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On March 09 2013 07:29 TheRavensName wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:27 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. On March 09 2013 07:22 OmniEulogy wrote:
if Arctic is scum and you guys nail him, it's fantastic but I'm still wondering how he is different from the other lurkers like bduddy. If we just talk about Arctic being lynched and flipping scum, the only thing we gain is scum being down by 1 which is huge for D1 don't get me wrong but his absence means we don't learn much else from it. My question to him at that point was the best I could do, he literally had 0 posts to his name, and all the questions were more aimed towards seeing peoples reactions to me asking them, and how people felt about Luneth as opposed to Arctic (who wasn't even a subject of conversation at that point).
I guess if I look at it from a point that Arctic wouldn't vote on his own scum buddies, we might be able to clear the people he's voted on as being town? Although even that is a shot in the dark. Did you read Taco's post? Or Raven's last few? We have plenty to learn. Daishi is goin' downnnnnnnnnn I really want to avoid trying to make a link between Arctic and Taco till after the flip. And if Arctic flips town I'm going to be kicking myself for not being able to persuade people to vote Taco, however I don't want to see NW lynched... I don't disagree that Arctic looks scummy, I just think Taco looks worse. Well can you explain to me what we learn if Taco flips town?
that I'm an idiot and can't read people. I believe he's scum but I'm willing to consolidate on Arctic to save NW for D1.
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On March 09 2013 07:34 OmniEulogy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:29 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:27 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. On March 09 2013 07:22 OmniEulogy wrote:
if Arctic is scum and you guys nail him, it's fantastic but I'm still wondering how he is different from the other lurkers like bduddy. If we just talk about Arctic being lynched and flipping scum, the only thing we gain is scum being down by 1 which is huge for D1 don't get me wrong but his absence means we don't learn much else from it. My question to him at that point was the best I could do, he literally had 0 posts to his name, and all the questions were more aimed towards seeing peoples reactions to me asking them, and how people felt about Luneth as opposed to Arctic (who wasn't even a subject of conversation at that point).
I guess if I look at it from a point that Arctic wouldn't vote on his own scum buddies, we might be able to clear the people he's voted on as being town? Although even that is a shot in the dark. Did you read Taco's post? Or Raven's last few? We have plenty to learn. Daishi is goin' downnnnnnnnnn I really want to avoid trying to make a link between Arctic and Taco till after the flip. And if Arctic flips town I'm going to be kicking myself for not being able to persuade people to vote Taco, however I don't want to see NW lynched... I don't disagree that Arctic looks scummy, I just think Taco looks worse. Well can you explain to me what we learn if Taco flips town? that I'm an idiot and can't read people. I believe he's scum but I'm willing to consolidate on Arctic to save NW for D1.
Ha. So the gains either way are subjective at best.
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When saying that I lurk or don't comment enough realise that most of this discussion is happening at 2-5 in the morning.for me.
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On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now.
I don't think this is much of an issue. Trying to pressure people not to vote for a fellow-scum because "he might get replaced" is a tactic too ridiculous for me to believe anyone would use it, considering the fellow-scum would have to post at some point. I think MT is fine overall - getting people to explain their positions helps to find out whether people are attacking/defending others for good reason or not. I'm still way more focused on AD and those defending/attacking him.
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On March 09 2013 07:37 TheRavensName wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:34 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:29 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:27 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. On March 09 2013 07:22 OmniEulogy wrote:
if Arctic is scum and you guys nail him, it's fantastic but I'm still wondering how he is different from the other lurkers like bduddy. If we just talk about Arctic being lynched and flipping scum, the only thing we gain is scum being down by 1 which is huge for D1 don't get me wrong but his absence means we don't learn much else from it. My question to him at that point was the best I could do, he literally had 0 posts to his name, and all the questions were more aimed towards seeing peoples reactions to me asking them, and how people felt about Luneth as opposed to Arctic (who wasn't even a subject of conversation at that point).
I guess if I look at it from a point that Arctic wouldn't vote on his own scum buddies, we might be able to clear the people he's voted on as being town? Although even that is a shot in the dark. Did you read Taco's post? Or Raven's last few? We have plenty to learn. Daishi is goin' downnnnnnnnnn I really want to avoid trying to make a link between Arctic and Taco till after the flip. And if Arctic flips town I'm going to be kicking myself for not being able to persuade people to vote Taco, however I don't want to see NW lynched... I don't disagree that Arctic looks scummy, I just think Taco looks worse. Well can you explain to me what we learn if Taco flips town? that I'm an idiot and can't read people. I believe he's scum but I'm willing to consolidate on Arctic to save NW for D1. Ha. So the gains either way are subjective at best.
fair enough as I wasn't really considering what would happen if Taco flipped town. Arctic is pretty much a blank sheet regardless of his flip, that's how I was comparing them.
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##Unvote
Right now, I'm a more in favor of a Daishi vote. He has looked quite scummy since appearing and his voting is rather lacking in conviction. He attempts to analyze, but it's severely lacking and since then he has virtually disappeared. If town, he should still be trying though to scumhunt.
+ Show Spoiler +On March 09 2013 06:07 Arctic Daishi wrote:I honestly do not believe that nobodywonder is scummy, he seems to honestly want what's best for the town. Also, he has been very defeatist since being accused and has stated his intention of welcoming his lynching if it helps the town. I hereby: Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 05:44 Arctic Daishi wrote:On March 09 2013 03:37 OmniEulogy wrote:My Case on FrorgonOn March 07 2013 22:29 Frorgon wrote:
Good morning all.
Glad to see things picking up a bit now.
As far as the discussion on "lurkers", I don't think it can be considered an applicable label for anyone as of yet, I mean there is still a lot of time left in day 1. But I will definitely be keeping my eye out over the next few hours.I also agree that I'd rather find a logical reason to lynch someone on day 1 instead of just randomly choosing someone. I'm not afraid to call people out but it seems quite scummy to just attack someone without any useful contribution behind it.
Also bduddy, you can claim you are lurking for personal reasons, but how are we to know this is true? You were warned before this game started that you should only commit if you had the proper amount of free time. A busy schedule is no excuse, so I do hope you contribute. I believe now it is applicable to call you a lurker. I'm kind of confused as to why you think it is scummy to attack people to see their reactions and how they react under pressure. I've seen players vote on almost everybody in the game by the end of D1 who weren't scum but were fishing for information, I have yet to see scum play so ballsy. You claim to not be afraid to call people out on things but when you tried you were almost afraid to commit and were very back and forth about it. On March 08 2013 06:29 Frorgon wrote:
@OmniEulogy I'm wondering why you asked me about what I thought was suspicious behavior. I clearly explained that in my initial post about the matter. It made me a bit uneasy about whether or not you were trying to get redundant information posted to cloud up the thread. As Wave said, the amount of posts you had started to raise a red flag for me. And don't get me wrong, it's not necessarily the amount of posts you had that was bad, it was that you seemed to be drowning the thread for a while with just your thoughts and limited discussion from others. That being said, I feel better about your contributions in the past few pages since other people have shown up. "The amount you talk to yourself while nobody is here raises a red flag, everything you've said while more than 1 person has been here has been awesome!" what? This to me seems like scum trying to pretend to contribute while at the same time not trying to make anybody upset. It wouldn't have made me look at it twice if you had been active and contributing but as we all know you've made 4 posts in nearly 48 hours. This is not acceptable for town. This is the behavior of scum. On March 08 2013 19:15 Frorgon wrote:
Alright I'm back. In my opinion, bduddy is not making a good case for himself. That's 3 different excuses for being inactive right now due to his "busy life". I really don't care about how busy your life is.
Nobodywonder still looking real scummy. Unvotes bduddy after the terrible explanation provided. I'm thinking they could both be scum covering for each other. NW makes a case early on against bduddy without actually being serious about it so there are no reprocussions. Bduddy has his suspicion on people who in my opinion don't same overly scummy as of yet, and is defending NW.
Right now I'm narrowing down my vote between NW and bduddy and I plan to make an actual vote shortly after they respond, if they respond. There should still be a decent amount of time on the clock for D1 after my vote. So many things wrong with your last post. - Attacks the weakest player in the game NW, WITHOUT placing a vote. Just a casual "wow you are so scummy" - Makes an association case between NW and Bduddy. - Claims he will make his case and we will have plenty of time to analyze and go over it. Nice case he's made. ##Vote: FrogronWe need to step it up town. The only two players I can identify as even having a chance at being town are Krafla and Rainbows. If you are town and have been content to just stay quiet and not contribute, wake the fuck up. Nobody is getting replaced tonight, stop talking about it. Everybody has posted D1 the only way somebody is getting replaced is if they don't vote. The following players are also on my list of potential scum Arctic Daishi - Playing the noob card after lurking for 36~ hours, NOT a smart move. I want to see some serious contribution from you starting D2 and if I don't I will be pushing for your lynch. Hell if Frogron can save his ass before the end of D1 from me I'll go after you in the next 7 hours. Bduddy - Lurking, scummy, if Frogron hadn't contributed less I'd be happy to see him gone today. BUT he does claim he's been busy so for D1 he gets some slack. Could just be an uninterested townie. Nothing to really disprove that so far. ChewOnStu - almost as bad as Frogron, really bad sheep vote. scummy. NobodyWonder I was going to vote on for most of today but realized if he is lynched and flips town we gain nothing, I'm not against seeing him lynched as I agree he's scummy as hell but I don't want to put all of our eggs in one basket. And then there is also Matriarch who is lurking as well... the largest problem I can see here, IS THAT THERE IS NO WAY ALL OF YOU ARE SCUM. So TOWNIES again I ask Wake The Fuck Up. I am seriously getting annoyed by the lack of activity out of you. You will cost us this game if you don't snap out of it before we end up lynching you. #unvote
#Vote: FrorgonThe Omni's case against Frorgon is simply too great to ignore.
Your strong case makes it seem as though Frorgon's scumminess is a forgone conclusion.
But what I find really weird is that he seems to somewhat doubt OE's analyse of Frogron. see the italics on the word foregone. But yet he votes anyway as simply too great to ignore. MASSIVE SHEEP.
[QUOTE]On March 09 2013 06:15 Arctic Daishi wrote:
[QUOTE]On March 09 2013 06:10 Frorgon wrote:
@Arctic What about Omni's case is so "great"? The claim that I have contributed the least? Because I'm pretty sure you've contributed less than me. Seems pretty easy for you to just sit back and buddy up with people without at least explaining why you like their case so much.
In this post:
[QUOTE]On March 08 2013 06:29 Frorgon wrote:
@OmniEulogy I'm wondering why you asked me about what I thought was suspicious behavior. I clearly explained that in my initial post about the matter. It made me a bit uneasy about whether or not you were trying to get redundant information posted to cloud up the thread. As Wave said, the amount of posts you had started to raise a red flag for me. And don't get me wrong, it's not necessarily the amount of posts you had that was bad, it was that you seemed to be drowning the thread for a while with just your thoughts and limited discussion from others. That being said, I feel better about your contributions in the past few pages since other people have shown up.[/QUOTE]
You seemed rather hostile against Omni, who was very active in investigating people. Perhaps to stop his investigation?[/QUOTE]
When prodded by Frogron, Arctic doesn't really explain why his thought process.
All I know is that I want an explanation from Arctic Dash: I want to know what and how you are thinking things through.
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Yes, but Omni what do we learn if Taco flips scum?
That's been one of the sticking points to vote him instead of Daishi and you haven't explained it yet; you seem to think we'll learn mroe from a Taco scumflip than Daishi. Why?
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On March 09 2013 07:37 MLuneth wrote:
When saying that I lurk or don't comment enough realise that most of this discussion is happening at 2-5 in the morning.for me.
please catch up quickly. I'd like to know what you think of all this.
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On March 09 2013 07:38 OmniEulogy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:37 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:34 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:29 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:27 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. On March 09 2013 07:22 OmniEulogy wrote:
if Arctic is scum and you guys nail him, it's fantastic but I'm still wondering how he is different from the other lurkers like bduddy. If we just talk about Arctic being lynched and flipping scum, the only thing we gain is scum being down by 1 which is huge for D1 don't get me wrong but his absence means we don't learn much else from it. My question to him at that point was the best I could do, he literally had 0 posts to his name, and all the questions were more aimed towards seeing peoples reactions to me asking them, and how people felt about Luneth as opposed to Arctic (who wasn't even a subject of conversation at that point).
I guess if I look at it from a point that Arctic wouldn't vote on his own scum buddies, we might be able to clear the people he's voted on as being town? Although even that is a shot in the dark. Did you read Taco's post? Or Raven's last few? We have plenty to learn. Daishi is goin' downnnnnnnnnn I really want to avoid trying to make a link between Arctic and Taco till after the flip. And if Arctic flips town I'm going to be kicking myself for not being able to persuade people to vote Taco, however I don't want to see NW lynched... I don't disagree that Arctic looks scummy, I just think Taco looks worse. Well can you explain to me what we learn if Taco flips town? that I'm an idiot and can't read people. I believe he's scum but I'm willing to consolidate on Arctic to save NW for D1. Ha. So the gains either way are subjective at best. fair enough as I wasn't really considering what would happen if Taco flipped town. Arctic is pretty much a blank sheet regardless of his flip, that's how I was comparing them. But when someone comes up mafia, you learn a lot about those defending him and not defending him - especially when's he's essentially a lurker without anything concrete to go on.
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On March 09 2013 07:33 MeatlessTaco wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 06:20 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 05:54 WaveofShadow wrote:
@Omni your cases so far have been solid, can you expand on your thoughts on MeatlessTaco? I agree he has been very aggressive in his posting though the only real scummy thing I've seen from him is the sheep vote onto Chew.
Also what are your thoughts regarding the rest of the lurkers today? There are quite a few of them (Matriarch, Daishi, Luneth probably the worst offenders) and it's going to be very difficult to determine what to do with them once the day is over. Hmm not sure what else to say about Taco... well actually I'll go the other way, I think I've covered pretty much everything he's done that seems to go against town, but he was right when he said you have to suspect everybody in one of his first posts. On March 08 2013 08:46 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 08 2013 07:07 WaveofShadow wrote:
...
MeatlessTaco: Aggressively enters the thread makes a couple early game cases and leaves. Who is your top scumread right now and why? (I refuse to believe it's NW just because you voted him)
... I wanted to pounce on Raven, his initial exuberance 10 min before game starts and then lurks for a long time like he's getting help from his scum mentor. Since then, he hasn't done enough to move my suspicion. There is no instant lynch. My vote means who I suspect right now. I felt that this was a good post, generally people who have decent activity before a game starts and then disappear as soon as it starts deserve to be looked at more closely. At the same time going back to odd actions from him we also have things like this On March 08 2013 08:55 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 08 2013 07:34 Krafla wrote:
What I wanted to add was it seemed like people only started to consider NW once MeatlessTaco went after him, and I was going to wonder out loud if MeatlessTaco ..
Everything starts somewhere. If my analysis was poor, argue that. Don't argue that I made an argument that caught on so that is bad. It's a good thing if an argument gets some traction. On March 08 2013 07:34 Krafla wrote:
And now the same thing has happened again and Matriarch has posted throwing doubt on Meatless just before I hit send, ohwell, I'm going to leave it here!
Let's hear Krafla's and Matriarch's reasoning behind suspecting me. I understand NobodyWonder hasn't said a lot, neither have I or you. We do what we can with very limited information. Make a case, but don't point fingers at me without a case better than "he made an argument that someone else agreed with". He didn't actually make a case... did he forget? It was a joke vote that stuck and other people attacked NW. There was no case from Taco. On March 08 2013 08:58 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 08 2013 08:53 nobodywonder wrote:
...I'd still say if I can't find concrete proof of scum, then I would just get rid of the scummiest lurker...
Isn't that kind of a high bar for day 1? Isn't that the exact job town is trying to do? On March 08 2013 14:56 MeatlessTaco wrote:
No vote: OmniEulogy, Krafla, TheRavensName, Arctic Daishi, bduddy, Matriarch, Frorgon, WaveofShadows
You all need to make a stand. Are you going to let marines kills our broodlings one by one? Vote and make a case. Again from somebody who hasn't actually made a single case all game this seems really REALLY bad... looking through his filter and doing this again... I'm actually going to move Taco to my scum list. ##Unvote##Vote: MeatlessTacoI believe this case is Much stronger than my case on Frorgon and am changing my vote for that reason. What does everybody else make of this case on Taco? In fact... I am going to push for Taco's Lynch, I expect anybody who wants to hit scum to jump on this train, The Wagon of Justice has arrived. + Show Spoiler +On March 09 2013 04:49 OmniEulogy wrote:I'm also quite worried about Taco. His actions so far are a mixture of scum/town so I can't get a good read on him. We have his opening joke vote, which alone I have no problem with Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:47 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 07 2013 14:06 WaveofShadow wrote:My GOD this thread is exciting.  On March 07 2013 14:17 nobodywonder wrote:
woo! ~ exciting game Nobody's only post is sheeping the experienced guy adding no new content of his own? Now you can lurk and say "I would have contributed if the game were more exciting?" That seems pretty anti-town to me. ##Vote: nobodywonder Now it's more exciting. However we do end up sticking on NW through pressure of other people so he never actually has to vote. He uses this as an excuse to pressure others to place votes on people when he himself never actually made a serious vote. Keep in mind how early in the game these posts are. Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 15:49 MeatlessTaco wrote:
Matriarch / Krafla:
If I held a gun to you head noose around your neck and made you pick someone to lynch instead of yourself, who would it be?
Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 17:05 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 07 2013 17:01 Krafla wrote:On March 07 2013 15:49 MeatlessTaco wrote:
Matriarch / Krafla:
If I held a gun to you head noose around your neck and made you pick someone to lynch instead of yourself, who would it be?
Point taken, I guess I'd have to pick someone randomly, so probably someone that hasn't posted yet, Arctic Daishi?! Why are you afraid to take a position? Are you going to vote for Arctic Daishi or just write his name with a question mark? I feel that Krafla here was trying to apply pressure the Arctic who had yet said anything at all but Taco tries to pressure him to vote for somebody who hasn't said a single word so far? that's sketchy so early on in the game. Makes it seem like he doesn't care who is voting for who. Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 17:13 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 07 2013 17:08 Krafla wrote:On March 07 2013 17:05 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 07 2013 17:01 Krafla wrote:On March 07 2013 15:49 MeatlessTaco wrote:
Matriarch / Krafla:
If I held a gun to you head noose around your neck and made you pick someone to lynch instead of yourself, who would it be?
Point taken, I guess I'd have to pick someone randomly, so probably someone that hasn't posted yet, Arctic Daishi?! Why are you afraid to take a position? Are you going to vote for Arctic Daishi or just write his name with a question mark? Nope, I'm not going to vote yet, I want to make an educated decision of who to vote for instead of flinging dirt and seeing what sticks Take a stand. Are you going to side with me trying to lynch someone acting suspicious or side with nobodywonder trying to lynch a lurker who can't defend themselves? This is TL Mafia which is serious stuff. You aren't allowed to be Switzerland. Again goes after Krafla early on, Why is Taco so obsessed with getting people to vote? The game isn't even through the first 24 hours. Town doesn't need to throw votes out so quickly, they need to think about their actions as Krafla is doing. This raises more questions about how much Taco actually cares who gets lynched. And then we have these back-to-back posts. Holy Shit Hypocrisy. Show nested quote +On March 08 2013 10:35 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 08 2013 03:08 ChewOnStu wrote:
Im finding nobodywonder scummy too for complaining about lurkers not contributing yet he's barely contributed anything himself.
##vote: nobodywonder
... Why are you bandwagoning on NW while your only contribution is couple of trite posts about your lurker policy? Show nested quote +On March 08 2013 14:06 MeatlessTaco wrote:
You are right. His behavior is unacceptable so far. You got anything to add Chew?
##Vote: ChewOnStu His FIRST real vote is a complete sheep with nothing to add about why Chew is scum. Does he really care who gets lynched? This doesn't take away from the good points he's made and some of his questions have been really good... but the inconsistency is there. ^ My original look through his filter. Shit just got real... I didn't expect that... Yeah, I forgot I had never made a case against NW, he had only 2 posts or something at that point. He defended himself poorly, but eventually my read was that he was making an honest effort. Chew's behavior was unacceptable, you can't let someone float through 2 days of discussion, put down a vote and avoid scrutiny. I stand by the concrete proof statement. All our scum reads aren't 100%. Being unhelpful to town has to still be a factor. Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:00 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 06:58 Frorgon wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote: MeatlessTaco
I am going to take a stand now to see if we can get more people onboard. I think nobodywonder does make a good point that we don't gain much information from lynching Arctic D1. I do find it curious that Meatless has disappeared after getting everyone to antagonize NW, maybe thinking that his job was done for the day. Lets see if he can defend himself. If we Lynch Arctic and he comes up Red though, we get a good deal out of it. Especially sense Meatless was pushing for us to forget about him cause he would just be replaced. I didn't want the copout available: vote for the guy who hasn't posted yet. I never considered the possibility that he would de-lurk. Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. As for the criticisms against me: they are correct. I've been hoping that it I prodded everyone into action I would be able to have a ton on information for the Day 1 lynch. In this post in particular, I didn't want someone to vote Daishi and say "I'm pressuring a lurker, see I'm helping". It has been my strategy that votes are the best way to pressure people and force people to take a position. In doing this, I was hugely hypocritical, because I didn't take too many positions myself. Honestly, I never thought the whole NW thing to take off. I was waiting to strike on Raven and asked the mentor about it, but Raven's return didn't give me anything to be suspicious and NW was digging himself a hole. I also assumed ( like 30 min ago while re-reading thread when I made that post), activity wise, that Frogron or Chew would be lynched.
All well and good but... do you have a new case or are you sticking with your cop out mr Taco? Your post in this way basically makes you sound more like a caught red trying to make excuses. I mean you said yourself that your a hypocrit, which is about as close to a liar your going to get in mafia this early in without a fake role claim.
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On March 09 2013 07:41 bduddy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:38 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:37 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:34 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:29 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:27 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. On March 09 2013 07:22 OmniEulogy wrote:
if Arctic is scum and you guys nail him, it's fantastic but I'm still wondering how he is different from the other lurkers like bduddy. If we just talk about Arctic being lynched and flipping scum, the only thing we gain is scum being down by 1 which is huge for D1 don't get me wrong but his absence means we don't learn much else from it. My question to him at that point was the best I could do, he literally had 0 posts to his name, and all the questions were more aimed towards seeing peoples reactions to me asking them, and how people felt about Luneth as opposed to Arctic (who wasn't even a subject of conversation at that point).
I guess if I look at it from a point that Arctic wouldn't vote on his own scum buddies, we might be able to clear the people he's voted on as being town? Although even that is a shot in the dark. Did you read Taco's post? Or Raven's last few? We have plenty to learn. Daishi is goin' downnnnnnnnnn I really want to avoid trying to make a link between Arctic and Taco till after the flip. And if Arctic flips town I'm going to be kicking myself for not being able to persuade people to vote Taco, however I don't want to see NW lynched... I don't disagree that Arctic looks scummy, I just think Taco looks worse. Well can you explain to me what we learn if Taco flips town? that I'm an idiot and can't read people. I believe he's scum but I'm willing to consolidate on Arctic to save NW for D1. Ha. So the gains either way are subjective at best. fair enough as I wasn't really considering what would happen if Taco flipped town. Arctic is pretty much a blank sheet regardless of his flip, that's how I was comparing them. But when someone comes up mafia, you learn a lot about those defending him and not defending him - especially when's he's essentially a lurker without anything concrete to go on.
but nobody is defending him. lol
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On March 09 2013 07:41 TheRavensName wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:33 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 09 2013 06:20 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 05:54 WaveofShadow wrote:
@Omni your cases so far have been solid, can you expand on your thoughts on MeatlessTaco? I agree he has been very aggressive in his posting though the only real scummy thing I've seen from him is the sheep vote onto Chew.
Also what are your thoughts regarding the rest of the lurkers today? There are quite a few of them (Matriarch, Daishi, Luneth probably the worst offenders) and it's going to be very difficult to determine what to do with them once the day is over. Hmm not sure what else to say about Taco... well actually I'll go the other way, I think I've covered pretty much everything he's done that seems to go against town, but he was right when he said you have to suspect everybody in one of his first posts. On March 08 2013 08:46 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 08 2013 07:07 WaveofShadow wrote:
...
MeatlessTaco: Aggressively enters the thread makes a couple early game cases and leaves. Who is your top scumread right now and why? (I refuse to believe it's NW just because you voted him)
... I wanted to pounce on Raven, his initial exuberance 10 min before game starts and then lurks for a long time like he's getting help from his scum mentor. Since then, he hasn't done enough to move my suspicion. There is no instant lynch. My vote means who I suspect right now. I felt that this was a good post, generally people who have decent activity before a game starts and then disappear as soon as it starts deserve to be looked at more closely. At the same time going back to odd actions from him we also have things like this On March 08 2013 08:55 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 08 2013 07:34 Krafla wrote:
What I wanted to add was it seemed like people only started to consider NW once MeatlessTaco went after him, and I was going to wonder out loud if MeatlessTaco ..
Everything starts somewhere. If my analysis was poor, argue that. Don't argue that I made an argument that caught on so that is bad. It's a good thing if an argument gets some traction. On March 08 2013 07:34 Krafla wrote:
And now the same thing has happened again and Matriarch has posted throwing doubt on Meatless just before I hit send, ohwell, I'm going to leave it here!
Let's hear Krafla's and Matriarch's reasoning behind suspecting me. I understand NobodyWonder hasn't said a lot, neither have I or you. We do what we can with very limited information. Make a case, but don't point fingers at me without a case better than "he made an argument that someone else agreed with". He didn't actually make a case... did he forget? It was a joke vote that stuck and other people attacked NW. There was no case from Taco. On March 08 2013 08:58 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 08 2013 08:53 nobodywonder wrote:
...I'd still say if I can't find concrete proof of scum, then I would just get rid of the scummiest lurker...
Isn't that kind of a high bar for day 1? Isn't that the exact job town is trying to do? On March 08 2013 14:56 MeatlessTaco wrote:
No vote: OmniEulogy, Krafla, TheRavensName, Arctic Daishi, bduddy, Matriarch, Frorgon, WaveofShadows
You all need to make a stand. Are you going to let marines kills our broodlings one by one? Vote and make a case. Again from somebody who hasn't actually made a single case all game this seems really REALLY bad... looking through his filter and doing this again... I'm actually going to move Taco to my scum list. ##Unvote##Vote: MeatlessTacoI believe this case is Much stronger than my case on Frorgon and am changing my vote for that reason. What does everybody else make of this case on Taco? In fact... I am going to push for Taco's Lynch, I expect anybody who wants to hit scum to jump on this train, The Wagon of Justice has arrived. + Show Spoiler +On March 09 2013 04:49 OmniEulogy wrote:I'm also quite worried about Taco. His actions so far are a mixture of scum/town so I can't get a good read on him. We have his opening joke vote, which alone I have no problem with Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 14:47 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 07 2013 14:06 WaveofShadow wrote:My GOD this thread is exciting. On March 07 2013 14:17 nobodywonder wrote:
woo! ~ exciting game Nobody's only post is sheeping the experienced guy adding no new content of his own? Now you can lurk and say "I would have contributed if the game were more exciting?" That seems pretty anti-town to me. ##Vote: nobodywonder Now it's more exciting. However we do end up sticking on NW through pressure of other people so he never actually has to vote. He uses this as an excuse to pressure others to place votes on people when he himself never actually made a serious vote. Keep in mind how early in the game these posts are. Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 15:49 MeatlessTaco wrote:
Matriarch / Krafla:
If I held a gun to you head noose around your neck and made you pick someone to lynch instead of yourself, who would it be?
Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 17:05 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 07 2013 17:01 Krafla wrote:On March 07 2013 15:49 MeatlessTaco wrote:
Matriarch / Krafla:
If I held a gun to you head noose around your neck and made you pick someone to lynch instead of yourself, who would it be?
Point taken, I guess I'd have to pick someone randomly, so probably someone that hasn't posted yet, Arctic Daishi?! Why are you afraid to take a position? Are you going to vote for Arctic Daishi or just write his name with a question mark? I feel that Krafla here was trying to apply pressure the Arctic who had yet said anything at all but Taco tries to pressure him to vote for somebody who hasn't said a single word so far? that's sketchy so early on in the game. Makes it seem like he doesn't care who is voting for who. Show nested quote +On March 07 2013 17:13 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 07 2013 17:08 Krafla wrote:On March 07 2013 17:05 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 07 2013 17:01 Krafla wrote:On March 07 2013 15:49 MeatlessTaco wrote:
Matriarch / Krafla:
If I held a gun to you head noose around your neck and made you pick someone to lynch instead of yourself, who would it be?
Point taken, I guess I'd have to pick someone randomly, so probably someone that hasn't posted yet, Arctic Daishi?! Why are you afraid to take a position? Are you going to vote for Arctic Daishi or just write his name with a question mark? Nope, I'm not going to vote yet, I want to make an educated decision of who to vote for instead of flinging dirt and seeing what sticks Take a stand. Are you going to side with me trying to lynch someone acting suspicious or side with nobodywonder trying to lynch a lurker who can't defend themselves? This is TL Mafia which is serious stuff. You aren't allowed to be Switzerland. Again goes after Krafla early on, Why is Taco so obsessed with getting people to vote? The game isn't even through the first 24 hours. Town doesn't need to throw votes out so quickly, they need to think about their actions as Krafla is doing. This raises more questions about how much Taco actually cares who gets lynched. And then we have these back-to-back posts. Holy Shit Hypocrisy. Show nested quote +On March 08 2013 10:35 MeatlessTaco wrote:On March 08 2013 03:08 ChewOnStu wrote:
Im finding nobodywonder scummy too for complaining about lurkers not contributing yet he's barely contributed anything himself.
##vote: nobodywonder
... Why are you bandwagoning on NW while your only contribution is couple of trite posts about your lurker policy? Show nested quote +On March 08 2013 14:06 MeatlessTaco wrote:
You are right. His behavior is unacceptable so far. You got anything to add Chew?
##Vote: ChewOnStu His FIRST real vote is a complete sheep with nothing to add about why Chew is scum. Does he really care who gets lynched? This doesn't take away from the good points he's made and some of his questions have been really good... but the inconsistency is there. ^ My original look through his filter. Shit just got real... I didn't expect that... Yeah, I forgot I had never made a case against NW, he had only 2 posts or something at that point. He defended himself poorly, but eventually my read was that he was making an honest effort. Chew's behavior was unacceptable, you can't let someone float through 2 days of discussion, put down a vote and avoid scrutiny. I stand by the concrete proof statement. All our scum reads aren't 100%. Being unhelpful to town has to still be a factor. On March 09 2013 07:00 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 06:58 Frorgon wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote: MeatlessTaco
I am going to take a stand now to see if we can get more people onboard. I think nobodywonder does make a good point that we don't gain much information from lynching Arctic D1. I do find it curious that Meatless has disappeared after getting everyone to antagonize NW, maybe thinking that his job was done for the day. Lets see if he can defend himself. If we Lynch Arctic and he comes up Red though, we get a good deal out of it. Especially sense Meatless was pushing for us to forget about him cause he would just be replaced. I didn't want the copout available: vote for the guy who hasn't posted yet. I never considered the possibility that he would de-lurk. On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. As for the criticisms against me: they are correct. I've been hoping that it I prodded everyone into action I would be able to have a ton on information for the Day 1 lynch. In this post in particular, I didn't want someone to vote Daishi and say "I'm pressuring a lurker, see I'm helping". It has been my strategy that votes are the best way to pressure people and force people to take a position. In doing this, I was hugely hypocritical, because I didn't take too many positions myself. Honestly, I never thought the whole NW thing to take off. I was waiting to strike on Raven and asked the mentor about it, but Raven's return didn't give me anything to be suspicious and NW was digging himself a hole. I also assumed ( like 30 min ago while re-reading thread when I made that post), activity wise, that Frogron or Chew would be lynched. All well and good but... do you have a new case or are you sticking with your cop out mr Taco? Your post in this way basically makes you sound more like a caught red trying to make excuses. I mean you said yourself that your a hypocrit, which is about as close to a liar your going to get in mafia this early in without a fake role claim.
Don't be so quick to judge; the only way I got myself out of a sure lynch situation D1 in NMM 37 was being apologetic because I was super noob. To be fair though Taco doesn't strike me as super noob. I still don't think this is enough for me to go on to change my vote though.
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On March 09 2013 02:13 nobodywonder wrote:Krafla, did you really expect me to highlight your failings and call you out? I attacked you, one of my initial defenders. You're either a very perceptive townie or just scum. You should use such perception on other reads too then, and join the scum-hunting fun. Thanks for your explanation for your bandwagonning, that wasn't that much pressure on you anyway though. No need for yourself to declare innonence so early while other possible bandwagoners such as Chew haven't explained themselves. I expect you to expect great things - of both town and scum. MLuneth + Show Spoiler +##Vote: nobodywonder
This vote is basically the result suspiciously targeting lurkers but more importantly the lack of an acceptable coherent defence.
Rainbow, it strikes me as odd that while you have accused/pressured people to find out their position on certain matters but your position is not clear. In what circumstances would you lynch a lurker? remember MLuneth, you yourself targeted lurkers and that was Arctic Daishi, lurked, and did not switch vote until after basically a consensus was made by the forum to ignore Daishi As for your question to Rainbow, what circumstances would you lynch a lurker. this question isn't even irrelevant. the consensus was already made. this post only strikes to further meaningless talk. besides that seems more like a PM to the town or scum coach. Show nested quote +On March 08 2013 14:52 MLuneth wrote:
EBWOP
My view at the time was and still remains is that unless I am confident that there is a high chance of an active person being scum I will Vote for an inactive scummy Lurker alright, show your confidence in me being scum. you should have switched your vote a lot sooner then
As I have already explained, my vote at that was a pressure vote. My goal was to get him talking rather than actually lynch him.
As for the switching vote sooner I live in Australia so if the town comes to a consensus on something at 3 in teh morning (which is happening) it'll be a minimum of 5 hours before you hear my reply/reaction
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On March 09 2013 07:15 bduddy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 06:57 WaveofShadow wrote:
Alright in a bid to get you to change your vote (not that I don't think Taco looks bad):
What would we learn from Taco's lynch.
Assume he is scum and he has just flipped. What have we now learned? We've learned that there is one fewer scum in the game and that we're way closer to winning. How is that not a great thing? Arctic is seriously lurking hardcore though (yes, I understand the irony. I just got done with a job interview that got pushed back from earlier today), and his few posts look like lame attempts to jump on a bandwagon or to look active. I'm also very suspicious of how Arctic and OE seem to be mutually defending each other. For example: Show nested quote +AD wrote: You seemed rather hostile against Omni, who was very active in investigating people. Perhaps to stop his investigation?. Show nested quote +OE wrote: @MLuneth Could you expand on why you chose Arctic to vote on when there were others (bduddy, ChewOnStu) without any content as well. Other than it just being a coin flip. @Krafla + Show Spoiler + Although you believe we may be giving some lurkers too easy of a time how do you feel about Luneth's vote on Arctic vs the other lurkers? Do you think it was too early to cast a serious vote on someone who has not been present or was it a justified action in your eyes? @Rainbows You mention Luneth being scummy, what do you think about his vote on Arctic? As Arctic has yet to show up, do you think it is more town oriented (trying to get a lurker to post) or scummy (attacking the easiest player early on in hopes that Arctic doesn't defend himself). @Arctic Can give us your thoughts on what has happened so far and answer most of the questions I have asked to the others. [ LOL that's the best you can do?] [others omitted] Show nested quote +OE wrote: I agree with you there, I don't think the vote makes much sense either and I'm trying to decide on if he just attacked an easy player or not, and if Arctic never does contest it it would be very easy for scum to latch onto him early and ride D1 out safely that way. I just re-read the first few pages and he does explain why he didn't vote for NW but considering he does that and then puts a serious vote on Arctic... I can see misguided townie and scum motivation behind it. I agree with TRN's recent posts and understand that what I was going off of may have been wrong. For now, even if I'm suspicious of OE, Arctic will be totally useless to us even if he is town, OE at least posts. ##Unvote
##Vote: Arctic Daishi
bduddy pointed you out soft defending Daishi. You keep saying we'd learn nothing if he flipped? Well we might learn something about you. We'd certainly also learn something about his voting patterns and we might be able to figure out if the people he was bandwagoning were scum or not.
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On March 09 2013 07:41 OmniEulogy wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:41 bduddy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:38 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:37 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:34 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:29 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:27 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. On March 09 2013 07:22 OmniEulogy wrote:
if Arctic is scum and you guys nail him, it's fantastic but I'm still wondering how he is different from the other lurkers like bduddy. If we just talk about Arctic being lynched and flipping scum, the only thing we gain is scum being down by 1 which is huge for D1 don't get me wrong but his absence means we don't learn much else from it. My question to him at that point was the best I could do, he literally had 0 posts to his name, and all the questions were more aimed towards seeing peoples reactions to me asking them, and how people felt about Luneth as opposed to Arctic (who wasn't even a subject of conversation at that point).
I guess if I look at it from a point that Arctic wouldn't vote on his own scum buddies, we might be able to clear the people he's voted on as being town? Although even that is a shot in the dark. Did you read Taco's post? Or Raven's last few? We have plenty to learn. Daishi is goin' downnnnnnnnnn I really want to avoid trying to make a link between Arctic and Taco till after the flip. And if Arctic flips town I'm going to be kicking myself for not being able to persuade people to vote Taco, however I don't want to see NW lynched... I don't disagree that Arctic looks scummy, I just think Taco looks worse. Well can you explain to me what we learn if Taco flips town? that I'm an idiot and can't read people. I believe he's scum but I'm willing to consolidate on Arctic to save NW for D1. Ha. So the gains either way are subjective at best. fair enough as I wasn't really considering what would happen if Taco flipped town. Arctic is pretty much a blank sheet regardless of his flip, that's how I was comparing them. But when someone comes up mafia, you learn a lot about those defending him and not defending him - especially when's he's essentially a lurker without anything concrete to go on. but nobody is defending him. lol
clarify this. now i realize my name is terrible for mafia, lets have it such that people should refer me only as NW or wonder so thread doesnt get confused
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EBWOP: The above is directed @Omni
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Vote count please, o fearless leader?
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On March 09 2013 07:45 nobodywonder wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2013 07:41 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:41 bduddy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:38 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:37 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:34 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:29 TheRavensName wrote:On March 09 2013 07:27 OmniEulogy wrote:On March 09 2013 07:24 WaveofShadow wrote:On March 09 2013 07:22 TheRavensName wrote:
Just going to toss it out there. That seemed a little early to be expecting a replacement on arctic when there was only a single vote for arctic. He acted like we were going to accidently lynch him. But that'll be the end of this for now. You're right, and I want to see Taco comment on this. On March 09 2013 07:22 OmniEulogy wrote:
if Arctic is scum and you guys nail him, it's fantastic but I'm still wondering how he is different from the other lurkers like bduddy. If we just talk about Arctic being lynched and flipping scum, the only thing we gain is scum being down by 1 which is huge for D1 don't get me wrong but his absence means we don't learn much else from it. My question to him at that point was the best I could do, he literally had 0 posts to his name, and all the questions were more aimed towards seeing peoples reactions to me asking them, and how people felt about Luneth as opposed to Arctic (who wasn't even a subject of conversation at that point).
I guess if I look at it from a point that Arctic wouldn't vote on his own scum buddies, we might be able to clear the people he's voted on as being town? Although even that is a shot in the dark. Did you read Taco's post? Or Raven's last few? We have plenty to learn. Daishi is goin' downnnnnnnnnn I really want to avoid trying to make a link between Arctic and Taco till after the flip. And if Arctic flips town I'm going to be kicking myself for not being able to persuade people to vote Taco, however I don't want to see NW lynched... I don't disagree that Arctic looks scummy, I just think Taco looks worse. Well can you explain to me what we learn if Taco flips town? that I'm an idiot and can't read people. I believe he's scum but I'm willing to consolidate on Arctic to save NW for D1. Ha. So the gains either way are subjective at best. fair enough as I wasn't really considering what would happen if Taco flipped town. Arctic is pretty much a blank sheet regardless of his flip, that's how I was comparing them. But when someone comes up mafia, you learn a lot about those defending him and not defending him - especially when's he's essentially a lurker without anything concrete to go on. but nobody is defending him. lol clarify this. now i realize my name is terrible for mafia, lets have it such that people should refer me only as NW or wonder so thread doesnt get confused
LOL sorry I didn't even think of your name, I just mean no player in this game is defending Arctic.
@WoS me stating facts isn't defending him. I'm just trying to get my top scum read lynched, I've said multiple times I have no problem with Arctic getting lynched if people can't come to an agreement on Taco.
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On March 09 2013 07:41 TheRavensName wrote:
All well and good but... do you have a new case or are you sticking with your cop out mr Taco? Your post in this way basically makes you sound more like a caught red trying to make excuses. I mean you said yourself that your a hypocrit, which is about as close to a liar your going to get in mafia this early in without a fake role claim.
I explained that my strategy was to generate content. I never worried if I looked town or not until an hour ago.
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My vote in NW stays the same because there has still been no coherent defence to tell me why NW is not scum.
I agree that other players are looking very suspicious too but I'm more confident that NW is scum than they are
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EPT
