On July 25 2014 17:22 Vivax wrote: You need to make something that is supposed to be convincing for the thread and not for me, so talk to the thread.
Everyone will see this conversation and judge it for themselves. I'm confident that I'm getting my point across now and that I'm not expressing myself poorly, as I did when I was half-sleep deprived and frustrated with the game and real life issues.
On July 25 2014 17:25 Vivax wrote: Here's how you do it:
(quote)
Here we see how Vivax bsbsbs
(quote)
Then he bsbsbsb
bs 1 and bs 2 make Vivax scum cause the scum motive was to bsbsbsbs
I don't care how you think I should be making a case because everyone else will judge these posts by themselves, as you said is more important, right? If you don't want to respond to my accusations, and instead call them "nitpicking", that's your problem. As I've already said, everyone else will decide for themselves.
On July 25 2014 17:30 Vivax wrote: Yes, it is for everyone to see that you're not legitimately trying to figure out my alignment and push for my lynch properly, good job, come again.
It doesn't matter that you think this. You're going to get lynched and everyone else will be doing it, not you.
See? I'm going to try to get you lynched, and you're still not doing anything to get me lynched. That's what you committed to, though, right?
On July 25 2014 17:34 Vivax wrote: For me it's not just all about getting lynched who's pissing me off at one particular moment, it's about lynching scum, hence whyI gave you the chance to prove your push was genuine, so I could reconsider if it was a good idea lynching you.
Wanted to see if you were a tunneled townie with real reasons and real intent or just a scummer shitflinging.
Needless to say what feeling I get from this page.
Your "chance to prove my push" was you telling me "l2p" and let go from my scum read on you, as well as telling me "how to make a case" against you, while in reality I have given a bunch of accusations against you that you haven't addressed yet.
No wait, apparently I've been "nitpicking" all this time.
To me this feels like you as mafia are trying to justify reading me as scummy.
On July 25 2014 21:43 Vivax wrote: If I get janitor'd and one of Koshi or Teemu claims vig, lynch them immediately.
Understood?
Hey, I wanted to nitpick at you a little bit. Does this mean you're not going to kill either one of us in the night? That's ok, I guess.
On July 25 2014 19:34 Vivax wrote: That would be true if he was a guy who scum has to fear, which I don't think is the case.
Prime targets for tonight are me, chopin, Palmar. Assuming they are all town which I currently do. On the other hand scum also has to assume they are likely medic targets, or jk, or whatever we got. So if one of us gets shot they really wanted us out of the way, and badly, take that into account the next day.
To get back onto more useful topics: Xata I have to admit that rereading the start of D1 you do seem scummy. Just so many weird things, starting with you deciding to not lynch Koshi for something he said in pre-game, then posting a list when prompted. Kinda tryhard but not really, same arguments I used on Damdred.
I'm just musing right now and it's night but I'll assume it's my last just to be safe, do you see the reasons for why that looks bad?
So you're just throwing scum at us again, without directly calling us mafia. This time you're using a WIFOM argument trying to make me look bad because obv obv obvi Koshi and/or I killed you in the night for you being SO onto us atm.
Why do you feel the need to speculate about nightkills and what those "will" mean before they've even happened?
Compare it. He's assertive, and genuinely tries to figure the game out, leaves back room for doubt. Asks the right questions.
I'm almost certain this is scum Koshi at this point.
[QUOTE]On July 25 2014 19:49 Vivax wrote: [QUOTE]On July 25 2014 19:43 Koshi wrote: Xatalos refuses to scumhunt.[/QUOTE]
What happened to your aggressive push. I feel like something is missing in my life since I don't hear the angry mobster asking for my death any more.
If you have legit reasons for thinking I'm town now, and not just the modconfirming silliness, then I need your opinion on Teemursu keeping up the push on the drill sergeant.
Martial law might have mercy if you prove you were just on the brink of insanity and not able to control your actions.QUOTE]
On July 25 2014 21:55 Vivax wrote: Teemursu is like the only guy in the thread that thinks Koshi is playing alright. If they aren't scumbuddies I don't know.
On July 25 2014 22:14 Chopin Liszt wrote: I don't know why people disagree with me when I am certain.
I am always right when I am certain. Literally always. It's like the thing I learnt to do this year. Like there are so many players who guarantee this or that or say people are 100% alignments and more often than not they are wrong.
But when I do that, they are the alignment I say. Because I am Chopin.
Chopin
Are you certain about my alignment? Am I town or mafia?
On July 23 2014 12:36 Navillus wrote: Just got here, my 2 cents on xatalos is that the list does look bad and I got the same weird feeling when he said that we shouldn't lynch kush because he's a good scum-player, especially after he posted:
On July 23 2014 06:16 Xatalos wrote:
On July 23 2014 06:10 Chopin Liszt wrote:
On July 23 2014 06:09 Xatalos wrote:
On July 23 2014 06:06 Chairman Ray wrote: The exchange between Xatalos and Koshi is the most awkward and forced conversation I have ever seen, especially this:
On July 23 2014 05:41 Xatalos wrote:
On July 23 2014 03:04 Koshi wrote: Xatalos it has been a while. I am town this game. You must be so happy.
Hmm. I think I want you to live longer than D1 just for the "Mafia totes alive guis" mass PM. That, and my history of reading you is horrible. I have the vague idea that someone explained your meta to me in a recent game so I'll search for that.
If we had two lynches, I'd lynch them both.
##Vote: Xatalos
I don't think it's a good idea to lynch either of us for D1. Generally speaking.
What does this mean?
Koshi can look scummy during D1 as town so it's not usually a good time to lynch him. I'm generally active regardless of my alignment, and I become a (somewhat) valuable asset throughout the game as town and I tend to reveal myself more easily later on as scum (+leaving material to work with). Neither of us are ideal D1 lynches.
so people who will reveal themselves early shouldn't be lynched D1 and people who won't reveal themselves early shouldn't be lynched D1? That doesn't make sense and looks scummy to me because it sounds like forced reasons to lynch or not lynch.
Also posting a list where like half the entries are saying nothing looks like an attempt to just generate content so for that I feel comfortable to ##Vote Xatalos
Aside from him I'm very happy that Chopinliszt stopped with that rhyming stuff but I would put them much higher on my list of who to lynch this game unless they post as much as two other players would, it's going to be way too difficult to get a read if we have a small amount of content half from one person half another.
1) Doesn't try to hide in this post. 2) Give his reads/thoughts freely on the game.
On July 23 2014 12:41 Navillus wrote: Re: Damdred I don't see anything particularly odd. His long post on Xatalos is the only thing that I would see as maybe indicative, I think often scum make long posts picking out a lot of pretty small stuff so they can look like they're contributing, but right now there's not much substantial to go on and xatalos has felt off to me with his pretty early defensiveness of other players. I don't see any reason to think Damdred is scum at the moment.
1) Doesn't try to hide in this post. 2) Give his reads/thoughts freely on the game.
On July 23 2014 12:54 Navillus wrote:
On July 23 2014 12:47 kushm4sta wrote: fuck no voting thread.. now i can't ninja vote ##vote harurh
reasons?
On July 23 2014 12:55 Navillus wrote: any reason that harurh is the placeholder?
On July 23 2014 13:29 Navillus wrote: vayne you have a reason separate from what kush said?
On July 23 2014 16:12 Navillus wrote: Teemursu unrelated to the content could you just try to consolidate your posts a bit more, it just makes things more readable.
On other notes, I hadn't noticed that post by Palmar which is definitely a problem post, I also would really like for vayne to explain the Haru vote.
Obi and temmursu what do you think of xatalos, damdred and kush?
Asking questions is not scummy if you first provided your own opinion in the thread. It's called scumhunting. So what that he made 3 questionsi n seperate posts and then made 3 more questions in a new post. He also asked to consolidate in the last post so maybe therefore he is putting everything in 1 post. Who the fuck knows? It isn't scummy.
On July 23 2014 18:13 Navillus wrote: Teem if If you're asking me what that post said about chopin I'm saying I want extra content out of the hydra because it's going to be a bitch to try to mix reads of two people and I will push their lynch if them being a hydra prevents me from getting a clear read on them.
Palmar your post was a problem not a reason to lynch because you posted an intention, if you had followed through that would have made you look a lot scummier to me. I didn't threaten to lynch because it's one post that's not very readable with a day+ to go, I seriously doubt you would have considered that a plausible threat and I wouldn't have followed through without more scum-reads, I'm not gonna vote or threaten to vote everyone that I might like to be more active.
Anyway I already posted my read of xatalos and since he hasn't posted anything since then that hasn't changed. On the other hand I just reread kush and for the second or third time and I am really getting a weird (read scummy) vibe off him. He defends xatalos multiple times from people posting reads very similar to what I got on my first read-through.
On July 23 2014 07:58 GlowingBear wrote: Particular focus to what he said about kush " I think he's quite a good scum player so I'd rather see until later to judge him". He is a good player as scum, so, let him live, guys. I don't get this logic.
While saying that a lot of people needs time because he can't judge now, suddenly, damdred can be lynched because of his gut feelings. Contradictory.
I don't get why you don't like the logic in the first post. What would you do, automatically scumread me?
the second point is a misrepresentation. xatalos' read on damdred seems no where near strong enough that he wants to lynch him. he was identifying some gut feelings, which we all have. so what's wrong with that?
On July 23 2014 07:58 GlowingBear wrote: Particular focus to what he said about kush " I think he's quite a good scum player so I'd rather see until later to judge him". He is a good player as scum, so, let him live, guys. I don't get this logic.
While saying that a lot of people needs time because he can't judge now, suddenly, damdred can be lynched because of his gut feelings. Contradictory.
I don't get why you don't like the logic in the first post. What would you do, automatically scumread me?
the second point is a misrepresentation. xatalos' read on damdred seems no where near strong enough that he wants to lynch him. he was identifying some gut feelings, which we all have. so what's wrong with that?
If I start arguing that someone is a good scum player, it means that it's almost impossible to read the guy at any point of the game. So, the consequence would be automatically lynching that guy day1, yes, and not wait to judge. Have in mind I would never suggest this. I'm just saying that the cause-consequence he brought there isn't natural IMO.
No problem in have gut feelings. The problem here is that he gives free passes for people he is not sure but got scum vibes from damdred. The way he stand regarding everyone else is completely incompatible with the gut feeling he gets from damdred.
hi again! are you a girl? if yes, want to be my egirlfriend, if you are over 18? we can go on edates. we both share the interest of forum mafia so I think we probably have a lot in common.
first paragraph u say it's best to automatically lynch everyone you think is good scum. Should xatalos have said "he's good scum SO LET"S LYNCH HIM!" and that would have been townie?
second paragraph you are essentially arguing that since he has scum feels for damdred, he should have feels for every person in the game. Why does getting feels about 1 person mean tha the should have feels on everybody?
^glowingbear brings the exact thoughts I had and kush ignores him saying that he's not making the argument to lynch good scums early but that xata's own posts would suggest that then xata contradicts himself. I thought this contradiction was weird but kush doesn't seem to notice and later just hones in on what i saw as a much less contradictory statement by haru
On July 23 2014 07:58 GlowingBear wrote: Particular focus to what he said about kush " I think he's quite a good scum player so I'd rather see until later to judge him". He is a good player as scum, so, let him live, guys. I don't get this logic.
While saying that a lot of people needs time because he can't judge now, suddenly, damdred can be lynched because of his gut feelings. Contradictory.
I don't get why you don't like the logic in the first post. What would you do, automatically scumread me?
the second point is a misrepresentation. xatalos' read on damdred seems no where near strong enough that he wants to lynch him. he was identifying some gut feelings, which we all have. so what's wrong with that?
If I start arguing that someone is a good scum player, it means that it's almost impossible to read the guy at any point of the game. So, the consequence would be automatically lynching that guy day1, yes, and not wait to judge. Have in mind I would never suggest this. I'm just saying that the cause-consequence he brought there isn't natural IMO.
No problem in have gut feelings. The problem here is that he gives free passes for people he is not sure but got scum vibes from damdred. The way he stand regarding everyone else is completely incompatible with the gut feeling he gets from damdred.
hi again! are you a girl? if yes, want to be my egirlfriend, if you are over 18? we can go on edates. we both share the interest of forum mafia so I think we probably have a lot in common.
first paragraph u say it's best to automatically lynch everyone you think is good scum. Should xatalos have said "he's good scum SO LET"S LYNCH HIM!" and that would have been townie?
second paragraph you are essentially arguing that since he has scum feels for damdred, he should have feels for every person in the game. Why does getting feels about 1 person mean tha the should have feels on everybody?
Hi! I'm male but I'd love to play the girlfriend role. Buy me stuff and maybe you'll get laid )) It's difficult for me to be clear, I realise I have some problems with it (particularly while talking in english), I'll be objective but if it's still unclear please tell me and I'll try to clarify it again.
I don't say that it's best to automatically lynch everyone who I think is good scum. I actually say that, if anyone starts a phrase with "I think he's quite a good scum player", in a mafia game, I believe that the most unnatural conclusion will be "I'll have to wait to judge him". I believe that a townie will mostly pressure the good player so he can get a better analysis. Therefore, if at early day1 I start saying that someone is a good scum player, I will automatically vote for him, because (i) I can get more information from him and (ii) it's better to lynch a good scum player than a bad scum player, although this last argument is secondary and less optimal.
Not what I'm saying in the last paragraph, also. I'm saying that if he has gut feelings, I'm almost sure damdred is not the only one. There are more mafias in the game. He shouldn't consider every other player scum, but why he is considering only damdred and noone else? He used a passive stance. He would say "I never played a game with this guy before" or "I need more time to read this one". Why picking damdred only? He doesn't get scum vibes from ANY other player?
Do you understand what I mean? The feeling I got from his post was "I'll be as neutral as I can with every other player so I won't be the centre of attention and so people won't OMGUS me, but I'll pick someone to start a wagon and maybe get a mislynch. But I won't do that too hard, or people will turn against me day2. Maybe saying that I have gut feelings will lead someone to build a strong case against this townie".
I write too much.
Another issue I have with this damdred gut read is that it doesn't fit with his no-lynch reads. He put a bunch of people on a no-lynch list because those people don't give a strong indication of alignment on day 1. This means that he's looking for really strong scumreads. However, he's scumreading damdred for hardly anything. Doesn't make a lot of sense.
The only issue I have with xatalos is how he is not putting any effort into trying to scumhunt, but decides to post a liszt post (hue) anyway. He blanket reads us who he never played before as 'not lynching/can lynch', which means nothing since this is everyone. However, his reads on damdred and va reeks of 'no effort', which is usually an indicator of scum trying to blend into town and yet post stuff.
wtf do you expect a few hours into the game?
^this also seems weirdly defensive to me,
. Defending him isn't scummy but doing so that early and to different people with similar reads just feels too sure that he's right. On top of that he really hasn't pushed much, he voted haru which was kind of an extension of his defense of xata then he put down a placeholder vote on palmer. In fact I just looked at his votes and he literally makes no attempt to explain why he unvoted haru, trying to pull that vote off to a non-vote is really weird to me. None of this seems like serious efforts to find scum.
So ##Vote: kushm4sta
1) Doesn't try to hide in this post. 2) Give his reads/thoughts freely on the game. ___________________________________________________
So why is Navillus not a good lynch: 1) He isn't hiding. 2) He gave his opinion on EVERYBODY and is actively playing.
On July 23 2014 20:39 Vivax wrote: It's cool that your opinion differs Koshi but I don't see why you spend so much talking about townreads and mechanics and the terrible idea of vets claiming when you don't have an own scumread to push behind it that warrants you taking the wind out of other peoples sails to push your own preference.
On July 23 2014 20:39 Vivax wrote: It's cool that your opinion differs Koshi but I don't see why you spend so much talking about townreads and mechanics and the terrible idea of vets claiming when you don't have an own scumread to push behind it that warrants you taking the wind out of other peoples sails to push your own preference.
##unvote ##vote: Vivax
Bite me.
This is where it all started. Here do you see why I am actually gold in this game and why Vivax is trash or scum. Somewhere you would like to think Vivax wouldn't be so obnoxious right? And I keep telling you people that Vivax is a liar this game. I already gave you 3 examples. If you didn't read them, look them up. Or take my word. I don't know if he does this as town but it isn't very townie. The last point on why Vivax is scum is that he tries to trap me into saying things that prove me scum. Now this could be comming from a townie, it also sounds pretty townie to do it, but I can just feel it in my bones that it is not coming from a townie and that the true intention is to let me say something I don't want to say. It is not a trap that a scummer would fall in. It is the kind of trap that is sneaky and let's you say something that you as townie clearly aren't thinking and therefore shouldn't say. I feel like Vivax knows this while asking these trap questions. It is hard to explain. Again, can it be that town Vivax plays like this? Maybe, but I doubt it. And maybe my 4th and last point is that I know that Vivax is wrong about me. And on top of that Teemu and I are connecting so fucking hard that I can only see him be wrong on him as well. Also, so many people see that I am obvious town, why is Vivax not accepting this? Why does somebody like Vivax thinks two scummers are just pushing him like this? It just feels all to wrong to me. Too wrong to be town Vivax. Oh, and a really last point. He says so much dumb shit. My eyebrows went up with at least 5 posts of him. Maybe more. Like not this guy is town and he said something dumb. More like: "I can't believe Vivax is town and makes this post." I will end all this with me acknowledging Vivax has a big filter and that that can be used to argument he isn't scum.
Tldr: Why Koshi is town, and has been pushing Vivax: Koshi activilly tried to steer town away from a Navillus lynch. Vivax bashes him for it. Koshi votes Vivax and never let's go. Then some other stuff happened.
But Navillus the obvious townie got lynched anyway. And Sentinel alone is to blame. I am 100% sure I would have gotten Obiwan lynched if I couldn't get more votes on Vivax within the first 10 minutes of the 20 minutes stolen from us by the host. I don't care how many votes Navillus in the end had. I tell you with 100% certainty he would not be lynched with 20 more minutes. No, I am 80% certain. It all kinda depends on how scum marv is and on how town Obiwan is I think.
I will not scream that Vivax or anybody else is confirmed town anymore by actions by this host. But let it be known that the host lynched Navillus and that he is responsible for denieing the information of a Vivax/Obiwan vote switch. I now completely calmed down. I have never been so mad in this game as I was after that lynch yesterday. I must say that I somewhere respect and am thankful to Sentinel for not modkilling me. I think I might go look for a selfban endgame. But the blind rage I felt after the lynch. And it kept going on till I went to bed. I never felt it before. Pretty epic experience now that I look back on it.
Now this game is tainted for me. Just like Noire was tainted. I still have this superupset feeling so maybe I can still care in this game. Maybe I will get shot. If scum has mercy on my soul. I am changing my TL meta from this moment on and I will try avoid making conversation posts or as I call them "game evolving posts" in the future. So don't expect small posts anymore. I might also not reply to Vivax if he keeps his shitty line of questioning up. Look at how he greeted me today. Oh well. I can't be too mad about that because I did push him like a maniac yesterday.
Vivax/VA/Xatalos/Obiwan/batsnacks If I could shoot 5 now I think those are the ones. marv alignment can be seen after N1 or for sure after N2 simply by the fact he lynched scum and is alive. If it is D3 and marv is alive and never lynched scum. Just lynch him please. CR I simply can't read. I don't know why. Damdred is null but I can see him being town. Palmar is Palmar but I can see him being town.
Somewhere if I really had to pick 3 Vivax/VA/batsnacks I don't know why these 3.
On July 24 2014 23:47 Xatalos wrote: Whatever. The damage is already done. I'm just PASSENGER (VT). I was trying to bait scum into shooting me at night but now it'll be impossible.
EPT
