EPTWill not be modkilled.
[M][N] I Still Can't Believe it's not Themed Mafia
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
Will not be modkilled. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
Your entrance is simply the most underwhelming so far. On June 05 2015 08:50 Mig wrote: Been awhile since I have played, is Marv still good? Anyone else known as a good townie that's playing? Yamamato still incredibly hard headed? On June 05 2015 08:58 Mig wrote: So that I at least have an idea on who has a reputation as being good at town without having to read everyone's past games 5 minutes into day1. On June 05 2015 09:12 Mig wrote: I am sad yamato hasnt replied to me. Any reasoning? It strikes me as someone that does not know what to post and you simply want to blend in asking useless questions. Questions such as "Who plays well as town?" are very evident as the game obviously progresses. I find it hard to believe that your alternate would be to dive people's last 5 games to find out. It is not wholly relevant to the game at all. Furthermore, I find that over the course of your previous games you tend to open aggressively as town whereas you just try and fit in and make peace or ask pointless questions as mafia. If anyone else would like to see if this is true, take a look for yourself: + Show Spoiler [Mig] + TL Mafia XXXVIII Town Medic Killed Night 3 TL Mafia XXXIX Town Vanilla Endgamed Day 0 Pick Their Power Mafia Town Bandwagon Hero Killed Night 4 TL Mafia XLII Town Detective Killed Night 1 Real Time Mafia Mafia Roleblocker Lynched Day 3 World at War 2 Mafia Town No Means Yesenhower Endgamed Day 2 Pick Their Power Mafia 2 Town Gunslinger Killed Night 1 TL Mafia XLIII Town Veteran Killed Night 4 Experimental Haunted Mafia Mafia Vanilla Endgamed Personality Mafia! Town dreamflower Killed Night 2 TL Mafia XLIV Mafia Vanilla Lynched Day 3 Some Mafia Game Mafia Double Voter Survived TL Mafia XLV Town Vanilla Killed Night 2 Pick Your Power Interesting! Town Detective Pardoner Survived White Flag Mafia Town Vanilla Townie Survived Day 2 TL Mafia LXIII: Time to Die Town 2-shot Vigilante Killed Night 5 PYP: League of Legends Mafia Town ChoGath Killed Night 4 SMB Mini Mafia Town Vanilla Killed Night 2 Excluding the PYP games, you almost always start with either a case, solid game logic or some kind of aggressive post. Your 2 mafia games in the aforementioned spoiler (most recent ones) you start off with a silly question to Kurumi or a mediocre afk excuse followed by a meek defence else. I think you are mafia. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 05 2015 15:54 Mig wrote: + Show Spoiler + On June 05 2015 10:04 NaCl`y wrote: @Mig Your entrance is simply the most underwhelming so far. It strikes me as someone that does not know what to post and you simply want to blend in asking useless questions. Questions such as "Who plays well as town?" are very evident as the game obviously progresses. I find it hard to believe that your alternate would be to dive people's last 5 games to find out. It is not wholly relevant to the game at all. Furthermore, I find that over the course of your previous games you tend to open aggressively as town whereas you just try and fit in and make peace or ask pointless questions as mafia. If anyone else would like to see if this is true, take a look for yourself: + Show Spoiler [Mig] + TL Mafia XXXVIII Town Medic Killed Night 3 TL Mafia XXXIX Town Vanilla Endgamed Day 0 Pick Their Power Mafia Town Bandwagon Hero Killed Night 4 TL Mafia XLII Town Detective Killed Night 1 Real Time Mafia Mafia Roleblocker Lynched Day 3 World at War 2 Mafia Town No Means Yesenhower Endgamed Day 2 Pick Their Power Mafia 2 Town Gunslinger Killed Night 1 TL Mafia XLIII Town Veteran Killed Night 4 Experimental Haunted Mafia Mafia Vanilla Endgamed Personality Mafia! Town dreamflower Killed Night 2 TL Mafia XLIV Mafia Vanilla Lynched Day 3 Some Mafia Game Mafia Double Voter Survived TL Mafia XLV Town Vanilla Killed Night 2 Pick Your Power Interesting! Town Detective Pardoner Survived White Flag Mafia Town Vanilla Townie Survived Day 2 TL Mafia LXIII: Time to Die Town 2-shot Vigilante Killed Night 5 PYP: League of Legends Mafia Town ChoGath Killed Night 4 SMB Mini Mafia Town Vanilla Killed Night 2 Excluding the PYP games, you almost always start with either a case, solid game logic or some kind of aggressive post. Your 2 mafia games in the aforementioned spoiler (most recent ones) you start off with a silly question to Kurumi or a mediocre afk excuse followed by a meek defence else. I think you are mafia. Well first of all my question wasnt useless. It gives me at least a baseline to judge someone from. I know marv is a smart player so if he says something illogical I know there is a good chance he is bullshitting and isnt town. In the same way if someone has a reputation as being a strong town and they arent contributing it would raise red flags. For the meta case, meh. I think in general as mafia I don't know what to do and I more just try to blend in. I was the first person to actually ask a question instead of bullshitting about chickens. I could have much more easily just done nothing since if you look at my past games I often times only make a few posts on day1 as town. Many people say illogical things. I don't think it's relevant to ask that question since if someone says something illogical in this game you pry them for more information regardless of if they play well or not in general. That's just the way the cookie crumbles. Ignoring our clearly differing opinions, however, you seems to just be asking people for their thoughts and this has happened repeatedly: here Fecalfeast, do you have any thoughts so far? Every post has been useless. here Thoughts from Artanis/fuba? Both around early on to joke but havent commented on anything that has happened. here Anyway besides me who do you think is the most likely to be scum? You mention several times that mafia like to do certain things like post jokes at the start and then just afk but then never really relate any of that to anyone in this game. Why is that? | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 06 2015 00:37 marvellosity wrote: You seem to type well but i'm not sure how you can genuinely believe this? It's a basic tenet of mafia that you have (often wildly) different expectations for different players. There are things 90% of the playerbase could get away with saying as mafia but I couldn't. *That* is the way the cookie crumbles. I have many a time seen good town people type wildly inaccurate statements that were illogical. Yes, you have to give some players more leniency but regardless of who says what you always push that person for more information on why they said that statement. Mig has definitely played with 3/4 of the people in this game. The majority of people in this game were in his LXIII game too. You may disregard this fact if you disagree with it, however, the rest of what I have said still rings true. He has pointlessly poked people and not followed through with his own statements of mafia strategy and assigning that to other players. I am willing to let it slide for now since there are many more egregious players in this game. I do believe that I agree with you on Artanis[Xp], although only slightly for his "lock in" post but more so for his repeated free town reads on players for 'complex' reasons that I don't think he'd necessarily make as town. Specifically on prplhz. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
How much longer are you going to continue this ruse? ##unvote ##vote Artanis[Xp] | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
I think you know which ruse I am talking about. I counterclaim jailkeeper. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 06 2015 07:32 NaCl`y wrote: @Artanis I think you know which ruse I am talking about. I counterclaim jailkeeper. More specifically, doctor. Not jailkeeper. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 06 2015 07:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I wasn't feeling all that threatened, I just figured that scum would figure out the crumb I made anyway after marv pointed it out. Then you're either scum or there's both a doc and jk in the game, which given it's a closed setup is possible. I'm not sure which to believe. I fail to believe any mini game would be so utterly awful at that kind of balance. I am quite content to get lynched first for the trade. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 06 2015 07:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote: How does lock and jail not make sense together? When marv pointed it out so strongly I figured it was obvious. At no point did you ever mention the word jail. Marvellosity had only ever mentioned that your usage of the word lock did not make sense with the phrase that you had said beforehand in regards to Mig. It is facetious that you could make us believe that mafia would be "onto you" from that phrase alone. The phrase jail had never existed with your posts up until you had claimed jailkeeper. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
I do not believe there would simply be 2 protective roles in this game. I would like the input of others that have not said anything towards this, it would be appreciated. Are there likely to be 2 town protective roles? Could Artanis[Xp] be the mafia roleblocker fake claiming since they are notified and it would be a good cover for somebody that notoriously does not play as mafia? | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
Since you are around and are a point of contention. Can you weigh in on these claims? Also, why is it that you complain about the state of the game earlier but then make no attempt to change that whatsoever? | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 06 2015 08:12 Fecalfeast wrote: I think I agree with JAT that artanis' claim is only worth it if mafia thinks they've been found out. As town idk why he would claim there and believed it was a joke so completely that I counterclaimed him to join in on the fun. I think you claim is ass all around. I complain while making no effort because that's what my brain tells my fingers to do. So why is my claim "ass" if it has given us a mafia? Since you weren't voting or implied no intention to vote for Artanis[Xp] it seemed like you were quite content to sit back and let him lie on his claim while putting in no effort to weigh in on it until asked. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 06 2015 08:14 NaCl`y wrote: So why is my claim "ass" if it has given us a mafia? Since you weren't voting or implied no intention to vote for Artanis[Xp] it seemed like you were quite content to sit back and let him lie on his claim while putting in no effort to weigh in on it until asked. If I am to read this post correctly. On May 26 2015 12:01 VayneAuthority wrote: oh fuba is mkfuba...probably town then. compare his early filter here to his early filters in these games. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/439654-a-quiet-game-of-mini-mafia?user=mkfuba07 - town http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/432880-white-flag-mafia?user=mkfuba07 - mafia both super short filters to illustrate a point, his tone and focus is quite different. As town he'll tend to get right into it and back posts without needing prompting, while as mafia he just responds to people directly and has a slightly different tone/way of typing. you could look at more games if you want but i think these are sufficient. It seems that if you need prompting to discuss situations that are so prevalent it means you are mafia. That looks increasingly like what you are doing this game. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
1) I felt that no individual would ever believe they were under pressure and mafia would have caught their breadcrumb and then hard claim jailkeeper on day 1. I could not believe that a town Artanis[Xp] would do this. Since I did not believe it, I had to test out his claim. I originally thought just claiming jailkeeper would make him either rescind his silly claim or if he was mafia, give up the game. He did not do this however so I concluded that from his reactions and interactions around it his claim was pretty much sincere. This is when I decided to enact the second phase of my plan. 2) I switched my claim to doctor in order to garner reactions. Since I am town and I am pretty sure Artanis[Xp] is town then the unbelievable situation is that we have both a jailkeeper and a doctor. I don't think anybody would think this would be balanced. At least, I don't think it would in a small game such as this. So, since this was the case I left it open that there were 2 healing power roles. I did want to let everyone respond but a lot of people are just afk. No matter, this led to some very interesting reactions indeed: The first of which is Justanothertownie. I think his reaction is by far the most sincere in the game. Posts like: + Show Spoiler + On June 06 2015 10:52 justanothertownie wrote: Going to bed. Anyone who is even considering not lynching Artanis has to explain all this: First of all you have to explain why NaCl is scum because there is no way there are 2 protective roles in a 10 vs 3 setup with 1 mafia KP and normal roles but EVEN IF THAT IS NOT ENOUGH FOR YOU ON ITS OWN and you think for some reason it is possible to have a JK AND a doctor in the same game: The situation is the following - you are Artanis a pretty good and experienced town player and you happened to role JK. Halfway into day1 nothing much happened so far and all of a sudden marvellosity who you townread and who you think is a really good player is attacking and voting you. You played a lot of games together. Do you either try to convince him that you are town/play the game or immediately feel the need to claim? The answer is even if Artanis thinks he will potentially get lynched he will never claim his really powerful role without trying to avert the lynch otherwise before (and his stats show that he is really good at not being mislynched). On the other hand if you are scum Artanis then you might think to yourself - "I will probably not be able to avoid being lynched" for whatever reason (maybe because town marvellosity set his sights on you). Artanis had some really weak scumgames. In THAT CASE claiming JK is pretty good. If noone counterclaims you will survive AT LEAST a day and be able to push an agenda. If you get counterclaimed you outed a really important role (if scum has a vigi getting rid of our protective role basically means they need one less mislynch for example) and in the worst case you just still get lynched. Maybe you even survive because people are idiots. So town Artanis obviously did not claim because of being afraid. So why would he? Artanis says he claimed because he thought he was outed by a dumb breadcrumb (which I think is HIGHLY unbelievable itself) he did which marv put emphasis on. So what do you do in this situation? The answer is you never ever ever claim right away. What does town get from your outing? Nothing. If you think you absolutely need to claim for whatever reason you can still claim during the end of the night to avoid getting shot if scum happen to not know about you. By claiming you are destroying any chance of them not knowing for no real benefit. If Artanis is town he acted incredibly stupid to a degree that is absolutely insane. I refuse to believe this and that he would not put any thought in how to play as one of towns most important and strong roles. The likelihood of him being mafia is much much higher. Add to this the claim by NaCl and we will absolutely lynch Artanis today. + Show Spoiler + On June 06 2015 07:42 justanothertownie wrote: Noone would ever make the connectionof lock = jail. Are you kidding me. Yeah, yes. There are never ever both jk and doctor in a 13 player mini with scum having 1 KP. NEVER. His reactions and surprise and looking at claims while analysing which ones make sense or not is very towny of him. I am quite happy to add him to the town pile of Artanis[Xp] and Justanothertownie thus far. prplhz is more of a toss up, I'm not sure what to believe really. His initial reaction to the claims seemed a skeptical but also as if they were not at the same time: On June 06 2015 07:58 prplhz wrote: Until recently there couldn't be godfather, framer, miller, cop in same game but then suddenly there was a game with godfather, framer, miller, cop. So I'm not inclined to this setup speculation either. Honestly I haven't a clue what to make of these claims, I'm pretty horrible with claims. What I'm pretty certain of is that one of you claimers is a giant moron. post that give me pause are posts like: On June 06 2015 08:45 prplhz wrote: No but I just said, the narrative of him being town, having his crumb outed, being scum read by marvellosity (who will probably get his lynch d1) and then being all frustrated and martyring and hard claiming shit, that sort of fits. Do you think scum would have done all this if they could have avoided it? This is pretty extraordinary. combined with On June 06 2015 09:30 prplhz wrote: seriously artanis has never been mislynched and that's not because he pulls off shit like this in all his town games it's the exact opposite He pretty much outlines reasons that Artanis[Xp] could be town while still saying that we should lynch him which is incredibly confusing, hence why I'm not sure about his alignment right now. I actually think marvellosity is mafia in this game. He has had several overblown reactions that I don't think he'd have as town and his reaction to this double protective role claiming is very sub par for him. I don't think he'd ever agree with Justanothertownie's reasoning for voting Artanis[Xp] and then just blindly lynch fuba. Ever. The reactions that I am talking about are: On June 06 2015 05:28 marvellosity wrote: that's so bad. this is why i'm playing less and less. i can't handle the sort of nonsense yamato + artanis are pulling this game. i don't find it enjoyable. it's too bad for me to find enjoyable both Artanis[Xp] and Yamato77 were marvellosity's scum reads. Yet, when they did such utterly terrible things it garnered this reaction from marvellosity. Now, he's played quite a few games with Artanis[Xp] and from what I've seen he catches him if he is mafia quite regularly and has seen Artanis[Xp] claim things like mafia but lynched him anyway. This is a stupid claim and his initial reaction is frustration at stupidity but we find out later that marvellosity is STILL scum reading Artanis[Xp]. This, in tandem with his reaction to Yamato77 (his other scum read) seems very disingenuous. Now, getting to the part of the claims. I never expected marvellosity to just sit back on a lynch when there were 2 protective roles claimed in the thread. ESPECIALLY if one of them was his original scum read that has now been outed. However, his reactions are so meek that I can only conclude that this is a mafia marvellosity. On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote: There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here. None. He is scum. On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote: yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. On June 06 2015 19:56 marvellosity wrote: Mig: the context is all in my posts, my patience levels are even lower than what they used to be, I have nothing further to add what jat wrote is honestly quite convincing about artanis, probably because i kinda believe it myself. still, it's possibly a risky play i guess just to randomly claim when you could talk yourself out of it? still can't decide firmly like i said last night, I find the idea that I found artanis, it happened to contain the word lock, and he made the best of it not unlikely that said, my vote is probably on mafia with fuba anyway. soooo...... Actually i went back and read what jat wrote again, still pretty convinced. i'd lynch either. He barely mentions the fact that there are 2 claims. He in fact ignores it. He bypasses this fact to then just talk about Artanis[Xp]'s reaction instead. However, it's as if he doesn't even care about it. He'd rather just sit back and lynch whoever instead of trying to figure things out. Fuba is such a cop out lynch and not something I think he'd be doing. Regardless his play this game can be surmised as: Overblown reactions to Artanis[Xp]'s stupidity and a fake reaction to Yamato77 and nothing. Also: On June 06 2015 20:00 marvellosity wrote: Does mafia KP = 1 mean KP is factional and leaves room for the possibility of a mafia vigi, or is it 1 maximum? I do not think he'd ever ask this question as town. I'm actually blown away that he'd ever ask this when he 100% knows it would never get answered. He has also now claimed inactivity excuses. I think he is mafia. Yamato77 is another person that I think is likely to be mafia. Out of all the reactions he had me scratching my head the most. He seemed to instantly believe that both claims were entirely real and that Artanis[Xp]'s post was most definitely a breadcrumb and never listened to logic that dictated otherwise. On June 06 2015 07:53 yamato77 wrote: It makes a lot of sense if you believe he's just fucking mafia. The crumb is obvious, and not something I think scum Artanis does very often. Town Artanis feels pressured, town Artanis feels like his role is outed anyway, so he claims. Is it really such a difficult sequence of events to understand? If NaCl IS town and he IS doctor, he's a fucking idiot for "counterclaiming" in a closed setup in the first place. If you don't believe Artanis' claim, MAKE GOOD POINTS ABOUT IT, DON'T "COUNTERCLAIM" WITH A DIFFERENT ROLE THAN THE ONE BEING CLAIMED It's fucking asinine that you're going along with this as well. Is town JAT honestly this fucking stupid to want to lynch into obvious claims? On June 06 2015 08:00 yamato77 wrote: Look, Artanis shouldn't have claimed when he did, but the crumb is quite obviously a crumb in hindsight If you don't think it's a crumb now, I don't know what to tell you On June 06 2015 08:09 yamato77 wrote: Fine, JAT, obviously you don't listen to me, so you can have your way. I will have no part in this lynch however. I don't think he ever pondered the possibility that one of the claims was false or otherwise. Artanis[Xp]'s breadcrumb did not look like a breadcrumb at all and was actually in a standard phrase that many people use in mafia so "in hindsight" it still doesn't look like a breadcrumb at all. I think he has shown that he is using too much information to make a read and that becomes very evident in this situation. I think mig's reaction: + Show Spoiler + On June 06 2015 16:59 Mig wrote: Some stuff I noticed, marv/yam interaction looks a little forced to me. Marv has to have played with yam 50 times by now. Yam is like this every game, the marv blow up seems overly emotional. I have seen marv blow up before but this seemed a bit much considering yam was just being his usual yam self. Just something to keep in mind. Feast/artanis interaction - If either of artanis/feast are scum it is very unlikely that the other is also. The claim/counter claim/ artanis vote feast stuff is too random. Just a weird/unlikely series of interactions if the scum team planned out an artanis fake claim. I honestly have no idea if having 2 protection roles would be OP for town or not. If mafia has a rber it doesn't seem that outlandish to me. That being said I am fine with lynching artanis. I read through Noir mini mafia that he just played and I actually think artanis played well that game. Day1 of that game was about as useless as this day1 has been and he still managed to actually post some useful thoughts. So far today he has posted a paragraph on being a little suspicious of JTA and that's it. Along with that his story for why he claimed is meh. Alternating between claiming because he was bored and because marv mentioned his line with the word lock in it. It was fairly clear that marv wasn't even saying that it was a bread crumb just that artanis was giving superfluous commentary. Assuming that mafia would have figured out he was JK from that is retarded. Seems more likely that artanis is bsing. Kind of funny he said this, made a few more posts then disappeared for the rest of the day as well. Artanis if you are town give your reads, make a case etc. actually looks quite genuine and thought out, it shows that he's analytically looking at the alignments of the big event that happened in the game so far and did some background reading to make sure. His interactions points seem a bit too surface level though so a bit hesitant to add him to a town circle but definitely not in a scummy circle quite yet either. This is getting a bit long and i'm not sure people are going to read it so for the sake of clarity People I am happy with and think are probably town: Artanis[Xp], justanothertownie People that I am happy with: mig, possibly fuba for analysing peoples' reactions (not mentioned in long post sorry), Alakaslam People that I am ok with: prplhz People that I have no idea about: VayneAuthority (not mentioned but I don't really have a clue, didn't like his reactions though), Chezinu (ignored most of the game), FecalFeast, People I think are scum: Marvellosity, Yamato77, boxerfred (I read his past game where he was mafia and it looked very similar) ##unvote ##vote yamato77 | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 07 2015 01:06 marvellosity wrote: i do this sort of thing all the time. so either you don't know my play at all, or you're just trying to guess how i'd play. both options suck. While you may lynch people like that "all the time" that is because you have simply eliminated the possibility of other people being mafia through repeated interactions and thinking. Something that is severely lacking from you in this game. I do not believe you call Artanis[Xp] confirmed mafia for his claim with the provision that you'll leave him alone unless someone counterclaims him: On June 06 2015 05:23 marvellosity wrote: There is absolutely no way a town Artanis claims jailkeeper for no reason here. None. He is scum. On June 06 2015 06:12 marvellosity wrote: yeah i guess unless someone hard counterclaims you, that might be a good idea. and then see a counterclaim yet still call him possibly mafia but not want to lynch him 10,000 times over when this would pander to your ego for finding him. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 07 2015 01:01 justanothertownie wrote: ##Unvote Yes, marv might be mafia. Gonna read you yamato bit now. Tell me what you think about this. | ||
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NaCl`y
131 Posts
On June 07 2015 01:13 marvellosity wrote: because the first quote is an emotional reaction the second is me making myself step back and think basically a massive towntell. Yes, but then you see someone actually counterclaim him and don't bat an eyelid about it. I don't want to get into this discussion with you. I've laid out my points and they will either be confirmed or abolished the more you play so you may as well talk about things that are not related to you since I am not pushing for your lynch at the moment and have made countless other points. | ||
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