EPTOn September 15 2011 06:27 EatThePath wrote:
Imagine MotM is a "household name" in the sc2 world in several months and all segments of the community actively look to it each month for rejuvenating ideas and well-executed maps. Major tournaments will watch for potential new maps as a matter of course, and players will discuss maps in threads whose length and cacophony of imba! cries rivals patch notes threads. In this environment, if you submit a map that goes as Nightmare Hollow went--with a map thread detailing all kinds of testing, refinement, consideration and reconsideration, etc.--but it doesn't get picked as a finalist... it may get picked up by a tournament organizer who sees it anyway and likes it! This is what exposure will create.
Imagine MotM is a "household name" in the sc2 world in several months and all segments of the community actively look to it each month for rejuvenating ideas and well-executed maps. Major tournaments will watch for potential new maps as a matter of course, and players will discuss maps in threads whose length and cacophony of imba! cries rivals patch notes threads. In this environment, if you submit a map that goes as Nightmare Hollow went--with a map thread detailing all kinds of testing, refinement, consideration and reconsideration, etc.--but it doesn't get picked as a finalist... it may get picked up by a tournament organizer who sees it anyway and likes it! This is what exposure will create.
This is what I've come up with, as well, when trying to envision the future of MotM in light of recent sponsorships. It will be interesting to see if we're right.
On September 15 2011 06:27 EatThePath wrote:
I do have one call to action, however. I would implore all the mappers who start to see success to bring everyone else with them. It's far too early to say that that isn't happening. But it's plain that some of us begin to perceive a tiered mapper community, even if it isn't really. It's been an awesome effort so far. Those of you who garner that wider attention, continue to reach out and support the up-and-comers and the desperate innovators (as I label myself). And in that environment of support, up-and-comers should feel comfortable approaching the shining lights of the map community to work with them, not compete against the prevailing philosophies.
I do have one call to action, however. I would implore all the mappers who start to see success to bring everyone else with them. It's far too early to say that that isn't happening. But it's plain that some of us begin to perceive a tiered mapper community, even if it isn't really. It's been an awesome effort so far. Those of you who garner that wider attention, continue to reach out and support the up-and-comers and the desperate innovators (as I label myself). And in that environment of support, up-and-comers should feel comfortable approaching the shining lights of the map community to work with them, not compete against the prevailing philosophies.
Beautiful, I love the vision you have for this.
Consider the following a notice of alert for those trying to make this come about, though.
To illustrate: my mother is one of the best horse breeders in the Arabian Horse Industry, of this I have no doubt. Her horses are consistently healthier, better balanced, clearer thinkers, friendlier, and with less genetic defects than the majority of popular horse bloodlines out there, while still retaining the desirable Arabian look. I mean, maybe I don't know as much as I think I do when it comes to these thing, but it is clear she excels at it, and that's all that's neededs to be known to illustrate the point.
Now, based on what I've seen of her experience and from her discussions, there are roughly three categories of people with knowledge on breeding and raising horses:
1) Those who know nothing
2) Those who realized they were ignorant, gained a little knowledge, and now think they know everything
3) Those who realize just how much they don't know, even though they've studied and practiced for decades
4) Those who skip # 2.
# 3 are the professionals. They are excellent, humble, confident, and respectful. They are the people you want to work with.
#2 are often dangerous to the industry (there are those who never become #2, but, unfortunately, it's a very natural mindset to fall into -- I catch myself doing it with almost any new skill I try to acquire, and have to correct my thinking.) I've seen #2s make horses end up dead or traumatize for life, or perpetuate terrible genetic defects, or sink masses of investor money in projects doomed to fail because they only understand small part of they need to. The worst traits are being close minded, and if anything doesn't match up to the bit of knowledge that they have, they dismiss or critize it.
And often they are vocal about their opinions, spreading their ignorance to #1s. They also often can become condescending and dismissive of #1s, when the only real difference between them is a week-long seminar.
Part of the reason #2s exist because the world is far more complicated than we want it to be or we either expect it to be simpler than it is, or decide that what he know is the truth of it to reassure ourselves. Those who avoid falling into this trap, who skip from 1 to 3, are those who remain curious and recognize that mastery of the task takes more than a lifetime.
I do believe map making is simpler than breeding, training, raising, developing, managing etc... a horse operation, so perhaps "more than a lifetime" does not apply. But, it will probably take at least a decade of consistent mapping, and maybe not even then.
So, to you I say: do not become #2s. Keep humble in your knowledge. It's a treasure to have gained and wonderful to share, but it is tiny compared to theoretical absolute knowledge of map making. Remember that you have only explored a part of that knowledge, and someone else may have explored a different part, and you are only harming yourself by rejecting their knowledge because it's not what you know.
It would be amazing but unlikely if there never is a #2. We're probably going to have to deal with them. Matching their condescension and arrogance with your own is not how it should be handled, that achieves nothing but creating a hostile environment, division, and leaves them in their ignorance. The best I understand how to help is to educate the receptive ones and ignore the most bullheaded ones -- they've set their path at that point, there is little you can do to change it.
Wow that got long. But, really, this is something that would really benifit the community to be aware of. I've seen part of the horse industry torn up because of it, and I don't want this creative group to experience it with their pants down. The most active mappers read this thread, hopefully we can minimize the division and strife by being aware and prepared. I don't want to be preachy, take it or leave it.
<3s
(Of course, remember those categories are very general. They illustrate a trend, not that everyone is exactly one of those, and I don't mean to be condescending with that explanation. This is just the trends and issues I have observed.)
Anyway, FoxyMayhem, how on earth did you get grandmasters to play on your map?? I would love that, but I can't ever settle on one map of mine that I think deserves to be perfected to that degree, let alone find access to that level of testing input. ;D
Well, ya see, heh heh... I've got friends. I'm also a pretty personable, occasionally funny guy to talk to on skype -- although I probably come off a bit stiff-in-the-collar on the forums. Eh, I blame text-base communication. This relevant because testing with them becomes "just hanging out" instead of the more bothersome "will you do me a favor, peeeeezzz".
NOT the answer you wanted to hear, amirite? For some reason my diamond level friend/clanny has like 12 high masters players on his list, who in turn have grandmasters on their lists. Being in a clan helps, too.
To be honest, it's the masters players who help most: they tend to be willing to play more games and execute more experimental and exploitative strategies, since they're not having to face perfect 4gates or whatever. I'd suggest sticking with them until you feel you're map is closer to that tournament level. Still, Grandmaster testing is great once the map has seen a lot of diamond and master level testing and appears to be balanced: there are some balance issues that only they can reveal.
If you've (or any of the mappers here) have a baller map that needs testing, though, I might be able to hook you up. I've had them test other people's maps before. Like I said, though, grandmasters are for "I think it's already done and balanced" stages. If I give them faulty maps to play on they are going to be much less inclined to assist in the future.
They really don't care about aesthetics, though, so that doesn't need to be finished. I like checking out other peoples matches and talking with the mapper while games are going on, so hit me up some time and I'll see if I can get the masters folk to play on it, or talk map stuff.
Skype: psalm.of.fire
SC2: FoxyMayhem.926
Make sure to introduce yourself as a mapper when you add me on Skype, or I might block you. Since I'm making a broad offer to people here, I reserve the right to *not* ask my masters friends and just talk map theory if I see some glaring flaws.
[silly] Actually, let's go one better: if it's worse than Rockstin Rockder (which, let's be frank, every map is) I reserve the right to block you and send the police to your house. Exceptions are at my sole discretion![/silly]
![[image loading]](http://addictionrecoveryhope.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/rockbottom.jpg)
). It's layout seems to borrow multiple proven concepts from some other maps and combine them into something new. It's just a very solid and well-made map and I think it's worthy of a spot in the top 5. 
