| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 27 2015 02:46 Palmar wrote: Announcement: The posts Robik refers to were made deliberately in a quick succession in an elaborate attempt to invoke amusement. ![[image loading]](http://reactiongifs.me/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/jeremiah_johnson_nodding-Robert-Redford.gif) | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
that's long enough to be policy townread. that sucks where did liancourt go? | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 27 2015 03:03 GlowingBear wrote: Ridiculous negotiation. Ridiculous. You had a townread on me and you're considering lynching me so you can get lian lynched? What? Townies, you're risking a mislynch on me. And the blame is all on you. I'm at the beach now so will be more active at night/ If I come back to discover I was hammered, I'm gonna be mad. obviously i'm not townreading you anymore...??? | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
- i don't remember why i townread him yesterday lol - he stopped doing the mind posts thing which if he were really trying out i figured he would be continuing to do - idk i'm just sheeping people for now leave me alone we're not even close to eod yet honestly i would really much rather liancourt, but no one's listening  | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
go read on... p8? where liancourt talked a bunch about toad's opening and statement that he wasn't readable and found it disconcerting and then gb is like "yeah toad is town! whoo!" in the NEXT post lol and then after that (p10 i think) gb townreads liancourt for... agreeing with him on toad when they didn't? idk man it's not great but it adds to the whole "gb is just bsing with his mind notes thing" | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
i talked about this multiple times in my last posts yesterday evening and fuckin everyone ignored me so im gonna be obnoxious and requote them | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 26 2015 12:07 Eden1892 wrote: I mean the liancourt thing though He says he scumread me for being different than before but last game we played I was mafia. How is his reason making sense? And I even explain how I was different. Dont ignore this please. I will come back to it if people do until they stop. This is a good point. liancourt is just looking for excuse to scumread me with that read | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 26 2015 13:04 Eden1892 wrote: Coming-down-Magic was fun but not for why you'd think it would be. Anyway I am back and I ?hope? of sound mind and judgment. I feel like my liancourt read was still pretty coherent. Maybe not in execu-- no, definitely not in execution, but at least in the logic. Let me try to explain it with a little more clarity of mind. My play style was different from both games he's seen from me, and I was mafia in one and town in the other. At the very least he's obscuring the truth by citing Imperial as the inspiration for his read without making any mention of the fact that my play is different from the time he saw me play mafiasided. I feel like a townie would make mention of this and try to give the other player a fair shake instead of simply going "different from this town game therefore mafia!" while ignoring the equally-important "different from this mafia game therefore ???" I also kinda felt like it was a cheap shot trying this kind of obscurantist read while I wasn't quite at full mental capacity, but to be fair it's not his fault that I decided to try new alcohol right before he gave his reads. Idk maybe it's unfair to hold that to him, but I felt like it was more sinister than a misunderstanding or error. | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
because that's also wrong he even was so kind as to link to the mafiascum wiki page on omgus which says "it is sometimes used as a shorthand to indicate that you are voting for someone primarily because they voted for you." i didn't vote him, firstly, and secondly i suspected him because his read on me was a half-truth that i felt was deliberately obscuring facts about my meta. reducing it to "he suspects me because i suspect him" is... also obscuring facts, more blatantly whether or not his meta is "vote for his suspect and not explain himself," until his reads are based in fact instead of obscurantism he's my target | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 27 2015 04:11 Toadesstern wrote: I agree in that liancourt feels like he is picking his target and once he has picked that he's writing something about them (because he has to) rather than going with the flow. It should be the other way around, you find something weird and you talk about it no matter who it is, especially early on into d1. Is he usually the kind of guy that locks on his target and just goes at it? hts says so, i've only played one game with him where he was town and i was mafia, and he locked onto me. but idk if he just does it in general or was zeroed in on me because i was obvious LOL my issue is less that he's zeroed in on me and refusing to budge or explain himself, because townies and mafia both tunnel on targets all the time. my issue is the reasoning he's using, which i feel like doesn't come from the position of someone who doesn't have the truth and is trying to figure it out, but instead from the position of someone who does have the truth and is trying to obscure it from the others | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 27 2015 04:22 Toadesstern wrote: though if he's tunneling he has confirmation bias by definition. If that's what he's doing it's likely he might ignore the parts you're blaming him for simply because he's certain you're mafia and looking at it only one way: Try to point out things that don't fit with your townmeta because you're mafia anyways Both what you said and what I said come down to the same thing I feel. It could very well be malicious just the way I think locking on to just one target could be something malicious because that way he doesn't have to make up stuff about a lot of people and can just focus on one guy. But if he does tunnel a lot that's a moot point. Nah, there's a key difference in what I'm observing - for him to start tunneling on someone he thinks is mafia he first has to have some reason for thinking it. If his initially-given reason for thinking I'm mafia doesn't actually make sense from a townie POV, it makes him significantly less likely to be town and tunneling. Let's say it's d2 and he had done this awesome vote count analysis and made a decent argument for me being mafia. Say I afk'd with my vote on an outlier. He gives his case, then votes me, never reconsiders and starts turning everything I say into something suspicious. He's tunneling on me, but his fundamental argument that began the tunnel is sensible, so he's probably town tunneling. In contrast, let's say it's d1 and he decided I'm mafia because I posted a picture of a puppy. (shit doesn't have to make sense just roll with it) He then never reconsiders and starting turning everything I say into something suspicious. He's tunneling again, but it starts to look a lot more like mafia tunneling to avoid having to engage the thread, because his original reason for suspecting me was bogus and he then starts adjusting his interpretations of everything I say to justify himself post-facto. Obviously he's somewhere in the middle, but as I argued before, I think he's closer to the puppy side than the awesome side of the spectrum. His reasoning outright ignored half of his (two) data points without explanation, which is something I think is more likely to come from mafia than from town. He then proceeds to tunnel and misinterpret what I'm saying. The tunneling can go either way but the ignoring of the data points to make his first read can't. | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 27 2015 04:25 Half the Sky wrote: Can someone clarify the term confirmation bias in this game? Or is that the same thing as tunnelling? I see it used often, but I don't know what it means with respect to this game. If you go into an attempt to interpret data with a conclusion about the data already in mind, you are more likely to misinterpret the data you're observing to fit the conclusion than you are to form the rationally optimal conclusion from the data (whatever that conclusion is). Typically this manifests in magnifying data points which support the conclusion while ignoring or discarding data points which don't. The process is unintentional, which is important; it's an innate cognitive bias rather than a deliberate effort. I do have an issue with characterizing liancourt's read as confirmation bias, though, because it presupposes an honest mistake instead of a more insidious, deliberate misrepresentation. The reason I have an issue with that is because I already pointed this mistake out to liancourt and he ignored my pointing it out without issuing a retraction or even addressing it. An honest mistake would be acknowledged and his conclusion would be modified to account for it. This hasn't happened. | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On January 27 2015 04:36 Half the Sky wrote: All people wanting to lynch Liancourt, I urge you to please wait 3-5h until he wakes up before pushing his lynch. He is unable to defend himself because he's asleep. Perspective please. He has one vote and I'm deliberately not voting him to make sure the lynch doesn't snowball and end the day hella early. And while I understand he probably won't be online to defend himself for a little while, these aren't new accusations. I raised these points yesterday, to him, and he ignored me then. If you really want this lead explored, you need to stop pushing people away from raising these questions, because if this just subsides for a few hours he'll probably wake up, look at this discussion, shrug it off and not do anything. | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
Pop quiz time. Who can name something of relevance that Onegu has done this game? The answer key is below, please don't peek until y [spoiler] | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
Who can name something of relevance that Onegu has done this game? The answer key is below, please don't peek until you've guessed. + Show Spoiler + Nothing | ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
| ||
|
Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
Please clarify how you suspected me based on me having a similar playstyle to my previous game when my filter was 4 pgs long by the time you voted me and my filter didn't hit p4 until day3 of the game you're citing | ||
| ||
[ Submit Event ] |
|
|
|
Replay Cast
Wardi Open
StarCraft2.fi
OlimoLeague
StarCraft2.fi
StarCraft2.fi
The PondCast
CranKy Ducklings
Sparkling Tuna Cup
|
|
|
EPT
