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On June 15 2015 10:03 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 09:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 09:50 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 09:46 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 09:44 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 09:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 09:39 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 09:30 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 09:25 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 09:16 MoosyDoosy wrote:
[quote]
It's another slip up on Sulfurus's part that he's Mafia.
As we all agree, Rels is scum. Trfel was the first one to suspect Rels and when we all least expected it. Thus, it would be really weird for Trfel to have been a Mafia as he would have been busing over Rels when no one was really looking into him. Thus, what Sulfurus is suggesting makes no sense.
He's trying to defend himself by offering Trfel as lynch but overlooked that point. Did we not learn from geripts case that mafia slip ups that get caught never are? That was different. geript made a contradiction in his posting. Sulfurus is trying to make a claim that makes no sense. Answer this question: Do you really think Trfel is a Mafia? I want to hear sulfur explanation before I answer that question. That's a way of running away which is not helping your case if you're trying to show you're a townie. It would be better if you answered the quesiton. I already answered this in a previous comment. Then I'm going to have to read you as Mafia. You would have no fear in answering the question if you were actually a townie. I've already answered the question, and you know that. N00bking quoted it a couple pages back. Then please refresh my memory?  Show nested quote +
ruXxar wrote:
n00bking is my #1 townread right now, 100%.
Trfel would be second.
Then there's no need for you to suspect him. Simple as that. I also find it strange that you're asking someone who you said is scum on why they think someone else is scum. If anything else, you shouldn't believe that person's words.
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On June 15 2015 10:14 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 10:08 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 10:03 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 09:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 09:50 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 09:46 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 09:44 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 09:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 09:39 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 09:30 MoosyDoosy wrote:
[quote]
That was different. geript made a contradiction in his posting. Sulfurus is trying to make a claim that makes no sense. Answer this question: Do you really think Trfel is a Mafia? I want to hear sulfur explanation before I answer that question. That's a way of running away which is not helping your case if you're trying to show you're a townie. It would be better if you answered the quesiton. I already answered this in a previous comment. Then I'm going to have to read you as Mafia. You would have no fear in answering the question if you were actually a townie. I've already answered the question, and you know that. N00bking quoted it a couple pages back. Then please refresh my memory?
ruXxar wrote:
n00bking is my #1 townread right now, 100%.
Trfel would be second.
Then there's no need for you to suspect him. Simple as that. I also find it strange that you're asking someone who you said is scum on why they think someone else is scum. If anything else, you shouldn't believe that person's words. I never said I suspected trfel. I want to hear why sulfur does. I already made it clear a few pages back why sulfurs play doesn't make any sense. It echoes the sentiment that n00bking referred to when bats asked why sulf would make such a bold move.
Sulfur is just trying to use someone else as scapegoat to avoid being killed. Again, I don't see why you're trying to listen to Sulfurus when you called him scum. And even if Sulfur tries to defend myself, why are you trying to see the reasoning behind a terrible claim like he's trying to make on Trfel. Unless Sulfurus believes that Rels isn't Mafia, there's no way that his claim on Trfel can make sense. And if he doesn't think that Rels is Mafia, it's basically a clear sign that he is Mafia and that Rels is too.
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batsnacks, wait until Rels and Sulfurus before going for ruXxar.
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On June 15 2015 10:58 WaveofShadow wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 08:45 Sulfurus wrote:
Can someone besides trfel explain to me why he is being so universally town read? I admit looking back his tunnel on rels is better then I thought but that's it. He has spent all his time on this one player and doesn't have good reads on anyone else yet multiple players have put him at the top of their townlists. Yeah, no. I want this dead. No thought into his post or who he's attacking. Once again shows up and posts ONCE and then screws off. ##Vote: Sulfurus
If at least one of those two is scum I want this one first.
Rels did much the same earlier.
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On June 15 2015 11:03 WaveofShadow wrote:
Lol also this moosy vs ruxxar business.
I gotta say moosy you're scaring me a little because if I'm going to get burned by one of you it looks like you'd be the one. I can visibly see you improving in the middle of this game and part of me wonders if it's because you were sandbagging all along.
^.^ Nah. idk if you'll necessarily trust me since this is a game of Mafia, but I'm not scum. Either way, thanks for the compliment. The only reason why I've been improving this much is because I have a whole host of role models and examples in this thread to look at.
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On June 15 2015 12:55 Sulfurus wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 09:16 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 09:08 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 08:45 Sulfurus wrote:
Can someone besides trfel explain to me why he is being so universally town read? I admit looking back his tunnel on rels is better then I thought but that's it. He has spent all his time on this one player and doesn't have good reads on anyone else yet multiple players have put him at the top of their townlists. Please explain why you wanted to defend rels so badly and also why you wanted to lynch trelf. This is very important information, please make it clear to me because I don't understand it at all. It's another slip up on Sulfurus's part that he's Mafia. As we all agree, Rels is scum. Trfel was the first one to suspect Rels and when we all least expected it. Thus, it would be really weird for Trfel to have been a Mafia as he would have been busing over Rels when no one was really looking into him. Thus, what Sulfurus is suggesting makes no sense. He's trying to defend himself by offering Trfel as lynch but overlooked that point. Thank you for the answer but I don't think you understand why I made that post. First off there's no point in me defending myself since I am not at risk to be lynched and Second I'm actually trying to reevaluate on trfel by understanding why others are townreading him instead of being one of those people who just mindlessly tunnel on one person. Anyway your logic is actually really good if Rels is mafia but what if rels is town? Is everything we have on trfel just wrong or is he still town?
Only way to find out for sure is if we lynch Rels.
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I'll work my way back and refute points from there.
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On June 16 2015 00:46 ruXxar wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 23:21 ruXxar wrote:
Im changing my My read on sulfur to town.
I'll explain further when I get home. Here's my reasoning on sulfur: 1. Sulfur under pressure of getting lynched tries to accuse townread trfel of being mafia, and hard defends Rels. This play is so bad that I don't even think a bad mafia would make this play, but still it's possible. 2. After n00bking's epitaph where he recommended to lynch sulfur as #1, moosy went of the offensive. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. Moosy and kick then both HARD agree that I have to bus rels and sulfur as the only chance to clear my name. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:45 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. I'm sorry, why would you vote me out when I agree they are scum? Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:47 Kickstart wrote:On June 15 2015 07:45 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. I'm sorry, why would you vote me out when I agree they are scum? Bussing is a known thing friend. That is why you are last in the line. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:42 ruXxar wrote:
Gaaah, my head hurts real bad right now.
I can't understand sulfurs logic at all.
Why would he defend rels so hard yet make such a terrible play to not become a lynch target.
It makes no sense to me.
His actions are so inconsistent.
On one hand he hard defends rel for god knows what reason,
Then he makes a terrible play that I don't think a mafia would do.
I want some second opinions in this. Sulfurus is just plain scum lol. He's trying to play like he usually does but the role of a Mafia teammate is interfering with his play. On June 15 2015 07:45 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. I'm sorry, why would you vote me out when I agree they are scum? You have no choice but to agree looking at how everyone is voting against them and there's too much evidence against them. 3. I then push really hard on sulfur to get his thoughts on Rels. He STILL didn't want to change his view on Rels and vote for him. If he was mafia scum, and the #1 suspect by n00bking. Would he not also vote for rels to try to clear his name? Any sane mafia person would.4. If I were mafia together with with sulfur, and our only chance of winning was to bus Rels as the first lynch target, would I not instruct my mafia teammate to also vote on Rels? I can only conclude that Sulfurus is Town
First of all, I don't know if you're trying to accuse me of Mafia or trying to clear Sulfurus. It seems like you're doing both which doesn't matter in any case because I disagree with both.
1. Sulfurus is trying to bring Trfel under the light which is a huge mistake. It makes no sense in any way whatsoever. It's either a very bad play or a weak attempt as Mafia to avoid being lynched. There is actually no way to excuse this attempt.
2. The reason I went on the offensive was to clarify n00bKing's suspicions that you might have been Mafia which you inadequately defended yourself on btw.
- I first asked you whether you thought Rels and Sulfurus were scum. You said they were.
- I then pointed out that this might be a case of busing. You pretended or really didn't know what we were talking about.
- I then pointed out that there's no reason for you to listen to Sulfurus's argument as you just said he was scum. For some reason, you kept on associating yourself with someone you said was scum and tried to listen to the basis of an argument that was unsound from the start. At this point you decided to leave and never replied.
- I won't even mention the fact that you're always following one wagon or another as I'm sure people will be able to look through your filter and see how you were always agreeing with almost every case out there.
3. Both Sulfurus and Rels were under fire. If they immediately began attempting to bus each other, it would most certainly be an assertion that they were Mafia. The only thing that they can do at this point is try and defend each other the best that they can. This point is weak.
4. No because both Sulfurus and Rels were primary suspects and are after n00bKing's post. The only reason why you would be able to get away with busing is because mostly everyone thought that you were town and it would be simplest for you to disassociate yourself from them. Which, I'd like to point out, you do by jumping on the n00bKing wagon immediately. Even now you're only revoking your argument because Rels is here and making a case for Sulfurus.
I don't see why you're so scared to make a stand for yourself and persist in wagoning off of other people's arguments.
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On June 15 2015 23:01 Rels wrote:
Hehe sure. I'm still checking if new posts have come from times to times.
I'm suspicious of moosy and scott voting me over Sulfu and doing so while praising noobking's post. I'm also suspicious of them because even before reading their posts, they were the most likely mafia with kickstart in my mind.
I'm actually reading their filters right now, so I'll see if my suspicions are match by their posts.
@Rels, the reason why I voted you over Sulfurus is because I had already made a case against you and I took n00bKing's epitaph as a confirmation for it.
I also admit, I was a bit excited over the fact that we caught Mafia which is why I linked mine, n00bKing's, and batsnack's arguments to Kickstart, since it seemed that he was wondering what had gone down over the course of the thread. And if anything else, arguments against a certain Mafia is the most important part of the game.
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On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches
Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you.
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Does anyone wish to follow this foolish attempt at lynching me?
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On June 16 2015 02:40 batsnacks wrote:
"Safer" is a weird word.
How so? I thought it would be pretty safe to lynch Rels considering the cases stacked against him.
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On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it.
In what way?
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On June 16 2015 02:50 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:26 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you. Alright I can accept this explanation. I responded all the cases you mentioned, did that change your read on me ? The thing about linking your cases to noobking's is still a little, little bit scummy. Obviously it's weak so nobody will lynch you for only this.
If anything, linking my cases to n00bKing's is the opposite of scummy considering that he turned out to be VT as well. Since it seems that no one exactly wants to immediately chop off my head, I'll go back and re-read over everything carefully.
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+ Show Spoiler +On June 15 2015 15:22 Trfel wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 21:52 ruXxar wrote:
So first off.
I'm very disappointed that the night actually started 1 hour earlier than expected.
It didn't give me enough time to analyze batsnacks accusation even though it made sense when he posted it.
I can't tell you his reasons for doing so, but it felt like such an improvised and irregular post that I don't know what to make of it.
All game I had him as scum, and suddenly he makes this one move which totally breaks with his character so far.
I can't help but feel like i've been fooled.
I want to say that I should've stuck to my gut feeling and not be swayed so easily.
If I disregard that one action of his, then batsnacks is still my top scumread. This makes no sense to me given this post here. Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 06:10 ruXxar wrote:On June 14 2015 05:38 batsnacks wrote:On June 14 2015 05:33 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 14 2015 05:32 batsnacks wrote:
Bat Traps™ mafia traps. The highest quality traps for your scum hunting needs. We'll see how right we are after Sulfurus, Rels, and getrip. You don't understand. geript just claimed mafia. Here is geript saying he will sheep Trfel's amazing case on Rels: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 04:54 geript wrote:
Actually, I think I'm going to sheep too. Here is sulfurus's bold post defending Rels: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 05:00 Sulfurus wrote:I didn't want to say anything about trfel before because his vote on Bats was protecting me but he is just straight up wrong on Rels. He makes a post here where he says rels made a bad town read on ruXxar even though (IMO) ruXx is one of the towniest players in the game. He also keeps saying that Rels is tunneled on Plant's only post and he basically dismisses the rest of his filter when in fact it's really good and shows a town who is focused on trying to solve the game. Here is me saying sulfurus's post is bold, I ask why mafia would post such a thing: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 05:04 batsnacks wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 05:00 Sulfurus wrote:I didn't want to say anything about trfel before because his vote on Bats was protecting me but he is just straight up wrong on Rels. He makes a post here where he says rels made a bad town read on ruXxar even though (IMO) ruXx is one of the towniest players in the game. He also keeps saying that Rels is tunneled on Plant's only post and he basically dismisses the rest of his filter when in fact it's really good and shows a town who is focused on trying to solve the game. This is bold. Why does mafia post this? Here geript explains that sometimes mafia like to defend town poorly. geript knows that Rels is town, yet he would sheep Trfel's case on Rels: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 05:08 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 05:04 batsnacks wrote:On June 14 2015 05:00 Sulfurus wrote:I didn't want to say anything about trfel before because his vote on Bats was protecting me but he is just straight up wrong on Rels. He makes a post here where he says rels made a bad town read on ruXxar even though (IMO) ruXx is one of the towniest players in the game. He also keeps saying that Rels is tunneled on Plant's only post and he basically dismisses the rest of his filter when in fact it's really good and shows a town who is focused on trying to solve the game. This is bold. Why does mafia post this? It's not uncommon for mafia to defend town badly. Especially newer mafia. Wow bats... I'm speechless. I had you and geript as my top two scum. I refuse to believe that you would bus your own scum teammate this hard. You really redeemed yourself here in my eyes. I'll have to change my alignment of you to town and change my vote to geript. ##Unvote batsnacks
##Vote geript Please explain. I'm more interested in this than the case on MoosyDoosy that follows.
MoosyDoosy, I know you've explained this a few times already, but I'm not sure I understand. Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 07:57 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 14 2015 07:37 Damdred wrote:
Also day post is at 18:06 for,me and it's 18:36 now Sooo it's right just sucks.
Anyway, who do you think is town/scum Lol, I don't think anything is certain after this. getrip was fine with suspecting both Sulfurus and Rels when necessary and he even voted for both at some point. Not only that, but both Sulfurus AND Rels were two of our top suspects as Mafia. I can't shake off the feeling that getrip just really screwed up by accident and we were jumping on it for no reason. Either way, I think that everyone should look over everything again. You made this post without knowing that geript flipped his alignment. My impression is that you are less convinced that geript is scum, and your worry for him actually being town caused you to be less convinced that Sulfurus and Rels were scum? Is this correct?
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 01:29 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 01:27 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:18 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 01:08 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:00 WaveofShadow wrote:On June 15 2015 00:56 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 00:55 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 00:53 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 00:03 MoosyDoosy wrote:
[quote]
Alright ruXxar, let's dance this dance of death.
1. Pulling the noob card
I mean, what can I say? This is completely my fault for not reading things correctly and I realize it more than anyone else. However, if you look at the posts I make cluelessly, you can see that I'm still genuinely attempting to help.
- When I bring up the possibility of 2 Mafia, I'm trying to expand our thought process in case there is more than 1 Mafia. After all, it's a terrible idea to have a confined mindset. Also, a nitpick with this point of yours. If you say that me suggesting there's 2 Mafia is "inexcusable" that's more of an accusation of bad play and not scum-oriented behavior.
- geript flipped as town. Okay, try and follow me here. IF we didn't know that geript was flipped, then my thought process was clear here. IF geript was a Mafia, then his two suspects in Sulfurus and Rels can't be Mafia as well unless he was busing them. Which was unfortunate because Sulfurus and Rels were also our top suspects for Mafia. IF geript was a townie which seems more likely due to the above scenario, we screwed up big time. That's what my thought process was but it turns out geript flipped which means we screwed up.
- Also, I do try and read stuff but some of it just doesn't end up in my brain. If you recall ruXxar, I did point out that we can ask questions in green text which at least displays some reading comprehension. You might want to point that out to show that I haven't completely been pulling out the noob card in every sentence I use.
2. Indecisive, passive play
- Your example where I'm suggesting either Sulfurus or geript to batsnacks is a terrible one. I believe I said it somewhere else before, but it was an attempt for me to set bait. If batsnacks does try to defend himself with either of my suggestions or just makes a good case in general, that means he's town. If he doesn't try, he's scum. In the end, I'd still say I think he's town because he's genuinely been trying to defend himself and used geript as a way out.
- Also, expand more on this if you're going to make it a point. You can't just nitpick things like you did with point #1 too. If we're talking about indecisiveness, cover how I don't really want to place a vote, I come into the thread passive, and I'm generally terrible at pressuring people. If you count all these things in, I'm pretty sure anyone can see that I have a passive playstyle. If you hate my playstyle, sure go for it and make a case off of my passivity, but don't nitpick stuff just to support your own argument.
- Also, I won't answer your other quotes because those are totally irrelevant when looked at in context.
3. Asking about pr roles
- Hm...I can see why you think a Mafia would post that. But don't worry, there was a reason behind that post. If you still want to pressure me on this, feel free to do so as I can't adequately defend myself on this one unless I wish to ruin the game.
Overall? Stop nitpicking stuff bro. Your argument was decent, but your evidence was weak. If you're going to try and kill a townie, you should work harder. The bold part makes me think you have a power role... Actually, I don't just think so, it seems like very strong evidence for a power role. I'm curious if you actually are the medic. (PS : Don't tell us if you are) Then why in blue fuck would you actually discuss this? Just terrible. Fuck.. that was a terrible play by me. I'm retracting my scumread on mossy based on this new information. ruXxar I put that post for a reason. I might be a town role. I might be a townie using it as leverage to keep me alive. I might be Mafia using it to keep myself alive. I might be trying to deceive you. That's not the main issue here, don't let that point blind you. Look at the rest of my actions and judge based on those. It was very enlightening for me to see you defend yourself so hard. I really liked the way you defended yourself with ferocity. I also believe in occams razor. I think that usually the scenario with the least amount of crazy assumptions is most likely to be correct. If you baited me with that piece of information, then good job, but I really liked your spirit in defending yourself, and seen in light of a newbie then it makes sense that you made some ramblings while under pressure. Keeping my townread on you for now. ^.^ I was hoping that someone would pick up on it and to get a solid read based on their reaction. Glad to see you're a townie with us ruXxar. How can you conclude that ruXxar is town based on this? If he's town, it's a bad play to bring it up because it draws attention to it. If he's scum, it's a bad play to bring it up because he would want to keep it secret and just shoot you. And I don't see anything in his tone that gives me a good read.
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 01:39 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:35 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:29 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 01:27 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:18 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 01:08 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 01:00 WaveofShadow wrote:On June 15 2015 00:56 ruXxar wrote:On June 15 2015 00:55 ruXxar wrote:
[quote]
Actually, I don't just think so, it seems like very strong evidence for a power role.
I'm curious if you actually are the medic.
(PS : Don't tell us if you are) Then why in blue fuck would you actually discuss this? Just terrible. Fuck.. that was a terrible play by me. I'm retracting my scumread on mossy based on this new information. ruXxar I put that post for a reason. I might be a town role. I might be a townie using it as leverage to keep me alive. I might be Mafia using it to keep myself alive. I might be trying to deceive you. That's not the main issue here, don't let that point blind you. Look at the rest of my actions and judge based on those. It was very enlightening for me to see you defend yourself so hard. I really liked the way you defended yourself with ferocity. I also believe in occams razor. I think that usually the scenario with the least amount of crazy assumptions is most likely to be correct. If you baited me with that piece of information, then good job, but I really liked your spirit in defending yourself, and seen in light of a newbie then it makes sense that you made some ramblings while under pressure. Keeping my townread on you for now. ^.^ I was hoping that someone would pick up on it and to get a solid read based on their reaction. Glad to see you're a townie with us ruXxar. I want to hear your opinion on the whole batsnacks trap thing. It seemed like a very big jump from his normal demeanor. Like out of the blue he suddenly makes an irrational action like that. I know you said you didn't have any scumreads right now, but if you wanted to go with a gut feeling, who would you possibly want to know more about? Actually, I think there should be more discussion in general around the batsnacks trap case. Was I the only one that found it a strange change in behavior from him? It was a strange change in behavior. However, using Bat Traps is an indicator of batsnacks being town. Batsnacks looks significantly better after that geript push, despite the result.
Also, wow. Those points that batsnacks raised about Rels are really strong. Rels certainly has a lot to say for himself. ##vote Rels
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 05:50 ruXxar wrote:
Here's some food for thought.
So far we have scum reads on 2 mafia, Rels and Sulfu.
Both are newbies.
How likely do you think that all 3 mafia are in the newbie group?
Would it not make sense that at least 1 mafia is part of the veteran group?
People who have played previous newbie games, what is usually the distribution of mafia on newbie/veteran side? Teams are randomized. Plus, it's best to go one lynch at a time.
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:I don't particularly expect to be killed tonight. But just in case that happens, here's where my thoughts are at. Briefly, let's consider what it means if I do get killed. There was one post I made that I backreferenced twice, and is probably the post that would be most strongly associated with me. It was this one: n00bKing wrote:
Situation: 11 players have votes in place, and 2 players are not voting. All 11 of the votes are on either batsnacks or Sulfurus. No one has a vote on anyone else.
At this stage of a Day 1, I'm more used to seeing a smattering of votes on some other miscellaneous players too. Maybe partially because the scum team doesn't want to have all their votes in one place, so they fan out some (and maybe a random Townie or two gets tunneled on their respective targets, and won't budge, even though no one else has any interest in following along).
Theory: This situation makes it pretty likely that one of the two players receiving votes is actually scum, and that we don't have a Town vs. Town situation for our two vote leaders. The scum team has not been able to fan out their votes, because they've needed "all hands on deck" to make sure that the scum player doesn't take a runaway lead in the voting.
Conclusion: Even though there's a lot of time left in the Phase, we may not want to introduce a third lynch target, and should instead stick to trying to pick between these two (since, if the Theory is correct, one of them would flip Red). I didn't have any luck whatsoever trying to get geript out of the noose, and some players (like damdred and batsnacks) have been saying that a lot of my posts can just be safely ignored. Based on all that, I don't think the scum players would kill me, to make it look like they were trying to silence me, to FRAME one of Sulfurus/batsnacks, if they were both actually town. Rather, the scum team would only kill me if my Theory was indeed correct, and one of Sulfurus/batsnacks IS scum. So remember, if the scum team kills me, the Theory is correct. We already know that I still think the Theory is correct, and I've mentioned some possible teammates for batsnacks (damdred, Moosy) if he is the bad guy in this scenario. And I said that I also had some ideas in mind about who could be possible teammates for Sulfurus, if he is the bad guy in this scenario. So here goes. This part of n00bKing's post is rather ironic. But I need to disagree here. N00bKing's lynch theory was hardly the most important contribution he's made to the thread, and I see no reason to believe it. There are several reasons for lynching him, one of them being that he's townread by most everyone in the game and is rather active. This is shown by people being suspicious of him during the night, and that suspicion went nowhere fast. N00bKing was almost certainly not going to be lynched this game. The association case that n00bKing presents is very interesting, but I generally don't like association cases. I have various levels of suspicions about the people that he suspected, though.
Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 13:08 Sulfurus wrote:On June 14 2015 10:20 Trfel wrote:
Sulfurus, you need to say why you are scumreading me. You can't throw around suspicions with nothing behind them.
WaveofShadow, I don't understand how a player of your caliber can just vanish before the lynch and come back after it. You even came back after the later deadline. Can you please explain this? You basically said Rels his scum for changing his position a lot which isn't even alignment indicative. Like if you like at way rels changes his vote he actually does it in a very townie way giving good logic every time he's done. You on the other hand changed your vote to Geript sporadically (without even giving a read on him at any previous point in the thread) simply because Bats found a 'slip'. This read makes no sense. I didn't scumread Rels for changing his position a lot. I created a list of Rels' reads and used that as a basis for the arguments presented below, leaving the initial work there for people to check the evidence themselves. Please read more carefully. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 08:45 Sulfurus wrote:
Can someone besides trfel explain to me why he is being so universally town read? I admit looking back his tunnel on rels is better then I thought but that's it. He has spent all his time on this one player and doesn't have good reads on anyone else yet multiple players have put him at the top of their townlists. Catching ONE scum is enough of a challenge for me, much less catching multiple. If I can find someone who looks really scummy to lynch, that's about as much as I can hope for. I've been asking questions and pushing my suspicions, so I don't really understand how you can say that I've only been pushing one person.
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 09:18 Kickstart wrote:
Cop check on me is only useful in confirming im town. I am not mafia nor is anyone really suspicious of me of being mafia from what I can tell, aside from being somewhat concerned over my afkness, cop should check someone that they think will turn up red. You are awfully concerned with what blue roles we have and what they do and you are quite wrong in what actions they should be taking. Let the blue roles play their roles and stop trying to direct them into bad plays or outing themselves. Posts like this are useless, and give me the feeling that Kickstart isn't invested in this game. He got townread, and then left for a long time. This isn't alignment indicative, but now that he's back, he isn't pushing the thread, or asking questions (which I really would expect, given how much he missed), but he's lurking and only responding when someone called for a cop check on him (right at the start of the day). Why doesn't he simply prove himself through his actions, or find scum? This is a huge contrast to the Kickstart at the start of the game, and the Kickstart I have seen before. And I don't like it one bit. Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 11:18 Kickstart wrote:
Of course me coming back after being afk looks bad, good job pointing out the obvious. Would you prefer I stayed afk? I don't need to make excuses cause it comes down to real life stuff which isn't anyone's business. Deal with it or don't. Me apologizing is because I don't think it is fair to everyone that I was afk when I am normally much more active. I should just ignore people commenting on me coming back but it annoyed me.
Wait, MORE of this? I don't understand why town!Kickstart would make these posts that don't provide any content and don't help town at all. Pure excuses, no scumhunting whatsoever.
Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 11:38 WaveofShadow wrote:Trfel - First to jump on the wake of Bat's 'discovery.' Eh. On looking through I thought he was on Rels all day and then dropped his amazing case instantly in favor of even after this post: On June 14 2015 04:14 Trfel wrote:
Ugh, I just don't quite feel right about lynching geript or Damdred. They're both incredible players, and it's the weekend, so it's unfair to expect normal activity levels from them.
##vote Rels But he was onto batsnacks as well at one point. It does kinda look as though he almost doesn't believe his own case at times because of his initial dropoff from Rels onto bats, then as bats lost ground back onto rels again and onto Geript. He does put a LOT of effort into his rels push when he is on him though so at the same time it seems doubtful that this is a half-assed push where he was just looking for an out. Not sold either on this one. Also liked his activity around the lynch and his first post after flip. What is the mafia incentive for pushing Rels hard at times, and at other times going with other wagons? That's a lousy way to go about a bus, and if I'm scum and Rels is town, why would I keep jumping around between flipped town geript, likely town batsnacks, and assumed town Rels? Given the lackluster way geript was playing, I was suspicious of him. I didn't want to lynch him for that alone, though, because of the weekend and because of the potential risk. However, when batsnacks caught what I thought was a scumslip, this new information convinced me to lynch geript. If I didn't re-evaluate based on new information, that would be more telling. WaveofShadow, with your geript wagon analysis in mind, what do you think about ruXxar, given that you were townreading him earlier? + Show Spoiler Show nested quote + +On June 15 2015 11:03 WaveofShadow wrote:
Lol also this moosy vs ruxxar business.
I gotta say moosy you're scaring me a little because if I'm going to get burned by one of you it looks like you'd be the one. I can visibly see you improving in the middle of this game and part of me wonders if it's because you were sandbagging all along.
Rels is looking pretty bad, the evidence presented by batsnacks pushes it over the top. Rels hasn't seemed at all interested in defending himself. I'm more than happy to lynch him. Kickstart is also looking quite bad. I just don't understand how a townie can be gone for many important events, then come back and only post saying that "being afk isn't alignment indicative". No scumhunting, no questions, no analysis, just excuses. I just don't know about Sulfurus any more. For scumreading me, he seems uninterested in pushing it, but he's so inactive that I'm not sure if this even applies. I just really hope that power roles or associations sort this out. Would like to see a response from Sulfurus about the flaws I've pointed out in his scumread of me. Damdred still feels off. I can't quite put my finger on it, though, beyond a few tells that are best kept to myself for now. I need to take a careful look at his filter in the near future. Also need to look more closely at MoosyDoosy, ruXxar, and Oatsmaster.
1. Exactly the opposite. If geript had been scum, then my suspicion on Rels and Sulfurus would have been reduced as he had felt free to vote against them at points in the game. However, geript turned out to have flipped which allowed me to relook at Rels and Sulfurus.
2. I thought it was a newbie play on his part to have let it slip by pointing out that line. I was hoping that he would point it out and fall for it and he did. Given n00bKing's argument, I am still inclined to pressure ruXxar especially since he finds it difficult to adequately defend himself and is all over wagons at every given point in time.
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On June 16 2015 02:58 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:50 Rels wrote:On June 16 2015 02:26 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you. Alright I can accept this explanation. I responded all the cases you mentioned, did that change your read on me ? The thing about linking your cases to noobking's is still a little, little bit scummy. Obviously it's weak so nobody will lynch you for only this. If anything, linking my cases to n00bKing's is the opposite of scummy considering that he turned out to be VT as well. Since it seems that no one exactly wants to immediately chop off my head, I'll go back and re-read over everything carefully. Now that you just admitted that your case and noobking's were different, I find it more opportunistic than good. That's why I called it a small scum hint.
Where did I say mine and n00bKing's cases were different? I was just saying that if you're linking mine and n00bKing's cases together, it would only show that I'm not scum because n00bKing turned out to be VT.
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On June 16 2015 02:54 batsnacks wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it. In what way? I don't consider this relevant because I feel like I understand what you were trying to say anyway but... It could also be "safer" because since there is more evidence for Rels, there will be less suspicion your way if he flips town. Compared to if you lynched hypothetical town sulfurus for (relatively) less evidence.
Lol, which is not what I was trying to say, say no.
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On June 16 2015 03:06 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 03:00 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:58 Rels wrote:On June 16 2015 02:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:50 Rels wrote:On June 16 2015 02:26 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 15 2015 20:55 Rels wrote:On June 15 2015 07:04 MoosyDoosy wrote:
##vote Rels
Good job n00bKing you did well. On June 15 2015 07:09 scott31337 wrote:
What an awesome post, n00b. I haven't felt good about Sulf or Rels, and Rels didn't reply to anything, just went to sleep.
##Vote Rels Hahaha that is so good (= I'm so happy to read these two posts. I think the two posters are scum. Here is why. All the suspicions noobkind put on me start with the premise that Sulfu is town. He himself say to lynch Sulfu first, then IF Sulfu is mafia, to lynch ruxxar or me day 3. He also says than ruxxar would be a better lynch than me day 3. Don't believe me ? On June 15 2015 06:59 n00bKing wrote:
Sulfurus would be my top lynch on Day 2. If he flips Red, is it better to go after ruXxar or Rels next? That's tough. The ties between Sulfurus and ruXxar are definitely stronger than the ties between Sulfurus and Rels. But Rels is being read by more people as being generally scummy right now, so he might be the easier lynch, even if ruXxar could be the more logical lynch.
[...]
If Sulfurus flips Green, then it's back to the drawing board, to some extent. Hopefully that would mean a batsnacks scum team, and he's paired with either Moosy or damdred. But that case is tougher to make than Sulfurus/ruXxar/Rels.
So. Just after this post, noobking dies and here is what happens: 1 - moosy and scott both expressed good feelings about noobking's post. 2 - noobking's post say to lynch Sulfu day 2, and if he flips mafia, to lynch ruxxar and me, ruxxar being the stronger lynch 3 - moosy and scott vote me instead. You know what is even funnier ? Let me quote this moosy post that happens just after his vote to me. Please read it carefully. On June 15 2015 07:05 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Alright guys, Rels first then Sulfurus. After that, we re-look over n00bKing's post then decide on the next person. I'm inclined to trust him though. That analysis was so good. That "so good analysis" that moosy is talking about says to lynch Sulfu first, and that I'm not mafia unless Sulfu is too. But moosy wants to lynch me first. Then he wants to lynch Sulfu. And finally ruxxar. I can see a scum agenda here. How ? Let's consider this timeline: 1 - we lynch Sulfu, he flips green 2 - if we follow noobking post, we're not lynching me nor ruxxar anymore. Conclusion: we only mislynched once. moosy seems to be pushing for a better timeline for mafia: 1 - we lynch me, I flip green 2 - too bad! Let's follow noobking post again ... mm that's true he asked for sulfu's lynch first. 3 - we lynch sulfu, I flip green Conclusion: two mislynches Yeh, again, that wasn't my intention. The reason why I voted to lynch you first was because there were already arguments from me, Trfel, batsnacks, and now n00bKing. Comparatively, no one really made any cases against Sulfurus which is why I felt it would be safer to be lynching you. Alright I can accept this explanation. I responded all the cases you mentioned, did that change your read on me ? The thing about linking your cases to noobking's is still a little, little bit scummy. Obviously it's weak so nobody will lynch you for only this. If anything, linking my cases to n00bKing's is the opposite of scummy considering that he turned out to be VT as well. Since it seems that no one exactly wants to immediately chop off my head, I'll go back and re-read over everything carefully. Now that you just admitted that your case and noobking's were different, I find it more opportunistic than good. That's why I called it a small scum hint. Where did I say mine and n00bKing's cases were different? I was just saying that if you're linking mine and n00bKing's cases together, it would only show that I'm not scum because n00bKing turned out to be VT. I'm not linking your case to noobking's. You did it yourself. Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 02:22 MoosyDoosy wrote:
[...]
I also admit, I was a bit excited over the fact that we caught Mafia which is why I linked mine, n00bKing's, and batsnack's arguments to Kickstart, since it seemed that he was wondering what had gone down over the course of the thread. And if anything else, arguments against a certain Mafia is the most important part of the game.
Oh that post. In there, by "linked", I literally meant "linked". As in provide what he should look at. Not the "connect" together definition of "link".
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On June 16 2015 03:05 batsnacks wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2015 03:02 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:54 batsnacks wrote:On June 16 2015 02:48 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 16 2015 02:46 batsnacks wrote:
It's not important I know that you're trying to say that there's more stated evidence for Rels and it makes him a better lynch. Safer is just a weird way to put it. In what way? I don't consider this relevant because I feel like I understand what you were trying to say anyway but... It could also be "safer" because since there is more evidence for Rels, there will be less suspicion your way if he flips town. Compared to if you lynched hypothetical town sulfurus for (relatively) less evidence. Lol, which is not what I was trying to say, say no. Sometimes human beings accidentally reveal their intentions with their word choices. But it seriously doesn't matter you could have afked all day today and still not been the lynch.
I honestly still don't see how you would read that from "safe". In a vacuum, who would you rather lynch? Someone with a bunch of cases against him, or someone with speculation and almost no cases? Thus, it's safer to assume that the one with a bunch of cases is the one to lynch.
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On June 16 2015 03:28 Rels wrote:MoosyDoosyI don't really know about him. Will list for what reasons I find him scummy, and what reasons he could be town too. Reasons for me suspecting him: 1. His first post. It's bad, long and weird. + Show Spoiler +On June 12 2015 08:16 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 08:10 ruXxar wrote:
I'd like to hear your reasoning for voting on me, besides the fact that very few other people have spoke up yet. I am just rather overwhelmed by the amount of (cross) analysis occurring right now. ^.^ Although this is my first time around, I can already tell this will be great. Down to business. So @ruXxar, your reasoning for voting for Kickstart is his statement about lying in a game of Mafia? And @Trfel, can you please share why you're suspecting @ruXxar? I would have to agree with ruXxar's point that it is generally annoying when someone answers a question directed at you. Although I don't see why Kickstart went so far as to vote for Oatsmaster right off the bat. Unless he's the Mafia and trying to mislead us. On another note, do we know how many Mafias there are? If there are two Mafias, Oatsmaster and Kickstart may be those two and may have set this up to make everyone confused and make people like you two fight amongst yourselves. 2. He refers himself as a newbie several times. Not as much as I thought day 1, but there is still a number of times he does it. In addition, he either dumbtells a few times and didn't read the OP carefully. + Show Spoiler +On June 12 2015 08:16 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 08:10 ruXxar wrote:
I'd like to hear your reasoning for voting on me, besides the fact that very few other people have spoke up yet. I am just rather overwhelmed by the amount of (cross) analysis occurring right now. ^.^ Although this is my first time around, I can already tell this will be great. Down to business. So @ruXxar, your reasoning for voting for Kickstart is his statement about lying in a game of Mafia? And @Trfel, can you please share why you're suspecting @ruXxar? I would have to agree with ruXxar's point that it is generally annoying when someone answers a question directed at you. Although I don't see why Kickstart went so far as to vote for Oatsmaster right off the bat. Unless he's the Mafia and trying to mislead us. On another note, do we know how many Mafias there are? If there are two Mafias, Oatsmaster and Kickstart may be those two and may have set this up to make everyone confused and make people like you two fight amongst yourselves. On June 12 2015 11:33 MoosyDoosy wrote:
[...]
I'll look through the rest of your points, but I'll try and provide a "newbie perspective." Either way, it looks like he wised up real fast and stopped being as frantic and energetic in his posts. On June 13 2015 03:23 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2015 02:43 scott31337 wrote:On June 13 2015 02:19 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 13 2015 02:08 scott31337 wrote:Geript has four posts and very little content. I know he's good as mafia - but on the scum side of null for now. On June 12 2015 08:16 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 12 2015 08:10 ruXxar wrote:
I'd like to hear your reasoning for voting on me, besides the fact that very few other people have spoke up yet. I am just rather overwhelmed by the amount of (cross) analysis occurring right now. ^.^ Although this is my first time around, I can already tell this will be great. Down to business. So @ruXxar, your reasoning for voting for Kickstart is his statement about lying in a game of Mafia? And @Trfel, can you please share why you're suspecting @ruXxar? I would have to agree with ruXxar's point that it is generally annoying when someone answers a question directed at you. Although I don't see why Kickstart went so far as to vote for Oatsmaster right off the bat. Unless he's the Mafia and trying to mislead us. On another note, do we know how many Mafias there are? If there are two Mafias, Oatsmaster and Kickstart may be those two and may have set this up to make everyone confused and make people like you two fight amongst yourselves. Is this a dumbtell and didn't read the OP? Did he read boxerfred's last game and took all his ideas (Ie I'll act like I'm so newb everybody will just read me over for a few days) On June 13 2015 00:58 MoosyDoosy wrote:
What I want to do is find out why geript stopped posting after WaveofShadow had a scumread on him.
@batsnacks, I mean, I'm pretty sure I made it clear I was a town but sure, go ahead and waste your vote. I sure am not seeing this "I made it clear". "Go ahead and waste your vote" is a very interesting way to word a vote on you if you are town. On June 12 2015 22:54 batsnacks wrote:
I think I'm going to sheep geript now he was making sense about moose.
##unvote
##vote moosygoosy On June 12 2015 10:27 geript wrote:On June 12 2015 08:16 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 12 2015 08:10 ruXxar wrote:
I'd like to hear your reasoning for voting on me, besides the fact that very few other people have spoke up yet. I am just rather overwhelmed by the amount of (cross) analysis occurring right now. ^.^ Although this is my first time around, I can already tell this will be great. Down to business. So @ruXxar, your reasoning for voting for Kickstart is his statement about lying in a game of Mafia? And @Trfel, can you please share why you're suspecting @ruXxar? I would have to agree with ruXxar's point that it is generally annoying when someone answers a question directed at you. Although I don't see why Kickstart went so far as to vote for Oatsmaster right off the bat. Unless he's the Mafia and trying to mislead us. On another note, do we know how many Mafias there are? If there are two Mafias, Oatsmaster and Kickstart may be those two and may have set this up to make everyone confused and make people like you two fight amongst yourselves. people should be talking about this. Making sense? He quoted one post and said talk about this. I like Oat's post about "N00bking" looking townie since didn't stop his advice posting even when people stopped him - that makes a lot of sense. Bats and Geript bussing Moose? looks like the most logical conclusion I see at this time. ## Batsnacks / Geript / MoosyDoosy but that would be too ez. But not liking Batsnacks. Anyone have any questions or want to point out things I may have missed? Ok, let's get this straight. As I said multiple times before, I'm new to TL and online Mafia. Either way, I'll address your points. 1. You say geript is a good Mafia from previous games and he's too obvious here leading to the conclusion he's not Mafia. If that's the case, how would you expect me to know that? I've never played TL Mafia before and never played with geript so I wouldn't know. 2. All I know about boxerfred is from his post here where he said he couldn't play and from his lack of posts. I don't even know what games he was previously in. The only person I know is Trfel who goes on Bnet forums from time to time which is where I commonly post. 3. I don't see how "Go ahead and waste your vote" is weird. I'm clearly a town so I don't see why batsnacks would vote for me. 4. I already explained why I worded my first post in my first Mafia game in the way I did. I've obviously seen why that's a bad thing to do (Mafia will find a way to point it out and lynch me) so I'm obviously not going to do that in the future. Is there anything else? 1. I was not saying either way - but Geript is a good mafia player.Is he AFK or uninterested or mafia or both? That's what we're trying to figure out. If you have free time and would like, the TL Mafia Database has a listing of peoples games here and links. 2. I'll rephrase - Boxerfred posted a lot of newbie/dumb questions and skated on this for a few days until people got suspicious of him. It was a ruse. You have read the whole OP (first post) now right? You know what roles CAN be in the game? 3. You just said it again. "I'm clearly a town" - if you say it enough I'll start to believe it? People who keep saying lines like this irk me. "The Most Basic Form of Mind Control is Repetition" 4. Fair enough point, thank you. scott, bottom line is that most of your reasoning is based on the belief that I'll know how others play or how to play. And what I keep saying is that I'm new to online Mafia and don't know how to play or how others play. On June 14 2015 03:54 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 03:50 n00bKing wrote:On June 13 2015 18:17 ruXxar wrote:
I disagree.
There are 3 Mafia and 2 town roles.
I believe that reducing kill power from 2 to 1 is the single most important factor in us winning the game.
This would buy us so much time that we should have overwhelming odds of winning.
The chance of targeting Carl is very low.
I'm ok with taking the odds of a power role checking Carl if it means we increase our chances of killing mafia. Does knowing that there is only 1 mafia attack each Night change your position? Also, where are you getting that there are "2 town roles?" I see absolutely nothing that would indicate there are 8 VTs and 2 non-Vanilla Town roles, if that is what you are saying. Sorry for this newbie question which I should have asked earlier but which slipped my mind because I had to do something else. What's a Carl? 3. WIFOM point: 3 hours before noobking was killed, moosy did two posts to say noobking was town. Could be he knew that noobking was going to be confirmed town, and wanted the towncred of listing as town before he died. + Show Spoiler +On June 15 2015 03:47 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Nah, I think n00bKing's a townie. He's been decent at pressuring people although he's pretty bossy and gives way too much advice. Not to mention his posts are super wordy. Either way, I still think Rels/Sulfurus deserve another look. When Rels comes back, we should ask him to defend himself against Trfel's points. We should be able to get a read on the defense. On June 15 2015 04:22 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Okay, did a reading of n00bKing and I don't think he's Mafia.
Personality read: Likes to be in control, dislikes change, rather bossy. As can be evidenced in his posts lamenting changes in people's opinion, how he gives so much advice, and how he always tries and tell people what to do. I think his personality is what affects so much of his posting which is why most of it is convoluted and he feels the need to pursue even the trivial. Like really? Arguing with batsnacks over "advice"?
Town read: Very consistent. At the start, yes he floods the thread with advice, but when he starts pressuring people, he remains consistent. It seems that he suspected batsnacks, me, and Plants at the start for our behavior and strange post(s). As the game continues and even to this very point, he has been pressuring me and batsnacks and has remained consistent in doing so.
In fact, this may be his downfall more than most. While it seems that he agrees that Rels/Sulf exhibit suspicious behavior, he still seems intent on finding ways to bring me and batsnacks down per how he read us at the very start of the thread. As for other people's posts, he seems content to question a couple but mostly agree or add on to their posts.
Conclusion: n00bking's filter just shows consistency in what he's been doing. He gets caught in the trivial, he's bossy, and he gave a bit too much advice at the start, but he is definitely a townie that's trying to catch the Mafia. 4. This post where I make the theory that moosy is using noobking's legacy to push his own case, even though it's not the same. 5. He was very wishy washy day 1, and argumented it was his style. Then night 1 and day 2 he changed pretty hardly and is now pushing ruxxar hard for my lynch. + Show Spoiler +On June 13 2015 09:20 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2015 09:14 Rels wrote:On June 13 2015 09:10 MoosyDoosy wrote:
@Rels, any comments on my posts? Still confused why you don't think I'm townie. OK sorry in advance, but in my mind it's actually pretty good where you're at. I was so sure you were mafia with your first post that me imagining you at null read is a pretty good deal. When I made this post with the two points I was thinking I was going to destroy you. I think I was clouded by my first impression of you. You won't ever be a town lean in my mind until you either make a case on someone and defend it, or sheep a case on someone and explain why. Not taking stances = I can't judge you 100%. Unfortunately I'm trying to be careful with my vote so it looks like that won't happen anytime soon. -.- At least I'm glad to see you're finally starting to realize I'm a townie. On June 15 2015 07:41 MoosyDoosy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2015 07:35 Kickstart wrote:
Maybe me being suspicious of all of them early day 1 will buy me some town cred???? I need some after being afk so long. Don't worry. It looks like Rels -> Sulfurus right now. If both are right, I'm pretty sure we'll have to vote to kill ruXxar and we always have cop to check if necessary. Reasons that he could be town: 1. He posts questions to people, but contrary to scott, he follows up with analysis of the answer. He shows a willingness to solve the game, or at least he's faking that willingness. 2. Didn't solely sheep the cases on me, but made his own. OK, the points are not clear, but he worked on it. He even addressed a point nobody else did: the fact that I wasn't that much engaged on a geript's lynch. + Show Spoiler +On June 15 2015 05:37 MoosyDoosy wrote:Okay, I started reading filters and I especially looked at Rels/Sulfurus as people have been implying. I REALLY think they're both Mafia. Rels first comes into the thread and directs all attention to the passive posts from both me and Fake)Plants. + Show Spoiler +On June 12 2015 17:53 Rels wrote:OK I finally found a mafia. Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 14:01 Fake)Plants wrote:Lying is a powerful tool that when used in the right situation can greatly benefit one's interests. I really don't like this idea from ruX. If town lies and gets lynched then what information did that townie provide? Are you trying to lure out mafia by lying? Mafia has more information at the beginning and can utilize lying better than town, especially if it comes from a townie. Sorry for being late to the thread, I did not check TL the last couple of days after I thought someone else beat me to a newbie slot. Good to be here! First post of his. Next to last to enter the thread. Just fluff on the first paragraph. What is really scum is the second paragraph. Two points: - He enter the thread late and feels he needs to post an excuse. To me, he had the mindset of entering the thread without saying anything, and apologizing so people like him. - His excuse is false. We all had to confirm yesterday, so that's not possible that he did not check TL the last couple of days, or that he believed that someone else took his spot. Then he tries to switch the case onto me-geript-batsnacks which is the next best scapegoat from a newbie who only posted once and never again. Not only that, but notice how he attempts to bring this under the light while trying to cover for Sulfurus who is beginning to become suspected. + Show Spoiler +On June 13 2015 07:29 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2015 07:22 scott31337 wrote:On June 13 2015 07:19 Rels wrote:On June 13 2015 07:14 Trfel wrote:Rels1. Lots of early posts with no content, only purpose is to make it seem like he's doing stuff + Show Spoiler +1. Completely useless "hi" post ~10 hours after the game started, not necessary at all. 2. "LOL" in response to ruXxar's contradiction, no conclusion about his alignment at all* 3. Asks a question to ruXxar (still nothing about ruXxar's alignment) 4. Says that MoosyDoosy's first post is weird* 5. Tells n00bKing not to defend ruXxar* 6. Asks a question to Sulfurus* 7. Repeats one of Oatsmaster's comments* The things with asterisks had been said by someone else before Rels commented on them. Then he (finally) posts his case on Fake)Plants. On June 12 2015 17:53 Rels wrote:
OK I finally found a mafia. And by doing this shows that all of his previous posts amount to very little. There's really no reason for Rels to post like this, it serves no purpose for scumhunting or confirming his own alignment. All it does is make it look like he's doing work, but repeating things that have already been said isn't even work. 2. Makes a case on the easiest possible target + Show Spoiler +Fake)Plants only had one post.
Rels just continues to talk about this post, spending many, many posts directing people back to it. He's not showing any interest in anything else that's happening. 3. Townread on ruXxar + Show Spoiler +On June 13 2015 00:22 Rels wrote:
Alright ruxxar I was unsure how to read you. But with this post I now believe you're a super excited townie. I too believe that we should not let mafia the ability to stay silent.
So. What do you think of plants first and only post ? Rels thinks that ruXxar is town for making a post with no content at all. RuXxar made a post saying that MoosyDoosy's defense of himself is really good, and then Rels townreads ruXxar for this. RuXxar's inability to defend himself but willingness to jump on someone else's defense of him is extremely scummy, and reminds me of ShoCkeyy in my last game. There is absolutely no reason for Rels to townread ruXxar because of this post. Furthermore, he agrees that we shouldn't let the mafia stay silent. And he does this by asking his townread about the only other read he's made in this game, and then vanishing. Not actually acting on this whatsoever. Oh hey good timing. I really disagree on the easy target. I have no idea who is mafia between geript bat and moosy, if any. On the other hand the entrance post of plants was and still is super bad. And I don't care for IRL wifom, a lie is a lie. So it sounds like you have been thru the thread. Any other thoughts? I have strong town reads on wos and KS. I have town reads on ruxxar, oats and trfel. I really want to like Sulfu as he had the same attitude of "not posting a lot but ask question" last game, and he was town. But I think he has less than 5 posts atm, that's really not a lot. Everybody I have not talk about I have either no read or mafia lean. It's especially hard on the moosy - geript - bats situation. I don't like moosy for : - his first post - his multiple times stating he is a newbie But geript's reasoning for voting him is super bad. And batsnacks' one is so weird, involving double bus at one point. Well. Here is my brain atm. Then he tries to make a case on me once people tell him me-geript-batsnacks was never a thing. + Show Spoiler +On June 13 2015 08:25 Rels wrote:Fuck I was making a case on you moosy but reading your filter a lot of my points are false. Like I was saying you kept repeating that you were newb. Actually it's not true. I still have two things left in my suspicion of you, so could you please comment on them. First pointYou don't take any stand. Not against me nor anyone else. More than that, a few hours ago, you discussed people you wanted to make a case on but you're still undecided. In particular what is this post: Show nested quote +On June 13 2015 05:52 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 13 2015 05:48 batsnacks wrote:On June 13 2015 05:44 Kickstart wrote:On June 13 2015 05:42 batsnacks wrote:On June 13 2015 05:40 geript wrote:
~7 hours batty Okay I can't dick around anymore. Please help me not get lynched, I require written instructions for how to get people to unvote me. Push someone who you think is actually scum then???????? Just a though~ What do I do if I don't have any scum reads? In a sense almost no one has scum reads because I'm town and the only people pushing stuff are pushing me. Here's would lynch: 3)MoosyDoosy 4)Sulfurus 7)Fake)Plants 2)batsnacks 3)Trfel here's idk can't form opinion: 6)damdred 1)Rels 4)WaveofShadow 5)geript 5)ruXxar Here's would not lynch: 2)n00bKing 1)Kickstart 6)Oatsmaster HELP Sulfurus looks easiest if you want to make a case. geript might pass but idk. They both have 1 vote so you just need to persuade 2 more. tbh, I'm deciding between either Sulfurus or geript so help me out by making a case. I hate that you are giving him targets on the basis of "you only need to convince two guys for those targets". Almost look like you want him to make a case, join him, and push the blame on him later. I also hate this sentence: "Sulfurus looks easiest is you want to make a case." Go make one yourself if you're so confident. Plus, you make this post to the guy voting you. Really, I liked your filter way than expected, but I hate this post. Second pointI find it weird that you say the following: newbie must be on mafia team, because otherwise they would have pushed on my first post. I find it weird that you felt the need to say it, against a super weak attack ("mafia should have pushed this post and didn't so moosy is mafia", more or less). Here are the posts I'm talking about: Show nested quote +On June 12 2015 11:03 MoosyDoosy wrote:
Yo, also keep in mind a newbie might be Mafia which is why he's not jumping on my post. Seems like something Mafia should do from reading the guide. Show nested quote +On June 13 2015 03:36 MoosyDoosy wrote:On June 13 2015 03:34 geript wrote:
Nah. It'd be pretty odd if there wasn't at least 1 veteran on the mafia team. I'm re-reading posts right now to make a list, but the veteran(s) had to be inactive at the start to not point it out. On the other hand, any newbie might be the Mafia. After this, he leaves the thread for a bit and posts a list of people he suspects in order to pretend to be active. Then WaveofShadow, Oats, and me begin to defend batsnacks whereupon a case begins to form around geript and Sulfurus. Rels decides upon lynching geript and not Sulfurus. Note that before this he is also defending Sulfurus by saying he played the same way in "the previous game". However, batsnacks provided several examples where Sulfurus was providing better critical analysis whereupon Rels is forced to remain quiet. + Show Spoiler +On June 13 2015 20:59 Rels wrote:
Alright I have to go. I will check from my phone from time to time. For now my vote is on geript. May switch to Damdred if he keeps on lurking.
If nobody changes vote and I have to choose between the two wagons I'll vote Sulfu.
##Vote geript As Trfel already pointed out, Rels also does not really seem to support this vote as he already knows who Mafia REALLY is. + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2015 01:27 Rels wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2015 00:58 geript wrote:
It was a good reason tho. I remember thinking that. Yo geript. If you ever remember that reason I'll be super interested, as I hated plants' only post. Please answer this post: Show nested quote +On June 13 2015 19:22 Rels wrote:Geript could you expand on two things when you come back ? 1On June 13 2015 03:08 geript wrote:On June 12 2015 10:12 Sulfurus wrote:I'm starting to really like the case on Kickstarter; he has made a lot of posts that give the illusion of being a helpful towny with his PSA and rule clarifications but they are really just filler and something that the mods already have covered. On top of that I think n00bKing's defense of ruXx is spot on which gives even more validity to the Kickstarter push. ##Vote: Kickstarter(I admit that in a vacuum I would probably scum read Bats more but I've learned my lesson from last game) This post is pretty bad. On June 12 2015 10:30 Kickstart wrote:
Because I've had the urge to troll you since I came back to playing mafia Oats. I can't help myself. Don't worry though the 2 scums atm are ruxxar and sulfurus so you are not in my tunnel atm. [...] Oooh Damdred replaced in. That guy's town 100%. ezpz. On June 13 2015 06:41 geript wrote:
Nah. Damdred is 100% town. He's gotten pretty easy to read. It's pretty cool that you can read damdred (= but this game he's impossible for to read atm due to lack of posts. Were you saying that if he's town you're going to know it for sure later ? And do you read damdred town right now ? 2On June 13 2015 06:56 geript wrote:On June 13 2015 06:47 batsnacks wrote:On June 13 2015 06:47 geript wrote:
Wave not making association cases would be far more concerning. Not a fan of trfel Why don't you like Trfel? Not really something something I can put my finger on. Feels I guess. Maybe my impression of his meta is off from his actual meta since I don't think I've played a game with him for a bit. [...] I would be super interested if you took the time to reread Trfel's past game with you and expand on that. If you don't have the time to do that, could you at least try to explain this more ? And from this point, Rels disappears, never addresses Trfel's point and he never really answered any other questions as well. I'm curious to see his response when he comes back although I believe a strong case can be made against both Rels and Sulfurus as a team of Mafia. 3. WOS, one of my town hard read, has a hard read on moosy. Quoted in the spoiler. + Show Spoiler +On June 15 2015 03:00 WaveofShadow wrote:
Moosydoosy
For all of the reasons I've stated previously. Moosy's play has just been extremely consistent with a very new player overall. Yes it is POSSIBLE scum can replicate this, but not without messing up somewhere down the line and certainly not with this level of activity. (The caveat here which might have to be looked into eventually that I find kind of interesting is this 'bait' he pulled off recently. Is a Moosy who is so nooby as to not realize geript flipped town for example, able to pull off a play like that? Food for thought, but not tomorrow.)
At the end of the day, I find that his wishy washiness disappeared a little bit too fast when he started pushing me hard. So I'm not definite he's scum, but if I was at LYLO with him and anyone other than Kickstart and scott, I would lynch him. Conclusion: Mafia lean
1. Newbie post. I know you hate me saying it, but it is a newbie post. As a note, I was interested in finding out their perspectives which is why I asked. I would understand if it was a completely empty and passive post, but I was trying to get in on the conversation, and it's enough that you keep harping on it after this long.
2. I was attempting to help my fellow newbies escape a mislynch based on their first posts like you seem intent on doing with my first post.
3. Someone said that we should look at n00bKing which the first quote was a response to. That someone (I think Damdred?) then asked for reasoning which I provided with second quote. So it wasn't me trying to associate with n00bKing but me answering someone's questions and replying to that someone.
4. Yeh, that's already refuted because I felt it was safer to assume that the person with more cases against him was Mafia.
5. I figured it was time to take movement. I'm still a passive player, but you can still see hints of that aggression in my defense in Day 1. I was also uncertain if ruXxar was a Mafia or not which is what I was pressuring him for. I wasn't pressuring him to lynch you two (he said he would, but backed out of it just as fast) but I was trying to see if I could get a slip to know if he's Mafia or not. I'm still not sure about it, but his defense was terrible and he ran away at the end.
Does that answer your points or would you like specifics?
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