between each building. | ||
|
KiNGMoNSteRkeN
Belgium22 Posts
On November 12 2010 02:08 TheGrimace wrote: When you have buildings of different types on the same key, you can only build from the active building in that hotkey setup. Pressing tab switches what set of buildings is active. For example, if you have your Factory and Starport on 4, pressing 4 will only allow you to build from one, I believe it's the last one added to the key group, so in this case, the Starport. Pressing tab would then make your factory active, allowing you to build from it. Note: tabbing switches between building types. If you have 3 barracks and 1 fact on your hotkey, you can issue build commands to all 3 barracks at the same time, you don't tab between each building. Hmm yea i see, do you recommend different production building on a hotkey or tab between them? | ||
|
nullspace
United States3 Posts
| ||
|
MadisonStreet
United States161 Posts
On November 11 2010 21:50 Carefoot wrote: In all MU's here is my question: Per expansion how tech buildings can you support feasibly? The only science I know is that on 2 bases I can support 10 barracks if I am going for all barracks. Hypothetically if I am going 1-1-1 opening against Protoss with marines/tanks/raven->banshee/drops when I expand behind my first push. What should I add on? 1 of everything? ie. 2-2-2 This feels too gas heavy for me so reasonably I can say I can double my barracks per expansion, and add 1 more advanced building per expansion to support constant use out of it. Like an armory, like a Starport. What is your rule of thumb? I am on a laptop and can't watch your replays. Without a specific match up or comp its hard to say. But if I'm going for a bio / mech or bio / air comp 3 - 6 rax, 2 : 1 Factory / Starport or inverse. General rule of thumb make it a point to check your income surplus as your keeping your mineral gas low and add additional structures. | ||
|
MadisonStreet
United States161 Posts
On November 11 2010 22:56 Tianx wrote: Hey Madison, thanks a lot for doing this. I've been experimenting a bit with TvZ, and I'm curious - is there any reason not to bunker rush a hatchery first build on a small map when going for a 2-rax or even 1-rax opener? I've found that if I get the bunker up I can pull ~6 SCVs for a guaranteed hatch kill and a free win, and it seems to me the worst case scenario is that I come out even if I lose my first two marines + scv to drones, but I never see good players trying this. In short - no. But sending 6 scvs is definately an overcommit. The thing is delaying his hatch or even killing / forcing a cancel isn't a guaranteed win. Whenever I'm in a favorable position - by killing or delaying hatch and have semi contain. I'll lay down my nat and macro a larger lead. On shorter map distances - close spawn metal close spawn temple you can go for a faster fact - before stim etc and just tank siege into his base from the low ground. You've got to be careful about his unit composition though. | ||
| ||
|
WardiTV Summer Champion…
Harstem vs Zoun
Harstem vs GgMaChine
GgMaChine vs Lambo
Harstem vs Lambo
GgMaChine vs Zoun
Lambo vs Zoun
OSC
Big Brain Bouts
FEL
Patches Events
AI Arena Tournament
FEL
Sparkling Tuna Cup
Replay Cast
WardiTV Weekly
[ Show More ] |
|
|
EPT
