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![[image loading]](http://oi52.tinypic.com/2q9a0w0.jpg)
*Banner thanks to Jiiks*
+ Show Spoiler [changelog] +9 dec 7:52 am
-thread now includes voting system rules
-reworded sections including the submission guideline
TL map of the month competition!
Date: 00:00 18 Nov - 23:59 17 Dec for entries, KST (which is the TL time in the top right)
-Maps are melee and designed for 1v1, therefore has 2-4 spots for players, as is standard anyway.
-Once entered, a map cannot be re-entered during subsequent monthly competitions, in order to encourage new entries as opposed to slightly revised maps monthly
-Contestants may enter as much as they feel like, participants are asked to not enter things that they believe to be incomplete just so they can make more entries
Submitting a map here means you are entirely happy with your entry, if it wont be ready in time, dont rush it and enter next months competition instead, updates to your map will not be considered if you posted an earlier version
Original maps only- no BW ports!
Reward: $5 US paypal, mostly the fame of being best of the month. The subsequent competitions prizepools will consist entirely of any donations anyone is willing to give; any donators would have a mention here regardless of amount.
Judging; will be via a vote - THERE WILL BE VOTING REQUIREMENTS AS FOLLOWS
-tl staff and recognised players can vote
-others will need to read the posts in this thread http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=174059
post a picture of your map, post a link to its forum thread, and optionally (preferably) what you think seperates it from the rest, what you like about it, why it should win blah blah.
No comments on: oh this tournament sounds good etc, potential donators to a prize pool are to pm me so i can search through entires easier (well i tried on this one anyway)
final note: this thread may be amended as necessary, ill make it obvious when it has been
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Judging by voting won't work imo. Too many low level players who think a map is good just because it has a natural and a third.
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I still believe voting is the preferable system. If just the top mappers decide, they either won't decide fairly or, if they do, people will still accuse them of doing so. If they aren't allowed to both vote and submit, it will severely hurt the overall quality of the maps.
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wasn't the idea the map would be featured on the front page?
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A bunch of people should be put together to decide the MotM, try to pick people of all kinds (actual mappers, casual gamers, competative gamers etc.) so it is the most fair. Voting won't cut it as people with no mapping experience at all can impact the results with random votes at a map that they just remotely like.
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Nice! voting would be the best method imo. Unless you got like top players or TL staff to vote.Im gonna spend like 6000 hours on my map then fuck yeah. Iccup better watch out!
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As it was said in the other thread, this is a great idea.. However I don't think you're the person to host it as you really have nothing to offer.
Let it be an official TL thing, made by the staff - who can then bring in pros to play the shortlisted best maps or just to look at the map analysis pictures. Just a vote is a terrible idea aswell, too many people who don't have a clue what is good/bad in a map will vote - making them meaningless.
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On November 18 2010 23:13 WniO wrote:
Nice! voting would be the best method imo. Unless you got like top players or TL staff to vote.Im gonna spend like 6000 hours on my map then fuck yeah. Iccup better watch out!
If you spend like one and a half years just on a map, you have deserved the win, lol.
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I'll call all Nightmarjoo's fake accounts hahahaha
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On November 18 2010 23:20 Shirolol wrote:
As it was said in the other thread, this is a great idea.. However I don't think you're the person to host it as you really have nothing to offer.
Let it be an official TL thing, made by the staff - who can then bring in pros to play the shortlisted best maps or just to look at the map analysis pictures. Just a vote is a terrible idea aswell, too many people who don't have a clue what is good/bad in a map will vote - making them meaningless.
thats ludicrous, just because a person isnt a member of the staff doesnt mean they cant run a tournament on the site, the staff have enough to do without worrying about this monthly map making tourney, theres enough of the organisation side of things that even someone whod never played sc before would be able to help out
that said, any staff or pro-gamers who wish to help judge it are encouraged to
final note; quit talking about the voting system and start submitting some maps 
On November 18 2010 23:22 Koagel wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2010 23:13 WniO wrote:
Nice! voting would be the best method imo. Unless you got like top players or TL staff to vote.Im gonna spend like 6000 hours on my map then fuck yeah. Iccup better watch out! If you spend like one and a half years just on a map, you have deserved the win, lol.
im just trying to imagine 6000 hours of making the same map now :O
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On November 18 2010 23:28 Cyber_Cheese wrote:thats ludicrous, just because a person isnt a member of the staff doesnt mean they cant run a tournament on the site, the staff have enough to do without worrying about this monthly map making tourney, theres enough of the organisation side of things that even someone whod never played sc before would be able to help out that said, any staff or pro-gamers who wish to help judge it are encouraged to final note; quit talking about the voting system and start submitting some maps
The whole idea was to get the map featured on the front page, or something similar like a stickied thread etc so people can see it.. A random thread in the custom maps section isn't what I, or most people I think, had in mind.
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you should figure out how people are going to vote before maps start rolling in.
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see, the problem in letting everyone vote is that although everyone here is awesome and knows everything about starcraft, maps take refined skill to observe correctly. I think if you did led EVERYONE vote, a majority of the votes would go to the longest comment on the first page, or the one that looks coolest. I vote for a panel of judges, like maybe ICcup mapmakers.
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On November 19 2010 00:06 Munk-E wrote:
see, the problem in letting everyone vote is that although everyone here is awesome and knows everything about starcraft, maps take refined skill to observe correctly. I think if you did led EVERYONE vote, a majority of the votes would go to the longest comment on the first page, or the one that looks coolest. I vote for a panel of judges, like maybe ICcup mapmakers.
no way man. they should put their best map here as well. it would be sick if like all of tl voted and we had a really great map come out of this. if anyone is singled out as the only voters it would have to be legit pros/ lead staff from tl. but i still say everyone 
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On November 18 2010 23:43 Shirolol wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2010 23:28 Cyber_Cheese wrote:thats ludicrous, just because a person isnt a member of the staff doesnt mean they cant run a tournament on the site, the staff have enough to do without worrying about this monthly map making tourney, theres enough of the organisation side of things that even someone whod never played sc before would be able to help out that said, any staff or pro-gamers who wish to help judge it are encouraged to final note; quit talking about the voting system and start submitting some maps The whole idea was to get the map featured on the front page, or something similar like a stickied thread etc so people can see it.. A random thread in the custom maps section isn't what I, or most people I think, had in mind.
everything has to start somewhere, telling the admins that they should be doing this isnt the best way to go about it
making all competitors vote on someone elses map/lose a vote if they dont?
well whatever, heres the basic layout
+ Show Spoiler +Map Example Name![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/VqbLd.jpg) /link to map thread/
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On November 19 2010 00:13 Cyber_Cheese wrote:
everything has to start somewhere, telling the admins that they should be doing this isnt the best way to go about it
No one actually said that..
Nevermind, have fun in your thread.
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dezi
Germany1536 Posts
So you're only allowed to post 1 map for the contest per month and it must be a completly new map or are we allowed to use our old maps, polish them and use them within this upcoming contest?
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On November 19 2010 00:21 dezi wrote:
So you're only allowed to post 1 map for the contest per month and it must be a completly new map or are we allowed to use our old maps, polish them and use them within this upcoming contest?
post as many maps as you like, but they have to have been posted on tl, and subsequently updated etc then finalised and pasted here within the date range, this ensures that every new month sees new maps, and not old ones that didnt win recycled over and over
$5 reward for winner added
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dezi
Germany1536 Posts
Ah, so i'm allowed to use them only once during a contest. That's fine, so i can use my already made maps right now :D
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actually now i think about it yea, just making an 'only use each map once rule clears that up alot'
editing the op
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This is a good idea but I would like to see the rules to be more clear in the op.
Plus I would say that one map/person is better because I see a lot of participants in this competition.
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That's a really nice idea and everything, but as already mentioned it wouldn't be THE map of the month, but a map of the month of some contest by some guy from TL. What I try to say is that it wouldn't have any impact at all. Sure, the mapmaker who wins will feel good but it doesn't mean that the map would be noticed by people or even get played in tournaments (sure there's a certain possibility this might happen but let's face it, it's not very big) and I thought that't what it was all about.
Recognition by the mapping community is really nice, but who else except the mappers themselfes and a couple other peeps even visit this forum? I don't know actually but I'd say not a whole lot. If you really want to go somewhere with this I think you should get toghether with someone and maybe combine it with a invitational tournament or something where the top 3 maps would be played.
Of course it would be awesome if TL officially helped to promote custom maps but I think it's really cool that you make the effort and try to change something. It's just not recommendable to just do something without any preparation and elaborate plan.
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On November 19 2010 01:24 FlopTurnReaver wrote:
Recognition by the mapping community is really nice, but who else except the mappers themselfes and a couple other peeps even visit this forum? I don't know actually but I'd say not a whole lot. If you really want to go somewhere with this I think you should get toghether with someone and maybe combine it with a invitational tournament or something where the top 3 maps would be played.
Of course it would be awesome if TL officially helped to promote custom maps but I think it's really cool that you make the effort and try to change something. It's just not recommendable to just do something without any preparation and elaborate plan.
and:
Guys I think there are a lot of different ideas coming together in this thread. as someone who kind of pushed the idea of a MotM I feel I should try to contribute to the discussion.
I mean it is nice that everybody likes the idea, but the commnity should try to become a clear picture of what they want and what is possible.
probably we all should try to find the key points to make MotM successfull. lets collect all ideas, make a big poll on lots of stuff and then ask someone from the TL staff how they could help us (mappers and players I think) with a front page feature, use of the map in a tourney, etc. probably IICup wants to give away a wildcard one-time entry? 
in my opinion most important question is:
who will be part of jury or will it be community vote only? I think if you want to have a MotM that is really woth something you need some restrictions. if everybody tries to take art with lots of maps 'all made this month' it is difficult to judge. and if you have an open poll where anybody could vote for a map....I mean everybody should be able to say what they think deserves to win, but clicking in a poll is easy, but judgin is difficult.
my suggestion is a jury of three or five: e.g. (1) TL staff + (1) community poll + (1) last winner. or if iicup is in, then someone from there staff as an expert as well. everybody puts down a name a winner. if here is a tie then vote again on all tied/best maps.
everybody can send any single melee map into competition (one map per mapper) as often as he or she likes no mater when it was made, tested, published, patched. once a map has won MotM they can't be proposed again.
there is no 2nd or 3rd. only 1st.
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I say, just let anyone vote, provided they send a replay of them playing all of the maps ( a full game, not like 6 pooling on each map). Just limit the entries each month to 3 or 4.
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On November 19 2010 02:12 Chriamon wrote:
I say, just let anyone vote, provided they send a replay of them playing all of the maps ( a full game, not like 6 pooling on each map). Just limit the entries each month to 3 or 4.
and what are the guidelines for such a limitation? which 3 or 4 maps are selected for the competition?
or do you want to have a limitation of three of four maps each mapper? that wold be insane. if only mapper contributed that are cappable of producing 4 maps a month, I am unsure what the overall quality would be...
On November 19 2010 00:45 Cyber_Cheese wrote:
actually now i think about it yea, just making an 'only use each map once rule clears that up alot'
editing the op
not too fond of that.
lets say you have 5 maps that you think have a shot at winning. you send them in in month 1 to 5. none of them wins although they are like 2nd, 3rd or 4th best each month. then you have to produce new maps each month. I know there are some people who do not produce a lt, but good maps. I think MotM is about showcasing quality maps.
what i in month 7 there are only few really good entries? and all he really good stuff that was already in the competion once is not alowed anymore? then a maper would propose one of his less good maps >> the overall quality will be lower.
if you want to have high quality consistenly then MotM should allow multi-proposing one map.
think about it: when people produce something knew they will think about: is this map better than my last? and this is exactly where people will be more critical towards their own maps and start to become better. overall custom melee map quality will be much better then.
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On November 19 2010 02:12 Chriamon wrote:
I say, just let anyone vote, provided they send a replay of them playing all of the maps ( a full game, not like 6 pooling on each map). Just limit the entries each month to 3 or 4.
i like the replay idea, but i think just one map is fine.
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can we dissallow iccup map makers ?
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On November 19 2010 02:35 TibblesEvilCat wrote:
can we dissallow iccup map makers ?
they should be able to submit maps as well.
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On November 19 2010 02:35 TibblesEvilCat wrote:
can we dissallow iccup map makers ?
That's not really fair, they should be allowed to submit maps.. Iccup or not, if it's a great map we'll all want to see it. Even iccup maps don't get the recognition some of them should, so this is a good chance for them too.
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I think the overall idea is pretty neat. Perhaps the map submitters should remain anonymous to reduce bias although some people may be able to tell who made the map by looking at the layout/doodads.
On November 18 2010 22:15 neobowman wrote:
Judging by voting won't work imo. Too many low level players who think a map is good just because it has a natural and a third.
I'm more worried it will come down to a matter of which map looks the best, in which case Koagel should be instantly banned from entering and be made a judge.
On November 19 2010 02:35 TibblesEvilCat wrote:
can we dissallow iccup map makers ?
Don't worry, we won't cheat.
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I'm digging the idea, but it would be nice to get some maps to actually see--ironically i'm not contributing a map--so that some sort of judging could start off.
Also, just so that way the MotM actually has some significance, you should probably get together with some sort of tourney, big or small, and let them play on the MotM. I know Day[9] started his Wednesday Night Fights thing, and maybe he wouldn't be too unopposed to having the MotM being one of the maps.
Basically, MotM is fine, but if no tournies use it then it is just $5 bucks for the winner and that's it. No further progress in custom maps would be made. You would just wait till voting ended for the next MotM.
That's my suggestion.
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I vote nightmarjoo should be one of the judges.
+ Show Spoiler +
yearly map of the month! awesome!
On November 19 2010 02:39 WniO wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2010 02:35 TibblesEvilCat wrote:
can we dissallow iccup map makers ? they should be able to submit maps as well.
I know you guys all want some recognition for your work, but honestly there is no good reason why you can't produce a map of equal or greater quality. If you can't, how does your map deserve a win any more than one of ours?
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United States2119 Posts
I believe it was my map thread that got derailed big time with the start of this discussion lol. Anyway, it would give mappers a better chance at advertising and increasing their popularity and reputation, rather than making maps and not hearing anything for months.
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dezi
Germany1536 Posts
On November 19 2010 03:07 prodiG wrote:I vote nightmarjoo should be one of the judges. + Show Spoiler +
yearly map of the month! awesome!
Show nested quote +On November 19 2010 02:39 WniO wrote:On November 19 2010 02:35 TibblesEvilCat wrote:
can we dissallow iccup map makers ? they should be able to submit maps as well. I know you guys all want some recognition for your work, but honestly there is no good reason why you can't produce a map of equal or greater quality. If you can't, how does your map deserve a win any more than one of ours?
I'm strictly against rules that disallows people to participate. Even the Iccupers aren't perfect so lets compete all together ^^
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On November 19 2010 03:07 prodiG wrote:I vote nightmarjoo should be one of the judges. + Show Spoiler +
yearly map of the month! awesome!
Show nested quote +On November 19 2010 02:39 WniO wrote:On November 19 2010 02:35 TibblesEvilCat wrote:
can we dissallow iccup map makers ? they should be able to submit maps as well. I know you guys all want some recognition for your work, but honestly there is no good reason why you can't produce a map of equal or greater quality. If you can't, how does your map deserve a win any more than one of ours?
It's nothing to do with the quality of the maps, it's about the influence iCCup has. If a competition like this was decided by a public vote I can pretty much guarantee an iCCup map would win every time simply because people who know absolutely nothing about map balance/making maps would vote for it because they assume it's a quality map when realistically it might not actually be the best.
If you want a competition like this to be truly fair, some key stipulations would be:
1) Anonymous map entries (author/map name unknown).
2) A panel of judges with zero affiliation to any mapmakers (they shouldn't know anything about who made the maps either).
3) A totally unbiased organiser, who does not take part in judging the competition.
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On November 19 2010 03:43 dezi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2010 03:07 prodiG wrote:I vote nightmarjoo should be one of the judges. + Show Spoiler +
yearly map of the month! awesome!
On November 19 2010 02:39 WniO wrote:On November 19 2010 02:35 TibblesEvilCat wrote:
can we dissallow iccup map makers ? they should be able to submit maps as well. I know you guys all want some recognition for your work, but honestly there is no good reason why you can't produce a map of equal or greater quality. If you can't, how does your map deserve a win any more than one of ours? I'm strictly against rules that disallows people to participate. Even the Iccupers aren't perfect so lets compete all together ^^
everybody in. blizzard employees working on maps in their free time? total newbies? iccup mapper? all in!
seriously, who wants to win a title 'best of economy class'. competing with iicup maps will strengthen the quality of the competition.
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Oh great, now the topic's just gonna get out of control through tons of ideas, of which a lot are just terrible. Try to find a solution and define the exact course of action publicly in the TL forums, that's gonna work out for sure!
But seriously, there are 2 camps that would be able to make such a project work without coupling it with tournaments, which are TL and iCCup and I think neither of them will do something about it. I like the optimism of everyone, what I don't like is the "let's do it right now it's gonna be awesome"- attitude. That has the potential of destroying all the motivation when you launch something and it doesn't turn out quite as you imagined it because you didn't take enough time to think it through.
But yeah I mean, just give it a try and if it fails miserably it's gonna be forgotten after a few weeks anyway.
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Good idea. But there's no need for any prize money, we're all happy mappers and the fame is more than enough
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On November 19 2010 03:59 FlopTurnReaver wrote:
Oh great, now the topic's just gonna get out of control through tons of ideas, of which a lot are just terrible. Try to find a solution and define the exact course of action publicly in the TL forums, that's gonna work out for sure!
But seriously, there are 2 camps that would be able to make such a project work without coupling it with tournaments, which are TL and iCCup and I think neither of them will do something about it. I like the optimism of everyone, what I don't like is the "let's do it right now it's gonna be awesome"- attitude. That has the potential of destroying all the motivation when you launch something and it doesn't turn out quite as you imagined it because you didn't take enough time to think it through.
But yeah I mean, just give it a try and if it fails miserably it's gonna be forgotten after a few weeks anyway.
although I also have the impression that there are some people who scream for more (easy) attention (for their maps) and who might not be into a really competitive competition, I want to ask you to contribute!
TL won't do anything. there you are completely right. but I want to add: unless there are some good ideas that are actually possible. I do not want to leave the idea of a map of the month to try that might fail.
lets try to take some control by listing possible options:
1.patron to oversee the competition and support: TL staff or someone who is well known in the community.
there is no other option.this person or these persons are responsible for it. so if this project should have a chance to come to being: his is the first and most important point.
also there should be a tourney featuring the winner or the three best maps.
2.who can take part:
or why are we interested: everybody want to get recognition, playtime, replays and a win. you get the win, when your map is the best map in the competition.
A) everybody should be able to propose his map
B) no iccup
C) no euros... (seriously the broader the spectrum, the higher the competition and the better the win)
> no option here in my opinion.
3.what kind of maps:
A) melee
B) custom
C) melee + custom
D) specific mode (e.g. 1v1, 2v2,...)
4.restrictions on number maps:
A) map produced in a specific time
B) one map per mapmaker
C) any number of maps
D) x maps
5.how many times can a map be contributed:
A) when produced (see 4A)
B) once
C) twice
D) until it takes the win
6. who decides on the winner:
A) community vote
B) jury
C) TL staff
D) famous mapper as a representative of mappers ('vote for your judge')
E) tourney.organizer
F) last month's winner
G) any combination of above mentioned
what else is important?
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I make one comment on some thread and go to bed and I wake up to this... what in the world.
Here's how I see it:
The maps should be submitted and then there should be a panel of 3-4 judges. The judges should consist of a respected map maker, a progamer, a TL staff member, and a "guest" judge (last month's winner). There would be submissions each month and the panel would take all of the submissions and they would decide the top maps (3-5). The top maps would be put to a vote for all of Team Liquid to decide the map of the month. In my opinion this is the best compromise and should satisfy everyone's concerns as to how the award is decided. The panel would be able to judge the maps on the correct merits and only the best maps would be put to a vote.
We could also create score cards that would decide the best maps. For example, 50 points for game playability, 30 for innovation/creativity, and 20 for aesthetics. Adding up to 100 points, scored by the judges and the maps with the highest point totals would go to a vote. Plus, it would be nice if the judges would place comments on the score cards and they were given back to the map creators so that they could see their scores.
The biggest problem is convincing the judges to actually participate by taking the time and effort to judge the maps. Getting respected judges on the panel would be the only way for this competition to see any legitimacy and get the recognition that people want. I think this is a great idea but it needs some endorsement from someone with clout to work. Even if iCCup decided that it would hold a competition where the winning map would be included in the their next month's map pool, I think that would be significant incentive to win.
I'd like if the maps were limited to 1v1 melee maps only to make judging easier. In my system, I think that the "top" maps should not be able to submit the same map the following month, but all other maps can be submitted again if they have had changes or revisions. In order to make judging easier I would also think that there should only be one submission per person per month and the winner of the previous month should not be able to submit (especially if they become a guest judge).
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Haha yeah please a ton of work for the judges, that should motivate people to volunteer.
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On November 19 2010 04:24 Samro225am wrote:although I also have the impression that there are some people who scream for more (easy) attention (for their maps) and who might not be into a really competitive competition, I want to ask you to contribute! TL won't do anything. there you are completely right. but I want to add: unless there are some good ideas that are actually possible. I do not want to leave the idea of a map of the month to try that might fail. lets try to take some control by listing possible options:1. patron to oversee the competition and support: TL staff or someone who is well known in the community. there is no other option.this person or these persons are responsible for it. so if this project should have a chance to come to being: his is the first and most important point. also there should be a tourney featuring the winner or the three best maps. 2. who can take part:or why are we interested: everybody want to get recognition, playtime, replays and a win. you get the win, when your map is the best map in the competition. A) everybody should be able to propose his map B) no iccup C) no euros... (seriously the broader the spectrum, the higher the competition and the better the win) > no option here in my opinion. 3. what kind of maps:A) melee B) custom C) melee + custom D) specific mode (e.g. 1v1, 2v2,...) 4. restrictions on number maps:A) map produced in a specific time B) one map per mapmaker C) any number of maps D) x maps 5. how many times can a map be contributed:A) when produced (see 4A) B) once C) twice D) until it takes the win 6. who decides on the winner:A) community vote B) jury C) TL staff D) famous mapper as a representative of mappers ('vote for your judge') E) tourney.organizer F) last month's winner G) any combination of above mentioned what else is important?
1) not really an option, but I like what the post above me said, where you have 3-4 judges deciding finalists for all of TL to vote on, which seems to be kind of what you are saying.
2) I'm voting for A
3) A
4) B (don't want to have a flood of maps from one guy)
5) D
6) A
I think the voting process is most important to get the specifics for. If you don't work that out, then it is just making up stuff as you go along and we have a whole mess of a competition.
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@boomstevo: I am with you on many points, but FlopTurnReaver is riht with the workload.
I think a pre-vote from the community will do it to have 'MotM promotions' -
and then a group of judges picks the winner.
pseudo-objective legitimating never works on such a subjective topic like a map.
edit:
@ elkram: I did not mean to have a poll this thread but collect all options.
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On November 19 2010 06:24 Samro225am wrote:
@boomstevo: I am with you on many points, but FlopTurnReaver is riht with the workload.
I think a pre-vote from the community will do it to have 'MotM promotions' -
and then a group of judges picks the winner.
pseudo-objective legitimating never works on such a subjective topic like a map.
edit:
@ elkram: I did not mean to have a polli this thread but collect all options.
Sorry I just see letters next to numbers and I think to myself "multiple choice section." Habits from middle and high school, as well as college.
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dezi
Germany1536 Posts
On November 19 2010 04:24 Samro225am wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2010 03:59 FlopTurnReaver wrote:
Oh great, now the topic's just gonna get out of control through tons of ideas, of which a lot are just terrible. Try to find a solution and define the exact course of action publicly in the TL forums, that's gonna work out for sure!
But seriously, there are 2 camps that would be able to make such a project work without coupling it with tournaments, which are TL and iCCup and I think neither of them will do something about it. I like the optimism of everyone, what I don't like is the "let's do it right now it's gonna be awesome"- attitude. That has the potential of destroying all the motivation when you launch something and it doesn't turn out quite as you imagined it because you didn't take enough time to think it through.
But yeah I mean, just give it a try and if it fails miserably it's gonna be forgotten after a few weeks anyway. although I also have the impression that there are some people who scream for more (easy) attention (for their maps) and who might not be into a really competitive competition, I want to ask you to contribute! TL won't do anything. there you are completely right. but I want to add: unless there are some good ideas that are actually possible. I do not want to leave the idea of a map of the month to try that might fail. lets try to take some control by listing possible options:1. patron to oversee the competition and support: TL staff or someone who is well known in the community. there is no other option.this person or these persons are responsible for it. so if this project should have a chance to come to being: his is the first and most important point. also there should be a tourney featuring the winner or the three best maps. 2. who can take part:or why are we interested: everybody want to get recognition, playtime, replays and a win. you get the win, when your map is the best map in the competition. A) everybody should be able to propose his map B) no iccup C) no euros... (seriously the broader the spectrum, the higher the competition and the better the win) > no option here in my opinion. 3. what kind of maps:A) melee B) custom C) melee + custom D) specific mode (e.g. 1v1, 2v2,...) 4. restrictions on number maps:A) map produced in a specific time B) one map per mapmaker C) any number of maps D) x maps 5. how many times can a map be contributed:A) when produced (see 4A) B) once C) twice D) until it takes the win 6. who decides on the winner:A) community vote B) jury C) TL staff D) famous mapper as a representative of mappers ('vote for your judge') E) tourney.organizer F) last month's winner G) any combination of above mentioned what else is important?
2 a
3 a
4 b
5 d (but i dont think a map that has been sent in will have a chance the next month but maybe 6 months later)
6 g (c+d = b)
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2a
3a
4b
5b
6 is kinda hard, although e and f would be stupid. Maybe a community vote and a jury then decides between the top three? (I like the concept of involving the community in the contest, as it may get more people interested in it)
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Hyrule19031 Posts
Samro's post confuses me. The contest is about finding the best maps, and yet he proposes no ICCup team and no Euro....and states something about having a broader spectrum?
Regardless, I don't really see this doing much for promoting maps without some backing by high level players to decide the winner, or some kind of featured status with TL (obviously both is preferable).
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dezi
Germany1536 Posts
Maybe you just reread his post ...
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On November 19 2010 07:09 tofucake wrote:
Samro's post confuses me. The contest is about finding the best maps, and yet he proposes no ICCup team and no Euro....and states something about having a broader spectrum?
Regardless, I don't really see this doing much for promoting maps without some backing by high level players to decide the winner, or some kind of featured status with TL (obviously both is preferable).
just to make it really clear: I suggest not to have any limitations.
I added an ironic 'no euros' to make it clear that any restrictions like 'no iicup' does not make any sense to me.
and btw: a) b) c) are like options I picked up from several posts and do not represent my own ideas on this topic.
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2b : Reasoning being that ICCUP mapmakers already get a lot more exposure than a normal mapmaker. Has nothing to do with quality of their maps; I just feel like they will have an unfair advantage due to a lot more exposure. Also, I think it will lead to decreased participation from new mapmakers. Many of them will not put in the effort to compete if they perceive themselves at a severe disadvantage going up against ICCUP mapmakers. (much love ICCUP mapmakers)
3a
4d : Limit 2 maps per month. It will ensure that no mapmakers flood entries but have a bit of flexibility with deciding entries.
5d
6g : I like Koagel's idea for this. I think a community vote for what maps make it into the final 3. Then from there a jury decides the winner. I think the jury should be a small group of people that are elected by the community (though this may be too complicated).
If the above g is too complicated of a process I will go with 6a instead.
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can i just ask the OP if we can have original maps only? no remakes.
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Everybody of course should be allowed to enter, but as I said in my post on the previous page the maps should be completely anonymous. Maps with known affiliations or associations will lead to biased votes.
The only downside of this is of course, you can't personally publicise maps that you want to enter in the contest.
On November 19 2010 07:28 WniO wrote:
can i just ask the OP if we can have original maps only? no remakes.
Personally I think it should be original maps only, there's hardly any talent in remaking BW maps imo.
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On November 19 2010 04:24 Samro225am wrote:
5.how many times can a map be contributed:
A) when produced (see 4A)
B) once
C) twice
D) until it takes the win
For me, I think that a map should be only contributed once, with a stipulation. You can only submit a map once, and if it loses, then you can change the map and resubmit it. But there must be something different about it for it to be considered. Honestly, if it didn't win then it probably isn't going to win the next one. Hopefully the makers of the losing maps will at least get some feedback which will allow them to improve it for the next competition.
On November 19 2010 06:19 FlopTurnReaver wrote:
Haha yeah please a ton of work for the judges, that should motivate people to volunteer.
I'd volunteer, but I don't think I'm qualified enough for the position (and it would mean I couldn't participate).
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so i think so far there is a consensus on melee maps.
no more voting for question 3
We're making progress.
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On November 19 2010 07:37 funcmode wrote:Everybody of course should be allowed to enter, but as I said in my post on the previous page the maps should be completely anonymous. Maps with known affiliations or associations will lead to biased votes. The only downside of this is of course, you can't personally publicise maps that you want to enter in the contest. Show nested quote +On November 19 2010 07:28 WniO wrote:
can i just ask the OP if we can have original maps only? no remakes. Personally I think it should be original maps only, there's hardly any talent in remaking BW maps imo.
Well, as I suggested before, if we had criteria for scoring maps it would make judging better and easier. For example you would have different categories such as: balance, viability, creativity/innovation/originality, aesthetics, etc. Each category would would only be allowed a certain number of points. Therefore, if you submit a remake, then they will score very low in the originality category, making it difficult to win.
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On November 19 2010 07:37 funcmode wrote:Everybody of course should be allowed to enter, but as I said in my post on the previous page the maps should be completely anonymous. Maps with known affiliations or associations will lead to biased votes. The only downside of this is of course, you can't personally publicise maps that you want to enter in the contest. Show nested quote +On November 19 2010 07:28 WniO wrote:
can i just ask the OP if we can have original maps only? no remakes. Personally I think it should be original maps only, there's hardly any talent in remaking BW maps imo.
id assumed it was a given, but ill add it to the OP
at this rate, the example map i posted wins by default..
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So how again did this thread turn in to a mapping type of a political debate? This should be rather simple.
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I think maybe TL staff members or select top players should be the only ones allowed to vote or something. Allowing everyone to vote probably isnt the best system.
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Well I think there needs to be two votings.
First one will decide which maps are actually playable.
And second one will decide which is the best out of those.
The second vote can be done by the community but the for the first one you have to get some experienced players or so on board.
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Is there a limit to how many can be sent in per person yet?
And
Can maps that have already been posted in previous weeks in other threads on the TL site be entered? or a new map not previously posted anywhere on the site.
Finally
Do we post maps straight to this thread?
Depending on the answers, I would be posting about 6 maps, 5 from previous threads and 1 that I am currently making for the competition. If the average map maker does the same, the first month competition might be flooded, less so in subsiquent months.
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On November 19 2010 22:44 MAPPoVe wrote:
Well I think there needs to be two votings.
First one will decide which maps are actually playable.
And second one will decide which is the best out of those.
The second vote can be done by the community but the for the first one you have to get some experienced players or so on board.
you cannot give such a workload to 'the judges'. nobody is interested in checking if something is playable...
On November 20 2010 01:15 Archivian wrote:
Is there a limit to how many can be sent in per person yet?
And
Can maps that have already been posted in previous weeks in other threads on the TL site be entered? or a new map not previously posted anywhere on the site.
Finally
Do we post maps straight to this thread?
Depending on the answers, I would be posting about 6 maps, 5 from previous threads and 1 that I am currently making for the competition. If the average map maker does the same, the first month competition might be flooded, less so in subsiquent months.
did you even bother to read more than the thread's title?
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On November 20 2010 02:17 Samro225am wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2010 22:44 MAPPoVe wrote:
Well I think there needs to be two votings.
First one will decide which maps are actually playable.
And second one will decide which is the best out of those.
The second vote can be done by the community but the for the first one you have to get some experienced players or so on board. you cannot give such a workload to 'the judges'. nobody is interested in checking if something is playable... Show nested quote +On November 20 2010 01:15 Archivian wrote:
Is there a limit to how many can be sent in per person yet?
And
Can maps that have already been posted in previous weeks in other threads on the TL site be entered? or a new map not previously posted anywhere on the site.
Finally
Do we post maps straight to this thread?
Depending on the answers, I would be posting about 6 maps, 5 from previous threads and 1 that I am currently making for the competition. If the average map maker does the same, the first month competition might be flooded, less so in subsiquent months.
did you even bother to read more than the thread's title?
moreover; quit bragging and FLOOD THE DAMN THREAD
its more than about time it got one decent map :/
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On November 20 2010 07:26 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On November 20 2010 02:17 Samro225am wrote:On November 19 2010 22:44 MAPPoVe wrote:
Well I think there needs to be two votings.
First one will decide which maps are actually playable.
And second one will decide which is the best out of those.
The second vote can be done by the community but the for the first one you have to get some experienced players or so on board. you cannot give such a workload to 'the judges'. nobody is interested in checking if something is playable... On November 20 2010 01:15 Archivian wrote:
Is there a limit to how many can be sent in per person yet?
And
Can maps that have already been posted in previous weeks in other threads on the TL site be entered? or a new map not previously posted anywhere on the site.
Finally
Do we post maps straight to this thread?
Depending on the answers, I would be posting about 6 maps, 5 from previous threads and 1 that I am currently making for the competition. If the average map maker does the same, the first month competition might be flooded, less so in subsiquent months.
did you even bother to read more than the thread's title? moreover; quit bragging and FLOOD THE DAMN THREAD its more than about time it got one decent map :/
Rules need to be decided before anything happens. As soon as one person posts a map, everyone will post maps and nobody will know wtf the plan is.
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Awesome idea!
Looking forward to the maps and perhaps participating.
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got a sick map almost done. probably post it in a few days. btw has anyone figured out how voting should be done and should we just have another thread for the official list of maps entered?
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Having a seperate thread for the official list of maps would be a good idea. Would make organization easier, also keeping a centralized place for people to look at the maps avoids the problem of having to sift through pages of posts just to find a map.
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On November 21 2010 08:00 WniO wrote:
got a sick map almost done. probably post it in a few days. btw has anyone figured out how voting should be done and should we just have another thread for the official list of maps entered?
All I can say is, start working on maps and be patient (at least another week).
Awesome things to come :D
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On November 21 2010 15:16 iGrok wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2010 08:00 WniO wrote:
got a sick map almost done. probably post it in a few days. btw has anyone figured out how voting should be done and should we just have another thread for the official list of maps entered? All I can say is, start working on maps and be patient (at least another week). Awesome things to come :D
So does that mean we got awesomeness in terms of how we decide a winner, or what? This is a very intriguing post, can you explain somewhat? Or at least give a date?
Did you and the OP collab and shit and make awesomeness?
Or are you just talking about your own map?
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On November 21 2010 15:16 iGrok wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2010 08:00 WniO wrote:
got a sick map almost done. probably post it in a few days. btw has anyone figured out how voting should be done and should we just have another thread for the official list of maps entered? All I can say is, start working on maps and be patient (at least another week). Awesome things to come :D
dude its gonna be sick i just have to wait till the third of december to put it online... so ive been trickin out on the details. this thread isnt as popular as i thought it would be  anyone else been working on any maps?
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On November 27 2010 00:26 WniO wrote:dude its gonna be sick i just have to wait till the third of december to put it online... so ive been trickin out on the details. this thread isnt as popular as i thought it would be anyone else been working on any maps? Yes. Now go stir up some publicity in the general forums.
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Has anyone even bothered to speak to the TL Staff about this? I raise the question not to be rude, but because they can't help if you don't ask.
To that end as well, it'd probably be helpful if you made a case for why this contest would be good for the community. I can think of several reasons myself, but I am tired and would rather see what you guys come up with.
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Might as well just have neobowman 1v1 p4ver in a mapping competition. No one else imo compares to them at all.
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Alright, I'll spill a few closely-held beans.
Myself and a few others have been working to make a huge map competition. As previously stated, it'll be announced "soon". Early december.
The reason for the delay is simple: polish. We want this to be huge, great, and long-term. That takes weeks of planning. I promise you that it'll be worth the wait.
In the meantime, go ahead and keep publishing maps. You'll be given ample time to create new ones once it starts.
If you've got specific questions, pm me! I'm said when my inbox is empty
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Boring day =/
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On November 27 2010 21:24 Jiiks wrote:Boring day =/
added to op and credited you
hmmm was going to wait for entries before deciding how this was judged, but theres still none so...
anyone wishing to take part in the judging pm me with credentials, admins/pros will be auto accepted, others should include a section on why i should choose them
should i allow people who enter a map to take part, such that they cant vote for their own map?
that way its an extra judge w/ map making background
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To keep interest I think it is pretty necessary to have a general vote, with that said I agree that it wont be the most accurate way of deciding a map and should have a elite vote alongside.
Also, is the voting going to be a 1v1 bracket set-up or a certain number of votes per contest etc. etc.
I would also recommend that you make a rule that a map may not be submitted 2 contests in a row (although every second one is fine) so that you see some variation, as well to that end I would think there should be a 2 or 3 limit per account since we don't want to flood it at the start and the map-makers will be forced to pick their best maps.
I would also support some show-matches on the winning map to be played by some pros/semi-pros if it could be arranged. (I would hope for each match-up but that might be hard to arrange)
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sounds like a reasonable requirement, to read your first reply to it at the very least
also your spectator one would be a good background requirement too
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On December 09 2010 08:15 Wrongspeedy wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Isn't that the new bliz map?
No, that is not Plunder Isle.
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DUdeeee i want to know when this thing turns official so i can send in my final map blarrr. i also really like that "what do you like in melee maps" thread but everythings been said
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Keep your eyes peeled for an official announcement in the General forum in about an hour.
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On December 09 2010 12:22 iGrok wrote:
Keep your eyes peeled for an official announcement in the General forum in about an hour.
Sweet! Cant wait to see other peoples maps as well!
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Personally, I think people voting should be required to at least play on the maps first. Remember how horrible people thought Outsider was going to be when they could only look at images?
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/AoGkm.jpg)
