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Sweet Summer Mafia - Page 97

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
June 09 2024 20:13 GMT
#1921
On June 10 2024 05:10 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 05:03 Trfel wrote:
I was really hoping that Vivax would go after me more and give himself away but unfortunately he backed down

Does anyone have a reason that Vivax might not be mafia? Because I don't really have reservations tbh, besides potentially activity level.

Besides activity I don't have good reasons either. I just clicked filter, saw 8ish pages, and read his doomsday posts with some misplaced enjoyment.

Vivax D1 8 pge filter is pretty good indication he is town though.
table for two on a tv tray
Vivax
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
22145 Posts
June 09 2024 20:14 GMT
#1922
Lol @ doomsday posts.
Koshi
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Belgium38799 Posts
June 09 2024 20:14 GMT
#1923
On June 10 2024 05:11 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 05:11 Koshi wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:10 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:06 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 04:32 Koshi wrote:
There is no way in hell scott is mafia. I read 3 pages and I know enough.

Koshi falling into the classic too many townread trap

is he falling or mafia?

I think falling into it as mafia.

you think youre falling into it as mafia? :D

I think he thinks I am

Good conversation :D
I had a good night of sleep.
scott31337
Profile Joined January 2013
United States2979 Posts
June 09 2024 20:15 GMT
#1924
I've tried to re-read AZ's filter and search my name to try to build a "case" but I don't think I have the energy to and I don't think I could get the message across even If it was awesome.
The biggest thing that still stands is when AZ says I have not changed my views/reads when clearly I had/have.

I'm willing to keep going though because Koshi is such a refreshing voice so far. I know some people can't stand Koshi's play-style, but I enjoy it (as long as he doesn't get personal)
THIS WAGON IS HITTING MAFIA FOR SURE BOYS!
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 09 2024 20:16 GMT
#1925
On June 10 2024 05:15 scott31337 wrote:
I've tried to re-read AZ's filter and search my name to try to build a "case" but I don't think I have the energy to and I don't think I could get the message across even If it was awesome.
The biggest thing that still stands is when AZ says I have not changed my views/reads when clearly I had/have.

I'm willing to keep going though because Koshi is such a refreshing voice so far. I know some people can't stand Koshi's play-style, but I enjoy it (as long as he doesn't get personal)

Eh I love Koshi’s play style

Kinda given up on him as mafia already

Boring
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
June 09 2024 20:17 GMT
#1926
scott can you me a favor?
you think AZ is mafia, can you lay out the reasons he is mafia for?
table for two on a tv tray
die_meatbaby
Profile Joined May 2023
Colombia1344 Posts
June 09 2024 20:17 GMT
#1927
On June 10 2024 05:02 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 04:59 die_meatbaby wrote:
koshi making good town impression btw

why?


he comes into the game. starts making reads straight away. Explains every single read. talks about illogical town/mafia reads from others again with good explanations. Is way too active to be mafia, because he usually puts in less “work” and rather joins other opinions as mafia
Everything has an end only the sausage has two
Vivax
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
22145 Posts
June 09 2024 20:20 GMT
#1928
One cannot not like Koshi.
He‘s the hypno-buddha in the flesh
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
June 09 2024 20:21 GMT
#1929
On June 10 2024 05:07 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 04:58 Trfel wrote:
Vivax
+ Show Spoiler +

Vivax seemed to scumread both scott31337 and Kelsi3r. He spent much of his day 1 trying to figure out which was the better lynch (while suspecting both). See these posts (for example) about his increasing desire to lynch Kelsi3r:
On June 09 2024 07:18 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 09 2024 07:03 Mocsta wrote:
I'm becoming more and more open to lynch outside kelsier

He doesn't looked bullied out to me as his tone is pretty consistent start to finish

I still think his tone specifically to me is more unhelpful mafia than town, however the nonchalantness is somewhat consistent even after which I am.imcreasingly.viewing as townie

...

I really don't want to vote Scott for mason stuff
Is there a case outside of that?
....
Rsoultin I will give sandroba a read


I think the opposite the less Kelsier does the more I want to lynch him.

Feels like a weird defense here if you don‘t have a particularly strong conviction outside of that.
On June 09 2024 07:51 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 09 2024 07:46 scott31337 wrote:
On June 09 2024 07:39 Vivax wrote:
I‘m comfy with Az taking the reins here. They seem competent and townish to me.

Them pitting Oats against me was a bit dickish tho


If you do this, He's going to want to lynch me and I'll flip town.

Only if you lynch him D2 is this a suitable outcome.


There‘s people I think are around but just choosing not to post. Mocsta and him would be my guess.

I‘m moving to Kelsier. He doesn‘t appear motivated anyway.
On June 09 2024 08:45 Vivax wrote:
What I like about scott is that he seemed pretty genuine as of late. He isn‘t really trying every trick in the book to keep himself afloat just doing his thing.

Kelsier might have given up as either alignment.
Then Vivax has this reason to vote for scott31337:
On June 09 2024 09:43 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 09 2024 09:19 scott31337 wrote:
On June 09 2024 09:04 AlphaZero wrote:
On June 09 2024 08:59 Mocsta wrote:
On June 09 2024 08:58 rsoultin wrote:
On June 09 2024 08:47 Mocsta wrote:
On June 09 2024 08:45 Vivax wrote:
What I like about scott is that he seemed pretty genuine as of late. He isn‘t really trying every trick in the book to keep himself afloat just doing his thing.

Kelsier might have given up as either alignment.
town can also not want to be mislynched.. is this 'effort'notion a scott meta thing?


at the risk of answering for viva

if scum's gonna keep posting they want to either

1) try to get the lynch off them
2) shit up the thread

or they just roll over

i guess there's the third option of trying to get more attention so it's off a scummate if you've got two scum up for lynch?

i wouldn't say that's what scott's posting looks like. guy's been scumread from minute 1 and still is just bebopping around
salient notion

alphazero - where does that sit with you?


Well he is trying to survive, to me he just continues to exhibit the traits that o find scummy and I outlined above. Says things and can’t provide foundations or reasoning that can really be taken seriously.


We can even contrast that with your own play, you have looked substantially more town aligned the more you interacted and explained thought processes and your reads have changed and grown as that has happened.

Scott’s reads haven’t changed and he hasn’t looked any better. That is classic mafia trait imo.




I favor Oats more than the last magical time you are making up. That's a change of read.
Rsoul is a little higher on my list as well.
Trfel isn't going to change much today unless he does something stupid.
What's there to change on DMB,sandroba, and Alakaslam? They haven't posted.
Marv isn't coming back tonight from his word.
Kelsi3r - nuff said
Mocsta - I still town read him even if he gets junk from other people. Is still thinking reasonable, unlike yourself.
Vivax - I wouldn't lynch today either.



Show nested quote +
On June 09 2024 09:38 scott31337 wrote:
On June 09 2024 09:33 Vivax wrote:
On June 09 2024 09:29 scott31337 wrote:
On June 09 2024 09:18 Mocsta wrote:
one underlying issue i have with scott is that

when he was getting heat and i backed him, he made some posts that soft buddied to me.. which i thought was completely reasonable if town.

my issue therefore is that, as my read with AZ has shifted and evolved, hes not paid attention (publicly at least) to it.. no comments or impact on scotts AZ read is very weird to me.

now scott says hes completely up to date, so its been read, and apparently not relevant - so again. i find this super super weird and struggling to identify how town would do that.


AZ is not the lynch today unless everyone expands their mind. So forgive me for not spending the energy nested into such.

But he's my #2 still - so help me out - maybe I missed a point of yours.


Excuse me but what do you mean by the bolded.


Town.


Yes. I'm town. But that doesn't answer the question.

If you're so convinced we should lynch AZ which I suppose you are by saying that the mind of town is closed, why isn't he in the list ?
And then this?
On June 09 2024 10:52 Vivax wrote:
Considering the time I‘ll just let Kelsier happen ig
He sounds so sad about lynching Kelsi3r, who he was very content to lynch for much of the day, and was getting increasingly happy to lynch until scott31337 did something that stuck out to him as especially scummy. This doesn't add up from the town perspective, Vivax ought to be at least content with a Kelsi3r lynch.

Then, Vivax has a series of posts after the deadline about scott31337 being town:
On June 09 2024 12:07 Vivax wrote:
Scott is never going to get lynched on D2, and he isn‘t going to get vigged either. Going by experience.

Doesn‘t have to be a bad thing but it means we look for 2-3 outside of him.
On June 09 2024 12:13 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 09 2024 12:09 die_meatbaby wrote:
On June 09 2024 12:07 Vivax wrote:
Scott is never going to get lynched on D2, and he isn‘t going to get vigged either. Going by experience.

Doesn‘t have to be a bad thing but it means we look for 2-3 outside of him.


how about giving a look on ninja rayn or az


Az lookedlike he was posting forcibly around EoD, rayn didn‘t make himself readable.

Townies can have reasons to refuse to be readable. To be honest everyone has good reason to refuse to be readable.

I‘d guess the masons of the day were rayn and Trfel.

The flip doesn‘t automatically make Scott more scummy, if you were town in his situation you‘d understand why, so look at those who think so.
On June 09 2024 12:17 Vivax wrote:
With the Kelsier flip and if he‘s town, Scott starts becoming useful to mafia.
On June 09 2024 12:35 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 09 2024 12:32 Mocsta wrote:
On June 09 2024 12:25 Vivax wrote:
On June 09 2024 12:18 Mocsta wrote:
On June 09 2024 12:13 Vivax wrote:
The flip doesn‘t automatically make Scott more scummy, if you were town in his situation you‘d understand why, so look at those who think so.
help me out, im being dumb dumb

the only reason i can see is this from marv
https://tl.net/forum/mafia/625928-sweet-summer-mafia?page=66#1302

like.. why cant mafia have wagoned kelsier to save scott equally?

i get in marv of rsoultin, he is expecting the most likely answer is double-town wagon; yet, why cannot it not be an effort to save scott equally?


It‘s beneficial to take sides as mafia here. Or maybe look undecided. They only have two buffets to choose from and don‘t have to be active so there‘s zero downside to being active, preferrably on the side of the one who‘s going to remain unflipped.

Without accounting for players who are time constrained or just don‘t care enough.
i see which feeds into my ongoing concerns with how the kelsi3r train was building

i dont want to blanket discard how d1 unfolded for you; heuristically for me, its really hard to not acknowledge the complexities of having 1/3 of town to barely post for the 24hrs before lynch. it makes it hard for me to then follow your interpretation.

i am in agreement with the other post that there should be options outside of scott tomorrow though.


Right ? Wouldn‘t make much sense after a majority decided to spare him.

My next favourite would be the rsoultin slot because theirs was one of the deciding votes.

Not necessarily to lynch but definitely to consider.
Which makes absolutely no sense given that he still strongly believes that scott31337 is mafia. How is not lynching scott31337, who is mafia, a bad thing? That's absolutely a bad thing! Vivax was seemingly frustrated that he had to settle for the Kelsi3r lynch instead of lynching scott31337, why is he suddenly accepting the "majority-decided" verdict of keeping scott31337 alive and why is that a reason to focus on other people instead?

It's not that what Vivax is saying is wrong necessarily, or in other words, it's completely fine to have alternative lynch options to scott31337. But from the perspective of someone who thinks scott31337 is mafia, and just missed out on lynching him, why is his focus on finding other people to focus on (besides scott31337) and what it means if scott31337 is town? Why isn't his focus on scott31337 being mafia? If Vivax was no longer scumreading scott31337 then this makes sense, but that isn't the case at all:
On June 10 2024 00:16 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 00:14 Trfel wrote:
On June 09 2024 23:53 Vivax wrote:
I have a townread on dmb fwiw. She seems very relaxed tonally.

I‘d like a doc on marv.
I‘d like rayn to play the game.

I love GabeN
Is scott31337 mafia still?


I think so. Don‘t understand his post about AZ if he isn‘t.
The end result is that Vivax is very suspicious. There hasn't been the normal insightful thinking or tinfoil, he seemed very happy with the two wagons day 1 (scott31337 and Kelsi3r), despite the odds of both being mafia being quite low. I would have thought this was even more suspicious for someone with paranoia like Vivax, but instead he seems quite content with the gamestate.

What is the core of your case? You believe town!Vivax should be trying to convince the thread to lynch scott more because his mindset is that scott is sure mafia? The fact Vivax is not doing that makes you think that this is mafia!Vivax faking reads.

Because some of the quotes from your previous case felt like it was just Vivax bantering and being at worst apathic about towns capabilities based on previous games and stuff.
Vivax's play doesn't make sense from a theoretical town mindset. As in, I can't put together a mindset that is congruent with Vivax's posting.

If Vivax is down on town's capabilities or chances, that's fine. In fact, that would make sense. See how AlphaZero and marvellosity were so frustrated after scott31337 didn't get lynched? They've only recently stopped complaining about it!

Quote by quote:
1. It's semi-understandable for Vivax to say that scott31337 isn't going to be lynched day 2 and isn't going to be shot by a vigilante. I mean I disagree but whatever. But then Vivax adds "doesn't have to be a bad thing." How is keeping someone alive that he is confident is mafia not a bad thing? The only possible way I could see this not being a disaster is if town manages to find and lynch other mafia... the same town that Vivax isn't happy with performance-wise, right? How does it make sense for Vivax as town to be disappointed in town's performance but also seemingly okay with letting mafia!scott31337 walk free?
2. Why would Vivax recommend looking at people who are thinking scott31337 is more scummy after the flip? The only people who might think this are the people who are trying to lynch scott31337, or at least are thinking scott31337 is mafia.... just like Vivax? So the people who are trying to lynch Vivax's strong scumread?
3. Why does Vivax care what town!scott31337's existence means to a mafia team? He thinks scott31337 is mafia!
4. Vivax says it wouldn't make much sense to not lynch scott31337 because "the majority decided to spare him." I think that's a pretty bad argument, but even if Vivax doesn't, is that argument more compelling than his desire to lynch obviously mafia scott31337? Apparently it is.

Basically, Vivax's posts don't make sense. If Vivax is town, scumreading scott31337, there is no way he should be making those posts.
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
June 09 2024 20:21 GMT
#1930
okay that checks out for you dmb
table for two on a tv tray
Vivax
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
22145 Posts
June 09 2024 20:23 GMT
#1931
I see what Trfel is doing now.
What a nice guy
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
June 09 2024 20:23 GMT
#1932
On June 10 2024 05:21 Trfel wrote:
If Vivax is down on town's capabilities or chances, that's fine. In fact, that would make sense. See how AlphaZero and marvellosity were so frustrated after scott31337 didn't get lynched? They've only recently stopped complaining about it!
.

I am gonna disagree with you here because i 100% disagree with marv's and AZ's efforts here...
table for two on a tv tray
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
June 09 2024 20:24 GMT
#1933
Why are you not scumreading me Trfel?
table for two on a tv tray
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 09 2024 20:24 GMT
#1934
On June 10 2024 05:08 Koshi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 05:06 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 04:32 Koshi wrote:
There is no way in hell scott is mafia. I read 3 pages and I know enough.

Koshi falling into the classic too many townread trap

Nha as long as I don't townread Mocsta Sandroba and for example Slam I am still good. As mafia for sure because I wouldn't expect town to actually lynch my scumreads.

I’m assuming you still think marv is scum so you have 4 non hard townreads, none of which make sense together
No gg, No skill.
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 09 2024 20:24 GMT
#1935
On June 10 2024 05:10 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 05:06 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 04:32 Koshi wrote:
There is no way in hell scott is mafia. I read 3 pages and I know enough.

Koshi falling into the classic too many townread trap

is he falling or mafia?

It’s a trap mafia fall into yes
No gg, No skill.
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
June 09 2024 20:25 GMT
#1936
On June 10 2024 05:24 Oatsmaster wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 05:08 Koshi wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:06 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 04:32 Koshi wrote:
There is no way in hell scott is mafia. I read 3 pages and I know enough.

Koshi falling into the classic too many townread trap

Nha as long as I don't townread Mocsta Sandroba and for example Slam I am still good. As mafia for sure because I wouldn't expect town to actually lynch my scumreads.

I’m assuming you still think marv is scum so you have 4 non hard townreads, none of which make sense together

come on man, he is not unreasonable...
table for two on a tv tray
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 09 2024 20:26 GMT
#1937
On June 10 2024 05:25 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 05:24 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:08 Koshi wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:06 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 04:32 Koshi wrote:
There is no way in hell scott is mafia. I read 3 pages and I know enough.

Koshi falling into the classic too many townread trap

Nha as long as I don't townread Mocsta Sandroba and for example Slam I am still good. As mafia for sure because I wouldn't expect town to actually lynch my scumreads.

I’m assuming you still think marv is scum so you have 4 non hard townreads, none of which make sense together

come on man, he is not unreasonable...

What does this mean lol
No gg, No skill.
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
June 09 2024 20:27 GMT
#1938
On June 10 2024 05:26 Oatsmaster wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 05:25 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:24 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:08 Koshi wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:06 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 04:32 Koshi wrote:
There is no way in hell scott is mafia. I read 3 pages and I know enough.

Koshi falling into the classic too many townread trap

Nha as long as I don't townread Mocsta Sandroba and for example Slam I am still good. As mafia for sure because I wouldn't expect town to actually lynch my scumreads.

I’m assuming you still think marv is scum so you have 4 non hard townreads, none of which make sense together

come on man, he is not unreasonable...

What does this mean lol

It is not unreasonable for him to think scott is town, just because (you?) dont agree.
Like fuck, i dont agree with him but his town case is not unreasonable.
table for two on a tv tray
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 09 2024 20:29 GMT
#1939
On June 10 2024 05:27 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 10 2024 05:26 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:25 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:24 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:08 Koshi wrote:
On June 10 2024 05:06 Oatsmaster wrote:
On June 10 2024 04:32 Koshi wrote:
There is no way in hell scott is mafia. I read 3 pages and I know enough.

Koshi falling into the classic too many townread trap

Nha as long as I don't townread Mocsta Sandroba and for example Slam I am still good. As mafia for sure because I wouldn't expect town to actually lynch my scumreads.

I’m assuming you still think marv is scum so you have 4 non hard townreads, none of which make sense together

come on man, he is not unreasonable...

What does this mean lol

It is not unreasonable for him to think scott is town, just because (you?) dont agree.
Like fuck, i dont agree with him but his town case is not unreasonable.

Koshi mafia because he has too many townreads, is that simple enough for you?
No gg, No skill.
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 09 2024 20:29 GMT
#1940
Nothing to do with the quality of his Scott town case
No gg, No skill.
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