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Fields of Strife - 144x174 - available on NA, EU and SEA
He who sowed strife shall reap strife.
Made by : Apom
+ Show Spoiler [current overview (v0.15)] +
+ Show Spoiler [angled overview] +
+ Show Spoiler [v0.6 overview] +
+ Show Spoiler [v0.4 overview] +
+ Show Spoiler [major changes from v0.1 to v0.4] +
+ Show Spoiler [v0.1 overview] +
+ Show Spoiler [initial sketchy overview] +Numbers in orange indicate cliff level (3 = high ground, 1 = low ground). Brown blocks are destructible rocks. Pink represents starting locations, and Xel'Naga watchtowers. Blue and yellow dashes are mineral deposits. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/WPl9k.jpg)
Introduction
Following the anouncement of the TL mapping contest, I decided to participate and give some love to team maps, and in particular 2v2 maps. This is also my first attempt at using the editor, so this is a learning experience and all feedback is welcome !
Rush distance
It takes 36 seconds for a SCV to travel between the main ramps.
For reference :
- Current 2v2 ladder pool is 32.5 seconds on average (from 19s on Boneyard close positions to 43 seconds on Tyrador Keep open ramp).
- All-time 2v2 Blizzard maps are 32.7 seconds on average (min/max unchanged, but Gutterhulk is also 43 seconds).
Aesthetics
The map is entirely built with the Agria tileset. There has to be hospitable planets out there ^_^
There are currently 1474 doodads, two thirds of which are some fort of vegetation.
Some real-life pictures that may relate to this map :
- low ground : Sabarmati River floodlands (India)
- middle ground : Val Terbi (Switzerland)
- high ground : South Dakota high plains (USA)
Pretty pictures
+ Show Spoiler [in-base naturals] +In-base natural expansions are on the low ground and vulnerable to air attacks. A mid-height ridge on the extremity of the cliff allows reapers to avoid the ramp if they desire so. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/bgoul.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Doq6r.jpg)
+ Show Spoiler [side expansions] +Each side has an high ground expansion that is reasonably easy to defend, and a much more open one on the other side which is high yield. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/aZjqo.jpg)
+ Show Spoiler [central expansions] +There are high yield expansions on each side of the main path, which overlooks them. Rocks block the ramp from one side, while the ramp from the opposing side is open. ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/t7jNw.jpg)
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Unless if they are intended, you should get rid of those straight lines in your cliffs. They make the map appear unnatural. I will not comment on the textures, because they simply don't seem to be finished, but getting those cliffs to appear natural is important before going into the balancing and copying the symmetry.
I like it that you chose such a pristine, untouched terraformed human colony as a tileset because although it looks very pretty, it's not very commonly used (people prefer alien jungles and barren wastelands appearantly).
Good luck with your project, it seems that you still have a lot of work ahead of you.
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Thanks for your input, I am hunting down straight cliffs and only have one left now (annoying to get rid of though). Textures are unfinished indeed, the only signifcant effort I have made in that regard is on the outer gold bases. They are probably the next step.
In the meantime, I added an actual overview to the OP : overview.
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did you just draw an angry guy throwing something and make it into a map?
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I think the map is too expansion light, also why such a long walk to the second back nat?
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The center is way too choky, let alone for a 2v2 map. I would fill in most or all of the 4 void spaces there to create enough room for maxed out armies for 4 players.
Also, terran drops will be outrageous cause they can shoot either main mineral line from below the cliff, meaning they are in zero danger. Not sure how to fix this without using up way too much space.
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United Kingdom10823 Posts
Can you build on the crops?
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Hey guys, thanks for the input !
On October 19 2011 14:17 a176 wrote:
did you just draw an angry guy throwing something and make it into a map?
Uh, no ?
On October 19 2011 14:40 Proko wrote:
I think the map is too expansion light, also why such a long walk to the second back nat?
I'm not sure about expansions. There is a total of 7 bases per team, it is exactly the same as every 4 player 2v2 map, except Monlyth Ridge / Arid Wastes (which only have 6) and Twilight Fortress (9, and Blizzard stated it was too much when they retired the map from the ladder pool).
I agree on the long walk, I will be reworking that part so there is a ramp to provide faster access to the player who is far from the other back expansion.
On October 19 2011 18:11 EatThePath wrote:
The center is way too choky, let alone for a 2v2 map. I would fill in most or all of the 4 void spaces there to create enough room for maxed out armies for 4 players.
Also, terran drops will be outrageous cause they can shoot either main mineral line from below the cliff, meaning they are in zero danger. Not sure how to fix this without using up way too much space.
You are right on the chokyness. I will make some room there.
Regarding Terran drops, I think the shorter walk distance (see above) will help defending. However, I rarely see drop play in 2v2, much less so than in 1v1. Maybe it's because you only need half of your team to go for some air tech to counter them, while in 1v1 you obviously need all of your team to do so.
On October 19 2011 18:19 Hassybaby wrote:
Can you build on the crops?
Crops that are inside the area of play, such as in the bottom right expansion, are buildable. The yellow-ish crops that surround the island are here for aesthetic purposes, and are unreachable.
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Update !
I went ahead and added a ramp in the back of the base. The blocked expansion has been reworked as part of this modification, you can see the result in this picture. I also cut the part of the ridge than linked the two natural bases, and flipped the main mineral line to reduce exposure to drops.
I also slightly enlarged the central path. I may enlarge it further later on, but I don't think I'll act before some testing has been conducted. I also did some detailing here and there, and will do some more before I publish a beta version. In the meantime, there is an updated overview. I have not started on essential texturing yet, so please give me all the feedback you may have on the layout !
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Hello guys,
I did some work on out-of-play areas, trying to find a suitable atmosphere without entirely replicating the same things on both sides on the map. More visibly, I also did some detailing the in-base expansions and the ridges above them. I will probably leave it at that for that part of the map.
+ Show Spoiler [pictures] +
In a more structural issue, I am not entirely happy with the middle of the map. Once all rocks are destroyed, it's not entirely clear what is the main path and what is a side path. I now think that flipping the entire central section of the map would make for a better layout. I came up with a Paint-powered overlay, you are welcome to share your thoughts about it.
+ Show Spoiler [<3 Paint] +
// edit : spoilered because the picture is pretty big.
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Update ! I implemented the changes described in the previous post.
+ Show Spoiler [overview] +
Following these changes, I published the map on EU (current version is 0.4). Texturing is not done on the majority of the map yet, but the layout should be close to its final state. All testing and feedback on this topic will be appreciated while I work on making the map more pleasing to the eye.
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Another update - it's the final stretch ^_^
I measured the rush distance, it's quite good with the new layout : 36 seconds, exactly the same as Scorched Haven. I updated the OP with more detailed information, which I repeat here for convenience.
+ Show Spoiler [rush distances] +It takes 36 seconds for a SCV to travel between the main ramps.
For reference :
- Current 2v2 ladder pool is 32.5 seconds on average (from 19s on Boneyard close positions to 43 seconds on Tyrador Keep open ramp).
- All-time 2v2 Blizzard maps are 32.7 seconds on average (min/max unchanged, but Gutterhulk is also 43 seconds).
I received some feedback that the four symetrical side expansions were both aesthetically unfitting, and boring gameplay-wise. I also wanted to put a gold base there (as explained in the vision statement), but it was kinda OP with the high ground (which is why it was made a regular base in v0.4). So, I reworked that area, there is now a gold base, but it's on middle ground, and fairly open.
+ Show Spoiler [updated overview] +
In other news, as can be seen on the overview, I have made significant progress on the detailing front. Only the starting bases (yellow grass on overview) are still to be done. Here is a couple of beauty shots.
+ Show Spoiler [pictures] +Man-made expansion, with gold base in the back : One of the central expansions :
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I really don't like backdoor rocks that are really far from the main entrance. There's too much gimmicky stuff you can with cannons, warp in, etc.
Also the cliff is too close to the mineral lines. Someone could put a cannon on the lowground and bring his probe back up or something and just deny mining from the base. And with it being so far from the main entrance there's basically no way to stop the cannon from getting up.
Looks like a really cool map though. Better than the blizzard maps by the looks of it :D 2v2 maps ftw!!
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On October 27 2011 11:09 DoubleReed wrote:
I really don't like backdoor rocks that are really far from the main entrance. There's too much gimmicky stuff you can with cannons, warp in, etc.
Also the cliff is too close to the mineral lines. Someone could put a cannon on the lowground and bring his probe back up or something and just deny mining from the base. And with it being so far from the main entrance there's basically no way to stop the cannon from getting up.
Looks like a really cool map though. Better than the blizzard maps by the looks of it :D 2v2 maps ftw!!
Ah, yes, I see how canon rushing from there is indeed subject to abuse. I'm fine with the warp-in possibility, and made some modifications to limit drop abuse, but the canon thing is a problem. Thanks for pointing that out.
To resolve it, I could move the rocks to the entrance of the back path instead, but I'm not sure I like four bases behind one ramp very much (Twilight Fortress does it, but it's a huge map, very macro by 2v2 standards). I'll think about it and come up with something.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
That back door is such a huge burden  map would be a lot better without it - or at the very least with the rocks positioned further away. I think moving it to the front is a good idea. There is also a lot of gold expos on this map, I think more regular bases would be nice.
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I really like the aesthetic; looks really pretty. ^.^
That said, I'm not an expert in balance, but I think the cannon rush comment is valid. I'd also like to point out that with cliffs you get elevator abuse--not sure if you wanted that or not. Anyway, great work!
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Hello guys, thanks for the feedback, it's appreciated ! I'm glad to see that aesthetics are pleasant to mroe than just me 
I eventually decided to remove the back route entirely. The back expo has been relocated in an outside position where it is easy to expand. I added a small ramp at the front, right next to the main ramp : this one is blocked by rocks which should be destroyed to facilitate defending the expansion, although players are not forced to do so.
+ Show Spoiler [updated overview] +
Regarding gold bases : I think that providing an incentive to agressive expanding (towards the enemy) is a worthy cause. This is not the first 2v2 map with 4 gold bases, Khaydarin Depths and War Zone already have that feature (Tyrador Keep has 3). However, should play testing prove that the side expansions are too easy to acquire/defend, I am very willing to turn them into regular yield ones.
Thanks again guys, keep the comments flowing
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Map is really beautfiul, it makes me want to quit starcraft and go have a walk on the countryside  it looks a bit like a cossacks 2 map
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It's pretty, but way too big and complicated.
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Hey guys, thanks again for the feedback
Now that the back expand is removed, I'm going to move stuff around and make the in-base expand less complicated (will not be two levels below main base anymore). This will also save space and allow me to make the playable area smaller, by cutting some of the top and bottom edges.
I don't think it will make the map way simpler or way smaller, but hopefully it adresses at least part of your concerns.
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Update ! I proceeded to tighten the in-base expansions and remove the previously existing rocky cliff. Here is what it looks like now.
+ Show Spoiler [in-base expansions] +
With this change, I could cut an entire water tile (8 units) both on the top and bottom edges of the map. Playable bounds are now 138x172.
+ Show Spoiler [overview] +
This intermediary version of the map has been published on B.net EU (current version is 0.7) so I can start working on detailing the main base. It's still time to share your comments
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Wow that looks really good.
I'm not really sure if its a huge problem, but can't the main get lowgrounded like lost temple (place a bunch of siege tanks and such) if you're like double zerg or something? It's not really a big deal I guess.
You might be able to stick in another expansion somewhere. Maybe on the other side outside the main? Maybe turn the islands into expos? I dunno, just a thought.
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On October 29 2011 11:45 DoubleReed wrote:
Wow that looks really good.
I'm not really sure if its a huge problem, but can't the main get lowgrounded like lost temple (place a bunch of siege tanks and such) if you're like double zerg or something? It's not really a big deal I guess.
You might be able to stick in another expansion somewhere. Maybe on the other side outside the main? Maybe turn the islands into expos? I dunno, just a thought.
Hey, thanks for your feedback !
I have never encountered a slow push strategy in 2v2. It may be because I'm not playing at a high enough level, but I think it's more likely that the team dynamics simply do not favor them. So you may very well be right on low ground sieging, but I think that, as you put it, it's not really a big deal.
Regarding an extra expansion, this is something I have considered. For now, I'm sticking with Blizzard standards : 4p 2v2 maps normally have 7 bases per team ; the only exceptions are Monlyth Ridge which has 6 and Twilight Fortress which has 9. I will not use the islands for expansions, because I don't want to make the actual play area larger than it already is. However, the location on the other side outside the main could indeed be used for an expansion, with minor terrain reworking. I may do something there one day, but the lack of high-level feedback on 2v2 maps makes it hard to know if pushing beyond Blizzard standards is a good thing or not.
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Update ! I have finished texturing the main bases. I finally decided against any doodad there, as the texture mix already gives enough variety and there isn't a lot of space.
+ Show Spoiler [overview] +
+ Show Spoiler [angled overview] +
Besides making a couple of aesthetic changes here and there, I also moved the rocks blocking the extra front ramp to the bottom of said ramp, as the previous solution (70% scale factor) produced bad results with the fog of war. Why Blizzard would make all the square obstacles fit on single or double ramps, except the 4x4 rocks, will forever remain a mystery to me.
This version is available on B.net EU (v0.8) ; I will likely send it to the TL map conterst later today, as I will be unavailable in the following days.
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I really like it. I think the center of the map is awsome and map looks cool and still has space to move. =D
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Thanks L4mppu
I added a rock texture lining to the cliffs of the main bases, in order to make a clearer distinction between high ground and low ground (a player-perspective issue that only affected the south base, but I did both for symetry). Also made some minor aesthetic changes to various mineral lines. Map is published as v0.10 on B.net EU.
For those interested, some real-life pictures that may relate to this map (also added to OP) :
- low ground : Sabarmati River floodlands (India)
- middle ground : Val Terbi (Switzerland)
- high ground : South Dakota high plains (USA)
Finally, the map has been submitted to the TL contest.
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Some minor changes :
- cosmetic adjustements to some doodads' variations and alignments (changes do not affect gameplay).
- slightly extended map bounds in all directions, because it hurt my heart that the B.net overview would cut some parts of the map.
- added a water tile to the bottom of the map (outside of play area) to prevent a visual glitch.
I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone who contributed feedback in this thread or outside, that feedback was invaluable in helping me reach a stage where I obtained an honourable mention in the Team Liquid Map Contest !
As a last note, I have made my own working version of the map private on B.net. The point is to use the TLMC version as reference.
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LOVE IT!!!
People should make more 2v2 maps. I think people should follow your example and make more 2v2 maps. I was kinda suprised people didn't try to enter more 2v2 maps in to the contest.
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On November 12 2011 05:21 thezanursic wrote:
LOVE IT!!!
People should make more 2v2 maps. I think people should follow your example and make more 2v2 maps. I was kinda suprised people didn't try to enter more 2v2 maps in to the contest.
Thanks
I think that most serious mappers aim for their maps to be "competitive". In large part, this is because the only way that a map can achieve some level of visibility outside of a small circle of fellow map-makers is if it's featured in a tournament. Since almost no tournament takes 2v2 seriously, it follows that almost no mapper takes 2v2 seriously.
The TL contest offered an opportunity for some team maps to be brought in the limelight, and a few mappers seized that opportunity, but even so the teamplay maps that received an honorable mention did not actually win (no prizes etc.). Of course there is the possibility of making it into the ladder pool, that probably would count as a victory, but for now we can only hope that Blizzard will make that move - there is no guarantee that any map will be retained for ladder, at all. On the other hand, the 1v1 finalists will have their maps played in a TL Open Tournament, and the winners will receive valuable prizes. It makes sense that people with a strong line-up of 1v1 maps would focus on that part of the contest.
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Warning: The last post in this thread is over two months old.
If you bump this, you better have a good reason.
As a matter of fact I do ! :p
I updated Fields of Strife with the following changes :
- made the outer expansions regular yield instead of high yield
- the low ground surrounding said expansions is now entirely unpathable, and has been slightly reworked for aesthetics
- minor texture improvements in a few places
- made custom melee available, for people who want to play with AIs
+ Show Spoiler [overview] +
The map has been uploaded to B.net EU under version number 1.0.
(note to mods : I can't update the OP because the edit link is unavailable, can you help on that issue ?)
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Hey this map really looks good even though I think you should maybe give it a couple more expansions, so every player can at least have 3 bases? right now there are 12 blue bases and 2 gold bases, which is very much a small number for a 2v2 map I think.
My suggestion would be to put an expansion right under the LoS blocker in the main, near the ramp, that would make it easier to get more expansions.
I think I played this map a long time ago, but I am not sure ^^ what I can say besides to add more expansions is that it seems the middle is very chokes compared to the area near the main ramp which is very open, I don't know if that is good or bad, what I can say that I see a Protoss / Terran team having problems expanding since there is so much area to cover, but I think we shall wait and see.
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Hey moskonia,
Just as you counted, there is indeed a total of 7 bases per team, which is exactly the same as every 4 player 2v2 map made by Blizzard, except Monlyth Ridge / Arid Wastes (which only have 6) and Twilight Fortress (which has 9). It should be noted that, when Blizzard retired Twilight Fortress from the map pool, they stated that the excessive (in their eyes) number of expansions was a reason for its retirement.
It is of course arguable that there should be "competition-oriented" maps with more emphasis on macro and multiple expansions, and some mapmakers have done just that (Citadel of Gaia comes to mind), but I personnally have doubts on the matter.
I also wished to produce a map that was very compliant to ladder standards - better, but not revolutionary - in hopes that Blizzard would consider it for ladder roation, but that is another story. At any rate, thanks for your feedback
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Blizzard maps sucks  there is no doubt in that matter, don't try to make a map that is at that level, if your map is good and can be used in competitions it can also be used in ladder. I think 2v2 maps can be and will be competitive in the future, it is important that there will be a good number of decent maps in order for the match up to start being competitive. Yours is already quite excellent, but I think 1-2 more expansions for each team would do it just good
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The 1.0 version of this map is now uploaded to NA under the name (2v2) Fields of Strife. You can find it fastest by looking for "2v2 Fields Strife" since including "of" gives you about a billion other maps. It's published under "SingleReed" but credit is given to Apom in the description.
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But why 4 Xel'naga towers?
Maybe its just me, but...
Ok so its hard to control 4 towers.. but even just running 4 workers there would let you observe anything hostile in good time before it happens..
I'd reduce it to maybe 3 just for the challenge bit.
Anyways great Aesthetics and cool idea for making a habitable colony.
And since the map bounds are what they are, i think 7 bases per side is pretty good.
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I fixed a couple of unpathable terrain issues (thanks to Toboe's feedback), and uploaded v1.1 to EU with these fixes.
Guardian, making defending somewhat easier is - in my opinion - a reasonable goal in 2v2. I agree with you in that I would not want a 1v1 map with that kind of Xel'Naga coverage, but I find it fine for 2v2.
Also it's impossible to hold all four towers, unless you contain your opponents so hard you have practically won, because the central towers are very close to the teams' respective bases. Plus the side towers can be stalemated (is that a word?) if each player sends a worker there, because you can't attack the other side in melee before breaking the rocks.
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Yeah i see what your saying, i just think the possibility to always hug a Xel'naga tower, with your army is gonna have a impact on the gameplay.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/yLalg.jpg)
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