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[M][N] Les Mafia - Page 89

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25563 Posts
May 20 2013 23:24 GMT
#1761
On May 21 2013 08:21 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 08:17 Stutters695 wrote:
Marv, what are the odds of BH being a town mason in your opinion?


pretty low, he's constantly put off scumhunting + making cases, despite promising to do so last night. He didn't use our mason QT as a chance to get anything done like he said he would either. Further his opening couple of posts in said QT came off rather as overjustification for masoning me (I talk about this in the iamp QT too)


but you asked me
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25563 Posts
May 20 2013 23:25 GMT
#1762
On May 21 2013 08:24 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 08:21 marvellosity wrote:
On May 21 2013 08:17 Stutters695 wrote:
Marv, what are the odds of BH being a town mason in your opinion?


pretty low, he's constantly put off scumhunting + making cases, despite promising to do so last night. He didn't use our mason QT as a chance to get anything done like he said he would either. Further his opening couple of posts in said QT came off rather as overjustification for masoning me (I talk about this in the iamp QT too)


but you asked me


in fact, when i gave a short explanation, you asked for more explanation afterwards, which i provided

wtf
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
May 20 2013 23:28 GMT
#1763
On May 21 2013 08:11 marvellosity wrote:
GK: so you're proposing you play differently when you don't know your alignment to when you know you're town?


I've already explicitly described my thought process behind what I did day one in my filter. You should read that more closely.:

On May 19 2013 13:07 goodkarma wrote:
If you want to lynch me, suit yourself. Just know this:

Day 1 I don't check my role PM. So you're basically random lynching.

I've resolved to do my best to help town, regardless of alignment, day one. Even as scum, if I were to lynch a teammate I figured I'd just be removing a liability. It was the fruit of all the bitterness of having people down my throat every day one as town.

And if you don't believe me, check hydra mini mafia II obsQT. The only reason I knew my alignment early there was because of my partner peaked.


I've honestly become very tired of putting up with this shit every day one. So feel free to lynch me. I've put it out there. I'll check my alignment closer to the deadline...

And hopefully you'll have enough sanity to go after the obvious people that should be looked into for lynching (BH / JarJar) instead of the guy that's being a tryhard.

WaveofShadow
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada31495 Posts
May 20 2013 23:28 GMT
#1764
On May 21 2013 08:19 marvellosity wrote:
I don't know which I find more likely. Maybe I'll muse on which Les Mis character would likely be SK. Tenardier perhaps? :>

Blazing's assumption that it means 3p is certainly not a good one. When I was last mafia in a 16 player mini, we had a mafia vigi (Hero Mini Mafia).

If town has a vigi he might not have shot last night. Who knows.

Well I require some insight if you will as I have never rolled scum or any sort of NK role.
Do people often wait to use vigi shots if town/scum? I think most if not all of the games I've seen with one-shot vigs (although apparently there's other types of vigs like infinite shot? I've only ever seen one-shot i think) they tend to shoot pretty much as soon as they can?
As far as shot reasoning, from what I understand:
Mafia vig - shoot to remove extra threats, or cause confusion amongst town
Town vig - shoot to remove lurkers, or if you're REALLY sure someone is scum?

The Rayn kill obviously doesn't fit in my understanding of what a townvig should be doing (even though he lurked slightly more than usual for him, doesn't compare to other people in this thread) therefore it must have been mafia vig or 3P. I know in LXI Grush was shot by Ace because STARSENSES and he was a low profile player---likely to cause confusion as to who shot him and why (though in the end I think he really gave away that it wasn't a mafia shot because no mafia would ever shoot grush lol) so it makes me wonder if a 3P were choosing a similar strategy to Ace why not either shoot Grush to cause that confusion once more or a similarly useless player? Why Rayn?
twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast! ||| Juicy Dad for lyfe ||| 'idk i get a kick out of stupid things' - Jarms Yarng
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 20 2013 23:29 GMT
#1765
On May 21 2013 08:28 goodkarma wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 08:11 marvellosity wrote:
GK: so you're proposing you play differently when you don't know your alignment to when you know you're town?


I've already explicitly described my thought process behind what I did day one in my filter. You should read that more closely.:

Show nested quote +
On May 19 2013 13:07 goodkarma wrote:
If you want to lynch me, suit yourself. Just know this:

Day 1 I don't check my role PM. So you're basically random lynching.

I've resolved to do my best to help town, regardless of alignment, day one. Even as scum, if I were to lynch a teammate I figured I'd just be removing a liability. It was the fruit of all the bitterness of having people down my throat every day one as town.

And if you don't believe me, check hydra mini mafia II obsQT. The only reason I knew my alignment early there was because of my partner peaked.


I've honestly become very tired of putting up with this shit every day one. So feel free to lynch me. I've put it out there. I'll check my alignment closer to the deadline...

And hopefully you'll have enough sanity to go after the obvious people that should be looked into for lynching (BH / JarJar) instead of the guy that's being a tryhard.



So you're playing for town, which you were pretty insistent in The Game meant you were taking it slow and not making premature cases, wanting to interact before voting etc.

You can't use not reading your role PM as part of your defence but then say you'd be playing as you would as town.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 20 2013 23:30 GMT
#1766
On May 21 2013 08:25 Blazinghand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 08:24 Blazinghand wrote:
On May 21 2013 08:21 marvellosity wrote:
On May 21 2013 08:17 Stutters695 wrote:
Marv, what are the odds of BH being a town mason in your opinion?


pretty low, he's constantly put off scumhunting + making cases, despite promising to do so last night. He didn't use our mason QT as a chance to get anything done like he said he would either. Further his opening couple of posts in said QT came off rather as overjustification for masoning me (I talk about this in the iamp QT too)


but you asked me


in fact, when i gave a short explanation, you asked for more explanation afterwards, which i provided

wtf


I'm talking about posts 2 and 4, which you posted totally unprompted, so no.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 20 2013 23:34 GMT
#1767
On May 21 2013 08:28 WaveofShadow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 08:19 marvellosity wrote:
I don't know which I find more likely. Maybe I'll muse on which Les Mis character would likely be SK. Tenardier perhaps? :>

Blazing's assumption that it means 3p is certainly not a good one. When I was last mafia in a 16 player mini, we had a mafia vigi (Hero Mini Mafia).

If town has a vigi he might not have shot last night. Who knows.

Well I require some insight if you will as I have never rolled scum or any sort of NK role.
Do people often wait to use vigi shots if town/scum? I think most if not all of the games I've seen with one-shot vigs (although apparently there's other types of vigs like infinite shot? I've only ever seen one-shot i think) they tend to shoot pretty much as soon as they can?
As far as shot reasoning, from what I understand:
Mafia vig - shoot to remove extra threats, or cause confusion amongst town
Town vig - shoot to remove lurkers, or if you're REALLY sure someone is scum?

The Rayn kill obviously doesn't fit in my understanding of what a townvig should be doing (even though he lurked slightly more than usual for him, doesn't compare to other people in this thread) therefore it must have been mafia vig or 3P. I know in LXI Grush was shot by Ace because STARSENSES and he was a low profile player---likely to cause confusion as to who shot him and why (though in the end I think he really gave away that it wasn't a mafia shot because no mafia would ever shoot grush lol) so it makes me wonder if a 3P were choosing a similar strategy to Ace why not either shoot Grush to cause that confusion once more or a similarly useless player? Why Rayn?


I would say town vigis usually shoot on night 1s (even though they shouldn't in minis especially, they should wait). I rolled vigi 3 times, shot twice first night and once 2nd night. Then again I don't expect to live to use my shot.

Shooting grush causes no confusion (at least not to a town with me alive). Either town vigi claims his bad shot and I shout at them, or it's 3p, because on night 1 especially it sure as hell isn't a mafia shot.

If I were 3p, I would leave enough weirdish, unreadable-ish players around like grush, stutters etc around as much as possible, because they never bring clarity to a game.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25563 Posts
May 20 2013 23:37 GMT
#1768
well it seemed like a good idea.
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 20 2013 23:38 GMT
#1769
On May 21 2013 08:37 Blazinghand wrote:
well it seemed like a good idea.


huh?
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Blazinghand *
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States25563 Posts
May 20 2013 23:40 GMT
#1770
man whatever look iamp and I are both like half masons why is it so unreasonable for there to be 2 of us
When you stare into the iCCup, the iCCup stares back.
TL+ Member
WaveofShadow
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada31495 Posts
May 20 2013 23:41 GMT
#1771
On May 21 2013 08:34 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 08:28 WaveofShadow wrote:
On May 21 2013 08:19 marvellosity wrote:
I don't know which I find more likely. Maybe I'll muse on which Les Mis character would likely be SK. Tenardier perhaps? :>

Blazing's assumption that it means 3p is certainly not a good one. When I was last mafia in a 16 player mini, we had a mafia vigi (Hero Mini Mafia).

If town has a vigi he might not have shot last night. Who knows.

Well I require some insight if you will as I have never rolled scum or any sort of NK role.
Do people often wait to use vigi shots if town/scum? I think most if not all of the games I've seen with one-shot vigs (although apparently there's other types of vigs like infinite shot? I've only ever seen one-shot i think) they tend to shoot pretty much as soon as they can?
As far as shot reasoning, from what I understand:
Mafia vig - shoot to remove extra threats, or cause confusion amongst town
Town vig - shoot to remove lurkers, or if you're REALLY sure someone is scum?

The Rayn kill obviously doesn't fit in my understanding of what a townvig should be doing (even though he lurked slightly more than usual for him, doesn't compare to other people in this thread) therefore it must have been mafia vig or 3P. I know in LXI Grush was shot by Ace because STARSENSES and he was a low profile player---likely to cause confusion as to who shot him and why (though in the end I think he really gave away that it wasn't a mafia shot because no mafia would ever shoot grush lol) so it makes me wonder if a 3P were choosing a similar strategy to Ace why not either shoot Grush to cause that confusion once more or a similarly useless player? Why Rayn?


I would say town vigis usually shoot on night 1s (even though they shouldn't in minis especially, they should wait). I rolled vigi 3 times, shot twice first night and once 2nd night. Then again I don't expect to live to use my shot.

Shooting grush causes no confusion (at least not to a town with me alive). Either town vigi claims his bad shot and I shout at them, or it's 3p, because on night 1 especially it sure as hell isn't a mafia shot.

If I were 3p, I would leave enough weirdish, unreadable-ish players around like grush, stutters etc around as much as possible, because they never bring clarity to a game.

Alright so from this I gather that you're leaning towards 3P explanation. I find it pretty unlikely that mafia gets a vigi while town doesn't and you say that town vigi usually shoots N1 so the lack of extra NK, as well as your explanation of who 3P should be shooting means you probably think 3P?

Now the existence of a 3P (assuming this is true...I haven't given up on the possibility of mafia vig). What does that mean for BH's 'slip?' Is a 11-4-1 setup possible or would it have to be 12-3-1?

Completely unrelated but I'd like to hear GK's answer to mine and marv's recent questions towards him.
twitch.tv/waveofshadow ||| Winner of AHGL's So You Think You Can Cast! ||| Juicy Dad for lyfe ||| 'idk i get a kick out of stupid things' - Jarms Yarng
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 21 2013 00:02 GMT
#1772
Well if BH is mafia, obviously 12-3-1 becomes much more likely.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
s0Lstice
Profile Joined August 2009
United States1833 Posts
May 21 2013 00:04 GMT
#1773
Marv,

do you believe that GK didn't check his role PM?
ATOBTTR
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 21 2013 00:04 GMT
#1774
As a small aside, any reasonable mafia team would have worked out iamp was a mason on day 1 when he asked me the question about blues and such.

##Vote: BlazingHand

less QQ, more pewpew
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
goodkarma
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States1067 Posts
May 21 2013 00:04 GMT
#1775
On May 21 2013 08:29 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 08:28 goodkarma wrote:
On May 21 2013 08:11 marvellosity wrote:
GK: so you're proposing you play differently when you don't know your alignment to when you know you're town?


I've already explicitly described my thought process behind what I did day one in my filter. You should read that more closely.:

On May 19 2013 13:07 goodkarma wrote:
If you want to lynch me, suit yourself. Just know this:

Day 1 I don't check my role PM. So you're basically random lynching.

I've resolved to do my best to help town, regardless of alignment, day one. Even as scum, if I were to lynch a teammate I figured I'd just be removing a liability. It was the fruit of all the bitterness of having people down my throat every day one as town.

And if you don't believe me, check hydra mini mafia II obsQT. The only reason I knew my alignment early there was because of my partner peaked.


I've honestly become very tired of putting up with this shit every day one. So feel free to lynch me. I've put it out there. I'll check my alignment closer to the deadline...

And hopefully you'll have enough sanity to go after the obvious people that should be looked into for lynching (BH / JarJar) instead of the guy that's being a tryhard.



So you're playing for town, which you were pretty insistent in The Game meant you were taking it slow and not making premature cases, wanting to interact before voting etc.

You can't use not reading your role PM as part of your defence but then say you'd be playing as you would as town.


I definitely can. If I were to not PM peek and then later look and find out I'm scum, I wouldn't have bias in my posts until after that point. And that's very relevant to your case at hand, and what originally made you so irked, no? This is very much about you not believing that claim, so don't pretend it isn't.

My play here is a little different from my prior games, and I've already highlighted those differences. I've also shown you how meta analyzing me based on my prior scumgames is pretty bad.


That leaves my reads, so I'd like to ask you: what about them do you disagree with? That is my strength, and where the discussion should be. In particular, I'd be interested in hearing what you have to say about what I recently posted about Dandel.
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 21 2013 00:07 GMT
#1776
On May 21 2013 09:04 goodkarma wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 08:29 marvellosity wrote:
On May 21 2013 08:28 goodkarma wrote:
On May 21 2013 08:11 marvellosity wrote:
GK: so you're proposing you play differently when you don't know your alignment to when you know you're town?


I've already explicitly described my thought process behind what I did day one in my filter. You should read that more closely.:

On May 19 2013 13:07 goodkarma wrote:
If you want to lynch me, suit yourself. Just know this:

Day 1 I don't check my role PM. So you're basically random lynching.

I've resolved to do my best to help town, regardless of alignment, day one. Even as scum, if I were to lynch a teammate I figured I'd just be removing a liability. It was the fruit of all the bitterness of having people down my throat every day one as town.

And if you don't believe me, check hydra mini mafia II obsQT. The only reason I knew my alignment early there was because of my partner peaked.


I've honestly become very tired of putting up with this shit every day one. So feel free to lynch me. I've put it out there. I'll check my alignment closer to the deadline...

And hopefully you'll have enough sanity to go after the obvious people that should be looked into for lynching (BH / JarJar) instead of the guy that's being a tryhard.



So you're playing for town, which you were pretty insistent in The Game meant you were taking it slow and not making premature cases, wanting to interact before voting etc.

You can't use not reading your role PM as part of your defence but then say you'd be playing as you would as town.


I definitely can. If I were to not PM peek and then later look and find out I'm scum, I wouldn't have bias in my posts until after that point. And that's very relevant to your case at hand, and what originally made you so irked, no? This is very much about you not believing that claim, so don't pretend it isn't.

My play here is a little different from my prior games, and I've already highlighted those differences. I've also shown you how meta analyzing me based on my prior scumgames is pretty bad.


That leaves my reads, so I'd like to ask you: what about them do you disagree with? That is my strength, and where the discussion should be. In particular, I'd be interested in hearing what you have to say about what I recently posted about Dandel.


This is all missing the point. You claim that by not looking at your PM, you'd be playing for town. So, in The Game, where you were town, you had a set of principles you followed, that you didn't follow this game.

Therefore your contention is that you playing for town is different from knowing you're town and that it explains the differences between the game where you read your town role PM and the game that you were merely playing in town's interests.

And this point is nothing to do with your scumgames, which I've not attempted to draw parallels too? So I have no idea what that part was about anyways.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
s0Lstice
Profile Joined August 2009
United States1833 Posts
May 21 2013 00:07 GMT
#1777
also, Marv

I'd like to hear about this some more:

It's players like s0lstice we need to keep our eyes on.

from the QT with iamp. What exactly is your read on me?
ATOBTTR
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 21 2013 00:08 GMT
#1778
On May 21 2013 09:04 s0Lstice wrote:
Marv,

do you believe that GK didn't check his role PM?


don't know.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
May 21 2013 00:09 GMT
#1779
On May 21 2013 09:07 s0Lstice wrote:
also, Marv

I'd like to hear about this some more:

It's players like s0lstice we need to keep our eyes on.

from the QT with iamp. What exactly is your read on me?


Similar to iamp, you're in the murky middle. You're almost the definition of murky middle. You've not been massively townie, but you've not set scumbells off particularly either, and often these dudes are scum. If I was forced to choose an alignment for you right now, I'd say town, but I'm not very decisive about it.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
s0Lstice
Profile Joined August 2009
United States1833 Posts
May 21 2013 00:16 GMT
#1780
To make this post...

On May 21 2013 02:17 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2013 02:10 yamato77 wrote:
His suspicion on JJD is not well-explained by any stretch of the imagination.

On May 18 2013 08:46 Dandel Ion wrote:
JJD looks like a decent lynch. I'd sheep that.


On May 18 2013 09:55 Dandel Ion wrote:
I'm mainly interested in lynching jjd and gk atm.

What has been said about jdd has been said, and he hasn't said anything.


Yeah, no.


This struck me as a valid point (perhaps because he was partially agreeing with me...)

Show nested quote +
On May 18 2013 20:31 Dandel Ion wrote:
On May 18 2013 19:18 marvellosity wrote:
One other thing - something I don't like that both WoS and JarJar are doing is complaining about thread activity. That riles me quite a bit. Especially with WoS, given how posty he usually is himself.

This actually interesting, since they do it only 10 minutes apart from each other. I think if they were both scum, they'd be more self-conscious about things like that and, if not not say it at all (since it sounds scummy as hell), at least space it out a little?

That's a scumtell on JJD mainly, I'd say. He's hinding his scummery behind the posts of somebody else. He also made it sound like he's not complaining when he totally was complaining.


And this is a pretty devious post construction if he's mafia:

Show nested quote +
On May 19 2013 21:00 Dandel Ion wrote:

I found it weird people were backing off jjd for no good reason/while keeping him in their "scum/would lynch" pile, so, trying to make sense of shit I decided to do a jjd counter!
JJD Counter: Spicy voting him and confusing his name with WoS
solstice defending him
BH saying he would lynch jjd
^DP trying to lynch BH for that
everyone else deflecting on BH
GK saying he would like to lynch jjd, yet votes BH in accordance with ^

JJD COUNTER DISCONTINUED BECAUSE GK CLAIMED SCUM GG
##Unvote
##Vote Goodkarma






You have to have a solid opinion on whether he actually checked his role PM or not at the time you made it, correct?
ATOBTTR
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