EPTActually I think this makes things ever so slightly easier?
Power Rank 01/01/2011 - Page 45
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flamewheel
FREEAGLELAND26780 Posts
Actually I think this makes things ever so slightly easier? | ||
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mnesthes
5433 Posts
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Mortality
United States4790 Posts
This month is a real bitch. In addition to FJBS you have Fantasy, Zero, Hydra and Snow all stepping up to the plate in a big way. Especially with Fantasy and Zero, if they were a little more consistent they could actually go ahead of FJBS in the ranking. But consistency is an issue. I see very little gap among the top 8 in terms of hotness or skill, which is unusual. You also have Bogus, Tyson, Stats, and Violet all doing big things for their teams and all deserving mention. A couple others like Turn, maybe, could be worth a CBNC, although my one big criticism of Flamewheel's ranking is that he tends to put too many people in CBNC. The CBNC category has only ever been used for players who really were in a position where they arguably deserve a top 10 spot, but there's no room on the ranking for them. | ||
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ISighZ
United States270 Posts
Stork can't be higher than Fantasy obvious reasons Bisu can't be higher than Stork obvious reasons Jaedong can't be higher than Bisu or Stork ( When was the last time Jaedong have a convincing win against Stork or Bisu) The Jaedong vs Stork Bo5 last time. If Stork would just add one more Cannon he would have got that game. I don't remember correctly but pretty sure Jaedong couldn't defeat Stork in late game during that BO5. His wins were due to hydra or something sort of early stuff. All in lings. Jaedong can't be higher than Flash. Seriously in his current form how can he? Sure he has a league but against Flash, he's nothing. I wouldn't mind either Flash or Bisu as number 1 but since Bisu can't be higher than Stork and zzzz this ranking sucks. And if you put Flash number 1, it's not reasonable at all. Sure you can say he is tearing up in Proleague but so is Bisu. But Bisu can't be higher than Stork and Flash can't be higher than Bisu. Fantasy is below Bisu Jaedong Flash. Seriously look at his series vs Calm at RO4, what is that crap.. Stork should really have won this final but he plays textbook style. Stork lost to build order!!! GET SOME ORIGINALITY. I'm tired of people calling Terran imba when the protoss player plays with no originality. The best map to do reaver harass is the map he choose not to go reavers. Ugh so disappointed in Stork. Really used to think he would rival Flash since calling Jaedong as a rival of Flash is just not right anymore. | ||
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Malinor
Germany4716 Posts
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Goragoth
New Zealand1065 Posts
Harder to drop Stork down a whole lot too, after his redemption today. I have no idea what the top should look like now. It's actually not to hard to list the 10 players that should be on the PR, but the order will be a tough call. | ||
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Lightwip
United States5497 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:14 Goragoth wrote: Harder to drop Stork down a whole lot too, after his redemption today. I have no idea what the top should look like now. It's actually not to hard to list the 10 players that should be on the PR, but the order will be a tough call. Stork lost 0-6 in both SLs and then won 2 games off of the mistakes of his opponents(admittedly, an S-class and a semi-S-class one), not really much of redemption. He didn't win when it mattered but rather after it didn't matter anymore. | ||
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Malinor
Germany4716 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:12 ISighZ wrote: Okay.. Ranking... Stork can't be higher than Fantasy obvious reasons Bisu can't be higher than Stork obvious reasons Jaedong can't be higher than Bisu or Stork ( When was the last time Jaedong have a convincing win against Stork or Bisu) The Jaedong vs Stork Bo5 last time. If Stork would just add one more Cannon he would have got that game. I don't remember correctly but pretty sure Jaedong couldn't defeat Stork in late game during that BO5. His wins were due to hydra or something sort of early stuff. All in lings. Jaedong can't be higher than Flash. Seriously in his current form how can he? Sure he has a league but against Flash, he's nothing. I wouldn't mind either Flash or Bisu as number 1 but since Bisu can't be higher than Stork and zzzz this ranking sucks. And if you put Flash number 1, it's not reasonable at all. Sure you can say he is tearing up in Proleague but so is Bisu. But Bisu can't be higher than Stork and Flash can't be higher than Bisu. Fantasy is below Bisu Jaedong Flash. Seriously look at his series vs Calm at RO4, what is that crap.. Stork should really have won this final but he plays textbook style. Stork lost to build order!!! GET SOME ORIGINALITY. I'm tired of people calling Terran imba when the protoss player plays with no originality. The best map to do reaver harass is the map he choose not to go reavers. Ugh so disappointed in Stork. Really used to think he would rival Flash since calling Jaedong as a rival of Flash is just not right anymore. I can see how this made sense in your head, but once written down it really doesn't. That's just a lot of "I look at two players, and whoever won must be above the other" (Bisu-Stork, Fantasy-Stork, Jaedong-Stork/Bisu). And why in hell can't Flash be higher than Bisu, what kind of logic applies here? Because Bisu got totally crushed in the MSL Ro16 instead Ro32 like Flash? And Flash also beat Bisu and only lost once until now? And using Fantasy's win against Calm against him? I don't think your post has reasonable basic assumptions for a PR. | ||
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Holgerius
Sweden16951 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:17 Lightwip wrote: Stork lost 0-6 in both SLs and then won 2 games off of the mistakes of his opponents(admittedly, an S-class and a semi-S-class one), not really much of redemption. He didn't win when it mattered but rather after it didn't matter anymore. Well, to be fair that's what Bisu has been doing all month.  Getting stomped hard in MSL and then winning in WL. | ||
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renzy
Canada781 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:17 Lightwip wrote: Stork lost 0-6 in both SLs and then won 2 games off of the mistakes of his opponents(admittedly, an S-class and a semi-S-class one), not really much of redemption. He didn't win when it mattered but rather after it didn't matter anymore. I would call Bisu's little incidence a tragedy. I still can't get over the fact of what he did with his units...i have no idea what he was focusing on at that time...thinking about his multiple girlfriends waiting for him back at home? =.= | ||
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Monkeyshark
United States406 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:17 Lightwip wrote: Stork lost 0-6 in both SLs and then won 2 games off of the mistakes of his opponents(admittedly, an S-class and a semi-S-class one), not really much of redemption. He didn't win when it mattered but rather after it didn't matter anymore. That is fanboyism so far up your ass. He didn't win when it mattered? I'm sorry? WINNING the SERIES for HIS TEAM doesn't matter anymore? | ||
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NovaTheFeared
United States7212 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:25 Monkeyshark wrote: That is fanboyism so far up your ass. He didn't win when it mattered? I'm sorry? WINNING the SERIES for HIS TEAM doesn't matter anymore? Deep starleague play matters way more than a regular league PL match. | ||
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Malinor
Germany4716 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:31 NovaTheFeared wrote: Deep starleague play matters way more than a regular league PL match. Most certainly, but bouncing back like this and beating Bisu and Fantasy approximately 20hours after that horrible series should account for something. Although Bisu made it pretty easy for him^^. But it's still a win. | ||
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Holgerius
Sweden16951 Posts
If only he had planned better builds for the OSL final.  He fails so hard with the mindgames (totally ignores them?). He should've asked Much for help like the time when he took his gold... | ||
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Lightwip
United States5497 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:25 Monkeyshark wrote: That is fanboyism so far up your ass. He didn't win when it mattered? I'm sorry? WINNING the SERIES for HIS TEAM doesn't matter anymore? A series in the most irrelevant scenario: when his team is doing fine mid-season, when no one is worrying about having to qualify for playoffs. So yes, this didn't matter at all, especially when those wins were from unimpressive play from his opponents rather than his own play. And I say this as both a Stork fan and an SKT fan. | ||
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Monkeyshark
United States406 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:31 NovaTheFeared wrote: Deep starleague play matters way more than a regular league PL match. I didn't argue which one matters more. His post implies that winning for his(stork's) team didn't mattered. On January 30 2011 16:34 Lightwip wrote: A series in the most irrelevant scenario: when his team is doing fine mid-season, when no one is worrying about having to qualify for playoffs. So yes, this didn't matter at all. And I say this as both a Stork fan and an SKT fan. Every damn series matters. What's to say that his team isn't going to lose the next 3 round? Or still stays on the top to qualify? SKT isn't surely going to keep #1 spot yet, hell they might even get kick off top 5 if bisu start slumping. | ||
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ISighZ
United States270 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:21 Malinor wrote: I can see how this made sense in your head, but once written down it really doesn't. That's just a lot of "I look at two players, and whoever won must be above the other" (Bisu-Stork, Fantasy-Stork, Jaedong-Stork/Bisu). And why in hell can't Flash be higher than Bisu, what kind of logic applies here? Because Bisu got totally crushed in the MSL Ro16 instead Ro32 like Flash? And Flash also beat Bisu and only lost once until now? And using Fantasy's win against Calm against him? I really don't think your post has any reasonable basic assumptions at all. Why can he? In terms of recent games, how is he superior than Bisu other than manage to beat him in a BO1. So he manage to beat Bisu once so what? In BO1 anything can happen. You have to take in the game quality. It's more of Bisu gave him the win. And Bisu played more games and he didn't lose in those games. I didn't watch all of his games but he doesn't win games by having better Build. Why can't I use Fantasy Vs Calm series? Fantasy can never be consider a S class or higher than Flash Bisu Jaedong if he doesn't overcome his V Z failures. I didn't watch the RO16 where Bisu got crush if he indeed got crush but I doubt it's worse than Flash game vs Hyuk(Straight outplayed). And if you watch the last 3 or 4 Flash games,he won due to his build. The game he lost to vs Zero is because Zero didn't go for Muta opening. I know a win is a win but BO wins are due to luck. Luck does not equal to power and it's power rank. And you don't think whoever won between 2 player in a BO5 likely make the winner a better player? Yes, there's the game quality to consider. But what's wrong with the logic that between 2 player in a BO5, the winner is the better player. | ||
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NovaTheFeared
United States7212 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:34 Monkeyshark wrote: I didn't argue which one matters more. His post implies that winning for his(stork's) team didn't mattered. Every damn series matters. What's to say that his team isn't going to lose the next 3 round? Or still stays on the top to qualify? SKT isn't surely going to keep #1 spot yet, hell they might even get kick off top 5 if bisu start slumping. That's all fairly useless semantics. Yes, in some sense every series has *some* value, but middle of the season regular match is probably the least meaningful set of games you can get outside of a showmatch. That's why he said it didn't matter. Not that it doesn't matter at all, but that it hardly mattered compared to getting trounced in the finals of the OSL. | ||
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Monkeyshark
United States406 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:44 NovaTheFeared wrote: That's all fairly useless semantics. Yes, in some sense every series has *some* value, but middle of the season regular match is probably the least meaningful set of games you can get outside of a showmatch. That's why he said it didn't matter. Not that it doesn't matter at all, but that it hardly mattered compared to getting trounced in the finals of the OSL. Once again, I am NOT comparing what matters more or less. I am not RANKING Stork anywhere. All I'm saying here is that it matters. And every game in proleague regular season has meaning, it determines if you can get to the playoff. The difference between the #6 and #7 last season was a 2 differential. 2 is a really close number. | ||
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Malinor
Germany4716 Posts
On January 30 2011 16:43 ISighZ wrote: Why can he? In terms of recent games, how is he superior than Bisu other than manage to beat him in a BO1. So he manage to beat Bisu once so what? In BO1 anything can happen. You have to take in the game quality. It's more of Bisu gave him the win. And Bisu played more games and he didn't lose in those games. I didn't watch all of his games but he doesn't win games by having better Build. Why can't I use Fantasy Vs Calm series? Fantasy can never be consider a S class or higher than Flash Bisu Jaedong if he doesn't overcome his V Z failures. I didn't watch the RO16 where Bisu got crush if he indeed got crush but I doubt it's worse than Flash game vs Hyuk(Straight outplayed). And if you watch the last 3 or 4 Flash games,he won due to his build. The game he lost to vs Zero is because Zero didn't go for Muta opening. I know a win is a win but BO wins are due to luck. Luck does not equal to power and it's power rank. And you don't think whoever won between 2 player in a BO5 likely make the winner a better player? Yes, there's the game quality to consider. But what's wrong with the logic that between 2 player in a BO5, the winner is the better player. Aside from the fact that I don't agree with all the comparisions (which obviously is just opinion). What you basically did was just naming around 5-6 scenarios between two players and the result of all these is that there is no ranking possible. For every A>B you have a B>C but C>A. You just say that it's impossible to rank... I would like to hear some suggestions how to solve that dilemma. | ||
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