• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:22
CET 13:22
KST 21:22
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival10TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting10[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3[ASL20] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Holding On9
Community News
BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION1Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams4Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest3Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou22Weekly Cups (Oct 13-19): Clem Goes for Four3
StarCraft 2
General
Could we add "Avoid Matchup" Feature for rankgame Smart servos says it affects liberators as well RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou The New Patch Killed Mech!
Tourneys
Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship $3,500 WardiTV Korean Royale S4 Tenacious Turtle Tussle
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace Mutation # 494 Unstable Environment
Brood War
General
BSL Season 21 BSL Team A vs Koreans - Sat-Sun 16:00 CET ASL20 Pre-season Tier List ranking! ASL Runner-Up Race Stats [ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival
Tourneys
[ASL20] Grand Finals BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION ASL final tickets help [ASL20] Semifinal A
Strategy
Current Meta Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Simple Questions, Simple Answers Roaring Currents ASL final
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently... Movie Discussion!
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The Benefits Of Limited Comm…
TrAiDoS
Sabrina was soooo lame on S…
Peanutsc
Our Last Hope in th…
KrillinFromwales
Certified Crazy
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1598 users

Catch 22 Mafia - Page 15

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 13 14 15 16 17 114 Next
Hapahauli
Profile Joined May 2009
United States9305 Posts
June 21 2013 06:53 GMT
#281
On June 21 2013 15:44 DarthPunk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 15:39 cDgCorazon wrote:
On June 21 2013 13:28 Oatsmaster wrote:
I wanna lynch cora seriously now.
1. He wants to waste his vote
2. He actually feels the need to justify his vote on marv


On June 21 2013 15:05 Oatsmaster wrote:
Cora is town.


On June 21 2013 14:02 Oatsmaster wrote:
DP and hapa are scum.


On June 21 2013 14:15 Oatsmaster wrote:
because you [Hapa] are wrong. and scum. Mostly wrong though.



First of all there is the 180 on me because it was obvious no one agreed with you.

Then it was the only semi-explained reasoning for DP, Hapa, and Yamato scum.

It doesn't equate to much contribution. I see a whole lot of nothing in your filter, and that's not good seeing as it's three pages already.


Do you agree or disagree with what hapa said about townies often being paranoid and casting suspicion on many different people for this reason?


This is a bit of an oversimplification for what I'm saying. Both scum and town can cast suspicion on multiple players. What's key is how they do it. In the case of Oats, he was doing it and making every effort to antagonize everyone around him. Combine this with his hyper-activity so far, and I associate this much more with his town play than his scum play. His scum-play is much more diplomatic.

Could he have adjusted? Mebe. I'd need much more than a couple of hours to catch him should that be the case, though I don't consider it likely.
a talking rock that sprouts among the waves woosh
Ange777
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Germany1164 Posts
June 21 2013 06:54 GMT
#282
@Oats:

Are you now saying yourself that your reasons for changing your mind are bad???
♥ Sen - 台灣之光 ♥
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
June 21 2013 06:54 GMT
#283
On June 21 2013 15:26 Hapahauli wrote:
@ GK

Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 15:18 goodkarma wrote:
On June 21 2013 15:05 Hapahauli wrote:
On June 21 2013 14:59 goodkarma wrote:
@Hapa:

Why you unvote Oats?


Because his play so far has been based on antagonizing every single person in the thread. There's no scum survival instinct in his play.

He's playing like a paranoid townie. Which is why I have severe objections to how you interpreted his play so far:

On June 21 2013 14:55 goodkarma wrote:
I'd say that right now I'm most suspicious of Oats.

He's called multiple people scum already, including: Cora, Hapa, DP, and has sheeped onto Yamato. But what I've failed to see from him is conviction in his reads. This is something I've seen from Oatsmaster in the past, even this early into the game, and I'm not seeing it here.

Oats, care to explain your current thoughts on DP and Hapa?


I have no idea how you associate any of this with scum-behavior. Firstly, "lack of conviction" seems the exact opposite of his play thusfar. Sure he doesn't have great justifications for his reads (which is normal on Day 1), but he seems to have as much "conviction" as possible.

Secondly, calling multiple people scum is completely non-alignment indicative, and might even be a town-tell (paranoia, natural suspicion, etc).

You are holding "townie conviction" to an immeasurably high standard. If there's anyone that has "conviction" about their reads so far, it's Oats. And hell it's early Day 1 - are you expecting the guy to have one clear scumread already or something?


Different people play scum in different ways. You say that the way Oats has played so far would be impossible for scum because there's "no survival instinct." I would strongly disagree with that. Oats so far hasn't really persay tunneled anyone all that hard. Coming from a game where he (as town) literally devoted all his energies to trying to get me lynched, his play this game is dramatically different. Sure, it's early and he could maybe not have that guy he's feeling really strongly is scum, but it is odd that he can so lightly jump on and off of people the way he has. Especially what he did with Yamato felt a bit off to me, more or less completely sheeping thread sentiment while entirely abandoning any focus on his prior scumreads.

I really haven't seen this "lack of survival instinct" you seem to have. This is a guy that as town waves his arms in the air and begs to get mislynched or vigshot for how scummy he looks. Here, I'd say he's not really acting like that.


He's already tunnelled a couple of people and is the most active person in this thread. I have no idea how you can interpret his play about having a lack of conviction.

In regards to him tunneling the hell out of you in "I Swear" Mini, you should know full well that he tunneled you on Day 2 of the game. How is that all relevant towards his play in the first few hours in the game, in which it is near impossible to have anything with which to mega-tunnel someone.

Can you point to me to any of his town-games in which he acts to the degree you attribute his play to within the first few hours of Day 1?


It was the first few hours I was in the game, so as far as I'm concerned it was day one. And it was based off my first post, so he literally is capable of megatunneling off basically nothing... But that's not really my main issue with him. I'm still having trouble understanding how he can so easily forget about you and DP when jumping onto Yamato. Also have you learned your lesson from Axel and Shao last game? Activity =/= towniness. Oats is always pretty active, so that's not particularly indicative of anything.
Corazon
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States3230 Posts
June 21 2013 06:55 GMT
#284
On June 21 2013 15:54 Ange777 wrote:
@Oats:

Are you now saying yourself that your reasons for changing your mind are bad???

inb4 Oats changes his mind for no reason and says that the reasons for changing his mind are actually good
Grubby's #1 Fan
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 21 2013 06:56 GMT
#285
I dont understand why you are so angry cora.
No gg, No skill.
Corazon
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States3230 Posts
June 21 2013 06:56 GMT
#286
On June 21 2013 15:56 Oatsmaster wrote:
I dont understand why you are so angry cora.


I'm not angry you're just being irrational and I'm calling you out for it.
Grubby's #1 Fan
Hapahauli
Profile Joined May 2009
United States9305 Posts
June 21 2013 06:56 GMT
#287
Anyway, I'm off to bed.

Oats is a strong town-read.
Cora is just under that.

At this point, the only person I'm suspicious of is GK for what I interpret to be a very bad entrance into the thread. He was suspicious of lynch-bait for very suspect rationale.

Essentially null on everyone else. Maybe a tinge suspicious of Shaio because one of his posts ("y u so scummy Yamato") rubbed me the wrong way.
a talking rock that sprouts among the waves woosh
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 21 2013 06:59 GMT
#288
On June 21 2013 15:56 cDgCorazon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 15:56 Oatsmaster wrote:
I dont understand why you are so angry cora.


I'm not angry you're just being irrational and I'm calling you out for it.

and?
No gg, No skill.
Corazon
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States3230 Posts
June 21 2013 07:00 GMT
#289
On June 21 2013 15:59 Oatsmaster wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 15:56 cDgCorazon wrote:
On June 21 2013 15:56 Oatsmaster wrote:
I dont understand why you are so angry cora.


I'm not angry you're just being irrational and I'm calling you out for it.

and?


On June 21 2013 13:53 cDgCorazon wrote:
Agree with what Hapa says, I do.
Cloudy and hard to see, the dark side makes it.
Behind the cloudiness, I think Oats is.

##Unvote
##Vote: Oatsmaster



And that.
Grubby's #1 Fan
Hapahauli
Profile Joined May 2009
United States9305 Posts
June 21 2013 07:01 GMT
#290
On June 21 2013 15:54 goodkarma wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 15:26 Hapahauli wrote:
@ GK

On June 21 2013 15:18 goodkarma wrote:
On June 21 2013 15:05 Hapahauli wrote:
On June 21 2013 14:59 goodkarma wrote:
@Hapa:

Why you unvote Oats?


Because his play so far has been based on antagonizing every single person in the thread. There's no scum survival instinct in his play.

He's playing like a paranoid townie. Which is why I have severe objections to how you interpreted his play so far:

On June 21 2013 14:55 goodkarma wrote:
I'd say that right now I'm most suspicious of Oats.

He's called multiple people scum already, including: Cora, Hapa, DP, and has sheeped onto Yamato. But what I've failed to see from him is conviction in his reads. This is something I've seen from Oatsmaster in the past, even this early into the game, and I'm not seeing it here.

Oats, care to explain your current thoughts on DP and Hapa?


I have no idea how you associate any of this with scum-behavior. Firstly, "lack of conviction" seems the exact opposite of his play thusfar. Sure he doesn't have great justifications for his reads (which is normal on Day 1), but he seems to have as much "conviction" as possible.

Secondly, calling multiple people scum is completely non-alignment indicative, and might even be a town-tell (paranoia, natural suspicion, etc).

You are holding "townie conviction" to an immeasurably high standard. If there's anyone that has "conviction" about their reads so far, it's Oats. And hell it's early Day 1 - are you expecting the guy to have one clear scumread already or something?


Different people play scum in different ways. You say that the way Oats has played so far would be impossible for scum because there's "no survival instinct." I would strongly disagree with that. Oats so far hasn't really persay tunneled anyone all that hard. Coming from a game where he (as town) literally devoted all his energies to trying to get me lynched, his play this game is dramatically different. Sure, it's early and he could maybe not have that guy he's feeling really strongly is scum, but it is odd that he can so lightly jump on and off of people the way he has. Especially what he did with Yamato felt a bit off to me, more or less completely sheeping thread sentiment while entirely abandoning any focus on his prior scumreads.

I really haven't seen this "lack of survival instinct" you seem to have. This is a guy that as town waves his arms in the air and begs to get mislynched or vigshot for how scummy he looks. Here, I'd say he's not really acting like that.


He's already tunnelled a couple of people and is the most active person in this thread. I have no idea how you can interpret his play about having a lack of conviction.

In regards to him tunneling the hell out of you in "I Swear" Mini, you should know full well that he tunneled you on Day 2 of the game. How is that all relevant towards his play in the first few hours in the game, in which it is near impossible to have anything with which to mega-tunnel someone.

Can you point to me to any of his town-games in which he acts to the degree you attribute his play to within the first few hours of Day 1?


It was the first few hours I was in the game, so as far as I'm concerned it was day one. And it was based off my first post, so he literally is capable of megatunneling off basically nothing... But that's not really my main issue with him. I'm still having trouble understanding how he can so easily forget about you and DP when jumping onto Yamato.


Well you didn't mention this before. That being said, I still have no idea about how this is scummy, but I'll let Oats answer for himself.

Also have you learned your lesson from Axel and Shao last game? Activity =/= towniness. Oats is always pretty active, so that's not particularly indicative of anything.


Shaio and Axle weren't very active. They were active in the early game, but dropped off later. The most active players in the thread were town, per usual. If there's a lesson to be learned, it's that early-game activity isn't as important as I weighted it to be. That being said, my read on Oats isn't entirely based on activity (though he has 3 pages of filter already) - it's based on his antagonistic attitude.
a talking rock that sprouts among the waves woosh
Ange777
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Germany1164 Posts
June 21 2013 07:02 GMT
#291
@Cora: What do you make of the fact that despite that quote Hapa now gave Oats a clear town read?
♥ Sen - 台灣之光 ♥
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 21 2013 07:02 GMT
#292
On June 21 2013 15:54 Ange777 wrote:
@Oats:

Are you now saying yourself that your reasons for changing your mind are bad???

oh god why people why.
To cora they are. Therefore in answering cora, Ill answer based on what he thinks so we can relate.
No gg, No skill.
Corazon
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States3230 Posts
June 21 2013 07:05 GMT
#293
On June 21 2013 16:02 Ange777 wrote:
@Cora: What do you make of the fact that despite that quote Hapa now gave Oats a clear town read?


Well it's not like I'm going to convince everyone. I feel like Hapa is giving Oats way too much slack for his shoddy play. Hapa's lack of scum reads disturbs me a bit, but he's low on my priority list right now.

I'm not gonna call anyone scum for disagreeing with me. I'm just a bit disappointed that Hapa doesn't agree with me =(
Grubby's #1 Fan
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 21 2013 07:06 GMT
#294
so to you cora, irrational = scumplay?
Can you link it to the other games ive played.

Meh when the push on yamato started both of you hopped on him and then you hopped off him for what I feel are not really awesome reasons.
Also you flipflopped around me after you said I was a POLICY lynch and not I was scum.
No gg, No skill.
Corazon
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States3230 Posts
June 21 2013 07:06 GMT
#295
Alright, I'm going to bed. I'm not getting anything else out of Oats cause he's acting like a complete dick, and I'm pretty sure it will spiral out of control once Marv wakes up and finds out I voted for him 30 seconds into the game.
Grubby's #1 Fan
Corazon
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States3230 Posts
June 21 2013 07:07 GMT
#296
On June 21 2013 16:06 Oatsmaster wrote:
Also you flipflopped around me after you said I was a POLICY lynch and not I was scum.


When did I say that?
Grubby's #1 Fan
Hapahauli
Profile Joined May 2009
United States9305 Posts
June 21 2013 07:09 GMT
#297
On June 21 2013 16:05 cDgCorazon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 16:02 Ange777 wrote:
@Cora: What do you make of the fact that despite that quote Hapa now gave Oats a clear town read?


Well it's not like I'm going to convince everyone. I feel like Hapa is giving Oats way too much slack for his shoddy play. Hapa's lack of scum reads disturbs me a bit, but he's low on my priority list right now.

I'm not gonna call anyone scum for disagreeing with me. I'm just a bit disappointed that Hapa doesn't agree with me =(


Objectively bad play ("shoddy" play) isn't necessary scummy. For example, spurr-of-the-moment, crazy, emotional play is often 100% pure columbian townie. You seem suspicious of Oats for his sudden 180 on you, but I view that as fairly townie. He's not interested in covering his tracks, and despite him thinking you're town, isn't very interested in buddying you or being your friend. I can't detect a coherent scum/survivalist mentality.
a talking rock that sprouts among the waves woosh
Corazon
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States3230 Posts
June 21 2013 07:13 GMT
#298
On June 21 2013 16:09 Hapahauli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 21 2013 16:05 cDgCorazon wrote:
On June 21 2013 16:02 Ange777 wrote:
@Cora: What do you make of the fact that despite that quote Hapa now gave Oats a clear town read?


Well it's not like I'm going to convince everyone. I feel like Hapa is giving Oats way too much slack for his shoddy play. Hapa's lack of scum reads disturbs me a bit, but he's low on my priority list right now.

I'm not gonna call anyone scum for disagreeing with me. I'm just a bit disappointed that Hapa doesn't agree with me =(


Objectively bad play ("shoddy" play) isn't necessary scummy. For example, spurr-of-the-moment, crazy, emotional play is often 100% pure columbian townie. You seem suspicious of Oats for his sudden 180 on you, but I view that as fairly townie. He's not interested in covering his tracks, and despite him thinking you're town, isn't very interested in buddying you or being your friend. I can't detect a coherent scum/survivalist mentality.


Then what do you make of the fact that he hasn't contributed much to the discussion and has only managed to murk up the thread will really silly sheeping/unexplained arguments and acting like an idiot.

I'm pretty sure he only called me town to get me to stop attacking him. It didn't work.
Grubby's #1 Fan
Corazon
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United States3230 Posts
June 21 2013 07:13 GMT
#299
Okay I'm out for realsies.
Grubby's #1 Fan
Oatsmaster
Profile Joined October 2012
United States16628 Posts
June 21 2013 07:15 GMT
#300
Talking to hapa in the 2nd part.

And this

I'm pretty sure he only called me town to get me to stop attacking him. It didn't work.

is not accurate in determining alignment.
No gg, No skill.
Prev 1 13 14 15 16 17 114 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Wardi Open
12:00
#57
WardiTV318
OGKoka 232
Rex81
Liquipedia
Replay Cast
10:00
Crank Gathers S2: Preliminary
Team Liquid vs Shopify RebellionLIVE!
Team Vitality vs Team Falcon
CranKy Ducklings184
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
OGKoka 232
SortOf 157
Rex 81
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 28487
firebathero 7869
Jaedong 5355
Sea 1551
EffOrt 556
Pusan 545
Stork 365
Rush 125
ToSsGirL 84
Liquid`Ret 66
[ Show more ]
Icarus 36
Movie 31
Shine 19
yabsab 15
Dota 2
Gorgc2966
Dendi470
qojqva254
XcaliburYe140
ODPixel113
420jenkins3
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1832
shoxiejesuss1098
x6flipin535
oskar176
Other Games
summit1g7743
singsing1756
B2W.Neo529
crisheroes314
Sick270
Pyrionflax202
hiko117
Lowko79
Mew2King58
Happy8
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL11138
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 13
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 22
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV225
Upcoming Events
CrankTV Team League
38m
Streamerzone vs Shopify Rebellion
TBD vs Team Vitality
Monday Night Weeklies
4h 38m
BSL 21
12h 38m
WardiTV Invitational
23h 38m
CrankTV Team League
1d
BASILISK vs TBD
Team Liquid vs Team Falcon
BSL 21
1d 12h
Replay Cast
1d 21h
OSC
1d 23h
CrankTV Team League
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
2 days
CrankTV Team League
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
CrankTV Team League
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
BSL Team A[vengers]
5 days
Dewalt vs Shine
UltrA vs ZeLoT
BSL 21
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
BSL Team A[vengers]
6 days
Cross vs Motive
Sziky vs HiyA
BSL 21
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 20
WardiTV TLMC #15
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

BSL 21 Points
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
BSL 21 Team A
C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
CranK Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025

Upcoming

SC4ALL: Brood War
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
META Madness #9
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.