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On November 21 2017 08:03 VisceraEyes wrote:
I don't know what that equation is supposed to represent. I made a joke about Palmar and Holyflare simultaneously because I like both of those guys and I haven't played with either of them in around 3 years. I didn't actually think HF and Palmar were mafia, I was just saying they were mafia with DF because I thought DF was mafia and I was prodding at them.
I see. Please, proceed reading. Would love to hear your take on it.
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On November 21 2017 08:25 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm tempted to lynch Palmar for sheeping on D1. It's not like he was just strapped for time too, he ADVOCATED for his sheeped wagon. He COULD have participated and given god reads D1 as he's wont to do. He chose not to and chose to lynch a strong townie via sheep instead.
I'm kinda bummed that it was likely he was getting modkilled for not voting. The man did not really care about the game, so meh.
Not gonna question your read on him as I don't have one myself.
Anyone else besides Palmar?
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On November 21 2017 02:37 Hapahauli wrote:##Unvote Darthfoley##Vote Sanislav PetrovDarthfoley was a test. + Show Spoiler +Stanislav Petrov failed. Holyflare failed. Tumblewood gets a D-. Stanislav Petrov is all-over-the-place, is throwing shade, and isn't pushing anything coherent. Shortly after giving a lynch list of... On November 19 2017 08:45 Stanislav Petrov wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2017 08:39 Z-BosoN wrote:On November 19 2017 07:57 Stanislav Petrov wrote:Lets just lynch Damdred for prodding Oats and backing off immediately  Kelsier & Ruxxar look like they're doing scummy stuff together. Though without confirming if Ruxxar's game history is true, I rather slightly liked Damdreds point on dumb-telling. But ofcourse Damdred would know if Ruxxar was town since Damdred would know all the scum through association. Z-bozon I like what you're doing, let's get along muchacho! If you can tell us your mafia buddies, I will be more than glad to just chill and get along. Ignore the other person that called you retarded, he's just that mean. Cooperating with us is in your best interests. Btw, let's not get too deep into these web of associations this early on. Who would you choose as scum out of KelsierSC/Ruxxar/Damdred? One pick. I'd love to be able to oblige you but since I'm not mafia I can't. Truly saddens me. Right now the order I'd like to lynch in is Damdred->KelsierSC->One of the lurkers ... he blind sheeps the darthfoley wagon without really ever pushing it. His next two posts are pushing the wagon without really contributing or attempting to figure out darthfoley: On November 20 2017 18:28 Stanislav Petrov wrote:Show nested quote +On November 20 2017 14:46 Tumblewood wrote:
@hf: why is the df wagon okay despite no one trying to stop it? your reasons seem to amount to "he looks scummy", which is fine i guess, but if it's just that he's scummy are you even considering how the wagon forms? like, what would it take to change your mind, or do you just not actually care? You're trying to stop it right now. The 'nobody is trying to stop it so therefore the accused is innocent' argument sound good in theory but has rarely proved accurate in my experience. And that's without considering how disastrous it would be to let that become meta. The facts are darthfoley is the most suspicious person, so we should lynch him. ...and pushing two other players while having his vote on darthfoley. On November 21 2017 02:20 Stanislav Petrov wrote:
I intended to me more active but I've been having a fever with a killer headache so I've just done some casual reading and lurking. But I'll be here aswell untill the lynch aswell but as of now I don't see a reason to switch target.
Oat's have definitely been getting away with doing the bare minimum, spam, unserious accusations and asking non-important questions in a 2 page filter.
On Conversation. If he hadn't voted me I'd say he's done nothing but throw questions into the air and hope somebody else picked them up and pushed them for him which is scum play. But he did vote me but looking at that because it also feels ungenuine to me. He sheeped Kelsier for the case and didn't aggressively accuse me of being scum as much as he voted me as a parking vote to pressure me to come back and explain something fairly non-important. And has no other scumreads. I don't like that it feels like he's both pushing me superhard by singling me out as his only scumread and at the same time isn't pressuring me hard at all but just says come back and explain this and until you do I'll have an alibi for voting you .
Can you give more insight to this test? Did you actually think DF = scum at any point?
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On November 21 2017 08:43 Oatsmaster wrote:
Nah hapa looks fine. Not very useful, but fine.
I really wanna know why conversion assumed that palmar was town though.
I'm inclined to agree but I'm genuinely curious. I'm certain that more can come of it.
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Damn Oats you are actually town aren't you.
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Koshi, Tumblewood, Chezinu. Lots of scum in there.
Conversion I'm sus of I guess? Don't know how to interpret our little exchange.
VE/Palmar might have a rotten fruit, but might not. Definitely one of those two options though.
Need to reevaluate reads on DF, Kelsier, ruxxar, all of which seemed pretty townie to me.
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On November 21 2017 09:01 Oatsmaster wrote:
Chez really?
Elimination I guess. He may have been busy irl, but today was a total no show for him.
He also went through the trouble of finding a particular post I made in 2013 where I was defending him. That can be interpreted either way, either as a mafia brag or as just a random thing that any Chez would do.
He mentioned he was telling me this so as to not get shot by mafia and not to look too townie, but his non-factor today would have been enough for that. Dunno.
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On November 21 2017 09:36 Conversion wrote:
alright before I catch up I want to apologize to Boson
work was pissing me off and I should have just calmed down before posting
going to catch up now
Np man, happens.
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On November 21 2017 11:59 Oatsmaster wrote:hes town
Care to provide justification? I think he and Koshi are very nice lynch bait but they also kinda look like mafia too.
Hapahauli, Koshi, TW are slow-activity posters that we will have a hard time with due to lack of content. They can't ALL be town... can they? -_-
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@Chez
Thanks for this, much feels, but what exactly was the point? It's like the second and third time you are pointing me to previous posts that I don't understand the why. It does not look like you are scumhunting.
+ Show Spoiler +On November 21 2017 14:45 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2012 04:41 Z-BosoN wrote:@Stutters He has been fishing roles all game? I don't remember this, can you please find where? The only thing I can recall is him interpreting a dubious thrawn quote to say why he thinks thrawn is blue. You basically said what's been said all game. YH uses WIFOM, is inconsistent, keeps changing his mind without specifying why. This to me is very scummy, as I've made clear for quite some time. But I will one-up this argument, I think I found something that, in my opinion will give a strong case against him.
Case against YourHarryI will not go over again how stupid and confusing and useless his posting is, how that looks scummy, etc. Ladies and gentlemen, the first thing YH says: I am not sure which meta I will choose this game . I am not sure which meta I will choose this game . I am not sure which meta I will choose this game . He clearly indicated that he wants to follow a certain meta. Apparently, he has already decided which one it is. He is thriving on confusion. Look at some of his quotes from previous games: + Show Spoiler +Release, I am not Grush.
I didn't particularly find lazer monkey's post scummy. This is a newbie game. He is simply providing some guidelines on what townies should avoid - since (I assume) that his previous games have been tainted by vanilla towns claiming power roles.
BTW, I am not OMGUSing Jingle. I just find it difficult to understand why he finds me scummy, since I think I explained myself and answered all of his questions. When someone is focusing his accusation on a player based on reasonable evidence, that someone could be town or scum.
But when someone is stubborn about his accusation on a player, even after the accused player adequately explained himself, I think that someone is likely to be scum. Maybe he is not satisfied with my answers. If so, Jingle, please tell me what you still think I am scum.
Here, someone may question whether my initial vote against Hopeless also makes me scummy for above reason. But as I explained, I don't particularly find him scummy and my initial attempt to incite responses from him and others did partially succeed - mostly in the forms of accusations toward me.
##Unvote
##Vote Jingle Release:
I maintain that it was not an OMGUS battle, at least from my perspective. I had valid reason, at least from what little was available at the time, to suspect Jingle. And if Jingle is scum, my quick reconciliation is not necessarily scummy. At best, it's WIFOM. One can argue that scums would be hesitant to dismiss each other's scuminess, in fear that 1) obvious buddying may make both of them suspicious, exactly how you are suspecting both of us 2) other's scum flip will incriminate them.
Either way, my actions on end of day 1 to place the one of the deciding votes on Hopeless (especially when I previously expressed my opinion that I didn't think hopeless was particularly scummy, I could have easily justified my vote against someone else) and my willingness to vote against Jingle now should make me unlikely to be scum.
Also, in regards to miller providing a difficulty for town victory: miller counters mafia role cop and detective is soft countered by miller. Mafia role cop is gone and detective is still alive. So, miller's value to town is at extreme minimum. Of course, if detective was nonexistant, miller would be as good as vanilla townie. The reason why medic shouldn't claim is obvious. Night2, the scum would roleblock medic and nightkill the detective. Medic role claiming does not allow us to gather any additional information on alignment of other players. However, this means that we must come up with a consensus on who we want to lynch way prior to the deadline so that medic does have a chance to roleclaim if somehow he gets picked to be lynched.
The reason for power role claiming immediately if they received the positive result is also evident. This is because what we will do today would be clearly decided: lynch whoever received the positive result. This also allows medic to anonymously protect the powerrole who got the positive result.
The reason for claiming in order is because we don't want two power roles to reveal their identity unless it gives us additional information. This prevents second power role role claiming just in case they targeted the same player at night. I think detective claiming first makes sense, because it is a more important role - so this allows medic to protect him at night. This is some quotes from his previous game as townie. Notice the difference? He still throws information around a bit, but notice how it is toned down and how much more reasonable he seems. One of the first things I have said in this game is that analyzing meta is weak and doesn't constitute arguments. However, YourHarry has been constantly playing the meta game, and even said so himself in the beggining of the game. He has decided he wants to be as confusing as possible, as random, as wishy-washy as he can. Another thing that I noticed is generally not done is analyzing the nk's. Oh, Jhuyt just died, but he was such a strong scum suspect. O well, WIFOM, scum wants us to think that blah blah blah. Not in YourHarry's case. The only consistent thing he's done is be confusing. I'm sure we can all agree with that. I raise now two points: 1) Why would this be the meta to go for a town YourHarry? Isn't it weird how much better his play was as townie in past games? Why would town Harry want to be as confusing as possible? 2) Jhuyt nk was confusing as hell. This entirely fits YH's profile this game. I cannot for the life of me come up with a better reason to kill JHuyt other than just try to confuse town. Since YH right now is confusion in person, this raises an uncanny coincidence. But Z-BosoN! 2) is WIFOM and analyzing meta is weak! Well, imaginary doubting friend, I don't think that this applies here. YH is strictly playing a meta game, and not ONCE did he abandon it. He's drowning in WIFOM, but I doubt that he would have considered this when deciding who a scum YH would want to kill, because up until now, all we've done is analyze the garbage he jams on his keyboard, but not the overall picture. Let's stop wasting time trying to think what a scum Harry would do, and think more about how a scum Harry would act. So there it is folks, I think this makes a lot of sense, and should give you one more powerful reason as to why YH is SCUM!. Think about it and tell me what you guys think. I think this is the best option right now, I can't think of a stronger reason to lynch someone else. ##Vote YourHarry You were right that he was mafia.
On November 21 2017 14:19 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2017 09:05 Z-BosoN wrote:On November 21 2017 09:01 Oatsmaster wrote:
Chez really? Elimination I guess. He may have been busy irl, but today was a total no show for him. He also went through the trouble of finding a particular post I made in 2013 where I was defending him. That can be interpreted either way, either as a mafia brag or as just a random thing that any Chez would do. He mentioned he was telling me this so as to not get shot by mafia and not to look too townie, but his non-factor today would have been enough for that. Dunno. It's ok Boson!!!! I'm going make tonight. You have to make the mafia think you want to lynch in the morrow. I can crazy by myself!! I can make them think they can lynch me. I love you boson!!! Wounds from friends can be trusted. I see you accuse me to protects me.. I understand.. You're a great friend.
I love you too man, but my heart is heavy. I really don't know where your loyalties lie. You aren't getting shot today I can tell you that. Why are you still going on about that? What is the meaning of it all?
Show nested quote +On July 26 2013 07:56 Z-BosoN wrote:On July 26 2013 07:47 Lazermonkey wrote:
Z-boson, you think Koshi and Malango are scum because their play is very bad for town. I can agree with this in some ways. However, a big part of my problems with both Koshi and Malango being scum is that their play is really bonkers if they are scum. Try to analyze their actions from scum PoV and not only town PoV and see if you see what I see! No, I think Malongo's play is very bad for town, and I haven't read koshi's filter yet. Like I said, I originially thought Malongo's play to be weird-as-fuck to make from a scum POV. However, remember Chezinu from nuclear mafia? Nuking MZ,a townie looking dude, for little reason? I thought that same thing, and disregarded any anti-town play coming up from chezinu. You can't base too much off of one action. What I do know is that Malongo's play is 100% anti-town, and thus town will benefit from killing him, regardless of his alignment. And who knows, he might actually flip scum. Think gumshoe from Nuclear, WIFOM ninja-voting. I do not regret that lynch. Same logic imo. I've played in a game once where it ended up with grush and BillMurray (two vets who are pretty trolly and useless) in the endgame, with DarthPunk as scum. It was sad to see town ignore an uncounterclaimed cop's reads leading to the endgame and then losing, despite the game already been solved. Don't you agree, ShiaoPi? (he was the cop) Anyways, my point is that D1 is likely a mislynch, so lets mislynch someone who we know is bad for town. This will be the case unless Malongo decides to post and contribute with anything useful. If I were a bunker, I would be a bank.
Is this how scum Chez acts?
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On November 21 2017 17:22 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2017 09:40 Conversion wrote:
tbh that hf lynch was a total crapshoot and just makes wveryone (including me) who lynched scummy. I should have used my head and realized that df dying or stan dying was the best outcome since it gives us info It only really makes TW scummy for his weird strategy bullshit and hesitancy around the vote. People keep forgetting that it's townies who do retarded shit and run around like headless chicken. Who do you think is more likely to jump on my terrible wagon that mafia knows is town? Suddenly an experienced player brim filled with confidence starts yelling at everyone in the thread to lynch some dude. Who is more likely to blindly follow, mafia (who knows I'm wrong) or town (who's just looking for a lynch.... any lynch). I'm inclined to believe most of the people who followed me are town.I'm kinda upgrading Oats to town too, but I'm definitely missing at least one mafia in my town reads (as I always do). But that's mostly fine because it's higher % chance of success by hunting mafia in my scumreads.
At least the ones that did so immediately.
Some were a little more hesitant.
On November 21 2017 05:25 Tumblewood wrote:
imma hold out in case someone comes in last second but at :28 i'm switching to hf, a#uming nothing changes
But I agree. Scum are generally more inertial when it comes to moving votes around. People with parked votes on DF:
VisceraEyes, Chezinu, Stanislav Petrov, Koshi
People with parked votes on Stan:
ruxxar
We have to be careful though, as inactivity does not imply scum. Don't really know what the point of this post is. I need to read more.
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On November 21 2017 08:34 VisceraEyes wrote:
I'm pretty sure mafiaHapa doesn't "test" townies, but anyone is free to debunk my feelings there if there's hard evidence to the contrary.
On November 21 2017 20:32 VisceraEyes wrote:
Like....Hapa is really confusing in a really mafia sort of way. He noticed the same thing I noticed about darthfoley, which made me think DF was mafia, and seemed to make him think DF was mafia. However he then comes in and says it's some sort of test? Like, a bait and switch sort of thing? It's just way more likely that he's not reading the game at all and doesn't care. And that's mafia Hapa to me.
Did you not know of this information before? Why does this come to light all of a sudden?
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On November 22 2017 03:03 Damdred wrote:
Maybe im giving bos to big a free pass, he said he would consolidate om stan to save df but with minutes to go hes not making much of a move even when people he thinks are scum (oats) are hard pushimg df.
Its strange some parts of his filter
I thought HF was the best candidate. I had a small heuristic read on Stan that made him a shittier candidate than HF. When Palmar started pushing the HF train I was like "sweet. problem solved"
Though I'm currently failing to see who comes out of this more scummier than the rest. I might also die soon so fuck.
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On November 22 2017 03:29 KelsierSC wrote:
Just about to go to the gym so going to bash out a few thoughts before day 2 starts.
Most importantly who I would want want to lynch tomorrow, TW, rux, conversion.
I don't even think TW needs explanation.
rux's reaction to me leaving and making a joke was super fake anger. , it just shows his weird focus and not really engaging in anything.
Haven't liked conversion all game, still don't.
I'm still undecided on darth I think he's likely town just from how others have interacted with him , like ruxxar said darth was bleeding town at a time where he wasn't bleeding town, just not being as bad as before. That felt like a bonus for df and a minus for rux.
I'm not going to lynch oats, I was pretty irritated by his comment on "why would tw defend df "or something like that so I was in a fuck this guy frame of mind but there's more good than bad, plus he didn't vote hf and stuck on his darth read.
I don't have many town, I like boson and Stan, I liked chez early on but that read was on tone mostly I like VE, VE said something this night phase which was pretty smart but I don't remember exactly what it was. Can't be asked to find the quote but i'll look it up later.
Damdred is sort of weird, I was kind of suspect on him , then when he didn't read me town in a situation where he should have made me call him mafia but he claimed vig, I read PR as mafia so maybe he's real.
Lastly palmar, hapa and koshi.
Palmar and koshi are playing sort of weird but they are both experienced players with a good range so I don't know what to do with them.
I liked hapa because he was one of the first people to vote darth and call him out I think but obviously around vote time I don't know what the fuck happened.
Then again at least one town voted on hf so some people are a little special.
As for me being "anti town" i'm probably the only player in the game who voted on mafia D1.
This isn't the most coherent piece so I will read and answer any relevant questions when I get back from working out
So I make my case against HF, on page 22. I keep pushing him, such as on page 25. Me and Oats discuss the shit out of it. You don't do anything because right before my post on page 22 you say "out till deadline". Sure.
HOWEVER, before that you had this gem of a post:
On November 21 2017 01:41 Koshi wrote:
Opened hapa and palmar tgeir filter. Then decided to open hf filter against better judgement. Now I am very sad.
I have it on good authority that there are 3 mafia. So it is ok to ml a couple times.
This is all the help I will give town today. Maybe I will be mpre generous in future days.
I'm by no means an English major, but that leads me to conclude you did not like what you saw in the HF filter.
So you peace out with the shittiest one liner, telling us to "not screw up".
Then, you shame us with this post:
On November 21 2017 06:05 KelsierSC wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2017 05:57 darthfoley wrote:On November 21 2017 05:54 KelsierSC wrote:
I need to read through what happened. The real question: did we screw it up? yeh pretty fucking baddon't know how TW didn't get lynched. Some comment oats made was pretty fucking special something like "why does mafia tw defend town df"... yeh buddy because mafia never defends town. Oats has played enough games to know that comment is really stupid or he has been repeatedly stomped in the head since we last played. Probably lynch between oats and TW tomorrow.
I was like "huh. to each their own, but I guess he REALLY wanted TW lynched."
Now you shame us again saying:
Then again at least one town voted on hf so some people are a little special.
Having some consistency issues there, dude?
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On November 22 2017 03:43 Damdred wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2017 03:36 Z-BosoN wrote:On November 22 2017 03:03 Damdred wrote:
Maybe im giving bos to big a free pass, he said he would consolidate om stan to save df but with minutes to go hes not making much of a move even when people he thinks are scum (oats) are hard pushimg df.
Its strange some parts of his filter I thought HF was the best candidate. I had a small heuristic read on Stan that made him a shittier candidate than HF. When Palmar started pushing the HF train I was like "sweet. problem solved" Though I'm currently failing to see who comes out of this more scummier than the rest. I might also die soon so fuck. but your stan heuristic of being a new player fumbling was proven wromg and you never reevlusted that read. So you had what seems to be a tr on df near the end but you made very little in the way of waves to try to aave him exactly? and it relied on us moving within like 3 minutes to do so?
Um, read my filter man. I was fighting for the HF (you typed DF but I think this is what you meant) lynch. I was Chief Strategist for Shepherd Palmar. Also, I didn't rely on anything. I wanted the HF lynch to happen, and pushed for it.
The heuristic is pretty shit, I will agree, but it's day one. Not much to go on. It also looked to me like Stan was trying and stuff. Palmar and some other person feel the same way, so I find strength in my claims.
Btw, I might get shot. Are you here? You're town, and I'm town. One of us might get shot today. Let's chat as townsfolk today and tomorrow you can continue your investigation on me. Sound good?
That being said, I'm confused as fuck about Kelsier. I had a fairly strong town read on him but he's doing weird shit.
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If anything came out of the HF lynch is that there is no fucking way that Oats is scum. If he is, I will bow my head and ask for his guidance in future endeavors.
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On November 22 2017 04:16 Damdred wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2017 04:08 Z-BosoN wrote:On November 22 2017 03:43 Damdred wrote:On November 22 2017 03:36 Z-BosoN wrote:On November 22 2017 03:03 Damdred wrote:
Maybe im giving bos to big a free pass, he said he would consolidate om stan to save df but with minutes to go hes not making much of a move even when people he thinks are scum (oats) are hard pushimg df.
Its strange some parts of his filter I thought HF was the best candidate. I had a small heuristic read on Stan that made him a shittier candidate than HF. When Palmar started pushing the HF train I was like "sweet. problem solved" Though I'm currently failing to see who comes out of this more scummier than the rest. I might also die soon so fuck. but your stan heuristic of being a new player fumbling was proven wromg and you never reevlusted that read. So you had what seems to be a tr on df near the end but you made very little in the way of waves to try to aave him exactly? and it relied on us moving within like 3 minutes to do so? Um, read my filter man. I was fighting for the HF (you typed DF but I think this is what you meant) lynch. I was Chief Strategist for Shepherd Palmar. Also, I didn't rely on anything. I wanted the HF lynch to happen, and pushed for it. The heuristic is pretty shit, I will agree, but it's day one. Not much to go on. It also looked to me like Stan was trying and stuff. Palmar and some other person feel the same way, so I find strength in my claims. Btw, I might get shot. Are you here? You're town, and I'm town. One of us might get shot today. Let's chat as townsfolk today and tomorrow you can continue your investigation on me. Sound good? That being said, I'm confused as fuck about Kelsier. I had a fairly strong town read on him but he's doing weird shit. Im not arguing that you werent consistant in wanting to lymch hf, your first two pages are trying to see if anyone is interested in that. I did mean to type df as you said he would not be the lynch today, but if we hadnt of switched he would of been. And you made very little effort to consolidate is my point. I disagree that stan was really trying hard, its more like pulling teeth from him tbh (no offense stan). But yes we will continue our talk
Ah yea, read your post wrong. I had no way to know whose wagon people would jump from. Pushing HF was more important than saving DF so it made the decision really simple.
Also, back to Hapa, this post really stood out to me:
On November 21 2017 02:38 Hapahauli wrote:
Holyflare failed because he's doing the thing where he's being overly antagonistic to his scumreads without trying to be productive. I have generally disliked the way he has pushed DF.
Tumblewood looks bad, but also seems super-lynchbaity. Someone tell me about him so I don't have to tunnel him for the next billion hours.
Wait. He said he wasn't going to be active this game. Why is he trying to make it sound like he would tunnel Tumblewood?
That's a blooper.
This also stood out as a "look at me I care about this game" post:
On November 21 2017 04:45 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2017 04:42 darthfoley wrote:
Petrov only became my public enemy #1 after he was called out for his 180 towards me and his justification was shit.
Which only happened like 3 hours ago. Wtf are you on about Please don't turn this game into a dick wagging contest.
Yep, definitely reconsidering my townread on Hapa. Funny that I just called out VE on the same thing, but I would like to see his reasoning.
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On November 22 2017 04:21 Damdred wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2017 04:03 Damdred wrote:
lol? Why you put a koshi post in a case against kel? Also this boson
LOL. That's a blooper. Fucking K's
Yea scratch that. I though I was looking at Kelsiers filter
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I still want KSC to be clearer as to why he is consistently shaming town despite his play. Seems like someone trying to get town cred I'd say.
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EPT
