EPT[N] Sicilian Mafia Style
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
What I feel is going to be the most important thing to focus on in the thread aren't necessarily the content of people's posts, but rather, where, when and why they vote. Voting is going to be more important than content analysis this game because of the change in posting style that the post count limit forces people to make. In this line of reasoning, I'm immediately suspicious of VE for his vote post here: On July 16 2013 15:36 VisceraEyes wrote: ##Vote: DocHelvetica Every post he makes (and he's made a full 12 of his allotted 20 posts at the time of writing) makes me vomit inside my mouth a little bit. I don't like anything he's doing. He's not pressuring anyone, he's wasting posts throwing shit at Vayne. I don't even know yet what I think about Vayne, but if the remaining 40% of his posts don't blow me out of the water, I want to kill Doc H today. Instead of attempting to interact with anyone, VE is content passing judgment from the sidelines about the interaction between DH and VA. This sort of voting in line with the sway of the thread (as both FT and VA were suspicious of DH) is a trait that I've seen mafia VE pull in games past. It's also worth noting that VE voting for DH for "throwing shit" at VA when VE has no opinion of VA is quite a ridiculous idea. This sort of bullshit reasoning is something that cannot be tolerated, and smells of mafia drumming up a reason to slap a vote on a player already under fire. In my opinion, Dr H seems like the kind of player who would be getting into these types of arguments if he were town. I've only casually observed some of the games he has played in, but I can tell that he is naturally hot-headed and aggressive. So far, nothing in his posting has warranted any sort of suspicion. VE needs to better explain what, exactly, makes him so ready to lynch Dr H, because at the moment, he seems to be the better candidate for hanging. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On July 17 2013 03:14 VisceraEyes wrote: I'm still anxiously, anxiously waiting for Sandroba, Node and Wiggles to come in with their thoughts. Their silence is NOT being ignored. (3/20) Don't have anything to add, VE? I'm watching you. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On July 17 2013 04:58 VisceraEyes wrote: @SnB My post wasn't useless and spammy. Not a single person has mentioned any of the names I brought up, so saying that's "something we all already knew" is ridiculous. I let the thread know that I'm watching for those names to crop up in particular because of how long they've taken to enter the fray combined with the fact that at least two of the names are known to be good scumhunters (sorry Node). I will say that Node has a tendency to get a case of the fo's in games so his absence is less of a surprise, but I was personally looking forward to playing with him. @Yamato If I found anything worth mentioning, I would have mentioned it. You watch me and call me scum in every game. This game will be no exception. Go away. @Town Scum have no motivation to post because no one is making them post. Everyone is just pointing fingers at people who have posted for dumb reasons. If you were scum, would YOU post at a time like this? You still have yet to better justify your vote on DrH. Also, I have a high success rate of reading you when you actually post, so it's in your best interest, if you are town, to post more. Alternatively, if you're mafia, you can continue to be useless and we'll just lynch you. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On July 17 2013 07:01 VisceraEyes wrote: Anyone who's paying even tertiary attention to the game knows that I never, in fact, ACTUALLY voted for Doc H. Much like my reasoning, my vote was illusory. It was designed to put the sentiment into the thread that I find Doc H suspicious, to see who picks up the ball and runs. I've had a couple of bites but nothing major - kholly is still attesting that he finds Doc suspicious but still hasn't really explained why. Now that Wiggles has graced us, I'm surprised he hasn't mentioned any of DocH, kholly or Malongo at all. Malongo faked an opinion on slOosh (what does "needlessly polarized" even mean?) and posted filters and fucked off, kholly is doing little more, thought to his credit he at least is voting for DocH. So right now I'm looking to lynch in the vicinity of kholly Malongo Wiggles And I'll go with the most useless so far. ##Vote: Malongo (5/20) Ugh, VE. Ugh. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On July 16 2013 17:16 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I'm on my phone so I can't copy paste but a couple posts up this page FirmTofu reponds the correct way to DrH and VE responds to wrong way. Also yamato's last post was absolutely horrible. I will probably use both my masons D1 on people who I feel are town. I'm going to bed now. On July 17 2013 11:12 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: hi biddies I'm just gonna wait for people to pop in and start asking me aggressive questions about reads and shit. Make it interesting or imma go play league of legends. Also fuck I wanted to mason rayn, glad he's basically confirmed town though. This is as close as he comes to actually posting reads. Given the already difficult nature of forming a consensus in a game like this and his rather lackadaisical approach to the game so far, I'm willing to believe he's mafia trying to hide among the other low-content players in the game. Plus, I always love lynching people who call my posts "horrible". | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On July 17 2013 16:10 FirmTofu wrote: I am willing to lynch VE, but I see DrH as the most optimal choice. Can you perhaps look into our conversations with one another and consider it? DrH has still not responded to my questions even though I have explicitly stated what I wanted him to answer. That, in itself, should be reason enough to warrant his lynch. Your arguing is incessant and altogether pointless. Dr H is far too active, abrasive, and emotional to be mafia. Whatever gran lie you think he's committed, I think you've misinterpreted. I have him down as a solid town read, and nothing you've posted has changed that. As for you, I'm undecided. What he's posted about you isn't all that convincing, but you seem so singularly fixated at the moment that it's worrying. Why don't you take some time away from tunneling DH and give me a productive read over a player of my choosing, say Oatsmaster, and then I'll do the same in return for you. This has worked excellent for me in the past for getting out of tunnels. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On July 18 2013 04:38 raynpelikoneet wrote: What has Sloosh actually done that's more than VE? Talked about setup and defended himself. I would not call that as effort. As i said earlier i'm not sure which one of those two i want to lynch, VE looks equally bad. There are questions asked from both of them and i'm waiting for them to answer. As for sloosh lurker moda, this is pretty close to lurker mode... Well I have little more than an hour before I have to leave for work, so I need to arrive at a dcent conclusion quickly. Of the two I've posted about, I'm more confident about VE being scum than MZ. MZ has been useless as town in games past, so perhaps waiting and seeing if/when he does anything is the best course of action for him. You think Sloosh is a decent lynch, which I'm initially hesitant to. I've seen Sloosh have bad day 1s on more than one occasion, but you are right that he hasn't posted anything meaningful in a while. I'm still more comfortable lynching VE, but Sloosh I suppose is a decent second option if you all don't see him return by the deadline and VE starts bursting with towniness. Really, I'd rather lynch VE. He's more than capable of being useful as town, but as we see this game, he's relegated himself to only posting about lurkers and not much else. Generally, when his scumhunting attempts are this pathetic, he's mafia. Town VE would have shown that he cares about finding mafia, but scum VE would have largely resigned himself to his fate at this point, given how many people are suspicious of him. I think it's obvious which VE we're seeing here. ##Vote VisceraEyes I'all try to stick around as long as possible to see if anything more interesting is brought up, but right now, this is the best course of action. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On July 18 2013 05:01 raynpelikoneet wrote: yamato what have you and Hapa talked about in PM's? Can you post some compilation or even full logs? Original Message From Hapahauli: VE might not be a bad choice. A good portion of people are suspicious of him right now. He seems to be very mindful of his post-count, so I'm not sure we could reliably get information out of him otherwise. What do you think of Rayn's pardoner claim? Is it alignment indicative? That's all we talked about before he replaced out. Not much means anything, and I was beginning to worry that he was so uninvolved, but obviously that was due to something outside of the game, not necessarily having been mafia. I confirmed with Marv that we're masoned and I have yet to hear back from him, but I'm sure he'll be obvious enough if he is actually town. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
With that, I'm gone. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
On July 18 2013 15:27 kushm4sta wrote: wonderful how you have less posts tonight and you waste one saying that Wonderful how you've been wasting posts the whole game. ZZZZZZIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNNGGGGGGGGG | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
Sloosh is looking many times worse after I left the thread. He is more than capable of solid analysis as a town player, yet has contributed very little that I would call meaningful. Watch him day 2, and if he doesn't improve, lynch him. MZ and Ace are also two people who could post useful things but don't. Kill them, too. If I'm alive tomorrow, expect a refreshed look at the game a short time after the daypost. Until then, adieu. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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yamato77
11589 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + Original Message From DoctorHelvetica: Sorry. I was really high. If you don't mind, I'd like to have a real discussion about the voting, particularly the division between sloOsh and VE. Don't you think it's a bit dangerous to assume that sloOsh must therefore be scum, since VE wasn't? I have a feeling mafia will push this agenda on Day 2. You will be able to tell who is scum if they say "sloOsh must be scum, but ya'll idiots voted for VE" or some reason like that - rather then pointing out real reasons that sloOsh is scum. The other alternative is that sloOsh is scum. I trust VE's reads and I've yet to see anything sloOsh posted jump out to me as real contribution. But I haven't really read his filter. However, any player that has a very good chance of getting lynched like that should normally increase his activity and contributions. VE became more reasonable considering he was about to get lynched, claimed and made his reads very clear and gave good reasons for them. His 15/15 post in particular was a very townlike way of reacting to his own inevitable lynch. But what's important is whether or not sloOsh reacted in this way. I think a mafia player is much more likely to give up in these kinds of situations. To which I replied: + Show Spoiler + Eh, I've seen two town wagons on day 1 before, so I don't think that Sloosh is automatically scum just because VE was town. That dichotomy is dangerous, and as you say, could obviously be manipulated by mafia into securing an easy lynch. On the flip side, however, I would actually expect more from Sloosh at this point. If he doesn't shape up by the middle of day 2, I'd no longer be willing to give him slack for poor performances in the past. He's a viable lynch target for day 2 along with MZ and Ace, IMO. Other than that, I'll give another look at FT if you think he's so obvious. Marv apparently shares your opinion, so that's encouraging. So obviously, he wasn't as confident that I was scum as he wanted the thread to think. I have my theories on why he omitted this and what it says about him, and we'll just say that him ragequitting this game only supports my hypothesis. So aside from Oats (who calls me mafia every game, regardless of my actual alignment), I think I played relatively well and had most of the thread fooled. I said earlier that Ace got lucky, but that's only half true. It's obviously legitimate to believe that I'm mafia for playing the way I did, because I was. I was playing to fool people that have certain preconceived notions about my play, and it worked. It just so happened that this tactic left me open to a more straightforward scumhunting style which players like Ace and Ver employ to great success. But that's enough about me, I want to talk about the game as a whole. Being mafia in this game had its ups and downs. I don't know if I'm just used to all new games, but we weren't provided with a host-made QT, I had to make one. Otherwise, we would have had to coordinate through PMs or the unreliable medium of skype. A small gripe, but it did make the initial period of lack of communication slightly lengthened. QT: http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/4NsAEe2dNT62Z Mafia was also handicapped somewhat by only controlling 1 KP per night plus having one dayvig. Obviously, having 2 mafia KP + SK would be quite unfair to town, but the game felt somewhat out of mafia's hands. The way the game played out, the SK had the most control over the game because of his ability to pardon + his 1 nightly KP. Mafia's other abilities were quite weak, given that we had a pardon we couldn't use on mafia, and a silence ability that slightly inhibited town's ability to communicate AT BEST. We had almost no recourse against the SK we had no idea about aside from attempting to figure him out and killing him (was he bulletproof?) or exposing ourselves greatly to get him lynched (a la Carnival Cruise). As for our play, well, it varied greatly. Not having one member day 1 probably helped us more than hurt us, as replacing in as mafia gives you some time to get going before people REALLY look at you. Korryne also played very well, in my opinion, after replacing in. It's too bad I died early on. Sloosh was obvious as mafia, but it's almost always been that way with him and I don't hold it against him. I made some attempt to defend him day 1 to mixed success. VE, my mislynch target, did get lynched, so I guess it was successful. I don't think it woulkd have hurt me if I lived longer, as many town players also defended Sloosh. It wouldn't have been difficult to argue my way out of. SNB's first post was so mafia-like I had to say something to Hapa about it. After I died, I talked with Hapa and he had SNB as scum like many in the game did at the time, just from that post. The rest of his play was fine. Killing Ace was a good decision at that time. As Ver said, beginning games as mafia is almost always the msot difficult thing to do. Kush was obvious to anyone that knew his meta. He came out the gate bussing Sloosh, and it didn't help the team. He was also overreactive in the QT and constantly telling teammates how scummy they looked. Whether right or wrong, that is not conducive to good mafia play. If I had to bus someone for town cred, it would have been him. Vayne probably played the best out of all of us, and him living until endgame is testament to that. Couldn't ask for a better teammate, honestly. There is one specific tell I picked up on and talked to Hapa about, but for his sake I'll keep it a secret. At endgame, though, it should have been obvious who SK was. Mocsta was the 2nd replacement for that slot and SK had shot all nights, plus pardoned Sloosh, so it couldn't have been him. Marv was obviously town given his recent townplay. Koshi was the best candidate for SK given the play of the game. Anyway, I think I'm going to host a podcast for this game, because I want to talk about it at length. Details in the podcast thread. | ||
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yamato77
11589 Posts
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