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On November 03 2010 08:26 FrodaN wrote:
Well played, but I want to bring up some concerns with your replay against the Terran. It was a blind build order win because he went 1 rax FE. You didn't even scout him once in which case a simple cloaked banshee would've man handled your econ maybe to make halt carrier (or at least graviton) production.
He didn't even get medivacs out so it's not a win against MMM, but against MM. Also, close positions helped incredibly as close air or cross spawns would've slowed down your push enough for him to get more units out.
Also, ATo doesn't play TvT...its his worst match up. He was obvi trolling you, but it's not like you would know otherwise.
Whoever this ATo guy is, he's got some manner issues.
Also, this build is cheese, plain and simple. It's very all in, but a good one. I also have a replay in the thread against a terran player with cloaked banshee + viking + marine (he knew it was coming because it was our second rematch)
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Bahaha I never saw this. I had a 1 base carrier strat in the beta that was much stronger than what you listed now (technically then). Should have just searched for other one base carrier topics^^.
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On November 03 2010 08:46 FabledIntegral wrote:
Bahaha I never saw this. I had a 1 base carrier strat in the beta that was much stronger than what you listed now (technically then). Should have just searched for other one base carrier topics^^.
enlighten me. My way is not the fastest way to get carrier but it let you have a sentry and some gateway units to hold out.
No offense, but I honestly don't think there is much more potential in improving a one base carrier build. If carrier comes out later you will be pwned by vikings on one base, if it comes out earlier you would be pwned by early bio pushes.
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On November 03 2010 09:01 Protoss_Carrier wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 08:46 FabledIntegral wrote:
Bahaha I never saw this. I had a 1 base carrier strat in the beta that was much stronger than what you listed now (technically then). Should have just searched for other one base carrier topics^^. enlighten me. My way is not the fastest way to get carrier but it let you have a sentry and some gateway units to hold out. No offense, but I honestly don't think there is much more potential in improving a one base carrier build. If carrier comes out later you will be pwned by vikings on one base, if it comes out earlier you would be pwned by early bio pushes.
No offense? You seem pretty damn sure of yourself. I already know the timings, I played it at the top of the ladder and made a topic on it already, but thanks your highness.
If you must know, it starts off as well with Zealot then sentry. However, you don't get warp gate tech, as there is literally utterly no reason for you to be getting them. It also recommends you proxy it in a corner of your base. You get a fast second gas and by the time your carrier pops it coincides with +2 air attacks, yet all the timings are nearly the same as yours. You have two sentries to hold off bio attacks. You carrier has 32 dmg more firepower and comes out nearly identical times, making it much more viable at fighting vikings.
Thx. No offense, but your build is subpar to mine.
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On November 03 2010 09:09 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 09:01 Protoss_Carrier wrote:On November 03 2010 08:46 FabledIntegral wrote:
Bahaha I never saw this. I had a 1 base carrier strat in the beta that was much stronger than what you listed now (technically then). Should have just searched for other one base carrier topics^^. enlighten me. My way is not the fastest way to get carrier but it let you have a sentry and some gateway units to hold out. No offense, but I honestly don't think there is much more potential in improving a one base carrier build. If carrier comes out later you will be pwned by vikings on one base, if it comes out earlier you would be pwned by early bio pushes. No offense? You seem pretty damn sure of yourself. I already know the timings, I played it at the top of the ladder and made a topic on it already, but thanks your highness.
So why not link him to the topic instead of being a dick about it?
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On November 03 2010 09:09 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 09:01 Protoss_Carrier wrote:On November 03 2010 08:46 FabledIntegral wrote:
Bahaha I never saw this. I had a 1 base carrier strat in the beta that was much stronger than what you listed now (technically then). Should have just searched for other one base carrier topics^^. enlighten me. My way is not the fastest way to get carrier but it let you have a sentry and some gateway units to hold out. No offense, but I honestly don't think there is much more potential in improving a one base carrier build. If carrier comes out later you will be pwned by vikings on one base, if it comes out earlier you would be pwned by early bio pushes. No offense? You seem pretty damn sure of yourself. I already know the timings, I played it at the top of the ladder and made a topic on it already, but thanks your highness. If you must know, it starts off as well with Zealot then sentry. However, you don't get warp gate tech, as there is literally utterly no reason for you to be getting them. It also recommends you proxy it in a corner of your base. You get a fast second gas and by the time your carrier pops it coincides with +2 air attacks, yet all the timings are nearly the same as yours. You have two sentries to hold off bio attacks. You carrier has 32 dmg more firepower and comes out nearly identical times, making it much more viable at fighting vikings. Thx. No offense, but your build is subpar to mine.
sounds like a good build, except that you rely a bit too much on carrier. I often use wrap gate to reinforce my gateway army. Carrier merely act as a spotter for me to wrap on to high ground.
I have some doubt about the stability of a build with no wrap gate and putting all egg into one basket. Plus you gain more DPS by building gate way unit rather than air attack level 2.
I've experimented with air attacks and realized that it doesn't work.
A little bit of humbleness instead of attitude may have helped your case, as well as an actual build orders with replays.
Here is the thing, you use that one carrier to bust your way into the terran base. Its DPS doesn't really matter.
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On November 03 2010 09:21 Protoss_Carrier wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 09:09 FabledIntegral wrote:On November 03 2010 09:01 Protoss_Carrier wrote:On November 03 2010 08:46 FabledIntegral wrote:
Bahaha I never saw this. I had a 1 base carrier strat in the beta that was much stronger than what you listed now (technically then). Should have just searched for other one base carrier topics^^. enlighten me. My way is not the fastest way to get carrier but it let you have a sentry and some gateway units to hold out. No offense, but I honestly don't think there is much more potential in improving a one base carrier build. If carrier comes out later you will be pwned by vikings on one base, if it comes out earlier you would be pwned by early bio pushes. No offense? You seem pretty damn sure of yourself. I already know the timings, I played it at the top of the ladder and made a topic on it already, but thanks your highness. If you must know, it starts off as well with Zealot then sentry. However, you don't get warp gate tech, as there is literally utterly no reason for you to be getting them. It also recommends you proxy it in a corner of your base. You get a fast second gas and by the time your carrier pops it coincides with +2 air attacks, yet all the timings are nearly the same as yours. You have two sentries to hold off bio attacks. You carrier has 32 dmg more firepower and comes out nearly identical times, making it much more viable at fighting vikings. Thx. No offense, but your build is subpar to mine. sounds like a good build, except that you rely a bit too much on carrier. I often use wrap gate to reinforce my gateway army. Carrier merely act as a spotter for me to wrap on to high ground. I have some doubt about the stability of a build with no wrap gate and putting all egg into one basket. Plus you gain more DPS by building gate way unit rather than air attack level 2. I've experimented with air attacks and realized that it doesn't work. A little bit of humbleness instead of attitude may have helped your case, as well as an actual build orders with replays. Here is the thing, you use that one carrier to bust your way into the terran base. Its DPS doesn't really matter.
I don't know why you're even trying a bust is the problem. You don't need a bust to win, if you've experimented with the build at all. The few seconds shaved off gateway units is completely irrelevant when your carrier is killing it's enemies much faster, and you're using a continual carrier pump. It's not exactly hard to search "1 base carrier" to find my topic, which I already claimed I had made, quite a bit before you in fact. I believe it's your fault for not searching before creating a topic, not my fault for not providing you with the link. And I've used this build on at least 3 Terrans that are consistently in the top 200, two of which are consistently between 75-100.
I'd say you're build is far more risky, promoting a bust and not upgrading air weapons when you are IN FACT completely reliant on the carrier. My build expands nearly as soon as the carrier pops out. The entire "all-in" relies in the fact they don't scout the carrier. You easily transition into a macro game following it.
And the lack of humility was only in your blind refusal to accept a build could be better than yours. "No offense."
Here's your link as you've failed to search still
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=128716
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When cyber is done: get one zealot, research wrap gate, start saving up chronoboost
- do not research wrap gate yet!
/facepalm
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On November 03 2010 10:49 shammythefox wrote:
When cyber is done: get one zealot, research wrap gate, start saving up chronoboost
- do not research wrap gate yet!
/facepalm
you don't need wrap gate at that moment since you are relying on sentry.
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On November 03 2010 10:46 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 09:21 Protoss_Carrier wrote:On November 03 2010 09:09 FabledIntegral wrote:On November 03 2010 09:01 Protoss_Carrier wrote:On November 03 2010 08:46 FabledIntegral wrote:
Bahaha I never saw this. I had a 1 base carrier strat in the beta that was much stronger than what you listed now (technically then). Should have just searched for other one base carrier topics^^. enlighten me. My way is not the fastest way to get carrier but it let you have a sentry and some gateway units to hold out. No offense, but I honestly don't think there is much more potential in improving a one base carrier build. If carrier comes out later you will be pwned by vikings on one base, if it comes out earlier you would be pwned by early bio pushes. No offense? You seem pretty damn sure of yourself. I already know the timings, I played it at the top of the ladder and made a topic on it already, but thanks your highness. If you must know, it starts off as well with Zealot then sentry. However, you don't get warp gate tech, as there is literally utterly no reason for you to be getting them. It also recommends you proxy it in a corner of your base. You get a fast second gas and by the time your carrier pops it coincides with +2 air attacks, yet all the timings are nearly the same as yours. You have two sentries to hold off bio attacks. You carrier has 32 dmg more firepower and comes out nearly identical times, making it much more viable at fighting vikings. Thx. No offense, but your build is subpar to mine. sounds like a good build, except that you rely a bit too much on carrier. I often use wrap gate to reinforce my gateway army. Carrier merely act as a spotter for me to wrap on to high ground. I have some doubt about the stability of a build with no wrap gate and putting all egg into one basket. Plus you gain more DPS by building gate way unit rather than air attack level 2. I've experimented with air attacks and realized that it doesn't work. A little bit of humbleness instead of attitude may have helped your case, as well as an actual build orders with replays. Here is the thing, you use that one carrier to bust your way into the terran base. Its DPS doesn't really matter. I don't know why you're even trying a bust is the problem. You don't need a bust to win, if you've experimented with the build at all. The few seconds shaved off gateway units is completely irrelevant when your carrier is killing it's enemies much faster, and you're using a continual carrier pump. It's not exactly hard to search "1 base carrier" to find my topic, which I already claimed I had made, quite a bit before you in fact. I believe it's your fault for not searching before creating a topic, not my fault for not providing you with the link. And I've used this build on at least 3 Terrans that are consistently in the top 200, two of which are consistently between 75-100. I'd say you're build is far more risky, promoting a bust and not upgrading air weapons when you are IN FACT completely reliant on the carrier. My build expands nearly as soon as the carrier pops out. The entire "all-in" relies in the fact they don't scout the carrier. You easily transition into a macro game following it. And the lack of humility was only in your blind refusal to accept a build could be better than yours. "No offense." Here's your link as you've failed to search still http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=128716
congrats at being able to be at top of the ladder.
Each build has pros and cons and are completely different. I failed to see why I must post under your thread, especially since my strategy is completely different.
I am sure you can have many different builds all centered around reaver, that doesn't mean no one should make a new post about it.
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why don't we let the mods handle this issue guys... either way he spent the time to write this no need to bash even if it's not a great strategy.
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I would just like to point out how the OP is crying for someone to notice him and give him some recognition for ANYTHING. You can't disagree with him without being wrong. And he acts like he's doing nothing but carrier rushes, which isn't true. I doubt he even played BW 12 years ago. He's just some kid who stops posting on a handle when he gets busted out too much for not knowing anything, who obviously spends more time here posting about carriers and trying to prove that his wins are valid.
One base carrier, fine. But take all the garbage lies out and clean up your thread. Your build order isn't even able to be digested quickly. You have to read two paragraphs to figure it out and at the end of the day, if you actually watched the day9 special on carriers (which came before your posts... interesting) you'd get more advice than this entire thread^2.
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On November 03 2010 10:46 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 09:21 Protoss_Carrier wrote:On November 03 2010 09:09 FabledIntegral wrote:On November 03 2010 09:01 Protoss_Carrier wrote:On November 03 2010 08:46 FabledIntegral wrote:
Bahaha I never saw this. I had a 1 base carrier strat in the beta that was much stronger than what you listed now (technically then). Should have just searched for other one base carrier topics^^. enlighten me. My way is not the fastest way to get carrier but it let you have a sentry and some gateway units to hold out. No offense, but I honestly don't think there is much more potential in improving a one base carrier build. If carrier comes out later you will be pwned by vikings on one base, if it comes out earlier you would be pwned by early bio pushes. No offense? You seem pretty damn sure of yourself. I already know the timings, I played it at the top of the ladder and made a topic on it already, but thanks your highness. If you must know, it starts off as well with Zealot then sentry. However, you don't get warp gate tech, as there is literally utterly no reason for you to be getting them. It also recommends you proxy it in a corner of your base. You get a fast second gas and by the time your carrier pops it coincides with +2 air attacks, yet all the timings are nearly the same as yours. You have two sentries to hold off bio attacks. You carrier has 32 dmg more firepower and comes out nearly identical times, making it much more viable at fighting vikings. Thx. No offense, but your build is subpar to mine. sounds like a good build, except that you rely a bit too much on carrier. I often use wrap gate to reinforce my gateway army. Carrier merely act as a spotter for me to wrap on to high ground. I have some doubt about the stability of a build with no wrap gate and putting all egg into one basket. Plus you gain more DPS by building gate way unit rather than air attack level 2. I've experimented with air attacks and realized that it doesn't work. A little bit of humbleness instead of attitude may have helped your case, as well as an actual build orders with replays. Here is the thing, you use that one carrier to bust your way into the terran base. Its DPS doesn't really matter. I don't know why you're even trying a bust is the problem. You don't need a bust to win, if you've experimented with the build at all. The few seconds shaved off gateway units is completely irrelevant when your carrier is killing it's enemies much faster, and you're using a continual carrier pump. It's not exactly hard to search "1 base carrier" to find my topic, which I already claimed I had made, quite a bit before you in fact. I believe it's your fault for not searching before creating a topic, not my fault for not providing you with the link. And I've used this build on at least 3 Terrans that are consistently in the top 200, two of which are consistently between 75-100. I'd say you're build is far more risky, promoting a bust and not upgrading air weapons when you are IN FACT completely reliant on the carrier. My build expands nearly as soon as the carrier pops out. The entire "all-in" relies in the fact they don't scout the carrier. You easily transition into a macro game following it. And the lack of humility was only in your blind refusal to accept a build could be better than yours. "No offense." Here's your link as you've failed to search still http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=128716
There is so much BM in all your posts it makes me weep. That post is so old that it's completely understandable that he made a new one. No need to be such a raging bitch about something so trivial.
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Just looking through this, a question comes to mind:
you say that you can hold off a banshee rush, yet there's not a hint of detection in your build. What do you do when those banshees cloak?
(I know whenever I rush banshees V toss, I get cloak, then double pump them)
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On November 03 2010 12:24 Selkie wrote:
Just looking through this, a question comes to mind:
you say that you can hold off a banshee rush, yet there's not a hint of detection in your build. What do you do when those banshees cloak?
(I know whenever I rush banshees V toss, I get cloak, then double pump them)
He builds a robo in 1 out of 4 games at random to stop this.
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I must be a genius because I just randomly build robo whenever my opponent goes banshee! Mind blown...
No, I build a phoenix every game and rally it straight toward terran's base and then fly around map. If I scout a banshee I just lay down a robo right the way. The timing is such that the observer will just pop out when the banshee comes out.
Also, roaming, you seem to have a very personal issue against me. We can resolve this via PM, no need to have personal attacks.
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Notice he didn't say I was incorrect about any of it. And I have problems with people who lie about credentials and try to give bad advice.
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On November 03 2010 12:46 Roaming wrote:
Notice he didn't say I was incorrect about any of it. And I have problems with people who lie about credentials and try to give bad advice.
You were indeed incorrect. Throwing down a robo was not random but result of scouting.
Please, why don't you quote stuff I got wrong here, and I'll change them so TL community will no longer get bad advice? If not, we can resolve this over PM.
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How does this build hold off any early terran aggression? it seems like you will die to any 1 marine 1/2/3 marauder push.
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Please explain to me to advantage to possessing warp technology in the build order. Are we building proxy pylons to warp in reinforcements? No? Are we churning a lot of gateway units? No?
The dumb/simple answer is just "oh, warpgate or way better than gateways, duh," but what exactly are we truly gaining from it?
I suggest you research +1 air weapons BEFORE warp gate, I know it sounds absolutely ridiculous, but +1 upgrades makes the carrier exponentially more powerful. Seeing how each carrier has 8 intercepters, each doing 2 attacks, a +1 air upgrade will give +16 damage for a carrier.
Given that this is such a micro intensive build, I don't see how a 16 health swing WON'T be of utmost importance. It could be the difference between sniping a single anti air ground unit, or not. And I'm not suggesting you skip out warp gate entirely, however, if you were to revise your "timing push" to include +1 air weapons instead of warp gate, then my god that will be extremely potent.
The idea comes to me when I saw a PvP game where one player didn't research warp gate technology in favor of getting colo thermal lancing range faster, so with carriers why can't we do the same thing?
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EPT
