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Ardar Prime 2.0
+ Show Spoiler [Overview] +
138 x 138
Tarsonis Title Set
4 Players
This is my newest map, Ardar Prime. It has a wasteland kind of feel to it, but the acid gives it a more alien feel than most wasteland title sets.
Your natural expansion is easy to defend and has a second entrance blocked by destructible rocks. The rocks will open up a quicker way to get to the gold expansion, making the gold a viable option for a third expansion. Once the rocks are destroyed, you'll be able to move units from the natural to the gold and vice versa quickly, but it will also open up a new attack route for your enemy. The rocks also serve the purpose for Void Rays to charge up on them and then wreck havoc, so you really want to keep an eye on the rocks. The unblocked choke to the natural is 8 units wide and can be walled off with two Barracks and one Supply Depot, making fast expand builds possible.
The XWTs are positioned on high ground near the middle of the map off to each side. They overlook each side of the middle, including the nine-mineral expansions. They do not overlook the center plateau though. Behind the XWTs are destructible rocks, which can be destroyed to create a new path into the nine-mineral expansion. This can be a new attack route, but also make it easier to rally units to the XWT.
~Feedback is greatly appreciated!~
~My Map Thread~
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There's no place at all for Z to get a surround :/ I'm pretty sure I can zone the map with 4 forcefields
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The acid makes it look really, really shiny!
Haha, the shiny is pretty interesting, reminds me of something out of 40k.
Is this a melee map idea as well? If it is, is it possible to spawn close positions?
Otherwise, good XNT placement, I like the possibility for a risky gold expansion.
Interesting map! (As per usual).
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On January 16 2011 06:12 iGrok wrote:
There's no place at all for Z to get a surround :/ I'm pretty sure I can zone the map with 4 forcefields
I think (as a zerg/protoss player) that the surround possibilities on the high ground, especially with the many ramps into and out of said high ground, makes it a good place to attack and to defend.
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@ iGrok - The most notable places where Zerg would be at a disadvantage would be their natural choke and the backdoor choke. Also, now that you mention it, the middle does look a little bit tight. I'll probably move the XWTs and make that area more spacious. I might also add a ramp on each side from the middle plateau, we'll see.
@ Homework - You can spawn adjacent to each other, so the gold could be contested. I'd find out where my enemy spawns before taking out my rocks  . Glad you like it!
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Hmm.... similar to some of your other maps. You should try rotational symmetry, take a look at some popular Brood War maps with it:
Adrenaline Rush
Byzantium
Return of the King
The map size seems to be an issue on this map. What size is it? Anyway, it looks a bit too big, and that will make games turtly, and likely Zerg favored. You could compact the map and try to make it fit into ~136x128 bounds. You'd probably have to remake it, and rework the mains and naturals to eliminate the wasted space.
The natural doesn't look like it has enough space behind the mineral line. You should give it some space for turrets/static defense; proxy space is typical too on Blizzard maps. Not a big issue, very minor.
The backdoors are unique, but I they're in favor of T or P; the backdoor makes rush distances shorter, and is also extremely choked. Zerg will have a hard time being aggressive with the backdoor is opened, because they opponent (P or T) will just waltz in through the choked pathway. Maybe you could open up the High Yield area, and make the backdoor a less viable path (lowground maybe?)
Anyway, I think you'd be good at making rotational symmetry maps. Maybe try it sometime!
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I think the tight chokes work very well for zerg play as well, especially at the backdoor. With forewarning, a fungal growth in the correct position could stall any pushes for ages, and allow you valuable time to adjust your army to flank or surround.
Zergs can use chokes to their advantage, as well.
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If you pull the gold out into the water more and make that a bigger area, that should negate the backdoor disadvantage somewhat. I think opening up the middle as you said would really help
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On January 16 2011 06:26 Homework wrote:
I think the tight chokes work very well for zerg play as well, especially at the backdoor. With forewarning, a fungal growth in the correct position could stall any pushes for ages, and allow you valuable time to adjust your army to flank or surround.
Zergs can use chokes to their advantage, as well.
Yes, Zerg can use chokes to their advantage. But at top Z play, you really need to be on 6 gases for infestor tech, if you're constantly pumping units anyways.
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Does anyone know how to manually resize images? I'm having trouble with the TL automatic image resize.
try using paint if you have it. easy resizing by percentage or pixels. the resize button is right in the middle of the top banner. only hard part is getting the right image format for paint.
Edit: also really like the map! what are the rush distances btw?
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On January 16 2011 06:28 iGrok wrote:
If you pull the gold out into the water more and make that a bigger area, that should negate the backdoor disadvantage somewhat. I think opening up the middle as you said would really help
That's a good idea, moving the gold back would allow me to move the center plateau back with it, or just stretch it out. I can see that there is wasted space in between the adjacent mains, and I don't really use islands on any of my maps, but its either islands or move the golds back.
I still want to keep the backdoor rocks, that was one of the original qualities of this map that I want to keep. I'll probably resize them or change the orientation of the "bridge" if the golds are moved away from the center.
EDIT: @ Homework - I don't know the rush distances but the map size is 136 x 148.
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On January 16 2011 06:31 iGrok wrote:
Yes, Zerg can use chokes to their advantage. But at top Z play, you really need to be on 6 gases for infestor tech, if you're constantly pumping units anyways.
I'll concede your point.
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I just played a few games on my map, and here's what I have to say about it.
Rush distances are not that long, except for cross positions. They are long enough for you to get away with a Hatchery before your Spawning Pool (or so it seems, I haven't been rushed yet, and do that normally on any map). The XWTs have no purpose in cross spawn games, and reveal a rather small area. I'm thinking about adding two on the northern and southern sides of the center plateau.
None of the games that I've played lasted very long (no one got a third). The rocks were also never destroyed. I'm going to upload replays soon, so stay tuned.
If anyone is ever interested in testing any of my maps, go to the channel "obs". If I'm online, I'm usually hosting 1v1 games on my maps.
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On January 16 2011 06:21 monitor wrote:Hmm.... similar to some of your other maps. You should try rotational symmetry, take a look at some popular Brood War maps with it: Adrenaline RushByzantiumReturn of the KingThe map size seems to be an issue on this map. What size is it? Anyway, it looks a bit too big, and that will make games turtly, and likely Zerg favored. You could compact the map and try to make it fit into ~136x128 bounds. You'd probably have to remake it, and rework the mains and naturals to eliminate the wasted space. The natural doesn't look like it has enough space behind the mineral line. You should give it some space for turrets/static defense; proxy space is typical too on Blizzard maps. Not a big issue, very minor. The backdoors are unique, but I they're in favor of T or P; the backdoor makes rush distances shorter, and is also extremely choked. Zerg will have a hard time being aggressive with the backdoor is opened, because they opponent (P or T) will just waltz in through the choked pathway. Maybe you could open up the High Yield area, and make the backdoor a less viable path (lowground maybe?) Anyway, I think you'd be good at making rotational symmetry maps. Maybe try it sometime!
Check out Noon Hill and tell me what you think. It's a lot smaller than my other maps.
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This map is going to be remade to make better use of the space and to shrink it down to a reasonable size.
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Well you say you are remaking it, one thing I think that would be difficult is taking a safe third. Vertical positions reminds me of metalopolis where the third is really difficult to take except for terran who get a huge advantage with a planetary there.
Cross positions seem pretty good, looks like a large distance and would be easy for zerg to macro up, but it would also be hard to make an effective surround anywhere but the center so that sort of counteracts that. Horizontal also seems quite nice with the Shakuras-esque short paths and plenty of options when expanding.
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On January 17 2011 00:36 Tomo009 wrote:
Well you say you are remaking it, one thing I think that would be difficult is taking a safe third. Vertical positions reminds me of metalopolis where the third is really difficult to take except for terran who get a huge advantage with a planetary there.
Cross positions seem pretty good, looks like a large distance and would be easy for zerg to macro up, but it would also be hard to make an effective surround anywhere but the center so that sort of counteracts that. Horizontal also seems quite nice with the Shakuras-esque short paths and plenty of options when expanding.
One of the main reasons why I am remaking this map is because I actually played a cross spawn ZvP and wrecked the other player, who was better than me. I scouted his push, and made roaches before his zealot/sentry army got to my natural. Then after a few bad FFs, I ate his army then his natural.
In the remade version the thirds will be easier to expand to and the middle might be redesigned a little bit.
Thanks for your feedback.
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HUGE update.
+ Show Spoiler [Overview of 2.0] +
Tell me if I'm heading in the right direction with this. I totally redesigned the middle and edges, made more efficient use of the empty spaces, and shrunk the overall map size from 136x148 to 138x138.
I haven't added LoSBs or any other doodads for that matter yet.
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2.1 update.
Fixed some unpathable areas on the map and made the center plateau less choked, with a high groud piece in the middle for Overlords or units if you want to drop them. The side towers blocked by the rocks have been removed.
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Looks even more alien then before! I love the new placement of everything, and the "backdoors" look awesome.
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On January 18 2011 03:47 Homework wrote:
Looks even more alien then before! I love the new placement of everything, and the "backdoors" look awesome.
Thanks!
The image is a little out of date, the center XWTs have been removed and some of the holes/puddles have been filled in, but the design is really similar to the overview.
I might change the main's ramps so that they face more towards the natural, which would make fast expanding a bit easier, as long as defending your natural and main's ramp at the same time. I'll update the image when I release v2.2.
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Woh you went berserk with the middle, would like to see how you've changed it. With all those paths it would be easy to get a surround but an experienced terran or protoss could reduce their surface area really well in the middle of that. I actually didn't mind the Xel'naga towers, was there a specific reason you removed them? Too powerful in their old positions?
Anyway looks pretty great as it is, much better than anything I could come up with.
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On January 18 2011 13:48 Tomo009 wrote:
Woh you went berserk with the middle, would like to see how you've changed it. With all those paths it would be easy to get a surround but an experienced terran or protoss could reduce their surface area really well in the middle of that. I actually didn't mind the Xel'naga towers, was there a specific reason you removed them? Too powerful in their old positions?
Anyway looks pretty great as it is, much better than anything I could come up with.
Thanks, I try to make all of my maps original.
The XWTs were too powerful at their old positions, that's why they were removed, you're right.
I'll be running customs on this and Noon Hill for maybe an hour or so, so anyone reading this, go on B.net and join channel "obs"!
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/oOlxB.jpg)
