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[M](4) LoS_Dark Matter - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 Maps & Custom Games
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 Next All
Randomaccount#77123
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States5003 Posts
August 29 2011 03:31 GMT
#21
--- Nuked ---
SidianTheBard
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2475 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-29 04:12:11
August 29 2011 04:11 GMT
#22
I think I would rather see the map set up more like this...

[image loading]

Reason being is the inbase natural is only a 1/2 base and if you want to take another full base you have to spread yourself out pretty dang far. So now you're most likely going to do some 1 1/2 base timing attack or just some 1 base. I think doing this will make the Third a lot more protected but will still be fairly hard to take. But with the back of the 3rd facing where your inbase natural is you won't have to worry as much about air harass, which there is tons of it currently.

The Red star, I'm in up in the air about it. part of my feels like you should get rid of the ramp there and just make it non-pathable. Would help zergs out with scouting as well because they could park an overlord up there.

Overall it's a great map, I love it a lot although I think it still needs some minor tweaks to make it better.

Does the inbase natural really have to be that big? As of right now there's just as much space at that inbase natural then you have at your main.
Creator of Abyssal Reef, Ascension to Aiur, Battle on the Boardwalk, Habitation Station, Honorgrounds, IPL Darkness Falls, King's Cove, Korhal Carnage Knockout & Moonlight Madness.
Sea_Food
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Finland1612 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-29 04:35:57
August 29 2011 04:12 GMT
#23
I dont think I agree with the los blockers + defensive high ground. Early agression will be really hard.
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
August 29 2011 04:26 GMT
#24
after playing on it multiple times i think that the map is a little too dark, now this isnt a bad thing since units/buildings really pop out from the terrain but maybe some lights could do the trick. its a great start though for the layout, but the entrance needs to be changed a tad.
sam!zdat
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5559 Posts
August 29 2011 05:01 GMT
#25
This map looks really great. Looks like cross positions would set up for some sick lategame, with five easy bases and and interesting high ground feature to battle over, that doesnt directly decide the game ala Antiga.
shikata ga nai
synapse
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
China13814 Posts
August 29 2011 06:43 GMT
#26
This map looks fucking massive. I love it.

Cute thing you did in the center, the map looks great ^^
:)
Samro225am
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany982 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-29 08:35:57
August 29 2011 07:06 GMT
#27
With a regular main and nat setup you would have enough space to make the ccw third saver and have less positional imbalance, but this would be a different map.

besides concerns of positional imbalances - that always occur in rotational three or fourplayer maps - i think this is quite a solid map. and i am looking forward to see your main/nat setup in action!
aRRoSC2
Profile Joined March 2011
Denmark241 Posts
August 29 2011 07:13 GMT
#28
This map looks awesome, would love to be able to have matchmaking on it T_T
Fatze
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Germany1342 Posts
August 29 2011 09:08 GMT
#29
looks awesome
Comfort from bottles, cheers from beers the guitars are our weapons and we know how to kill!
Ragoo
Profile Joined March 2010
Germany2773 Posts
August 29 2011 09:29 GMT
#30
Oh my god an innovative 4p rotational map! Quickly, kill it!

I definitely like the innovation in this one, really want to see how it plays out. I'm a bit concerned about changing the natural to a 6min1gas.

As others have said the main+natural seems to be a bit out of proportion. Normally a main should be around 40 CC units (correct me if I'm wrong) and this one already has near 50 + the natural is huge as well.
I don't necessarily think that's bad but normally you want to keep everything as small as possible, right?^^
Member of TPW mapmaking team/// twitter.com/Ragoo_ /// "goody represents border between explainable reason and supernatural" Cloud
Samro225am
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany982 Posts
August 29 2011 09:45 GMT
#31
On August 29 2011 18:29 Ragoo wrote:
Oh my god an innovative 4p rotational map! Quickly, kill it!

I definitely like the innovation in this one, really want to see how it plays out. I'm a bit concerned about changing the natural to a 6min1gas.

As others have said the main+natural seems to be a bit out of proportion. Normally a main should be around 40 CC units (correct me if I'm wrong) and this one already has near 50 + the natural is huge as well.
I don't necessarily think that's bad but normally you want to keep everything as small as possible, right?^^



i think 40CC already is to big. 25-35 is fine and should be made accordingly to a bigger/smaller nat.
bigger mains are harder to scout (offensivly and defensivly) and easier to drop.

the main is quite circular in shape, so it is not that difficult (50CC size and long/bend is worse), but still it is really big. i do not ask for killing the concept, but at least changing the mai and nat to good proportions. this should free enough space to set the ccw third back a bit and make the map even better.
EatThePath
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States3943 Posts
August 29 2011 10:16 GMT
#32
On August 29 2011 18:45 Samro225am wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 29 2011 18:29 Ragoo wrote:
Oh my god an innovative 4p rotational map! Quickly, kill it!

I definitely like the innovation in this one, really want to see how it plays out. I'm a bit concerned about changing the natural to a 6min1gas.

As others have said the main+natural seems to be a bit out of proportion. Normally a main should be around 40 CC units (correct me if I'm wrong) and this one already has near 50 + the natural is huge as well.
I don't necessarily think that's bad but normally you want to keep everything as small as possible, right?^^



i think 40CC already is to big. 25-35 is fine and should be made accordingly to a bigger/smaller nat.
bigger mains are harder to scout (offensivly and defensivly) and easier to drop.

the main is quite circular in shape, so it is not that difficult (50CC size and long/bend is worse), but still it is really big. i do not ask for killing the concept, but at least changing the mai and nat to good proportions. this should free enough space to set the ccw third back a bit and make the map even better.


I think the analyzer might be counting the whole area including the two high grounds. When you play the map, it definitely doesn't feel too big. Terran will want that extra space at the in-base expansion. Also, since that is all space behind your main choke, who cares what the proportions are? There's no rule that says you need a bigger blob next to your starting CC than anywhere else. ;D

This map is deceptively subtle with how the choke plays out. It's definitely not too easy to defend. You only get a mini expo anyway. I would be in favour of shifting the 3rd just a little bit closer to promote taking the outside expansion. The four bases closest to the center need to be juicier for being so vulnerable, and they should have two geysers so as not to be anti-zerg.

Played a lot of pvp to test out the choke. We all agreed the space outside the LosB should be slightly narrower so you can't avoid stalker fire from either cliff. I don't think 4gate is mandatory because attackers will be taking enough fire walking in, a good 3gate should hold. Sentries are useless though, unless you can pull off a trick by hiding the sentry until they try to walk through a partial wall-in and split them in half. Blink is basically mandatory since there is so much cliff space and so much maneuvering room in general.

Still want to play more games, I'll be around in MOTM channel on NA next couple days hoping for some testing.
Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE
Samro225am
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany982 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-29 12:35:19
August 29 2011 12:35 GMT
#33
On August 29 2011 19:16 EatThePath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 29 2011 18:45 Samro225am wrote:
On August 29 2011 18:29 Ragoo wrote:
Oh my god an innovative 4p rotational map! Quickly, kill it!

I definitely like the innovation in this one, really want to see how it plays out. I'm a bit concerned about changing the natural to a 6min1gas.

As others have said the main+natural seems to be a bit out of proportion. Normally a main should be around 40 CC units (correct me if I'm wrong) and this one already has near 50 + the natural is huge as well.
I don't necessarily think that's bad but normally you want to keep everything as small as possible, right?^^



i think 40CC already is to big. 25-35 is fine and should be made accordingly to a bigger/smaller nat.
bigger mains are harder to scout (offensivly and defensivly) and easier to drop.

the main is quite circular in shape, so it is not that difficult (50CC size and long/bend is worse), but still it is really big. i do not ask for killing the concept, but at least changing the mai and nat to good proportions. this should free enough space to set the ccw third back a bit and make the map even better.


+ Show Spoiler +
I think the analyzer might be counting the whole area including the two high grounds. When you play the map, it definitely doesn't feel too big. Terran will want that extra space at the in-base expansion. Also, since that is all space behind your main choke, who cares what the proportions are? There's no rule that says you need a bigger blob next to your starting CC than anywhere else. ;D

This map is deceptively subtle with how the choke plays out. It's definitely not too easy to defend. You only get a mini expo anyway.
I would be in favour of shifting the 3rd just a little bit closer to promote taking the outside expansion. The four bases closest to the center need to be juicier for being so vulnerable, and they should have two geysers so as not to be anti-zerg.+ Show Spoiler +


Played a lot of pvp to test out the choke. We all agreed the space outside the LosB should be slightly narrower so you can't avoid stalker fire from either cliff. I don't think 4gate is mandatory because attackers will be taking enough fire walking in, a good 3gate should hold. Sentries are useless though, unless you can pull off a trick by hiding the sentry until they try to walk through a partial wall-in and split them in half. Blink is basically mandatory since there is so much cliff space and so much maneuvering room in general.

Still want to play more games, I'll be around in MOTM channel on NA next couple days hoping for some testing
.


this!

it is all about what you do after having the main and nat setup. The space in the main is not an issue, but the space could be used differently really. the "fourth" is something you might want to take to expand away from your opponent in the current setup, but it is vulnarable from the centre. so either the third should be a definite third that you take before going ccw or the third and the fourth have to be equaly save.
Ragoo
Profile Joined March 2010
Germany2773 Posts
August 29 2011 14:11 GMT
#34
Okay just played on it and I take back my previous concerns. The nat and main has fiitting proportions and the nat only having 6mins1gas is great in relation to the third

Aesthetics are nice and solid and from what I saw PvP should play out fine (possibly better than on normal maps cause you can expand easier?!)
Member of TPW mapmaking team/// twitter.com/Ragoo_ /// "goody represents border between explainable reason and supernatural" Cloud
Archvil3
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark989 Posts
August 29 2011 18:13 GMT
#35
Thanks for all the feedback guys, its pretty awesome.

The changes I'm going to be looking at first is to move the third closer to the main choke. Even when you spawn counterclock wise from your opponent I want you to take that as your third and not consider the middle expansion as your third. I think that would cause a positional imbalance issue if you were to take that as your third while your oponent get a much easier defendable third.

Second change is going to be to make the middle expansions full mining bases with 8m2g instead of 6m1g.

I've also had a lot of feedback regarding the choke. Some say it should be smaller to make it a better defendable position. My worry is that it becomes too good and nearly impossible to attack.

I will also have another look at the aesthetics, I hear improvements can be made.

I'm gonna start working on the changes as soon as I get rid of my cold(thanks MLG for messing up my sleep schedule and depriving me of my sleep causing me to leave work today with a cold and a massive headache! )
Let thy speech be better than silence, or be silent.
Archvil3
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark989 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-09-04 17:54:24
September 04 2011 17:12 GMT
#36
First update of Dark Matter

[image loading]

The thirds have been pushed a bit closer to the choke/natural. It was a bit too hard to take and defend when spawning ccw compared to the cw who had a much easier 3rd. I may change it a bit more and push it back further if it's still the case that ccw spawn is worse off then cw.

The middle expansions are now full 8m/2g bases.

I will work on an aesthetic update as well. More creep and destruction of the map to come!

Update available on EU and NA.
Let thy speech be better than silence, or be silent.
Icetoad
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada262 Posts
September 10 2011 03:02 GMT
#37
Man I hope this map gets chosen in MoTM#9 so much unique feature in the map and it plays really well, with the new update
Map Maker of Nimbus
Archvil3
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark989 Posts
November 07 2011 22:41 GMT
#38
Update!

I finally did the update that I wanted to make 2 months ago.

All lowground was raised to highground and all highground was raised to double highground. This allowed me redesign the center and put it on lowground.

The small highground near 3rd/4th that was previously pathable is now covered in doodads and unpathable.


New Overview picture
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Angled Overview
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
Let thy speech be better than silence, or be silent.
The_Templar
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
your Country52798 Posts
November 07 2011 23:00 GMT
#39
This map is genius
ModeratorI am still alive, somehow
TL+ Member
Yonnua
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United Kingdom2331 Posts
November 17 2011 00:00 GMT
#40
I have to say, the more I see this map, the more I fall in love with everything about it.
LRSL 2014 Finalist! PartinG | Mvp | Bomber | Creator | NaNiwa | herO
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