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Witchcraft Mini Mafia
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 /in Here I come ! Is it OK to speculate about the setup in this game ? | ||
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On a serious note, I think that this game is going to be very interesting. | ||
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On December 15 2012 02:06 Promethelax wrote: That isn't something to be proud of buddy. At least, they were discussing about NKing him in the NMM XXIX scumQT | ||
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I know half of the player list basically... You can find my games in my profile by the way ! | ||
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I would like to emphasize something very important for this game. Never give a single townread this game ! For obvious reasons, because of the Witch Hunter, we should avoid to get a consensus that a player is town. Because if he is town, there are good chances for him to get insta-shoot by the mafia. On the same note, I don't want to see anybody propose a idea or plan on how to cast our witchcraft votes. Never speak about these votes. Keeping everything for you is the best solution. Other than that, I would like everybody to give a little hindsight of their game experience, especially newbies, if there are some. Regarding me, you can find all my previous games on these forums (only forum games I've ever played) in my profile. | ||
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On December 15 2012 07:08 MrZentor wrote: ##Vote MrZentor Because I can. Because mafia tends to do that. ##Vote MrZentor | ||
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I know it's going to be very difficult, but we have to refrain ourselves from doing it while the Witch Hunter is alive... | ||
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On December 15 2012 10:49 Hapahauli wrote: The thing is that you can't live in fear of things like that. I mean when it really comes down to it... who cares about blue roles? A town can win without blues. All we can do is play the game and try to find mafia. If someone gets shot, so be it. In fact I'm half tempted at this point to have a policy of never voting blues. That way, we'd have a 10-3 setup of 3 mafia goons vs 10 VTs, which IMO is town favored. You can only vote for one no-vote. Do you have even Witchcraft vote Hapa ? Maybe you would be more interested in the way you have to use them if you did ? ##Unvote ##Vote Hapa | ||
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On December 08 2012 09:45 Blazinghand wrote: *snip* Witchcraft: Each day, in addition to the normal vote, there is a secret vote done via PM to elect Blues. Each player, regardless of alignment, has X votes (See below) they can distribute as they want, but can't put more than one vote on a guy or vote for themselves. They can vote to give the power to nobody, but only with one vote. The results are secret, though of course people can claim their votes in the thread... if they want to out the blues that is :D At the start of the night, the X top winners can choose from the following pool of Powers, which they retain until the next election: *snip* @ Hapa I cannot believe you didn't read this... | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:08 Hapahauli wrote: Yeah so what? That means that we can choose not to give the power to anyone. Yeah, that means that your policy of not voting anyone is impossible. I don't think that a town Hapa would not care a bit about how he can use his votes. You couldn't have come up with this idea if you had read the OP, which was the first thing I did when I got my PM. | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:11 thrawn2112 wrote: ok ##Vote Djodref what kind of information are you looking for? I want to know if they are some total newbies in this game. I like newbies because I have good reads on them. What's up with your vote ? | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:13 Hapahauli wrote: The hell are you talking about? It explicitly states there that we can chose to vote for no one if we want to. I have 3 witchcraft votes, why do you think you only have one ? | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:13 Hapahauli wrote: So answer me this Djo: 1) Why are you so fearful of the witchhunter? 2) Why are you pushing a plan that compromises our scumhunting? 3) True or false: a 10-3 VT-Goon setup is town favored. 1) Because I don't want us to lose blues / obvious townies 2) I honestly think that we can scumhunt without stating our townreads 3) True, but impossible in this game | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:17 Hapahauli wrote: This is how voting works according to the OP: Either we cast 3 votes on 3 separate people. Or we cast 1 vote saying we don't want to vote anyone. There's no middle ground (i.e. you can't vote for only 1-2 people, it's either 3 or nothing). The OP is pretty clear imo. You always have 3 votes, the thing you can do is : Vote Player A Vote Player B Vote No-One | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:20 thrawn2112 wrote: so djo, when someone asks you if you want to lynch player x but you have a strong town read on player x, what are you going to say? In your case, if one of my strong town read is going to be lynched, I'm going to defend it. If the guy is in the danger to be lynched, he is not going to receive WC votes, and anyway the mafia is not going to get rid of him. Let's say that we should avoid to give our towntells on players in the thread. | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:21 DarthPunk wrote: 1- you are valuing blues to highly 2- That is a ridiculous proposition 3- So you were voting someone for a plan that was impossible. But you knew that. So you are essentially voting for someone for not reading the OP? Do you think town or scum are less likely to read the OP? 1- the problem is not the blues, the problem is that town players are going to get insta-shot 2- I mean, you focus only on your scum reads, you keep the towntells you find for yourself, is that a better proposition ? 3- I have witchcraft vote and my first reaction has been to check how they work. I was expecting every other town player to do that. Did you not notice that scum players don't have Witchcraft votes. Plus, it's the early game, we have to vote people for small reasons to get the discussion started. I think this reason was good enough. I was hoping that people would discuss my first vote on MrZentor, but this vote on Hapa has been more efficient. By the way, I've noticed that you didn't read the OP as well | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:27 kushm4sta wrote: "in not retarded I'm town" -djo does that strike anyone else as an intensely scummy thing to say? not sure why but i read it and my scumsenses went off the charts. Why so nitpikcing ? Why didn't you bother to quote all my one-liner ? The full quote is On December 15 2012 11:09 Djodref wrote: I'm not retarded, I'm town, I'm interested into the way I should use my witchcraft votes, obviously you both don't which makes perfect sense in the context (me answering to people calling me retarded when they failed to read and/or to understand the OP) By the way, it looks like Hapa genuinely misread the OP, regardless of his alignment ##Unvote | ||
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I've checked how the witchcraft votes where working exactly. I read it the first time when the OP came out but I didn't remember exactly how it worked when I joined for real. The players list made me join by the way | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:47 DarthPunk wrote: Holy shit. Djo be scummy. Look at that un-OMGUS as soon as Hapa unvotes. also. Both his votes have been weak as shit. Djo. Are scum or town less likely to read the OP? They are both as likely to read the OP. But the witchcraft votes part is more likely to be read in details by the town. It turns out that Hapa has misread the OP (his behaviors feels genuine), so my point against him was not so relevant. Weak votes in the early game are a way to get the discussion started. By the way, did you read the witchcraft votes part in the OP or not ? Did you do the same mistake as Hapa ? | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:52 Blazinghand wrote: You can use one of your votes to cast a "no-one" vote. If "no-one" wins, it blocks out a spot in the election. Today there are 10 townies alive, which means you are electing three blues, which means you must cast three witchcraft votes. One of these votes may be a vote for "no-one", and if it is in the top 3 choices town will have one less blue role than usual tonight. The OP was pretty straightforward imo. We cannot force a 10 VT - 3 goons setup. | ||
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On December 15 2012 11:55 drazak wrote: Hey if you're lurking we're gonna kill you, cut it out. I'm not sure what's scummy about DP yet but djo bro, I'm not sure you're thinking things out in regards to hapa. Hapa came out with an idea that was looking good for town but was impossible to achieve if you were really paying attention on how the witchcraft votes are working. I thought it was a cheap way to look town and also a mistake from a mafia player who didn't read carefully the part of the OP destined to town roles. It turns out that it was a misunderstanding. or at least it looks like it. | ||
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On December 15 2012 12:02 DarthPunk wrote: So you were voting for a good player based on a coinflip? Is that it? If both scum and town are just as likely to not read the op, and you vote for someone based on not reading the OP you are just randomly voting for hapa, a good town player historically, based on a 3/13 chance he is scum? My reading/ not reading the OP is irrelevant to my alignment so I don;t feel the need to talk about that with you. especially after mario and learning of your penchant as scu to force these kind of discussions. How about you talk about something other than the set-up? how about you do some scumhunting. My vote will stay where it is until that happens. It's not a coinflip at all. I've read the witchcraft vote part in the OP carefully and I expect every town player to do so. Mafia players don't have witchcraft votes so I expect them to read this part less carefully. My thinking process is valid. Why do you think that it is not better than a random vote ? Why have you failed to read the part of the OP specifically addressed to town players ? In mario, I was speculating about the setup to avoid contributing. Here I'm trying to identify town players and scum players by checking if they had the same reactions, thoughts process that I have. For me, you couldn't reasonably come up with a 10-3 VT-goon setup idea if you were town. It is also a good way to look town to propose such ideas. | ||
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On December 15 2012 12:24 DarthPunk wrote: He was voting for someone, based on nothing whatsoever. That is what I am accusing him for. Why are you ignoring my posts ? Did you read this ? On December 15 2012 12:19 Djodref wrote: It's not a coinflip at all. I've read the witchcraft vote part in the OP carefully and I expect every town player to do so. Mafia players don't have witchcraft votes so I expect them to read this part less carefully. My thinking process is valid. Why do you think that it is not better than a random vote ? Why have you failed to read the part of the OP specifically addressed to town players ? In mario, I was speculating about the setup to avoid contributing. Here I'm trying to identify town players and scum players by checking if they had the same reactions, thoughts process that I have. For me, you couldn't reasonably come up with a 10-3 VT-goon setup idea if you were town. It is also a good way to look town to propose such ideas. My vote wasn't a coin flip. I must admit than it wasn't a strong vote, but weak votes in the early game usually can get the discussion started and are great to help you read someone. In this regard, this post On December 15 2012 11:55 DarthPunk wrote: Fuck I hate playing town. People always want to lynch me day one. Source: my last three town games. and this game. is a very scummy reaction to Hapa vote on you. Not to mention you already OMGUS vote him. ##Vote DarthPunk | ||
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On December 15 2012 12:33 DarthPunk wrote: And I would say that reading the OP is not alignment indicative at all. and that any vote for someone not reading the OP is either stupid or scummy. I do see where you are coming from, though I disagree. So what you are saying is that you voted for hapa based on your feelings that townies were more likely to read the part of the OP that would disprove hapas plan? Still seems an awfully weak reason to vote for hapa. Why did you vote for MR Z? I voted to Mr Z to create some early game discussion. This vote was as serious as him voting himself. It didn't work at all, so I dropped it quickly. I voted Hapa for the following
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On December 15 2012 12:35 DarthPunk wrote: So you are voting for me by sheeping the weakest part of hapa's case against me? I vote you for the following reasons
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On December 15 2012 12:40 DarthPunk wrote: Let me elaborate on a previous point. Djo: What about MrZ's self vote made you vote for him. What is scummy about self votes? You said scum are likely to do that. Do you have any links to games you have played in to backup that assertion? First of all, it was not a serious vote. I gave this reason to get some discussion started about something. I know that self-voting is not relevant of the alignment. But I have seen scum doing that more so often that town. By the way, do you remember this in LVII ? On September 21 2012 00:07 DarthPunk wrote: ##VOTE DARTHPUNK And I also have this example from the first game I've ever played here. Kush in NMM XVIII On September 29 2012 06:22 kushm4sta wrote: kush seems scummiest honestly ##vote kush | ||
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Do you have any suspicion on other players than thrawn or myself so far ? | ||
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On December 15 2012 13:35 DarthPunk wrote: what do you think my position is on you djo? I know your position on me, I was trying to get you talk about other players but it looks like I've been sniped. | ||
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On December 15 2012 13:40 MrZentor wrote: I generated more discussion than you could have ever hoped for. Be thankful. I don't think you deserve the credit for generating discussion. Because I do Anyway, if you are here, you'd better comment on what happened so far. | ||
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Yes, you did talk about Hapa, which is a different player from thrawn and me. Or are you talking about the position you have on me ? | ||
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"my vote is on you until you scumhunt" | ||
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So, if you are town, you absolutely must start posting more and giving us your scum reads, even if they are weak and backed up with a short reasoning. We need at least this from you. Here are some players I'm very concerned about right now MrZentor MrZentor has not made a single post which could be called a good contribution to this thread. The thing that concerns me is the way he is trying to get as much as town credit he can for doing absolutely nothing. On December 15 2012 07:08 MrZentor wrote: ##Vote MrZentor Because I can. This is meaningless in itself. The town motivation could be to spark some discussion, the mafia motivation could be to throw some WIFOM out there like "mafia players don't vote themselves" and/or to be disruptive. I've cast my vote on him as a probe to see his reaction (or anyone reaction in the thread) and here is the answer I got. So I don't think that his goal was to create discussion. This post is just meaningless again. And yet, here he comes with this On December 15 2012 13:40 MrZentor wrote: I generated more discussion than you could have ever hoped for. Be thankful. On December 16 2012 02:02 MrZentor wrote: Okay, I think I've established my townieness. I should be more or less actually helpful from now on. Totally unwarranted. He didn't generate any good discussion, he didn't take part of it at least. MrZ is totally a lurker this game (even if he states he is not). Moreover, I've tried to confront him for his "generating discussion post" and he didn't answer me... The icing on the cake is his total OMGUS vote on JieXan, with absolutely no explanation. On December 15 2012 23:21 MrZentor wrote: ##Vote JieXian So, yeah, I think that MrZ could be scum. My concern right now is that another player that could be totally scum, JieXan (more on this later) is also going after him. I don't believe that they could be both scum, but meh... I'll post separate posts for JieXan and kush I'm dropping DP for the moment because I believe that DP doesn't care about the setup or the OP, regardless of his alignment. He is also fairly active and confronts people, and will do so as town or as mafia, and I feel that could actually help us given all the lurkers we have. We just have to check if he drops his scum reads for easier mislynches in the future and if he is not too stupid in his tunnelings, that's what Keir told about his scum meta basically, am I right ? Regarding the setup/OP thing, him lynching our uncontested self-aware miller who had claimed at the beginning of the game and totally discarding all my posts about the setup in the Mario showed me that town DP doesn't give a fuck about this kind of things. I thought at first he was totally hypocrite when saying "you cannot go after people for not reading the OP", trying to cover for his own mistake, but he could be actually be genuine about this one. | ||
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JieXan First of all, I liked DYH latest case against him + Show Spoiler [for reference] + On December 16 2012 07:32 DoYouHas wrote: @DP - I think the optimal way to play is to do our best to get the witch hunter to miss. Losing 2 townies, good or bad, is always worse than losing 1. I don't think this is going to convince you, so I'm not going to bring it up again. I'm feeling more comfortable with my vote on JX right now. His initial post was rather scummy, the thing to note about it is that it looks constructed (the phrases used when talking about hapa and MrZ, "mindless babbling" & "relative non-chalance". What makes me think he is scum is the progression of his pushing MrZ. A behavior read. An unsupported meta read with some WIFOM. Finally providing support for his meta read. Not conclusive enough considering he is ignoring paranoia (MrZ's most recent town game). This reads like he is trying to justify his stance on MrZ after the fact. Instead of finding MrZ scummy and looking into him, the presenting good reasons to vote him, JX voted him, then went in search of the reasons when pressured. This strikes me as scummy. I already pointed out how his first post feels constructed, and if that is true and he spent time on that post, why didn't he spend time backing up his vote on MrZ right from the start? Here is how he entered the thread casually spreading suspicion over Hapa and DP. On December 15 2012 14:47 JieXian wrote: Hi and sorry I'm late, I'm at +8GMT and I didn't wake up as early as DarthPunk At first I was really confused (scummy read) about hapa's mindless babbling about 13-3, which ISN'T RELEVANT to anything at all because you can't change anything except stir the discussion towards the wrong direction. Later I got a stronger read from DP from his ridiculous "pressuring" above all for a point that's completely moot But above all there's Mr Zentor's relative non-chalance to everything seems to trump everything else as doesn't seem to give a damn to anything as townies are well on their way to lynching one another ##Vote MrZentor His point against Hapa is not so bad, but it's kind of nit picky. I'll pass him this one because I was really startled when Hapa brought it. On the other hand, his points against DP and Zentor are bad. Regarding DP, in the early game, you have to pressure people for some trivia, and pressuring people is more a townie behavior than a mafia behavior, even if it's not totally true for DP. The main point here is that he calls them townies in the same post. That's just a scumslip. because this refers to Hapa and DP. So he enters the thread by spreading suspicion on them but calling them townies when he votes finally MrZ. So either he has a townread on them, in this case the first suspicions and points against them are totally useless and unwarranted for, either he is a mafia player that knows their alignment. Let's take a look at the rest of his filter to decide what is more likely. On December 16 2012 01:06 JieXian wrote: I was out the whole day man relax. You guys didn't understand my post. I found what Dp and hapa was saying to be weird BUT I changed my mind as I kept on reading the thread (notice how those 2 points were quite early on) Based on MrZentor's "uselessness" as you guys termed it, my meta read on him shows that he's acting differently but most of all, if he were scum, he'd have nothing else to do but sit and watch because dp and hapa were in the spotlight and not take any blame. Meaning he doesn't need to participate and make/risk any reads. I mean take a look at everyone else that's posting, they are all reads (be it weak or strong or sheep reads) He doesn't really comment on the fact that he called them townies. And now he said that they were saying weird things, and not scummy things. And then just proceeds to tunnel MrZ, which has not given us so much to work from. Right now, I think that JieXan has the most chances to flip scum. Hence my vote. ##Vote Jiexan | ||
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Kushm4sta Kush <3 Kush is notoriously hard to read and an easy mislynch, but they are some things that concerns me in his posts so far. The first thing, of course, is that he is going after me in a very nit-picky way. He is attacking me for one post that he takes totally out of context. That could totally be a scum kush scanning filters to look for something scummy. Let's take a look. On December 15 2012 11:27 kushm4sta wrote: "in not retarded I'm town" -djo does that strike anyone else as an intensely scummy thing to say? not sure why but i read it and my scumsenses went off the charts. Totally taken out of the context here. At least he quotes the whole sentence in the next post, but still failed to note that I was answering to Hapa and DP at that time. On December 16 2012 01:23 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* My biggest scumread so far is djodref. I'm not going to make a big case because it's mostly a feel read at this point honestly. what's really going on in this post is he is making it clear that the reason he brought up the witchcraft votes in the first place was because he thought it was something town would do, and he brought it up not because he cared but because he thought it would make him look town. The other part of my suspicion is how he reacted under pressure. in the last game I played with him he was town. There was a similar early bandwagon and he seemed like he didn't really give a shit. This game he responded to the bandwagon very attentively. Making lists and responding to everyone. His vote on hapa looked like a panic vote. *snip* I brought it up because it was clear for me at that time that Hapa and DP didn't read the part about the witchcraft votes in the OP. I've explained it already when he posted this. So he totally discards the context of this post one more time. For the pressure thing, it's kind of true, but I have been mislynched in the NMM XIX game for not giving a shit about people going after me for bad reasons. So, yeah, I care more about my defense now. I don't understand were he comes from when saying that my vote on Hapa is a panic vote. That's just bs. The other thing is that Kush has shown an anti-town mentality. On December 15 2012 10:27 kushm4sta wrote: town for the millionth time in a row. my rules this game: 1. I will never vote thrawn no matter how scummy he looks. I've been certain and wrong too many times. and I have to live with th regret every day of my life. *snip* 3. I am going to advocate the systematic extermination of lurkers. Yup I want to lynch unreadables over scmreads. And lurking makes you unreadable and immune to all efforts at scumhunting. Fuck fake pressuring active people.by pretending we might vote them. IF there is a lurker I will push his lynch. Never voting someone, no matter how scummy he looks... Lynching lurkers over scumreads... That's anti-town, but kush is also quite non-sensical, so I'm not sure what to do with that. On December 16 2012 05:48 kushm4sta wrote: Yup that's my rule for this game. kill lurkers before scumreads At least he is consistent with his rule. Oh wait ! he is being called for it and then... On December 16 2012 11:14 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* So when you look at it, the lurker issue really isn't that bad this game. So thrawn, when you say lurkers are making this game "unplayable" that is kinda bs. WTF ! This lurker issue is very concerning this game. I don't understand how he could not stick to his rule now ! So, all in all, I'm leaning scum on Kush, but it's a weak read because he is could have done these posts as town as well. | ||
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If we cannot consolidate on them, we have to lynch a lurker/inactive player. Here are now my candidates to a policy lynch
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On December 16 2012 13:43 MrZentor wrote: Whether somebody is a lurker or not isn't based on the content of their posts, but their activity. And I'm pretty sure JieXan is scum. ok, cool, based on your activity you are totally a lurker. I could even say that you are active lurking because you start to post just after my case against you. Give us your own reasons why you think that JieXan is scum. | ||
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If you are around, I want you to address my case. I'm really interested in your stance on me right now | ||
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On December 16 2012 13:55 MrZentor wrote: Djo, you're missing something. Something big. Look at all the cases on JieXan. They're all based on his reaction to ME. I had a part in each and every one of those cases in that I formed the foundation of them; why should I repeat what they say to you? That's not true ! DYH's case is based on how JieXan is going after you. On the opposite, my case against JieXan is based on his scumslip regarding DP and Hapa. And to answer your question, you have to give your own reasons for wanting to lynch JieXan. So we can have a better read on you. I don't understand how you can be so sure that JieXan is going to flip scum and I want you to explain yourself ! | ||
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On December 16 2012 13:55 kushm4sta wrote: @djodref have you ever made a mega case as town? Why did you feel to make THREE mega cases at this stage in the game? @ Kush Are you seriously going after me because I'm scumhunting ? I've made some cases like this in the Chrono Trigger game (against TC) and in the NMM XXX game against Clarity. I'll let you check my previous filters, the links are in my profile. This game is full of lurkers and/or inactive players, I had to step up and put some real effort in this game. Seriously, kush, if you are town, you should know that you always read me wrong. You had me as town in the Looney and as scum in the NMM XIXX so get your things together and go after someone else. What about your stance on the lurkers ? What was your fucking post where you say that lurkers are not a problem this game ? | ||
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On December 16 2012 14:11 MrZentor wrote: Yeah, it might have but a bit of an exaggeration, but you get point. ' And you have an excellent read on me, knowing that I am purposefully not giving you my reasons as to why I think JieXan is scum. Would a scum take that risk? Your defense is based on WIFOM and so it's not a valid point to defend yourself. Retaining information is anti-town. I don't have an excellent read on you, all your post so far have been meaningless and useless. The only thing that speaks so far for a town MrZentor for me right now is that JieXan was going after you from the get go and is tunneling you right now. You have done nothing on your own to show that you are town and yet you blatantly state the opposite. That is worrying me a lot. | ||
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On December 16 2012 14:25 MrZentor wrote: I have done a lot to show that I'm town; you're just reading it the wrong way. Quit the crap and go scumhunt, and first of all give us your own reasons to vote for JieXan. | ||
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On December 16 2012 14:36 JieXian wrote: as people are* posting cases against me Do you have any other scumread so far (at the exception of MrZentor) ? I want you to provide extensive cases against other players, you have to convince me than somebody is more likely to flip scum than you, which I doubt at this point. | ||
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On December 16 2012 15:31 JieXian wrote: djo no, I don't have other solid reads yet because it's so easy to misintepret my rushed first post and jump on me . it's only referring to hapa and dp , not you Why the fact that your first post is "easy to misinterpret" has anything to do with your lack of suspicion of anyone at the exception of MrZentor ? | ||
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On December 16 2012 16:53 JieXian wrote: djo I only have town reads well, because others are not posting too and I can only have suspicion at most on them and of course posting my train of thought on my suspicions on people won't/wasn't a good idea So what do you make of my case against Kush then ? You have a town read on him as well ? It looks like you are refusing to contribute right now. | ||
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I am sick, it's 5 am here. I'll just be here for the deadline and then go back to bed. This thread has just gone pants on head when I was sleeping. I fear that we are heading straight into a no lynch. I think that there ar e mafia players at work out there cause there are a very disruptive atmoaphee right now. Not so suee that Jx is scum withall the new players OMGUS over Omgus votes.players Nits time for a policy lynch imo !! ##Unvote ##Vote theesr | ||
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Like, I didn't even see a real case against Mordi, and I like his views on mrZ. Policy lynch, anyone ? | ||
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On December 17 2012 05:35 JieXian wrote: ? He's been consistent in being against MrZ the whole game Consistency is not a townie trait. But here I like the fact that he is after mrZ | ||
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Why is everybody ignoring my proposition to lynch theesr on a policy lynch ? | ||
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On December 17 2012 05:40 MrZentor wrote: What?? There are least four. Why do you want to kill a town lurker so bad? I don't think he is a good lynch. Lynching a lurker here would set a standard for the rest of this game. That we don't accept lurkers. | ||
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On December 17 2012 05:47 MrZentor wrote: Djo, read through Morbidiu's filter. Then look through each of the cases against him. Then read through Threesr's filter. THERE IS NOTHING SCUMMY IN HIS FILTER. We shouldn't be lynching a lurking town instead of an active scum. If you want to lynch Threesr instead of Morb, list some reasons for why Threesr is scum, and Morb is town. And if you can't find any reasons for why Threesr is scum, but still want to lynch him, that means you are lynching him solely on the fact that he is a lurker, and lynching a lurker should always be a last resort, when you can't find any scum.. lol Coming just before the deadline to drop his vote on the latest bandwagon is fucking scummy in my book. For mordi, I don't like his opening post and the way he reacted drazak's vote. But I like the fact that he is going after you. You made nothing to make me think that you are town. | ||
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Mordibus was a lurker, see what is happening to him and fuxking post in thsi game ! | ||
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Going back to bed now | ||
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On December 17 2012 06:09 Eywa- wrote: Q: Which townie predicted this? A: Eywa- I'd like to thank the other civilians for not realising that there are 3 scum and that the votes simply had a very low % chance of adding up to Morbidius being a mafia member. Wow I sure don't like this post. Are you trying to get town cred from this ? | ||
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bleh... I'm sad now | ||
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GG DarthPunk | ||
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On December 17 2012 03:06 Eywa- wrote: It is not my first time playing mafia, it is my first time playing TL Mafia. Previous character profiles are a nuisance to the town, they generally bring people to quick and unfortunate assumptions, if someone plays a certain way 10 times and are a townie every time, why wouldn't they play the same way once they got mafia? It's common sense... Previous knowledge can be used for serious meta-games, stay away from it. Otherwise, it suffices to say that: I am not going to jump on someone else's band wagon just because it's a popular choice. I will remain with my vote on hapahauli. I don't believe him to be a town. @ Eywa Is it the first time you are playing on a forum ? Did you play IRL mafia ? Or some other kind ? | ||
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On December 17 2012 09:35 kushm4sta wrote: @hapa you got a scum game for me to read? @thrawn are you still without a scum game? Mario Mini Mafia for both. You can find the link in my profile. I was aslo mafia in this one if you are interested. | ||
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On December 17 2012 09:45 thrawn2112 wrote: djo and kush... could both of you comment on eywa? I'm kinda torn. I like Hapa's case against him. Also Eywa has been told that Hapa lynch was not going to happen. I don't see him dropping it nor pushing it more. Bu, regardless of his alignment, he is a newbie here. I think we could agree on that. So I'm really wondering if his scumteam would let him post like this and also go after Hapa (if Hapa is town ofc, but I don't have reasons to doubt that yet). It's possible, but I would expect them to bus him hard now to get the credit, even prepare to bus him from yesterday. I need to take a better look of what happened D1 when I was sleeping. But the scumslip makes me lean on a scum Eywa... | ||
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On December 17 2012 09:55 kushm4sta wrote: Djodref translation: I dont think he's scum but Im willing to vote him anyway. Am I wrong djo? No, I think he is scum but I have some doubts because he does look like he doesn't understand how thing are done around here. So, I wonder if he has a scumteam or not. Also, I couldn't read carefully yesterday shitfest yet (I had to wake up at 5am to be present at the deadline) to check how other people interacted with him. | ||
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On December 17 2012 09:55 kushm4sta wrote: Djodref translation: I dont think he's scum but Im willing to vote him anyway. Am I wrong djo? How do you explain his slip then if you lean town on him ? How could you not see this when you definitively know that mafia is slipping like this (scum kush does at least) ? | ||
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On December 17 2012 10:14 Eywa- wrote: I think the premise of most people's argument about me is that "I don't play like other people on TL".. Who cares... Mafia is Mafia, you don't need meta game or prior knowledge. So you did play on other forums before ? Do you have some links to your games ? | ||
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On December 17 2012 10:19 kushm4sta wrote: @hapa 2, 3 of your case are all about things he didn't do leading up to the lynch. 2 he ignored yoru defense 3 he didn't push his reads enough 4 his prediction of the mislynch and then gloating about how his prediction was right You should keep in mind that the time during which this happened was a chaotic shitstorm spamfest. It was not an ideal environment to discuss things. There was no way his scumpicks were goign to get lynched, so why would you bust his balls over not pushing something that was impossible? That pretty much covers 3 and 4 Day 1 isn't it more likely that scum would just latch on to one of the more popular lynches? Stubbornly tunneling you does not make him scum necessarily. I see town do that all the time. It's not that there's nothing to the case, but it's not even close to 100% certainty, and it doesn't warrant NOPE YOUR SCUM every time he tries to talk to you. Why wouldn't you want more content from him to analyze? @ kush What about his slip ? | ||
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On December 17 2012 11:17 Eywa- wrote: That's no problem, if they disagree with me, they lose. Typically this happens... I don't see why more faith wouldn't be put in the guy who was already proven right... I'm arguing with a couple of people who just lynched a civilian. lol I'll remember this argument for my next scumgame ^^ | ||
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On December 17 2012 11:25 Eywa- wrote: This assumes you can figure out which players are civilians - which you can't. And this is something you, on the opposite, can do right now How did you know that Morbidius was a civilian before he was killed ? Because you are mafia and know who is townie and who is mafia of course ! Same for Hapa, you knew his alignement. Could you tell us who are your scumbuddies please ? Is that kush ? | ||
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On December 17 2012 11:33 kushm4sta wrote: so this is ewyas first forum gameright? and knowing that you actually still think he's scum? I looked at filter and he looks pretty obvtown to me. djo is scum...more tomorrow. hapa or thrawn one of those is prob scum. one of the more quiet lurker people, one of those is probably scum.. I'm thinking dhs maybe jx. @ Kush Right now, I have you as either eywa's scum buddy hard defending him, either you going totally pants on head. I'm leaning over the first solution right now. Please make your case against me so I can see how full of shit you are. | ||
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On December 17 2012 21:31 JieXian wrote: saw that? hapa and mrcc are definitely scumbuddies @ JieXian So, according to you, MrZentor, Hapa ans Cheesecake are the scumteam, right ? And that makes Eywa town... I strongly disagree with you. And I should be town, right ? The problem with your reasoning is that you are making association cases before the flip. If you want to prove that Hapa is scum, you have to make an independent case against him. I want you to show me what is wrong in Hapa's case against eywa. I want you to write a strong case against Hapa. Then you can start to post like you do. If you cannot write your case, it's probably because Hapa is town, as I believe he is, or because yourself is mafia. I'm just asking you to convince me, ok ? | ||
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On December 17 2012 06:05 Blazinghand wrote: Final Vote Count! Morbidius (8) - Drazak, MrZentor, DP, MrCheesecake, DoYouHas, threesr, Hapahauli, kushm4sta threesr (1) - Djodref Mr. Cheesecake (1) - thrawn MrZentor (1) - Morbidius Hapahauli (1) - Eywa- thrawn2112 (1) - Jiexian @ Eywa Morbidius wasn't an "obvious civilian" at all. Even if the 3 church members were voting Morbidius at lynch time, he had minimum 5 civilian town votes against him. DP and threesr were town players by the way. And I cannot let you say that I'm mafia like this. You are so full of shit. Bring a case against me or go die. I'll be Hapa to show everybody how bad your case will be. | ||
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what a lapsus :O | ||
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On December 17 2012 23:39 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: @Djo Curious, who's you're top scummer read apart from Eywa? Have your opinions on the people you made cases on changed at all since the lynch? @ Cheesecake I'll keep this for before the deadline. I have one other strong scum read apart from Eywa. Still wary of Jx and MrZ, but I way more confident on Eywa and the other guy. | ||
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On December 18 2012 00:00 Djodref wrote: @ Cheesecake I'll keep this for before the deadline. I have one other strong scum read apart from Eywa. Still wary of Jx and MrZ, but I way more confident on Eywa and the other guy. By the way, what do you make of thrawn right now ? | ||
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On December 18 2012 00:06 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Oh believe you me, I still think he's scum. My entire case beforehand make sense, and he just calls it bad and never defends or responds to it. Also, he thought I was scum and voted for me D1 but somehow left me out of his scumreads tonight. @ Cheesecake I agree with you that thrawn has been sheeping from time to time. But he was also the first to see JX slip (or scumslip). He also is quite reasonable and is doing stuff here and there, he is quite laid back also, so, yeah, I don't agree with you. But I've been playing with him and also reading him more than you. Did you read the Mario Mini Mafia ? You can read just D1 if you want (lol) The link is in my filter, thrawn was scum with Hapa in this game. The only thing we know about scum thrawn is that he lurks and doesn't engaged himself. Tell me what you think after reading this game, would you ? | ||
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How much are you familiar with Hapa play ? "Town Hapa can't possibly screw up his logic that badly" What logic are you talking about ? I told you that the fact that you are consistent doesn't make you town. Town players don't know about any other players alignment. So it's natural for them to change their minds Because they have no fucking idea who is who... | ||
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On December 18 2012 00:50 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: @Djo Not a fan of meta cases, never have been. His play looks scummy to me, and I don't think you can deny that. He didn't look like he cared who was going to get lynched mid-day and totally forgot he thought I was scum. Yeah, me neither, but you should read this game. At least you can read thrawn's filter. It's not like it's going to take you a long time Could you do this at least and tell me what you make out of it ? For me, the fact that he found Jx scumslip is showing that he is reading the thread carefully. | ||
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On December 18 2012 00:49 JieXian wrote: read my case and don't base your judgement on your philosophy on consistency town hapa was tunneling on hopeless on d1 while jingle and I were dying to swing the vote onto someone else you people have been voting based on 1 thing jx - scumslip morbid - scumslip eywa - scumslip read the dam case I would vote Eywa for the whole case Hapa brought up against him. And, yes, the deciding point for me was the scumslip. Go read NMM XXVIII in my profile and see scum kush getting lynched D1 for a scumslip of this order. What scumslip are you talking about regarding morbidius ? I don't remember this. And your case is weak. I would go as far as saying that it's not even a case. What logic are you talking about ? | ||
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On December 18 2012 00:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: curious who you're suspect of djo, DYH perhaps? lol I already have my case ready. I'll post it after the night action resolution deadline is passed. And then I'll go back to bed This deadline is very shit for me, I was really hoping to get a insta vote rule to "fix it" at my convenience ^^ | ||
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On December 18 2012 00:59 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Okay, can you link it? Check my profile | ||
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On December 18 2012 01:12 JieXian wrote: he's been going back and forth finding ways to accuse me and when people are trying to hard because they're mafia, they make huge mistakes like mrcc and hapa no one else, except kush but I already know that he's an idiot based on his pre game posts and his in game posts. Eywa's "scumslip" was about calling him a townie because it was the concensus wth @ Jx I don't like your explanation for the scumslip. You never call some one town when you have a strong scum read on them, even if it's the consensus. Anyway, Hapa's case against Eywa is not to try-hard, he brings a really good point when showing what could be the mafia motivation for Eywa to tunnel him. It's disruptive to tunnel somebody who is not going to get lynched. Why did Eywa not stop to go after Hapa when it was clear that he was not going to get lynched ? There are other scummers here... Why did Eywa not present a reasonable case against Hapa ? Your job as town is to convince other people that you are right. I don't think that Eywa's behavior speaks for a town Eywa. So, the scumslip here is damning in my view. | ||
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On December 18 2012 01:19 JieXian wrote: think of a strong town player like dp, being careful about his decisions what about hapa? JUPM ON HIM JUMP ON HIM SCUMSLIIIIIIIIIIIP JUMP EVERYONE comparing kush to someone who's able to raise money for a bw tournament and organise things is a huge insult to him. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=387231 please. Why are you misinterpreting the events ? Hapa's case against Eywa has been the most extensive case in this game + Show Spoiler [Hapa's case] + On December 17 2012 07:33 Hapahauli wrote: Eywa- Introduction: One of my weaknesses as a player is catching more active mafia players. I tend to read into activity as genuinity a little too much. When I unvoted Eywa- earlier, it was partially because of that. While he came into the thread, he all of a sudden was actively pushing a case (against myself), and he looked to me like a confirmation-bias spewing townie. However, when you really examine his play from yesterday, that's just simply not the case. If there's one player that was pushing mafia objectives yesterday, it was Eywa-. Table of Contents: 1) Ewya's "Case" 2) Ewya "Addressing" My Defenses 3) Ewya "Pushing" His Case (or, why this is isn't simply him being stupid town) 4) Post-Lynch Anger ***This one is the most damning*** #1: Ewya's "Case" Against me First let's establish the context of Eywa's case. 1) He was absent for most of Day 1 2) When he arrived in the thread, he started bombing suspicion against a player who had no chance of getting lynched (myself). The second point is the most relevant. It's a very common mafia tactic to bomb a third party case to create chaos in the town. It's also very common for mafia to push a player who has no chance of getting lynched, as they can appear to be useful while not doing anything for the town. Now none of this makes him scum alone (yet), however, when you start to look at the content of his cases, it's very very lacking. Basically Eywa's entire point against me is that I've been "bandwagonning." The spoiler below is his compilation of posts on the subject: + Show Spoiler + On December 16 2012 23:30 Eywa- wrote: Hey guys, I haven't been lurking... I just haven't gotten around to reading up until now. After reading I see a lot of people saying weird shit that I couldn't really come into this game expecting to hear, but that is basically just written off as different cultural background or different lifestyles. I really can't make a judgement based on that. So, I will go by the very standard... Goal of the game. Generally speaking, the mafia or in this case, the church will want to be on everyone's good side... Thus jumping from band wagon to band wagon to please the crowd with his/her vote. For this reason, I shall vote for the king of band wagon hopping: ##vote hapahauli If you have any questions about me or anything game related to discuss with me concerning my character, please don't hesitate to ask. On December 17 2012 01:44 Eywa- wrote: Just read up, he's hopped onto about 4-5 different people for no other reason than it seemed to be a good idea based on one previous post or because someone said it was a good idea. On December 17 2012 05:27 Eywa- wrote: Are you done lying?.. How do you expect me not to accuse you especially after you make a case for yourself which is blatant lies. That's 1, 2, 3 non-lurkers (if you count myself which you've jumped on... I can find more, didn't feel like picking through the whole thread. You have yet to jump on a lurker. I don't know why you guys are standing for a townie that is supposedly "helping the town by bringing lurkers to post through accusing them" when that reason is a blatant lie. On December 17 2012 05:34 Eywa- wrote: This has nothing to do with the timing, this has to do with your claim (which is a lie)... YOU said that you called out lurkers with votes so that they'd post... Q: Were they against lurkers? A: No You've never voted against a lurker and your entire I'm innocent because story has just fallen to shreds through your own ignorance of past actions you've committed. Fact: You've jumped from band wagon to band wagon Fact: You lied about a story that would justify the band wagon hopping. Fact: You've directly accused anyone who's ever accused you just because "they have yet to justify why they're not guilty" You're tracking on very thin ice here, you've been pointing fingers all game, I've kept my eye fixed on the game and I've come to one conclusion at every turn. One way for mafia to avoid making analysis is to be obsessed with irrelevant topics. In this case, Eywa- is obssessed with the idea of bandwagonning. Even though bandwagonning has no relevance to one's allignment, he uses it as a talking point over and over again. But more importantly, he's somehow 100% convinced that I'm scum based on this talking point, which is nonsensical. #2: Eywa- "Addressing" My Defense Initially thinking he was a confirmation-bais ladened townie, I took some time to address his accusations. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=386816¤tpage=38#760 Here for example, I made a fairly long and well laid out post for why his accusations were wrong. His replies: Eywa straight-up ignores me. He doesn't even read my defense. He doesn't attempt to analyze it. Instead, he keeps screaming "Hapa is scum" without any substance. A townie would atleast attempt to read my defense. Eywa doesn't - he keeps trying to push his suspicion while avoiding any attempts at analysis. #3: Eywa "Pushing" His Case The problem is that Eywa doesn't push his case against me. He's more concerned about justifying his own vote on me rather than convincing others to vote for his top scumread. For example: Look at all the above posts. He's not trying to get me lynched. He's trying tell everyone "Hey! I have a reason to vote this guy!" The ONLY time he ever attempts to get other people to lynch me is the following: Look at that weak-ass shit. "Please guys, sway your votes." This coming from the guy who is foaming at the mouth that I am scum. #4: Eywa's Post-Lynch Anger Eywa made this post a couple of hours before the deadline... ... which struck me as really odd for it's pessimism. So what does town Eywa- do when he thinks townies are going to the gallows and he's convinced I'm scum? NOTHING! That's right! Nothing! While the town scrambles to put together a lynch at the last minute, this is what he does in the last 25 minutes: He apologizes, half-ass pushes his suspicions against me, and peaces out. Then after doing jack shit about preventing the mislynch, he goes and does this: HERP DERP ALL YOU GUYS SUCK I AM AWESOME 'CAUSE I PREDICTED THIS AND DID NOTHING TO STOP IT. In conclusion, lynch Eywa- tomorrow. He's pushing mafia objectives, he has no case against me, he didn't push said case against me, and his post-lynch anger is the scummiest thing I've seen in this thread. Show me why you thing this case is wrong. | ||
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Never speak about the WitchCraft votes! | ||
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On December 18 2012 02:16 drazak wrote: FFS. You're trying to goddamn kill townies. WHY ARE YOU GOING AGAINST OUR WIN CONDITION SHDFSDNIUFBIUDBVD. Also FFS, if you're town, part of your play is making sure you don't get lynched, because if you get lynched it's a mislynch and it's against your win condition. You just said you support two things against town win condition. I wasn't completely convinced after Hapa's case, but I am now. @ drazak Good to see you here ! Would you mind to post a little more ? Scumreads apart Eywa and stuff like that... | ||
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because you are part of the mafia team, that's the simplest explanation | ||
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Anyway, I'm never going to reveal my votes before the beginnig of D3, and even then I would be reluctant. You are being very stupid talking about this openly because you might endanger the other blues. Think about it and just give up these ideas forever -you guys are going to miss DP and Morbidius votes in the count -mafia is going to lie about there votes and fuck you up -other blues are in danger I'll try to get some sleep. I'll wake up to post a case. | ||
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On December 18 2012 02:30 MrZentor wrote: Yeah, and if scum lie and say they voted for you, we kill you, and you're innocent, then the pool of suspects will have narrowed greatly. I want to kill myself... | ||
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Sorry I couldn't wake up for the deadline, I have to catch up but here is the case I promised | ||
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Kush What a scummer ! My case here boils down to the following main points. Let's have a look at Kush's behavior in this game.
Part I --- Flying away ! On December 15 2012 11:34 Hapahauli wrote: Actually kush, talk to me about that a bit. What about it would you see as scummy? Did Kush ever answered this question ? Not at all... On December 16 2012 13:49 Djodref wrote: @ Kush If you are around, I want you to address my case. I'm really interested in your stance on me right now Did he address my case+ Show Spoiler [My case against Kush] + On December 16 2012 13:32 Djodref wrote: Kushm4sta Kush <3 Kush is notoriously hard to read and an easy mislynch, but they are some things that concerns me in his posts so far. The first thing, of course, is that he is going after me in a very nit-picky way. He is attacking me for one post that he takes totally out of context. That could totally be a scum kush scanning filters to look for something scummy. Let's take a look. Totally taken out of the context here. At least he quotes the whole sentence in the next post, but still failed to note that I was answering to Hapa and DP at that time. I brought it up because it was clear for me at that time that Hapa and DP didn't read the part about the witchcraft votes in the OP. I've explained it already when he posted this. So he totally discards the context of this post one more time. For the pressure thing, it's kind of true, but I have been mislynched in the NMM XIX game for not giving a shit about people going after me for bad reasons. So, yeah, I care more about my defense now. I don't understand were he comes from when saying that my vote on Hapa is a panic vote. That's just bs. The other thing is that Kush has shown an anti-town mentality. Never voting someone, no matter how scummy he looks... Lynching lurkers over scumreads... That's anti-town, but kush is also quite non-sensical, so I'm not sure what to do with that. At least he is consistent with his rule. Oh wait ! he is being called for it and then... WTF ! This lurker issue is very concerning this game. I don't understand how he could not stick to his rule now ! So, all in all, I'm leaning scum on Kush, but it's a weak read because he is could have done these posts as town as well. On December 17 2012 11:44 Djodref wrote: @ Kush Right now, I have you as either eywa's scum buddy hard defending him, either you going totally pants on head. I'm leaning over the first solution right now. Please make your case against me so I can see how full of shit you are. Did he ever make a case against me while stating many times that I was his scumread ? No... And Kush is now officially announcing that he is taking his holidays in the scumQT now that he is totally caught in the same bed with Eywa. On December 17 2012 19:24 kushm4sta wrote: who would use masonry that sounds like total shit compared to the others... guess what. all activity I promised tomorrow is hereby postponed until Tuesday. Sorry. Part II --- Defending Eywa This part works regardless of Eywa alignment, but of course it is going to be even better if Eywa flips scum. How could Kush hard defend Eywa so strongly ? What did Eywa do to convince him that he is town ? I don't know, and kush didn't ever say why he thinks that Eywa is town (the newbie excuse doesn't count in my view). Moreover, kush has already been caught scumslipping like Eywa did in the NMM XXIII game. That was almost exactly the same circumstances. How could have he forgotten it ? He is being a total hypocrite in taking Eywa's defense. I think he is trying to defend a scumbuddy (scum kush is rather obvious) or trying to get town cred by defending a townie in the improbable case where Eywa flips town. Please also notice how he is dismissing Hapa's case to concentrate on the scumslip only. On another note, it's not like his scum read was attacking Eywa with a biased case. Hapa, the "strongest town", in his own words (scumslipping much ?), is pushing a good case against Eywa. How could he be so certain that Eywa is town ? The answer is simple: town kush wouldn't, it's just that we have here scum kush. Scum kush defending scum Eywa, most probably. And I think Kush was also scumslipping here. On December 17 2012 01:51 kushm4sta wrote: That is a scumhunting strategy. He is pressuring people. For that reason you want to lynch the strongest town in this game? There was not a single mention of a possible town Hapa before this post. The previous mention of Hapa in kush's filter is here. On December 16 2012 01:23 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* Hapa... I am concerned with this guy. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think he has a really good feel for dps meta and has caught scum dp many times. But I found his case on dp really underwhelming and reaching. And then he drops the tunnel because of something he read irc...really? *snip* Part III --- Dumb on purpose I don't want to comment these posts in details. Just make yourself your own opinion about it. On December 17 2012 14:32 kushm4sta wrote: Exhibit A: Ewya's alleged scumslip Exhibit B: In which Ewya says im town This is just one of many examples of his use of the word citizen. Ewya says CITIZEN when he means town and TOWNIE when he means player. Remember this is his first forum mafia game. The only experience he has had is IRL mafia. So untrue... On December 16 2012 13:55 kushm4sta wrote: @djodref have you ever made a mega case as town? Why did you feel to make THREE mega cases at this stage in the game? Because I'm town you dumbass... On December 16 2012 11:14 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* 2 of the lurkers look like they are just gonna get straight up replaced - Eywa Mr cheesecake so we probably dont have to worry about them. Morbidus looks like he's starting to participate more now. JieXian has put pressure on Mr Zentor, who actually has virtually no content Threesr might be replaced he is doing so little. If he's not replaced I'm gonna be worried. Mr. Zentor is the scariest lurker for me right now. So when you look at it, the lurker issue really isn't that bad this game. So thrawn, when you say lurkers are making this game "unplayable" that is kinda bs. Lurker issue really isn't that bad this game ? For real ? On December 16 2012 05:48 kushm4sta wrote: Yup that's my rule for this game. kill lurkers before scumreads Ah, nevermind... Conclusion Kush is most certainly scum I still do prefer a Eywa lynch for tomorrow. Because, yeah, kush being kush, there is still a small chance for him to be town. 1% town chance for Eywa right now, 5% town chance for Kush. GG guys, Y u no concede ? | ||
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Doesn't even take time to read a case. Town atmosphere = shit constructive discussion = 0 | ||
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On December 18 2012 08:18 Eywa- wrote: On the contrary, all evidence I've presented has been ignored with false claims being made that I had presented none... Given that you should be voting for yourself (since you ignored both cases I made). Your cases are shit... See the kind of posts I make. I expect even more than that from you right now. Stop shitting the thread and post an extensive case against Cheesecake. | ||
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On December 18 2012 08:33 Eywa- wrote: I've made my case, civilian likely to be voted out today again, good job mafia. ##unvote ##vote eywa- I'm going to eat, later. Present an extensive case please... @ Kush What do you think of him self-voting ? Could you address my case this time please ? | ||
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Your speculation is totally useless and wrong. Cut the crap and start contributing for real. | ||
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On December 18 2012 08:57 MrZentor wrote: Only scum would know whether it's correct or not. Just sayin' That's why you should stop, if you are not scum of course. We have no fucking way of knowing what scum would do or not do. Maybe they are just trolling us. I could totally imagine that right now... | ||
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On December 18 2012 04:10 MrZentor wrote: It's unlikely that he's town. It's unlikely, even if he's town, that scum has another bullet. Also, waiting two hours won't stop him from getting shot if he's blue. If the witch hunter has bullets, it can shoot at any time. This is so wrong. I mean, this conclusion is just so wrong. We have no way to know what scum would do, but I totally disagree with what you find likely or not. Why ? Because Hapa has been looking town all day during day 1. There is no contradiction. | ||
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On December 18 2012 09:57 MrZentor wrote: But if How do we know that a scum won't try t acot like an helpful, active townie? Are you talking about Hapa here ? Because I don't see him pushing a scum agenda. I mean, okay, he could be playing a hell of a scum game. But there are so many players here being sooo scummy. Like Eywa, JieXan, Kush or even you with your attempts to out the blues. Did you read my case again Kush ? Not to mention Drazak or DYH that you don't even know what they are doing in this game. Hapa is alsmost townie by elimination here. | ||
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I'm not here to participate into your shitfest and that makes me scum ? Let me be clear I live in South Korea, most of the discussion here happens at night for me I have another game going on wich requires much attention and time for me I don't want to participate into this kind of discussions I provided some good cases that almost everybody has dismissed or discarded If you think I'm scum, you have to write a case against me. Something I could answer to. I cannot accept to let you throw away 'Djodref is possible scum' or 'Djodref is scum' comments like this. But I'm glad that this shitfest is over, seriously... | ||
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What do you guys think about lynching Kush today ? I didn't get a single comment on my case against him. | ||
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Ikr, but at least I'm making the effort to participate into the two games. Anyway, I would like to discuas this with you in the post game rather than now | ||
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I could totally imagine him or drazak being mafia given their general lack of emotional involment during the shitfest. I need to look at them both, but I would prefer to do it from a computer. Regarding Kush, I don't remember him mentioning finals, but right now I could have him as scum for activity alone. He's really avoiding to answer some questions. I have personal concerns regarding him because he s keeping saying that I'm mafia without backing it up. I would gadly unvote Eywa for Kush if Eywa keeps on contributing like he started to do. | ||
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On December 18 2012 13:34 Hapahauli wrote: Ok sorry that was uncalled for. But please read up on the last few pages and give your comments. Totally uncalled for... It's ok but I would like to mention to you that I've prepared my case against Kush yesterday while I was also talking my way out of a lynch... I didn't wake up to post it on time but the deadline was at fucking 6am here. Not to mention that I have stayed awake until 2am to see the thread going totally pants on head, ready to out the blues and stuff. | ||
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I call everybody out for lurking right now ! Especially MrZentor ! Seriously guys, I live in Korea, you cannot expect me to stay up all night just to see you start to outing the blues. You can check the KST in TL banner, it's now the middle of the afternoon here, so I can start to shit this thread with myself. By first I would like to tell you who I'm going to vote for this round... Not This post was a sarcastic post. I'm not mad to have been called a lurker... Just you have to realize that I'm living on a different timezone. | ||
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Right now, I would lynch Kush over DYH. I really think he has more chances to flip scum than DYH. I really need to see more from DYH and drazak though... | ||
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Kush What a scummer ! My case here boils down to the following main points. Let's have a look at Kush's behavior in this game.
Part I --- Flying away ! On December 15 2012 11:34 Hapahauli wrote: Actually kush, talk to me about that a bit. What about it would you see as scummy? Did Kush ever answered this question ? Not at all... On December 16 2012 13:49 Djodref wrote: @ Kush If you are around, I want you to address my case. I'm really interested in your stance on me right now Did he address my case+ Show Spoiler [My case against Kush] + On December 16 2012 13:32 Djodref wrote: Kushm4sta Kush <3 Kush is notoriously hard to read and an easy mislynch, but they are some things that concerns me in his posts so far. The first thing, of course, is that he is going after me in a very nit-picky way. He is attacking me for one post that he takes totally out of context. That could totally be a scum kush scanning filters to look for something scummy. Let's take a look. Totally taken out of the context here. At least he quotes the whole sentence in the next post, but still failed to note that I was answering to Hapa and DP at that time. I brought it up because it was clear for me at that time that Hapa and DP didn't read the part about the witchcraft votes in the OP. I've explained it already when he posted this. So he totally discards the context of this post one more time. For the pressure thing, it's kind of true, but I have been mislynched in the NMM XIX game for not giving a shit about people going after me for bad reasons. So, yeah, I care more about my defense now. I don't understand were he comes from when saying that my vote on Hapa is a panic vote. That's just bs. The other thing is that Kush has shown an anti-town mentality. Never voting someone, no matter how scummy he looks... Lynching lurkers over scumreads... That's anti-town, but kush is also quite non-sensical, so I'm not sure what to do with that. At least he is consistent with his rule. Oh wait ! he is being called for it and then... WTF ! This lurker issue is very concerning this game. I don't understand how he could not stick to his rule now ! So, all in all, I'm leaning scum on Kush, but it's a weak read because he is could have done these posts as town as well. On December 17 2012 11:44 Djodref wrote: @ Kush Right now, I have you as either eywa's scum buddy hard defending him, either you going totally pants on head. I'm leaning over the first solution right now. Please make your case against me so I can see how full of shit you are. Did he ever make a case against me while stating many times that I was his scumread ? No... And Kush is now officially announcing that he is taking his holidays in the scumQT now that he is totally caught in the same bed with Eywa. On December 17 2012 19:24 kushm4sta wrote: who would use masonry that sounds like total shit compared to the others... guess what. all activity I promised tomorrow is hereby postponed until Tuesday. Sorry. Part II --- Defending Eywa This part works regardless of Eywa alignment, but of course it is going to be even better if Eywa flips scum. How could Kush hard defend Eywa so strongly ? What did Eywa do to convince him that he is town ? I don't know, and kush didn't ever say why he thinks that Eywa is town (the newbie excuse doesn't count in my view). Moreover, kush has already been caught scumslipping like Eywa did in the NMM XXIII game. That was almost exactly the same circumstances. How could have he forgotten it ? He is being a total hypocrite in taking Eywa's defense. I think he is trying to defend a scumbuddy (scum kush is rather obvious) or trying to get town cred by defending a townie in the improbable case where Eywa flips town. Please also notice how he is dismissing Hapa's case to concentrate on the scumslip only. On another note, it's not like his scum read was attacking Eywa with a biased case. Hapa, the "strongest town", in his own words (scumslipping much ?), is pushing a good case against Eywa. How could he be so certain that Eywa is town ? The answer is simple: town kush wouldn't, it's just that we have here scum kush. Scum kush defending scum Eywa, most probably. And I think Kush was also scumslipping here. On December 17 2012 01:51 kushm4sta wrote: That is a scumhunting strategy. He is pressuring people. For that reason you want to lynch the strongest town in this game? There was not a single mention of a possible town Hapa before this post. The previous mention of Hapa in kush's filter is here. On December 16 2012 01:23 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* Hapa... I am concerned with this guy. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think he has a really good feel for dps meta and has caught scum dp many times. But I found his case on dp really underwhelming and reaching. And then he drops the tunnel because of something he read irc...really? *snip* Part III --- Dumb on purpose I don't want to comment these posts in details. Just make yourself your own opinion about it. On December 17 2012 14:32 kushm4sta wrote: Exhibit A: Ewya's alleged scumslip Exhibit B: In which Ewya says im town This is just one of many examples of his use of the word citizen. Ewya says CITIZEN when he means town and TOWNIE when he means player. Remember this is his first forum mafia game. The only experience he has had is IRL mafia. So untrue... On December 16 2012 13:55 kushm4sta wrote: @djodref have you ever made a mega case as town? Why did you feel to make THREE mega cases at this stage in the game? Because I'm town you dumbass... On December 16 2012 11:14 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* 2 of the lurkers look like they are just gonna get straight up replaced - Eywa Mr cheesecake so we probably dont have to worry about them. Morbidus looks like he's starting to participate more now. JieXian has put pressure on Mr Zentor, who actually has virtually no content Threesr might be replaced he is doing so little. If he's not replaced I'm gonna be worried. Mr. Zentor is the scariest lurker for me right now. So when you look at it, the lurker issue really isn't that bad this game. So thrawn, when you say lurkers are making this game "unplayable" that is kinda bs. Lurker issue really isn't that bad this game ? For real ? On December 16 2012 05:48 kushm4sta wrote: Yup that's my rule for this game. kill lurkers before scumreads Ah, nevermind... Conclusion Kush is most certainly scum I still do prefer a Eywa lynch for tomorrow. Because, yeah, kush being kush, there is still a small chance for him to be town. 1% town chance for Eywa right now, 5% town chance for Kush. GG guys, Y u no concede ?[/QUOTE] | ||
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##Unvote ##Vote Kush | ||
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Kush More stuff on Kush, his obsession with lurkers Ok, right now, I really think that Kush is the best lynch for today. I'm pretty sure that he is mafia. I strongly advise you to read his filter before reading this case. The new points I am bringing here are the following
Part I --- Lurker Obsession My point here is that Kush unusual super strong stance on lurkers allows him to avoid contributing to find the mafia. Sure, he is making some comments, and mainly against me, but the majority of his D1 filter is speaking about the lurkers. On December 15 2012 10:27 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* 3. I am going to advocate the systematic extermination of lurkers. Yup I want to lynch unreadable over scumreads. And lurking makes you unreadable and immune to all efforts at scumhunting. Fuck fake pressuring active people.by pretending we might vote them. IF there is a lurker I will push his lynch. His opening post is very aggressive, but he doesn't try to convince people to follow his policy. There is no justification for this aggression. And that's why I think this stance is fake. On December 16 2012 01:23 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* this game is full of lurkers, but I think most of them are going to get modkilled or replaced. I will vote for a lurker who is avoiding modkill, and right now this includes drazak and threesr. The thing about the lurker policy is that you lynch any lurker, especially the ones who are going to be replaced. If a lurky mafia player gets replaced, he has won one day without contributing at all, for free. On December 16 2012 05:48 kushm4sta wrote: Yup that's my rule for this game. kill lurkers before scumreads This statement is clearly showing an anti-town mentality. And it's reinforced by the fact that Kush was looking for lurkers to kill rather than scumreads during D1. Here is a typical contribution from Kush during D1. On December 16 2012 11:14 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* 2 of the lurkers look like they are just gonna get straight up replaced - Eywa Mr cheesecake so we probably dont have to worry about them. Morbidus looks like he's starting to participate more now. JieXian has put pressure on Mr Zentor, who actually has virtually no content Threesr might be replaced he is doing so little. If he's not replaced I'm gonna be worried. Mr. Zentor is the scariest lurker for me right now. So when you look at it, the lurker issue really isn't that bad this game. So thrawn, when you say lurkers are making this game "unplayable" that is kinda bs. Ok, I would understand that we could have enforced a strict "lynch a lurker" policy for this D1, given the participation levels, but my problem with Kush here is that he missed the opportunity to apply his policy on the most perfect target for a lurker lynch: threesr. On December 17 2012 02:50 kushm4sta wrote: we really need a vote count... We only have 3 hours left... people should not be discussing anything but the lynch. Who are teh viable lynches at this point? Is anyone adverse to lynching a lurker? I don't understand why Kush didn't go super mad against threesr. This guy was our lurkiest player by far. Where is the kush that should be spamming the thread to advocate a threesr lynch ? I didn't see him. My conclusion is that Kush's stance on the lurkers this game was fake, and allowed him to avoid contributing in a constructive way. He has not done any sort of scumhunting, but rather has spread suspicion on players for free. Moreover, he has been a while that Kush is not concerned with the "Lynch a Lurker" policy. This is something he has not even mentioned in Chrono Trigger, or the Acme Game. Where he was town. He has nothing to justify this sudden change in his play. Did he have a bad experience with lurkers recently ? I don't think so... | ||
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His stance on Hapa On December 16 2012 01:23 kushm4sta wrote: *snip* Hapa... I am concerned with this guy. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think he has a really good feel for dps meta and has caught scum dp many times. But I found his case on dp really underwhelming and reaching. And then he drops the tunnel because of something he read irc...really? *snip* Note that he doesn't care trying to figure out Hapa's alignment before the following post. No interactions with Hapa. And then, suddenly ! On December 17 2012 01:51 kushm4sta wrote: That is a scumhunting strategy. He is pressuring people. For that reason you want to lynch the strongest town in this game? Let's vote Kush, shall we ? | ||
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Could you guys give us your comments ? | ||
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On December 18 2012 07:32 DoYouHas wrote: Wrong, your case is based on that assumption being true, mine is not. My case is based on you pushing a strategy that would reveal whether hapa is blue or not when he is still potentially in danger of being silver shot. My case is based on acknowledging that you don't know exactly how scum are operating, which you clearly don't, because you want to lynch hapa. How could be MrZ be scum if he doesn't know how the scumteam is operating ? I think there is something wrong in this post. Honestly, I don't clearly understand what is his point against MrZentor here. @ MrZentor Why are you so obsessed with silver bullets ? Could we agree that your speculation was useless now ? | ||
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I'm really interested in your opinion on Kush when you come back and you read my cases. Would you like to lynch him today ? I also recommend you to catch up with the whole thread before posting in the future... | ||
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On December 18 2012 12:11 Eywa- wrote: *snip* Djoref is just... Well let's just say he's given just about everyone a criminal case which proves their guilt... This does not add to his credibility... This does not make him look good, makes him look scum. He's been head hunting for a while. *snip* What I'm doing is called scumhunting. I'm giving criminal cases on the people I'm suspicious of, to gauge their defense, and also to start constructive discussion about them from all the members. The problem here is that nobody commented nor addressed my cases so far. It doesn't make me scum, it should make me town. That's why I was keeping asking you for a "criminal case" against Cheesecake. I've read your cases but I didn't like them because I didn't understand what you were trying to prove. I like lists and concision. So could you make a list with your main points against Cheesecake, please ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 02:34 MrZentor wrote: The difference being that he doesn't post very much even when it's the afternoon at his timezone. Our filters have the same size... And I would go as far as to say that I have better content than you ! How do you want me to post a lot when I have nobody to talk to ? Why are you discrediting me like this ? | ||
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DON'T TALK ABOUT WITCHCRAFT VOTES ! YOU GUYS ARE PISSING ME OFF ! DO YOU WANT ANOTHER DP ? JUST WAIT FOR D2 TO START, IF YOU REALLY WANT TO, OK ? | ||
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lol | ||
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On December 19 2012 08:27 Hapahauli wrote: Uhh we're not talking about votes 'dawg I'm catching up, they went into retard mode again, I wonder if some do that on purpose... | ||
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On December 19 2012 08:29 MrZentor wrote: Hey, scum, I voted for Djo, and I think a lot of other people did too. I'm pretty sure he's blue. If you have another silver bullet, you should shoot him!!! WIFOM | ||
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On December 19 2012 00:25 Eywa- wrote: Fact: Every person I voted to give witchcraft powers are now dead towns people.  I voted DarthPunk, Morbidius and Thrawn. On December 19 2012 00:28 JieXian wrote: i gave to dp and morbid. 1 guy is still alive This game ! And I don't think both of them are mafia here... | ||
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On December 19 2012 08:30 Hapahauli wrote: Oh I need to read that Kush case of yours. Not sure why I haven't yet. How did you make this comment then ? On December 19 2012 04:40 Hapahauli wrote: More Regarding Djo There are a lot of things in his cases that read townie to me. For example, him really looking for specific Kush comments seems town motivated. Most scum aren't going to read into the game that carefully (no real motivation to do so beyond pushing the occasional mislynch). I also came away from his first argument with me (early D1) with him being town. We argued over a misunderstanding about the game-rules, and as soon as he understood that I misread something, he immediately backed off. That's something that strikes me as really townie - not taking an argument further than it needs to go. *snip* | ||
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On December 19 2012 08:40 Eywa- wrote: Now you guys are just being silly... Put up your votes for cheesecake. ##unvote ##vote Mr.Cheesecake @ Eywa Honestly, I didn't look into Cheese so much right now. If I promise you an analysis of his play, could you please give me an analysis of kush play ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 08:33 MrZentor wrote: Scum, why would he be so afraid of people revealing their witchcraft votes if he wasn't a blue? He has to be a blue himself. That's the only explanation. KILL HIM How about you comment on my cases againt Kush ? | ||
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CheeseCake It's time for me to break the "don't give townreads rule". But still you guys shouldn't talk about witchcraft votes. I'm leaning town on CheeseCake right now. I didn't like his case against thrawn because it was missing the fact that thrawn was the first to vote JieXan. I also didn't like that he didn't want to consider thrawn meta to back off. And I think he didn't push thrawn so much, he failed to bring some new elements against thrawn. But all of this can be explained by his current lack of time to play this game. And I'm sure that he isn't lying about his lack of time. His excuse is legit. What if he is mafia with a legit excuse ? Well, I would like you to consider the following posts On December 18 2012 01:28 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: But let's think about it if I'm scum. I could push Thrawn, who I know is town, to the very end. We lynch morb anyway. I'm in the clear and can flame about how everyone is an idiot for lynching him. Town motiv for sheeping onto Morb: He might be scum, i don't want to no-lynch. Keeping my vote on thrawn = useless. Mafia motiv for sheeping onto morb: None, Morb had a decent chance of getting lynched regardless. My vote would literally only be bad for myself. I really like this post. And his move on Morb was pro-town. Because if Morb was still here today, maybe we would try to lynch him again, missing an opportunity to lynch real mafia... You cannot blame him for that. I also like this post + Show Spoiler [Chesse fighting stupidity] + On December 18 2012 10:14 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Basically, Hapa, people were trying to tell me that there was 100% chance that the witchhunter shot you. I was blowing up at people, saying that we didn't know that for sure. I was pretty frustrated because people were saying it was 100% totes mafia witchhunter shot you. I didn't like it. I just gave up and said "HERE'S WHO I VOTED FOR OMG" and left for work shortly thereafter. People were going full retard by speculating about the fact that Hapa should be dead already. We are never going to know who voted for who exactly (because dead people + mafia player interferences) and we don't know what the fuck the mafia is planning. And CC jumped into the thread to fight stupidity. For me, it shows a genuine interest about this game. Also it might have helped people to stop this bullshit and start to contribute in a constructive way. Lately, I didn't like him flaming with Eywa, but they are both responsible. So, all in all, I'm leaning slightly town on CC, and I don't want to consider him for a lynch today. Eywa, I'm open for discussion about this subject. Please show me where you think I wrong. If you really think that CC is mafia, please make a small list of your main points against him. And now, please consider Kush for today. | ||
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drazak DYH CheeseCake MrZentor + Show Spoiler + This post is sarcastic + Show Spoiler + But still, I want to hear more from the first three players + Show Spoiler + And I want MrZentor to comment on my Kush case | ||
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Among these three, I would say that Kush is the most likely to flip scum. I'm totally up to lynch him today and I'm getting tired that Jx, MrZ and Eywa are dismissing my cases. I feel like DYH is the less likely to flip scum. I really want to hear more from him. And on somebody else than MrZ... Regarding drazark, I was null on him so far. I'll come back to you after reading his filter one more time. | ||
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I might have been fooled because he was trying to get people to shut the fuck up about the witchcraft votes and the "silver bullet" speculation. I liked this part, and he really looked genuine while doing it. But, yeah, that doesn't make you town. I need to reconsider CC as well now... I disagree with you regarding Jx, I didn't like at all the fact that he brought up the witchcraft votes again. And I don't like his tunnels. And the fact that he totally dismissed to comment on my cases against Kush when I specifically asked him. Regarding MrZentor, I would like to lynch him for his behavior alone. This guy is seriously pissed me off. But we have to lynch scum, don't we ? I've read his past games and he looks like he could be town. The problem is that his play his easy to emulate. | ||
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On December 19 2012 11:03 kushm4sta wrote: I have a reason for hating lurkers. It's because I obsed a game on ms where scum won the game by straight up lurkrng. They were doing a lurk strat and there was literally nothing town could do to catch them. My lack of scumhunting, yeah but that's not because I don't have ideas. I could write a good case against djodreff I know that. Just no time. Yeah I have a few minutes now but not enough to read through his filter and compose something convincing. I am on a cell phone and its hard. Oh and djo keep making those large text announcements it totally makes you looks town bro. Also to the people saying either me or djo is town, just for future reference I always bus as scum, so we could definitely both be scum. :p @ Kush You cannot write your case against me because I'm town. And you failed to write your case against me until now. Anyway, I'm not getting lynched today, so why don't you write a case against someone else ? | ||
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So yeah, they are less likely to be scum than Kush, Drazak, DYH and CC. Right now, my scum team would be Kush and Drazak and one other guy. But Kush is definitively scum | ||
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On December 19 2012 11:20 MrZentor wrote: I feel as if my play is being greatly misrepresented. @ Mr Zentor How can I get you to comment on Kush ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 11:34 MrZentor wrote: Give me 18 hours. And then I *might* do it. Are you saying that you are going to disappear to come back just before the lynch ? Why are you avoiding to comment on Kush ? Who would you lynch if you had to choose right now ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 12:04 Hapahauli wrote: Either works fine for me really. Kush though has the chance of being active and proving us wrong (doubt it, but possible). DYH is just going to lurk no matter what. Yeah, but right now, for me, it would be a lurker lynch. And I think that he is really less likely to flip scum than Kush or even Drazak. I mean, he has at least tried to scumhunt, and I understand that you could consider MrZ to be scum, I have some doubts myself. And I don't like at the fact that MrZentor refuses to comment on Kush and drops his vote on DYH in a OMGUS way. I would like to give him a chance to participate more. | ||
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Who would be your scumteam right now ? | ||
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@ MrZentor Show me in your filter your case against DYH. And if you are here, I want you to comment on Kush !!!! | ||
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On December 19 2012 12:51 Eywa- wrote: If I revealed, there'd be a lesser chance of killing Cheesecake. Do you have time to discuss about Cheesecake now ? Can you make me a list with your strongest points again him ? What didn't you like in my post and Hapa's post on CC ? | ||
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Dear Eywa, Believe me or not, but I'm town. If you are town, you are going to need my vote against CC, if you are really certain that he is scum, so your job should be to convince me that he is indeed scum. I've explained why I thought he was town, althought I'm not totally sure of it. I'm open to discuss anything. On the other hand, I do believe that Kush is scum, and I think that I've provided good points to show it. So I would like to discuss a Kush lynch with you. See, I have town interest in mind. Could we discuss for real now ? | ||
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Yeah, I'm totally up ! 2.30 pm here... Just some questions for you Did you have time to read thrawn filter in Mario Mini ? What were you expecting to achieve by revealing your WC votes ? | ||
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And who is today best lynch in your opinion ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 14:39 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Shit, Eywa if I could. I'll totes sheep your Kush thing going on, blatantly too. I'd say mr.Z over DYH personally. As for best? Impossible to tell. I don't think Eywa is scum. It's not necessarily a good argument but I don't see a first time scum player do this. How did you feel like the first time to play scum ? For me, I was not comfortable posting the first time, at least not the first day. Even if it is was part of a scumteam strategy, I don't know how his team mates could have thought to send the newb go head-on against Hapa would be a good idea. And, yeah, his behavior is quite anti-town, and he slipped hardcore, but he looks also genuine and honest, and shows true passion Also he has made some efforts lately. I would like your own comments on Kush, please... | ||
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On December 19 2012 14:50 drazak wrote: TBH. You hapa, and eywa still. I didn't like how defensive and angry you were getting, and there were numerous cases made on eywa (some of which got dropped for little reason) Yeah, there is still the case where Hapa and Eywa are in the same scumteam and decided to give us an act and to shit up the thread to oblivion. But I think it's too far-strechted and also why would they have stopped ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 14:58 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Kush... He's Kush. Dat hard defense, dat no scumhunting, dat Kush. I can't really say anything that hasn't already been said. I'm pretty clueless right now tbh--Haven't invested enough time into this game. No shame in admitting that. I'm probably just going to sheep most of the game. inb4 "omg scummy" What do you mean by "He' Kush" ? You think that he could behave like this as town ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 15:06 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Anything is possible. He does have a reputation to uphold. Ok, well... What do you think of my argument for a town Eywa ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 15:23 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: "Too scummy to be scum" I hate that argument. It's not "too scummy to be scum", it's that it is not likely that the scumteam decided that it would be a good idea to suicide him on Hapa (if you think that Eywa is scum and Hapa is town). And, even in this case, Eywa would be really doing it like a boss, way too good for a first time scummer imo... For me, I'm not sure that he is town, but he looks so honest and passionate that it's difficult for me to believe that he is mafia. Why did you twist my argument ? | ||
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How can I convince you to switch your vote to Kush ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 15:34 Hapahauli wrote: We have a day to go, and I want to see Kush get in here and give some responses. Even though I think Kush is scum, I can still see scenarios in which he flips town. This is not the case for DYH. Could you expand on this please ? | ||
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He shouldn't have tried to go after me, I'm not an easy mislynch anymore, like in NMM XXIX ! I'm also peacing out I have RL stuff to do. I'll try to stay up tonight... | ||
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Fact: DP, which is confirmed town because dead, proposed a strategy to note vote for the possible strongest town players Fact: I used this strategy because I found it reasonable, because you spread the risks, ie you don't lose a good player and a blue... Speculation: Some other people may also have followed this strategy, we don't know Conclusion: we have no way of knowing anything, and this discussion could endanger the blues -> Comments on Kush and DYH please | ||
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Are you around ? Could you address my cases against you and also Hapa's case ? How about you write your case against me ? | ||
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On December 20 2012 02:24 JieXian wrote: Not true, because DP got shot anyways. People did not take his advice. How the fuck do you know ? I'm just telling you that I took his advice. I didn't vote for the strongest possible town, that is Hapa. DP is good, but not as strong as Hapa imho... | ||
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You have failed to bring a case with Hapa. If you have a good case, I could accept your speculation as the icing on the cake. Anyway, Hapa is not getting lynched today, so we have limited time to discuss this, because there is no consolidation on the lynch right. That's why I really need your comments on DYH, CC and Kush... | ||
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On December 20 2012 02:34 Eywa- wrote: Mr.Cheesecake is my lynch, I will not compromise. Even if it risks a no-lynch ? I would like to lynch Kush today, then DYH and then maybe maybe maybe CC | ||
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Drazak totally refusing to scumhunt, and lurking like a boss | ||
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What about you give me your stance on Kush ? It's not like you have been avoiding to answer this question forever... | ||
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Here is the summary of the points against DYH. I would like to remind you that the cases against Kush are far better Especially mines ^^ Anyway...
@ Eywa Could you do the same thing for CC ? It took me like 5 minutes | ||
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On December 20 2012 02:55 JieXian wrote: I call SCUMPSLIP Blew, half of the players have been doing 'scumslips' at this point of the game... Even you did But, please, enlighten me ^^ | ||
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I'm trying to reason him... | ||
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On December 20 2012 03:05 JieXian wrote: lol wasn't for you you're bee nplaying super clean just like dyh I know it wasn't for me. What were you talking about ? And how is my play clean ? Can you give me examples ? Is that really the feeling you get when you read my filter ? | ||
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On December 20 2012 03:12 JieXian wrote: ok it's 2 am and I'm feeling really sleepy and this really sucks will try to wake up in time for lynch Zentor what happened to the hapa blue shot arguement. djo you basically called it speculation, which is a euphemism for "stupid nonsense No, speculation is speculation. I called it stupid before but this thread had enough flaming already. But when speculation points toward conclusions that is really likely to be wrong (ie, Hapa is scum), it means that the assumptions you are making are wrong. If you are seriously believing that Hapa is scum, please present me a short list of arguments supporting this theory. Could you do that for me ? | ||
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It's time to consolidate, because town is going pants on head once again. I'm voting DYH for the reasons given in my list above... ##Unvote ##Vote DYH | ||
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On December 20 2012 03:10 JieXian wrote: I haven't found many mistakes or contradictions or incoherence in your filter, you haven't been angry at all I even voted for you etc etc Did you really read carefully my filter before making this comment ? I can think of some mistakes on the top of my head. You guys are seriously pissing me off with your speculation and refusing to discuss Kush at all. And you are being totally stupid when you publicly reveal your witchcraft votes. And there is almost no constructive discussion in this thread. | ||
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On December 20 2012 03:34 MrZentor wrote: You're town, and if you leave your vote on CC, you're assisting scum. (Regardless of whether CC is scum or not, you leaving your vote on him still helps scum.) This is exactly what Kush is doing by the way... | ||
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On December 20 2012 03:35 Eywa- wrote: Djodref, Mr.Cheesecake, Hapahauli Who's assisting these guys? I'm done talking to you... | ||
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On December 20 2012 03:35 Eywa- wrote: Djodref, Mr.Cheesecake, Hapahauli Who's assisting these guys? Let's play a game Kush, DYH, Drazak I reserve the right to call you a total moron at the end of this game if I have more scum than you in my list | ||
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He clearly doesn't give a fuck of this game, just read his latest comments and tell me that he is not mafia. Just go read the last page of his filter. I'm very worried right now because both Kush and drazak are not here, so maybe mafia doesn't need any interference for today. Maybe both CC and DYH are a mislynch. Can we just lynch Kush ? DYH is the guy I'm the least sure to be mafia in my tentative scumteam... | ||
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On December 20 2012 03:50 Eywa- wrote: Assume you're right, wouldn't they vote for Mr.Cheesecake? That'd make 5. And then we just lynch them one by one in the following days ? All of them have no fucking reason to lynch CC. | ||
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On December 20 2012 04:02 kushm4sta wrote: the fuck? im here and i'm playing, despite you guys making it as hard as possible with all your fucking spam. None of my post are irrelevant today. 1 defended cheesecake, 1 told you when you could expect more activity from me. TOWN, look at djo. Look how indecisive he's being with today's vote. shit like--Hmm ill vote for this guy but I really wanna lynch this guy. Djo pick who you want to vote and VOTE for them instead of wishy washing all over the place. I'm not indecisive at all. I want to lynch you, and almost everybody is fucking ignoring me here.. Your defense of CC was a very weird post to prove that someone is town. The arguments you are giving are bad and I have to admit that it was kind of relevant... And yeah, I'm getting behind a DYH lynch because we need consolidation. And, I've stated earlier, I believe that he could be mafia. I even gave my reasons to vote him, so cut the crap... | ||
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On December 20 2012 04:12 Eywa- wrote: This is where you went wrong. I don't think you have a case. Va te faire foutre ! Tu es la pire merde avec laquelle j'ai jamais jouee... | ||
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I'm going to take a short nap before the deadline.. | ||
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In fact, I'm two times happy right now ^^ I need to catch up and reassess my reads (especially Kush) but I'm going to take a plane back to France tomorrow and I didn't prepare anything so far so I'm not going to have much time to spare, I'll try to come up with something before the deadline though... @ Eywa Djodref - 1 Eywa - 0 Could you start to be reasonable now ? @ Kush I'm still waiting for your case. But please remember that you always read me wrong. | ||
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I'm not totally sold on a town Kush yet, because he hasn't be insta shot when he revealed, because he is filter is really scummy and also because nothing prevents mafia from being elected to the WC votes. And they would know that DYH would be a green check. But that would be very very ballsy to play like this. I also have to admit that the fact that kush was reasonable and finally lynched DYH is speaking in his favor. I'm not dropping Kush, but I don't think that we should lynch him tomorrow. | ||
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The way DYH was tunneling MrZentor was typical of the bad tunneling scum are faking against townies. I mean, MrZentor could be DYH scum partner, but the cases against him would have been better in that case I guess. Hapa and MrZentor have also been the main supports for DYH lynch. And he wasn't getting much attention before Hapa's posts painting him as scum. Does anyone object this ? | ||
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On December 20 2012 06:43 Keirathi wrote: Vote Count! DoYouHas (5) - Hapahauli, MrZentor, Mr. Cheesecake,Djodref, kush MrZentor (2) - DoYouHas. Eywa- Mr. Cheesecake (1) - JieXian Not Voting (1) - Drazak *snip* Here is my current view on what happened during the lynch. Comments please ! I have CC as town right now because I doubt that we had two mafia players as lynch candidates for today. He was also pushed hardcore by JieXan and Eywa. And he is scumhunting. | ||
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On December 20 2012 11:25 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: What do you make of Eywa Djo He could be scum, and I wouldn't mind to lynch him for his behavior alone. But, in my opinion, he has less chances to flip scum than Jx or Drazak. And again, I doubt that his scumteam would let him play like this. I hope that he changes his behavior so he starts to contribute for real. I won't let him pull off this anti-town play thrice. I'm very interested to know what are his views of what happened during the lynch right now. | ||
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On December 20 2012 11:33 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: [/red]Do you think it's likely that DYH would bus his scumbuddy so early? He was only the third on him. Truth be told, he did hop off his wagon quickly for the morb lynch. It was still early in the day, giving Jx a lot of time to talk himself out of his lynch. Or try to switch the lynch onto a lurker. And if Jx made a scumslip, DYH would have looked good after his lynch. Being the Priest, he could have lurked his way into this game. I don't see why it would innocent Jx. Jx tried to derail DYH into MrZentor, that DYH was aslo tunneling. And Jx has been strangely obsessed with Hapa today, and kept speculating again and again and again. So, yeah, I have Jx as scum way before Eywa... | ||
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You can find a compilation of Jx posts trying to derail the lynch of DYH, either by trying to talk MrZ out of it, either by voting MrZentor. + Show Spoiler [Jx posts to try to save DYH] + Here is tried to get Kush on his side, and he finally tries to vote MrZentor (?!) with the worst reason ever... On December 20 2012 06:49 JieXian wrote: #unvote ##Vote MrZentor I had you as townish but I'm not sure of your alignment after all that crap but if djo hapa and mrcc have their votes on someone like that I can be sure it's town. hapa it's 5.49 am here where do you think I was That makes at least 4 mafia in this game, with most of them being really looking townies, even before DYH flips. And before that we had On December 20 2012 02:55 JieXian wrote: I call SCUMPSLIP To try to get people vote you I guess. And also look how he tries to talk MrZentor out of DYH lynch... On December 20 2012 03:12 JieXian wrote: ok it's 2 am and I'm feeling really sleepy and this really sucks will try to wake up in time for lynch Zentor what happened to the hapa blue shot arguement. djo you basically called it speculation, which is a euphemism for "stupid nonsense On December 20 2012 02:53 JieXian wrote: wth ? he thought I was scum and let go and he still thinks eywa is scum | ||
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The good thing is that the more I'm arguing with you, the more I think that Jx is scum | ||
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On December 20 2012 11:29 Djodref wrote: Here is my current view on what happened during the lynch. Comments please ! I have CC as town right now because I doubt that we had two mafia players as lynch candidates for today. He was also pushed hardcore by JieXan and Eywa. And he is scumhunting. @ Eywa and Kush or anybody I want you to do the same thing I did, ok ? Take your pencils and draw me a nice picture | ||
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On December 20 2012 12:07 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: We're arguing? O.o mmm, I guess the meaning is different in French and in English then. I meant than we are discussing bout Eywa and Jx alignment, and who is most likely to be scum among the two of them, if not the two of them. Does it sound better ? | ||
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On December 20 2012 12:12 kushm4sta wrote: How can anyone think this??? Drazak is just a big unknown pretty much to me. Calm the fuck down, Kush, I've just changed my mind. I posted this before checking again what happened before the DYH lynch. By the way, do you really have no breadcrumbs ? Is there any posts showing that you a blue mentality, or that you had a green check on DYH ? | ||
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On December 20 2012 12:27 kushm4sta wrote: why aren't you answering my question tho djo... how can your biggest scumread be of an unreadable lurker? He is not unreadable. He has done zero scumhunting, and he has clearly shown very little interest in this game, very similar to DYH play in fact. And, if we proceed by elimination, he has more chances to flip scum than other players in this game, at the exception of JieXan. By the way, I didn't say he was my top scumread, I've said that he had the most chances to flip scum at that moment, and it was before checking JieXan's filter... Please also answer my questions. You have been avoiding too many questions addressed to you in this game, Kush. What do you make of Jx right now ? Could you show me any post where you hint that you were blue, or that you had a green check on DYH ? | ||
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On December 20 2012 12:36 kushm4sta wrote: ::crickets:: i swear to god, every time i go back to this thread I read some new scummy thing djodreff has posted Oh, yeah, and then everytime I'm addressing your comments, ask you some questions back and you disappear. | ||
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I want him to show me, hopefully he has post other clues in his filter... | ||
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On December 20 2012 12:48 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: DP won witchcraft... Kush won witchcraft... Who was the third? Thrawn I guess | ||
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JieXian I'll tunnel and then I'll tunnel, but I'm also going to back it up with some speculation Intro I'm glad to introduce you my new case against JieXian. I'm going to present you the following points which are proving that JieXian is scum.
Part I --- His OP with le scumslip I'd like to remind you here my previous case against JieXian. I've updated it a little, but it is still standing. + Show Spoiler [Jiexian's scumslip] + JieXan Here is how he entered the thread casually spreading suspicion over Hapa and DP. On December 15 2012 14:47 JieXian wrote: Hi and sorry I'm late, I'm at +8GMT and I didn't wake up as early as DarthPunk At first I was really confused (scummy read) about hapa's mindless babbling about 13-3, which ISN'T RELEVANT to anything at all because you can't change anything except stir the discussion towards the wrong direction. Later I got a stronger read from DP from his ridiculous "pressuring" above all for a point that's completely moot But above all there's Mr Zentor's relative non-chalance to everything seems to trump everything else as doesn't seem to give a damn to anything as townies are well on their way to lynching one another ##Vote MrZentor His point against Hapa is not so bad, but it's kind of nit picky. I'll pass him this one because I was really startled when Hapa brought it. On the other hand, his points against DP and Zentor are bad. Regarding DP, in the early game, you have to pressure people for some trivia, and pressuring people is more a townie behavior than a mafia behavior, even if it's not totally true for DP. The main point here is that he calls them townies in the same post. That's just a scumslip. because this refers to Hapa and DP. So he enters the thread by spreading suspicion on them but calling them townies when he votes finally MrZ. So either he has a townread on them, in this case the first suspicions and points against them are totally useless and unwarranted for, either he is a mafia player that knows their alignment. Let's take a look at the rest of his filter to decide what is more likely. On December 16 2012 01:06 JieXian wrote: I was out the whole day man relax. You guys didn't understand my post. I found what Dp and hapa was saying to be weird BUT I changed my mind as I kept on reading the thread (notice how those 2 points were quite early on) Based on MrZentor's "uselessness" as you guys termed it, my meta read on him shows that he's acting differently but most of all, if he were scum, he'd have nothing else to do but sit and watch because dp and hapa were in the spotlight and not take any blame. Meaning he doesn't need to participate and make/risk any reads. I mean take a look at everyone else that's posting, they are all reads (be it weak or strong or sheep reads) He doesn't really comment on the fact that he called them townies. And now he said that they were saying weird things, and not scummy things. Some additional comments: JieXian didn't state at all that he had town reads on DP and Hapa in the first post. If he had town reads, why not explaining his townreads first, and then counterbalancing them with the small things he found suspicious ? Also why enter the thread by giving town reads ? The answer is that this post was meant to spread suspicion on DP and Hapa. The problem (for JX), is the scumslip. Please also not the vote for MrZentor for a very weak reason, and that MrZentor has also been pushed by DYH. Part II --- Cheese's Tunnel Here are the reasons I could find which JieXian presented to support his idea of a scum Cheese.
The fact that Cheese didn't want to risk a no-lynch to follow a vote on thrawn which made little sense from JieXian's perspective is perfectly acceptable and is quite pro-town. I'm not going to explain here why no-lynches are bad for town, at the exception of MYLO situation, but we can develop this point in the post game if you want. And yet, JieXian proceeded to clutter the thread forcefully with his obsession of Cheese, avoiding constructive discussion on the subject. He dismissed any argument that we presented supporting a town Cheese: Hapa, Kush and me have made some posts in CC's favor and we got no comment on them. Just some "lol, you are scum with CC" type of comments. He didn't want to discuss the fact that preventing a no-lynch is rather pro-town than anti-town. Here is the case which allowed JieXian to call scum all game. Do I need to remind you that Cheese was DYH's contender for the lynch ? JieXian was pushing his scum agenda here. + Show Spoiler [JieXan's case] + On December 18 2012 00:47 JieXian wrote: Mrcc care to explain all that? Makes a case on thrawn -> drops it -> I push it -> claims he's not talking to me -> said he'd lynch thrawn -> calls him a random ass person HELLO? Pretty weak to call someone scum during all game... Part III --- Hapa's Tunnel I'm not sure if I really understood the reasons that JieXian presented to support his idea of a scum Hapa.
First of all, it was obvious that Hapa's lynch was not going to happen. But by cluttering the thread, barking that Hapa was scum, JieXian is achieving the following objectives. He disrupts the thread and creates a bad atmosphere in the town, while discrediting the strongest town player of this game. He also diverts the attention from DYH's lynch which was gaining some momentum. Please also note, that once again, he's avoiding constructive discussion on Hapa. On December 20 2012 03:20 Djodref wrote: No, speculation is speculation. I called it stupid before but this thread had enough flaming already. But when speculation points toward conclusions that is really likely to be wrong (ie, Hapa is scum), it means that the assumptions you are making are wrong. If you are seriously believing that Hapa is scum, please present me a short list of arguments supporting this theory. Could you do that for me ? Guess what, I've never got this short list of arguments. Nor a proper case against Hapa. And he could never admit that his speculation was certainly bad. Like, Hapa has been voted blue because DP was ! Him being so obsessed with this leads me to think that he is the Witch Hunter and that he has maybe tried to shoot DP and Hapa at the beginning of N1. The speculation achieves two objectives: making townies doubting Hapa and encouraging them to talk about their votes, if the mafia team has still a bullet. It is soft-bluehunting, if you want... Part IV --- Lynch Derailments Morbidius Lynch I think that JieXian was trying to provoke a no-lynch when he provoked MrCC into voting thrawn. Please note that JieXian has no fucking reason to vote thrawn at that point. What kind of town player would do that ? DYH Lynch One thing I like in JieXian's filter is this post, because he is basically claiming mafia here On December 20 2012 06:49 JieXian wrote: #unvote ##Vote MrZentor I had you as townish but I'm not sure of your alignment after all that crap but if djo hapa and mrcc have their votes on someone like that I can be sure it's town. hapa it's 5.49 am here where do you think I was Let's try to switch the DYH lynch on the guy I have as townish, and not the three other guys which I have as mafia. I'm going to develop on JieXian's attempt to derail DYH lynch in the following part. Part V --- Association with DYH I don't think that I have to mention again that JieXian forcefully tried to get DYH out of the lynch. But, on top of that we have all this posts where JieXian is defending DYH. + Show Spoiler [Jx posts to try to save DYH] + Here is tried to get Kush on his side, and he finally tries to vote MrZentor (?!) with the worst reason ever... On December 20 2012 06:49 JieXian wrote: #unvote ##Vote MrZentor I had you as townish but I'm not sure of your alignment after all that crap but if djo hapa and mrcc have their votes on someone like that I can be sure it's town. hapa it's 5.49 am here where do you think I was That makes at least 4 mafia in this game, with most of them being really looking townies, even before DYH flips. And before that we had On December 20 2012 02:55 JieXian wrote: I call SCUMPSLIP To try to get people vote you I guess. And also look how he tries to talk MrZentor out of DYH lynch... On December 20 2012 03:12 JieXian wrote: ok it's 2 am and I'm feeling really sleepy and this really sucks will try to wake up in time for lynch Zentor what happened to the hapa blue shot arguement. djo you basically called it speculation, which is a euphemism for "stupid nonsense On December 20 2012 02:53 JieXian wrote: wth ? he thought I was scum and let go and he still thinks eywa is scum I also found this one, which I really like On December 20 2012 03:00 Djodref wrote: @ JieXan Here is the summary of the points against DYH. I would like to remind you that the cases against Kush are far better Especially mines ^^ Anyway...
And here comes JieXian answer ^^ On December 20 2012 03:05 JieXian wrote: lol wasn't for you you're bee nplaying super clean just like dyh No you ! Conclusion JieXian is Scum ! We have to lynch him tomorrow ! | ||
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I have thought of some other points to bring against him but I would like to see if anyone is going to mention them or not A lot of these points are also valid against Eywa, but Eywa did lynch DYH at the end, and there is less occurrences where he defends him. Please refer to the discussion between Hapa and him when they start to discuss Eywa's reads. + Show Spoiler [for reference] + On December 18 2012 12:11 Eywa- wrote: I think DoYouHas has taken a far too impersonal approach to the game so far... He hasn't really seemed to care what has gone on and generally has just sponged off other people, really doesn't make sense to call him mafia. Also, when attacked he hasn't fled Jie Xian is all over the place without having changed personalities, normally when a mafia member realizes that what he is doing is suspicious, he slowly adapts. The mistakes which you may think Jie Xian makes, he's been making all game, it's not from pressure or anything because while under pressure and not, he's the same. Kush's lurking is suspect because of how he approaches it, he'll take on scenarios up till he's the topic of conversation at which point he's gone till the conversation turns again. He's just awkward and doesn't feel quite right. Also, his first vote antics were odd to say the least If MrV is scum, he's ridiculously good, because I see no traces of scum whatsoever. He's been over the fire while still not changing at all similarly to Jie Xian, which in itself isn't definitive, however, when others have, it's hard to count these guys as real threats. CharlieChaplain is just scummy, he doesn't answer questions about himself and has only ever targeted civilians. Sure, he's under a lot of stress, but stress doesn't translate into not being able to answer one simple question. His slip ups are numerous. Draskal is that lurker which literally never posts anything insightful... There's no way to tell either way what he is, so it's best to leave him since if we get one wrong, we're in hot water. Djoref is just... Well let's just say he's given just about everyone a criminal case which proves their guilt... This does not add to his credibility... This does not make him look good, makes him look scum. He's been head hunting for a while. You've been my target from the start, ever since I read your first day posts, your slip ups have been many, I don't believe you to be innocent. | ||
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My activity is going to drop very soon because I don't see my family and my friends in France often so they are going to resent it if I spend too much time in front of my computer. Also I don't have an internet phone back home. Be sure that I'm going to cast my vote against JieXian tomorrow before taking my plane, if I'm still alive | ||
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On December 21 2012 01:53 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: I'm 100% certain that either JX or Eywa is scum. If JX somehow flips green, Eywa is totally flipping red. Don't think we'll have a problem here, will totally support a JX lynch tomorrow. However, if Eywa ends up being the scum, I'm putting you as his scumbuddy over Drazak WTF ? What is your rationale for that ? Me being scum with Eywa ? You are insulting me here MrCheese What do you think of the two of them being the scumteam ? I don't like how they suddenly became silent when they usually produce much garbage around that time... | ||
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On December 21 2012 01:53 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: I'm 100% certain that either JX or Eywa is scum. If JX somehow flips green, Eywa is totally flipping red. Don't think we'll have a problem here, will totally support a JX lynch tomorrow. However, if Eywa ends up being the scum, I'm putting you as his scumbuddy over Drazak In fact, I think that you have to explain me your whole reasoning for all theses hypothesis. I don't understand where you are coming from here. | ||
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On December 21 2012 02:33 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Woa there buddy, calm yourself. Don't get all defensive. You only voted DYH because you had to. You're still less of a suspect than either of those guys. You want Drazak/JX dead apparently, and seem to defend Eywa. So does Hapa, actually, but Eywa + you would make at least a little sense. We're going to lynch JX so we'll see how that goes mmkay? In fact, we still have plenty of time, and hopefully drazak is going to get modkilled. I'm very interested to see what Eywa and JieXian are coming to come up with this night and also tomorrow. And I'm to decide then who is going to be lynched among them. So I'm not going to be totally rigid on who we should lynch. But, if I had to do it right now, it would be in that order: JieXan first, Drazak second and then Eywa/Kush. And yeah, sorry, but I hate the idea to be associated with Eywa... | ||
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I'm not very proud of what I did yesterday, and I would like to present my excuses again. If you are town of course If you are scum, I'll just lynch you. Anyway, did you realize that there is almost one full page of cases against Kush on page 73 ? Do you realize the time I've spent to make these posts ? I felt insulted when you said 'there is no case against Kush' when you clearly had shown that you didn't read my posts. | ||
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On December 21 2012 02:34 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: The two of them being scum together, whew, that would actually be great. I would be restored in the faith of humanity. @ Cheese Yeah, but I don't want you to figure out who is scum so you can preserve your faith in your humanity. What would be the most likely scumteam for you ? | ||
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On December 21 2012 03:02 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Think I said it before, JX/drazak makes the most sense for me ATM. JX is in danger of lynch, drazak starts the lurker wagon. That's all he's done this game and it fits quite well assuming JX is scum. Second scumteam would be Eywa/kush... I'm leaning off you right now. On December 20 2012 13:09 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Hmm JX/draz scum would fit very well. JX is up for lynch draz starts the lurker wagon, DYH hops on ASAP This post... Okay ! You meant morbidius wagon. I thought you were talking about the end of D2. Interesting... I'll have to look into it. Why are you suddenly leaning off me ? | ||
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On December 21 2012 03:21 JieXian wrote: *snip* Djo please tell me how the hell am I playing clean lol what nonsense are you talking about. Everyone agrees that I'm messy as hell. If you mean clean as in not accusing everybody like what you're doing, I don't need to because things appear clear to me. *snip* You are totally twisting what I've presented. I have made a post presenting the points I had against DYH, at your request. You didn't reply directly to this post (of course not, so why asking it at the first place ?) but you have made the a comment related to this post a few moments after. On December 20 2012 03:00 Djodref wrote: @ JieXan Here is the summary of the points against DYH. I would like to remind you that the cases against Kush are far better Especially mines ^^ Anyway...
@ Eywa Could you do the same thing for CC ? It took me like 5 minutes So there is no direct comment on this from your side. But here is what I get from another remark. On December 20 2012 03:05 JieXian wrote: lol wasn't for you you're bee nplaying super clean just like dyh This is an OMGUS, but on the behalf of DYH. I point out to you what makes DYH scum, you take your pick, and say without justification that I'm guilty of the same sin. | ||
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On December 21 2012 03:29 JieXian wrote: I just skimmed at this and you don't seem to understand my logic 1 zentor and dyh are null to me 2 scum want to lynch dyh 3 Didn't expect them to bussing 4 I vote for zentor lol At this point, here are your supposed premises, tell me if I'm wrong but you are supposed to believe that Hapa, CC and me are the scumteam. Is that right ? There is only 3 scum in this game so, here is what town JieXian would think. I have already the whole scumteam so 1. zentor and DYH are town, we are currently lynching a town player (green check on DYH) 2. And, the whole scumteam is behing this lynch, this is obviously a mislynch ! 3. Bussing who ? The 4th mafia member ? 4. I vote for another townie, to be sure to have a mislynch.... No, if you were town, you should vote for one of your scumreads | ||
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We need you to catch up and to give us your current reads on everyone. Just to give you the heads-up, you have replaced a very scummy guy. I believe that you are scum, but not as much as I think that JieXian is scum. You have just claimed town, so please prove me wrong, if that's really the case. Good luck ^^ | ||
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What do you make of this post ? On December 19 2012 11:03 kushm4sta wrote: I have a reason for hating lurkers. It's because I obsed a game on ms where scum won the game by straight up lurkrng. They were doing a lurk strat and there was literally nothing town could do to catch them. My lack of scumhunting, yeah but that's not because I don't have ideas. I could write a good case against djodreff I know that. Just no time. Yeah I have a few minutes now but not enough to read through his filter and compose something convincing. I am on a cell phone and its hard. Oh and djo keep making those large text announcements it totally makes you looks town bro. Also to the people saying either me or djo is town, just for future reference I always bus as scum, so we could definitely both be scum. :p | ||
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On December 20 2012 04:48 kushm4sta wrote: fuck it. I got a green check on dyh for scrying. could definitely still be scum but it's less likely. And his newer stuff does have more effort. Come guys, Kush basically claimed scum in the thread with this post ! How come the mafia did not shot him at that point ? | ||
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On December 20 2012 07:49 kushm4sta wrote: k this is pretty easy from here. I'm thinking jx djodrrff scumteam. Naysayers prepare yourself for the sickest most convincing case ever tomorrow. I know djodreffs scum meta very well and I know he is scum. I voted thrawn, dp, mrz. Just for your reference | ||
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On December 21 2012 09:32 Hapahauli wrote: Djo, you need to answer Kush's case. Secondly, kush did not claim scum there. He did | ||
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On December 20 2012 05:48 kushm4sta wrote: no i thought about it but then thought it would be dumb because scum could breadcrumb just as easily Like, seriously, how can you believe this ? | ||
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On December 19 2012 05:58 kushm4sta wrote: have people claimed witchcrafy yet? also hapa do you know that you were shot kush also claimed scum here | ||
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On December 20 2012 06:33 kushm4sta wrote: LOL ##unvote ##vote dyh I would have been better off masoning And here again. Like masoning ? Who is seriously considering masoning as a power to use ? Oh wait, the scumteam has RB and masoning powers ! | ||
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On December 17 2012 10:42 kushm4sta wrote: Scumslip is kind of worrisome but it's not in any way definitive... I did the same thing earlier actually. I called you the strongest town. Here as well, you have a self admitted scumslip | ||
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On December 21 2012 09:47 Hapahauli wrote: Djo, flinging shit at kush is not going to do much when it a) looks really really desperate b) Kush has a really really good case on you I could put up a defense or an excellent case against Kush if I was not in a fucking airport. | ||
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On December 17 2012 02:29 kushm4sta wrote: that he is the strongest town player yes so he is a terrible idea for d1 lynch. not that he is town this game. | ||
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On December 17 2012 02:29 kushm4sta wrote: but i do think he's town this game lolol lolol scumslip | ||
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On December 21 2012 09:50 Hapahauli wrote: When will you have time to defend yourself then? I don't plan on defending myself. I'll devote myself to get Kush lynched. But I have at least 12 hours of flight then I have 10 hours more to get to my hometown. | ||
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On December 21 2012 09:53 Hapahauli wrote: Djo, calling a bunch of things scumslips that aren't scumslips is not productive. It's scumslips. I know scum Kush, I know his meta and I know they are scumslips | ||
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On December 21 2012 09:56 kushm4sta wrote: Djo before I made a case against you I wasn't your strongest scumread it seemed like. Now that I made the case, I'm suddenly your biggest scumread again? Also I find it weird that you can find all these quotes from me yet you can't even attempt to defend yourself? I'm phone posting. And you gave yourself away in your filter, so I don't care if I cannot defend myself, they'll understand you are scum when I flip. | ||
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On December 21 2012 09:59 Hapahauli wrote: If you knew anything about Kush's meta, you'd realize that he "scumslips" as town every other post. If you really knew Kush scum meta, you'd realize that he is scum... | ||
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Bon voyage ! | ||
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On December 21 2012 10:07 Hapahauli wrote: Djo, this was just about the worst and scummiest way possible you could have approached this situation. Enjoy your vacation, but I expect both a defense and a case (explaining why these are actually scumslips) when you get back. I promise to explain everything. But you have everything at hand. It's just meta and love... | ||
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I'm finally home ! And I had to sleep as soon as I arrive. Also I met a virgin, so I don't even think I'm gonna ever address the case against me. I just want to say that, I just entered the thread and I didn't even catch up but kush is definitively being scummier and scummier here. This was sarcasm My point here is that Kush is getting a lot a leeway this game. He is still on my possible scum list. And I just got mad that he waited to post his case that I was waiting from almost day 1 just before I had to take my plane. The timing is just too good. I also got mad because Kush made some bad arguments and some good arguments, but you took all of them for their face value. So I decided to behave exactly like Kush does, to show you that I'm town, because some of you have a town read on him for being a total jackass. I put a lot of effort into this game and I'm being called mafia with the first arguments brought by a jackass. So yeah, I went crazy... | ||
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On December 22 2012 14:43 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: It's okay Djo, I'm defending you right now. Perty sure ur town brah. Vote Eywa. Scumteam is Eywa / Kush or Eywa / JX. I need to catch-up with the thread first. I had Jx, drazak and then Eya/Kush as possible scum before grush came back green. So yeah, pretty sure that both scum are among JieXian, Eywa and Kush now. Why Eywa above JieXian ? | ||
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On December 22 2012 14:45 kushm4sta wrote: djo how was I a jackass to you? i never meant to be. I was not purposefully waiting for you to leave to write the case. also i did not just meet a virgin I also had sex with her. just need to clarify that. Can you not understand how the sudden start of a new relationship plus finals week would be a huge time sink for me? It's not being a jackass to me. But you have failed to address my cases against you nor present any arguments for a scum Djodref for a long time. That's what I meant for you being a jackass. I can make a list of my arguments supporting a scum Jx, a scum Eywa and a scum Kush in 5 minutes. So I don't understand what time you were missing to do this before I was going to take my plane. Intentional or not, I took it realle bad. Jx -tunnels Cheese and Hapa to avoid contributing -defends DYH and tries to derail his lynch -scumslip -blue hunts by leading the discussion on speculation topics Eywa -tunnels Cheese to avoid contributing -flames and disrupts the thread to create a bad town atmosphere where town can't share good arguments -does not scumhunt -scumslip Kush -avoids to scumhunt or contribute with his lurker obsession -avoids questions and cases addressed to him -tunnels djo all game to avoid speaking of the other players -scumslip | ||
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On December 22 2012 15:01 kushm4sta wrote: still going to bed but I will say one more thing. well my case against you involved shit from you filter so i had to read through your filter. it took about an hour to do it, maybe more. Yeah, but that also means that you have been calling me scum all game without knowing why. | ||
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On December 22 2012 14:54 kushm4sta wrote: ##unvote ##vote eywa happy cheesecake? Did i mention I had sex yet? Could you give us more reasoning for that vote ? I wonder if it's scum you bussing Eywa or scum you diverting the Jx lynch or just town you... | ||
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On December 21 2012 06:10 kushm4sta wrote: PART 1 (more parts inc.) I'm going to make this meta comparison easy for you guys: here is a d1 megapost from town djo: So this a djo case as town. TOWM + Show Spoiler + On November 04 2012 14:07 Djodref wrote: I'm betting that you didn't really notice him because this guys is sure blending in First of all, I would like to say that Clarity is non-committal with his reads. Please have a look at the different posts in the following spoiler. + Show Spoiler + + Show Spoiler + On November 03 2012 18:43 Clarity_nl wrote: I don't think it's directed at you specifically, but it's interesting that you think it is. The reason Cheese said to not drop the newbie card is because it's not town behavior. When you are town you want people to believe you, if you come out of the gate saying you're awful and no one should listen to you then that's anti-town. It also prevents scum from using "omg sorry I'm just new!", the less excuses scum have available the better for town. My reads at this point in time: Obzy: Leaning slightly town. He hasn't quite come out of his shell yet but he seems genuinly interested in discussion and progressing. @ Obzy Do you think you can get over this "I'm new" thing and give us the best reads you've got? Instead of posting something that's obvious to everyone perhaps post something that stands out to you. _ Rad: Null. He's being more careful than last game, lurking a bit more. He mentioned he would be more careful, but not in pregame, he did this after the role PMs were sent. He also seems really invested in helping Obzy out as he's the newest, the only one here who wasn't in XXIX. @ Rad Why the interest in Obzy? Are you going to use MLG as an excuse at any point this weekend? _ Alsn: Leaning slightly scum, very little info about him though. He opened super aggressive this game, which is the opposite of how he played in the majority of XXIX. Perhaps the only reason he snapped at debears so hard is because debears said @ Alsn Why the change in behavior from last game? What do you think of debears at this point? _ Mr Cheesecake: Null. He went SUPER defensive when he was called out about making a ton of jokes, but that discussion got blown way out of proportion. The fact that he's acting more like the way he was in mafia QT XXIX than in the actual XXIX thread is indicative of town. @ Cheese You did have some jokes in the XXIX thread. Can you tell us if these were jokes for the sake of jokes or if you used them to push a scum agenda? An argument can be made for both. _ Djodref: Leaning slightly scum, He was obsessed with policy. Everyone was ready to move on but he kept mentioning it over and over. He's also the person that blew up the whole *Cheese's scum joke* thing, which bogged us down for a couple of pages. @ Djodref If you had to lynch someone right now, would it be da0ud or someone else? _ Debears: Null. Regardless of if he's scum or town, he is getting the ball rolling which is good for us. Problem is... that was what he was doing in XXIX as well and he was scum in that. Older games suggest this is simply his meta so there is no read to be made about his opening. What I'm curious about is if he's going to pull a vanishing act in D2 / D3 again. @ Debears What's your ready on Obzy? _ Sylverfire: Null. Only have 3 real posts to read him on. He opened really aggressive onto debears, even though he's keeping the ball rolling, an odd choice. He showed up way late but Rad pointed out that he is sticking to the same schedule he's had in previous games. @ Sylverfire You've only shared your read on debears, is there anything else that stands out to you? _ So with all that said, I only have two slight scumreads on Alsn and Djo, so I hope they defend themselves as soon as possible. Even if we end up lynching da0ud for lurking, currently with 0 posts, we can at least gather as much information as possible Hopefully this gets some discussion going, please comment on as much as possible in my post and point out any flaws. Do no avoid answering the questions I addressed to you, it would be a very scummy thing to do. This post is full of null reads or slight reads, it speaks for itself. On November 03 2012 21:39 Clarity_nl wrote: My two weak scumreads are still you and Alsn, but that's what they are... weak. My post is simply to gather as much info as possible. I will end up making a case before the day is over, but I figured giving this thread a good kick would help. Weak scumreads on Alsn on me On November 04 2012 04:38 Clarity_nl wrote: <snip> I am no longer suspect of Alsn, at least not as much. Although he seems to have a hard on for debears and djo he's making decent points and trying to further conversation. Debears... I'm not quite sure. The stubbornness about sylver's post where he said he has a lot of fluff really shouldn't have been that big of a deal, he just couldn't let it go. Maybe Rad is on to something. Drops Alsn and is wishy washy about debears Then Clarity is also using double-standards, he has being reproaching Rad not to scumhunt but have you seen Clarity scumhunting ? You might argue that he has put pressure on daoud but he has conveniently done it while it was Saturday night in Hong Kong. And given daoud lurky habits, it's an easy target to attack. Clarity has been defensive when I was trying to give him advice after his post with his reads. The point I really don't like in his reaction is the fact that he said that he didn't make a list. Regarding the plurality lynch, we have individually to focus on our scum reads but town in general should not focus on only two players. By the way, you have failed to put pressure on me or Alsn, but we were your scum reads. In conclusion FoS Clarity Now this is this game's equivalent: SCUM + Show Spoiler + On December 16 2012 12:50 Djodref wrote: JieXan First of all, I liked DYH latest case against him + Show Spoiler [for reference] + On December 16 2012 07:32 DoYouHas wrote: @DP - I think the optimal way to play is to do our best to get the witch hunter to miss. Losing 2 townies, good or bad, is always worse than losing 1. I don't think this is going to convince you, so I'm not going to bring it up again. I'm feeling more comfortable with my vote on JX right now. His initial post was rather scummy, the thing to note about it is that it looks constructed (the phrases used when talking about hapa and MrZ, "mindless babbling" & "relative non-chalance". What makes me think he is scum is the progression of his pushing MrZ. A behavior read. An unsupported meta read with some WIFOM. Finally providing support for his meta read. Not conclusive enough considering he is ignoring paranoia (MrZ's most recent town game). This reads like he is trying to justify his stance on MrZ after the fact. Instead of finding MrZ scummy and looking into him, the presenting good reasons to vote him, JX voted him, then went in search of the reasons when pressured. This strikes me as scummy. I already pointed out how his first post feels constructed, and if that is true and he spent time on that post, why didn't he spend time backing up his vote on MrZ right from the start? Here is how he entered the thread casually spreading suspicion over Hapa and DP. His point against Hapa is not so bad, but it's kind of nit picky. I'll pass him this one because I was really startled when Hapa brought it. On the other hand, his points against DP and Zentor are bad. Regarding DP, in the early game, you have to pressure people for some trivia, and pressuring people is more a townie behavior than a mafia behavior, even if it's not totally true for DP. The main point here is that he calls them townies in the same post. That's just a scumslip. because this refers to Hapa and DP. So he enters the thread by spreading suspicion on them but calling them townies when he votes finally MrZ. So either he has a townread on them, in this case the first suspicions and points against them are totally useless and unwarranted for, either he is a mafia player that knows their alignment. Let's take a look at the rest of his filter to decide what is more likely. He doesn't really comment on the fact that he called them townies. And now he said that they were saying weird things, and not scummy things. And then just proceeds to tunnel MrZ, which has not given us so much to work from. Right now, I think that JieXan has the most chances to flip scum. Hence my vote. ##Vote Jiexan READ BOTH there is a distinct difference. Even though he is incorrect in the town post, there is a lot more certainty in the tone of the case. Town djo thinks his cases are right. Scum djo knows they are wrong. This post regarding my meta is bad. He doesn't even point out what the differences he supposedely see i my play. This shows that Kush has serious confirmation bias towards me, regardless of his alignment. | ||
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On December 21 2012 06:21 kushm4sta wrote: K im just going to make this a series and publish it in installments. Djo's behavior gets scummier and scummier the closer to the lynch it is. This is about d1 lynch: So he is ok with lynching SEVEN people. Basically everyone except DYH ofc. Once again, Kush is totally discarding the context of this post. At that point in time, there was so much inactivity in this thread that both DYH AND Drazak were not on my lurker list. Things were like that at that time, drazak and DYH were active in comparison of the other players. And yeah, the point of bringing a policy lynch is to force the lurkers to post. Also please note that I mention JieXian, Kush and Eywa as possible lynches for today, and I'm going to eat my hat if one of them is not scum. Kush's point is not valid here and I really saw red when CC went "this is damning". | ||
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On December 21 2012 06:37 kushm4sta wrote: So this is what djo says in the conclusion of his megacase against me: That SAME day he posts this later: Notice the reluctance against lynching DYH here. "meh" lol. Also he was SOOO sure about Ewya but completely sheeps hapa's reversal on the matter. Regarding his first quote here, it's from a post that I was supposed to bring up just before the start of D2 but I was unable to wake up to post it. So I posted it first during a middle of a shitfest then again from my phone because I thought it didn't get any attention. As I was from my phone, I couldn't update my read on Eywa. And yes, Eywa was starting to make sense and contributing at that time, so I was sharing Hapa's views on him before I wrote the post that you quoted first. It's totally reasonable to change your mind, the problem here is the time span, but it's because it was a repost that I couldn't update. And, once again, this is something that Kush didn't care to mention at all. So, yeah, he is framing me here. | ||
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On December 21 2012 07:07 kushm4sta wrote: He keeps stressing that DYH is scummy, but he's the LEAST likely to flip scum. Classic soft defense stance. The following quotes are leading up to the d2 lynch. They demonstrate his reluctance to lynch DYH. More DYH love: Djo really doesn't want to lynch DYH... Oh he's willing to vote DYH..but only if everyone else does. K finally he votes DYH, but it was totally his idea ("for the reasons given in his list above") This is also a good point. But I really though that you were scum at that time. I actively tried to push your lynch. And you could still be DYH's partner, it's not like you claimed having a green check on him. Also, I have never said that DYH's lynch was my idea. I never tried to get towncred for my lynch. I simply gave my reasons for why I thought he could be scum. And, yes, at the time of my vote, we needed consolidation and focus. | ||
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##Vote JieXian | ||
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@ ghost Your conclusion is wrong so I guess that your starting hypothesis are wrong as well. And I would appreciate you to read the whole thread. You could provide us great insight with your new eyes. And you are also in a very good position to do so because you are confirmed town with Hapa. Scum Hapa would have never gave a green check on you, and never pushed DYH lynch. But in the improbable case where both Hapa and you are town, I just have to say GG | ||
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On December 23 2012 00:19 kushm4sta wrote: also you kept saying nitpicking... "why so nitpicking?" it's called scumhunting....... Because you take my posts out of context to make them say what you want. | ||
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I didn't tunnel kush all game. Go read my cases against him which he never adressed. I was trying to push my top scumread. And don't tell me that itit's not possible for him to be mafia. | ||
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Can we agree that the lynch candidates for today are Eywa and me ? It really looks like my case against JieXian has no traction... | ||
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On December 23 2012 01:43 kushm4sta wrote: I did actually address them djo, it just got lost in the spam. No you didn't address them. For example, you never explained your obsession of the lurkers for day1. I'm not on computer so I cannot find all the things you didn't address and all the questions you didn't answer, but there are too many of them in this game. | ||
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On December 23 2012 01:49 kushm4sta wrote: i voted eywa because the 2 active players were telling me to vote for him. the case against him is good. no one wanted to vote for djo but me. but now that the djo wagon has support it's a different story. What about your previous town read on Eywa ? Why do you think I have more chances to flip scum than Eywa ? | ||
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On December 23 2012 01:50 kushm4sta wrote: yes I did. I observed a game on ms where mafia won by lurking. And it looked like the easiest thing in the world and there was nothing town could do but roll the dice. Which game was it ? | ||
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I'm back, and I see that the votes are 3 vs 3. 3 for me and 3 for Eywa. I know I'm town, and Eywa has pushed a mafia agenda almost all game long. This one is a no-brainer  ##Unvote ##Vote Eywa I'll be here until the deadline, which is at 11pm in France, and far more convenient than 7am in Korea. I have still the jet lag though, so I'm barely keeping my eyes open, but I'm here ! | ||
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They have no apparent reason to lynch me, and they were both incredibly anti-town all game long. Seriously Kush, even you should be able to see this ? Remember that you always read me wrong... | ||
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I cannot believe it... Like, I have good points made against me, but I've put a great effort to assert my townieness this game, and I feel really depressed to be mislynched right now, it's not like Eywa and JieXian were not obviously scum right now. Kush has been as stupid as usual and ghost didn't even read this game. And seriously, so much confirmation bias from Kush, I cannot believe it, like I've been fucking scumhunting this game. The worse thing is that I don't feel like I can do anything about it... | ||
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Hapa and gost are town, anybody not being able to see that is either on the scumteam or an idiot. JieXian and Eywa are the scumteam, if one of them flips town by miracle, then Kush is your remaining scum. Cheese is town by elimination, and also because he's being reasonable and defending me from this stupidity. | ||
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I think it is time for me to write a good bye post. I wouldn't say that this game was enjoyable, so I have mixed feeling about getting mislynched right now. I'm happy to get away from this game, because IRL is getting pretty busy with me being back to France, and also because there are too much insults and flaming around here. People are not being reasonable. On the other hand,I've really put a lot of effort into this game, and I think that most of my cases were good, even if a few of them were certainly misguided. So I guess that I was establishing that I was town quite well. My last case againt JieXian is something I'm very proud of, and I really don't think Kush or Ghost cases are better than it, so I'm feeling very bad about getting lynched right now. Hopefully, you guys can realize that the scum players are really obvious this game, and I'm counting on you to get your lynches right. I was happy that we had lynched DYH, and I was really hoping for the town atmosphere to get brighter, but it didn't happen. I have faith that you can win this game for me, so please do so ^^ Good luck and try to do something to improve the town atmosphere, because I really feel bad when I read this game... Alas, flaming occured again, and too much time is spend on irrelevant points. | ||
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JieXian never addressed this case against him, and he perfectly shows that he was following a mafia agenda all game long. | ||
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I don't see anyone moving their votes, so what do you want me to do. I told you what to do to win this game after my flip. And, ghost, next time, please read the whole game when you replace... And kush, you are bad at this game... | ||
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Explain what exactly ? He addressed some little parts of the case, but never explain why he tunneled you and cheesecake, nor say why speculating was the good reason. | ||
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On December 23 2012 06:43 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: In all seriousness if Eywa is town, I'd say hapa is scum tho. The thing is that it never happens in real life | ||
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On December 23 2012 06:55 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Hey I'll lynch Djo or Hapa if you're town. lol, no way he is town, don't even think about it ^^ | ||
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On December 23 2012 07:09 JieXian wrote: I recall marv policy lynches at D3 time to carry it out on hapa Could we at least have a real case against him ? Or just a short list ? | ||
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On December 23 2012 07:10 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: One quote sticks to me about Hapa: "I encourage you to vote DoYouHas.." This was when just he was on him... I don't get it. That has to be the sickest bus ever if he's scum. And that's why I don't see Hapa as scum this game. | ||
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On December 23 2012 23:49 Hapahauli wrote: I likely won't make it back before the deadline, so here's my hastily-written outlook on things right now: 1) Djo is probably scum. If there are any players looking bad after last night's exchange, it's Djo. Now him voting Eywa isn't bad (since he had to in order to survive. However, the way he suddenly started pushing the idea that "oh there's no way that Eywa is going to flip town" near the lynch deadline is pretty bad. He's been convinced that three players were going to flip scum yesterday: Kush, JX, and finally Eywa. His early-martyring and detachment also read as pretty scummy. Finally, the way he pushed Kush's case is seems scummy rather than rage-phone posting in retrospect. 2) Second Scum By association, I don't think it's kush unless it was their plan just to throw shit at each other all game. Definitely possible, but I don't think it's likely. The most likely scum-team member seems to be Mr. CC. While his filter has quite a few pages, most of it is him screaming "Eywa is scum!" over and over again. Not that I haven't either, but there's remarkably little analysis in Mr.CC's filter, and unless he starts contributing in a big way tomorrow, I have no reason to change that opinion. Mr.CC/Djo scumteam also would explain why I'm alive right now - I've been their buddies for most of the game. I don't think JX is scum. Him setting himself up to look like an ass post-DYH flip makes it implausible. There's a huge difference between setting yourself up to look like a stupid townie by playing ignorant about the flip, and setting yourself to look like an asshole by being convinced that DYH isn't scum and doing everything to antagonize the other players on the wagon. @ Hapa First of all, I'm not scum, and my martyr act was the result of me getting lynched over Eywa at that point. That was depressing, seriously. Also I find it very strange that you think that CC is scum the moment he starts to have suspicion about you. Why the change of heart ? I was under the impression that you had Cheese as town all game ? The only thing that I can agree in your post is that I was certainly wrong about JieXian, because my case against him was almost the same than a possible case against Eywa, and he flipped town. So if I dismiss all his scummy behavior, which a town player proved to be capable of, he is town, because he looks genuine and passionate. | ||
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On December 24 2012 01:16 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Scum bussing that hard also makes sense: He'll get all the votes and win powers. Be able to fakeclaim using powers and prevent town from checking/vetting up. I'm also sharing some concerns about Hapa, because I know your scum meta, and I really don't fell like you are scum this game, so I'm really curious how Hapa can have you as scum right now. What do you think about JieXian right now ? I mean, given that Eywa has flipped town. | ||
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I need to read this game again to see if this team would work out. | ||
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On December 24 2012 01:29 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: I was convinced that one of Eywa/jx was scum (I didn't think that much stupid could exist in one thread, no offense JX :p). No, you don't know my scum meta. I guarentee you I wouldn't play even remotely the same as i did against you that game. Sorry about that lynch btw. Debears told me to do it. I hate meta cases anyway. JX could very well be Hapa's scumbuddy. But that could also be Kush, Ghost, hell even you haha. But overall I'd consider him to be fairly townie per that play last night The thing is you have played only one scum game so far until this game. I don't see your scum game improving that much since that last game. Also, you being pissed off at Eywa looked very genuine. I can definitively understand your feelings wrt him and also you spend a lot of time fighting with him with passion, and I don't see a scum player doing that, because he would have known that Eywa was town, so I imagine less confrontational. | ||
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On December 24 2012 01:34 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: You mean Eywa not Drazak right? Could be imo. I don't think JX because he was screaming HAPA CC SCUMTEAM GG E-HANDSHAKE POST GAME. If you look at Hapa's early play he does push both jx and kush. And you. Not DYH and not Drazak for lurking. No, I meant Drazak. I accepted that both Hapa and Drazak/ghost as confirmed town, but I have some doubts right now. I mean, drazak didn't look townie, and ghost didn't really change this impression. Or, JieXian/Kush is the scumteam. I don't know, I really have some doubts about JieXian being mafia now that Eywa has flipped town, and Kush has done some scumhunting, even if it was misguided. I'm kind of lost now, I need to read this game again, and I'll consider everything. | ||
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On December 24 2012 01:40 ghost_403 wrote: Alright, I'm out again for the rest of the cycle. Quick post: I agree with Hapa. Djo is pretty much confirmed scum, IMO. I think my case against him is pretty good, and yesterday didn't make him look any better, especially considering that he never addressed any of the points that I made. Looking back at his filter, he tries to distract everyone else from the crux of my arguments. For example, his immediate reply to my case was Basically, he's defending his tunneling of Kush, which is not part of my case. My case is built around the fact that (a) he defended scum while voting scum, and (b) he refused to interact with the scum until forced by the town. After that, I think that MrCC is a decent pick for scum. He spent all day fiercely defending Djo. If/when Djo flips scum, I think that MrCC is the next logical choice for a lynch. After all, Boom. GG. @ ghost Did you even read the whole thread yet ? | ||
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On December 24 2012 01:41 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Also, the only other thing that could be besides us is Kush + JX (provided hapa is actually town). This doesn't hold much water, right? Kush did want to lynch JX a bunch of times, ya? I only remember Kush wanting to lynch me, I'll have to check this. | ||
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On December 24 2012 01:48 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Well if we're right about Hapa / Ghost, Kush or JX will die tonight. Djo, who did you vote for? D1, I voted for thrawn, DP and Cheese. D2, I voted for Hapa and Cheese. I prefer to speak about my D3 vote after the NK. | ||
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On December 24 2012 01:56 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Wow wtf you actually voted for me? Ain't neva seen no powers in this game haha. D1 was kush dp hapa D2 was you hapa. D3 I'll post when i get home. There is no chance you or I is dying tonight. In fact, I liked DP idea so I didn't want to vote Hapa D1. Also, I didn't really have the choice. Except for Hapa, you guys were the only town reads I had. D2, only town reads I was confident in. | ||
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On December 24 2012 03:00 JieXian wrote: my problem with hapa is that I'm convinced his scum but going through all his posts to make a proper case is a lot of work =( damn you @ JieXian I'm really eager to see your case. Also I would like to know who do you think is Hapa scum buddy... | ||
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Right now, I'm hesitating between a ghost/Hapa scumteam and JX/Kush scumteam. | ||
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This is scummy, but that's not enough to get me sold on a scum CC. He was really convinced that Eywa was scum, and I don't think that he really consider the case where Eywa was going to flip town seriously. I really feel CC sincere and passionate in his interactions with Eywa... | ||
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##vote no-lynch | ||
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It's done ! | ||
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On December 24 2012 16:00 Hapahauli wrote: And just to clarify, you voted Mr.CC before I posted the above, correct? The timing is crucial. Yeah sure, it was done before | ||
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On December 24 2012 16:28 Hapahauli wrote: Double check. Exactly what time (TL time) did you send your PM out? Was it sent before you made this post? 1-2 minutes after? Sorry, this is rather important and will decide who we lynch tomorrow with 100% certainty. I've sent my PM at 15:46, we also need to check with JieXian by the way and make sure than nobody else voted before me. | ||
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I would like them to give their word that they are not going to vote as well ^^. | ||
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So I have him and ghost back at confirmed town. It should be pretty much GG when I get confirmed town as well So, yeah, sorry for not being active, but I'm going to enjoy Xmas with my family since this game is going to get solved soon. Can we not have the Xmas break ? It's not like anything is going to happen now... | ||
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On December 25 2012 03:10 kushm4sta wrote: i feel like djo is gonna flip town and I'm being framed by a cheesecake/jx scumteam. Can you confirn that you didn't vote anything before 15:46 ? Are you ok with the plan ? | ||
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Joyeux Noel a tous ! Already starting here, so I wish you all hapiness and stuff ^^ | ||
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On December 26 2012 11:11 kushm4sta wrote: when is night? Why do you care ? Waiting to send in your kills ? Night is going to be in 14hours and I'm also going to be confirmed town at that point ^^ And it really doesn't look like it pleases you | ||
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There is a flaw in the plan ^^ | ||
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On December 28 2012 09:29 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: I'm guessing Vet, maybe a lucky JK I think you are wrong. I don't think that ghost got any powers yesterday. And I'm serious ^^ | ||
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OK, I got it now. It is a little imbalanced then... Mafia has to keep the silver bullets and the witch hunter not be lynched. Plus I really thought that the plan was going to work in our favor. But here, JieXian claiming was confirming him townsomehow... I really have failed the night actions. And I don't think we should have bussed DYH on D2. Cheesecake was really possible to mislynch. And I was really mad at Kush. I was about to game throw at that time. I think I was looking fairly town before he started to bus me for no reason. I still don't underatand why people listened to him when nobody gave a fuck when I was trying to bus him... | ||
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I think you should remove the abstain mechanic or you should gave the bullets to the whole scumteam. And you shouldn't have told them how to abstain Also I really don't understand why JieXian didn't claim his vote. I know he had me as scum with Hapa, but his actions made me confirmed scum when I could still be town from his point of view. I think we could have won this game easily after D1 if we had run a proper disruption in the thread during D2. I really don't wish you to be scum with kush in any of you game. This is just so frustrating ^^ | ||
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On December 28 2012 18:28 JieXian wrote: dafuck I get it now, djo and kush didn't understand the plan which was why they went through with it lol lol YOU 2 BLOODY IDIOTS LOL THAT'S SO DAMN CUTE djo t'es vraiment con :D mystery solved. I take back everything I said about you 2 lol That was what was supposed to happen if town players didn't get to abstain, which was never mentioned in the OP in the first place. From my point of view, I think I understood it quite well. | ||
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On December 28 2012 20:00 kushm4sta wrote: and it's like you weren't even dead yet. but your scum epeen was so big from that last scum game you played that any whiff of your own lynch and you wanted to concede. It's just too easy. When I send the night actions and you get jailed so the NK don't get through, it is my responsability. When you forget to send the night actions, it is also my fault. I think we could have got Cheese lynched D2 if you were actually playing this game for winning and not for being right. So really excuse me for not giving a fuck at the end. We are all responsible for losing this and your plan of bussing all your partners is just fucking brilliant if you are unable to send a PM. | ||
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On December 28 2012 20:04 JieXian wrote: I would have very much preferred being humiliated by brilliant mafia play than 2 people not getting the rules. Please show me which part of the rules we didn't understand. And you were very close for losing the game for the town with your obsession with Hapa being scum. So yeah, don't be cocky... | ||
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On December 28 2012 19:58 kushm4sta wrote: godammit thinking about missing that nk rages me. thanks for completely failing to give a shit djodref. I had to work overnight the night before so my sense of time was all messed up that is my excuse. DJO did you know that when you die that doesn't mean you lose??? selfish arrogant bad scumplay from djo i am mad. You were playing like a selfish retard all game... | ||
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On December 28 2012 23:43 kushm4sta wrote: no? 1 i tried to save DYH and would have saved him if people were actually in the thread 2 i did save you fact of mafia: scum must bust unless town is a total failure. you have way too much ego Dear Kush, You are more obsessed with the Looney Game than I do. You shouldn't care of how scummy you look because you are getting a lot of leeway because of your town play. 1) You shouldn't have gave Cheese a town read. He was the only contender to DYH lynch and we should have pushed his mislynch D2. The following LYLO at D3 with the 3 of us would have been a piece of cake. 2) There is no problem with taking some distance, but don't bus if you don't need to. 3) Learn to send night actions. 4) Try to be right on your town games, not on your scum games Best Regards, Djodref | ||
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On December 29 2012 07:54 Blazinghand wrote: So in terms of setup changes here's what I'm thinking: 1) there is no mechanic for town to not cast a witchcraft vote: you must always vote for someone. This will prevent most of the shennannies with using witchcraft as a rolecheck 2) possibly change the scum setup from gf + goon + 2-shot blue vigi to gf + 1-shot blue vigi + 1-shot blue vigi. This seems a bit more stable. Any thoughts on these changes, or suggestions for further tweaks? I need to think how town could abuse the vote mechanics in this situation. But I like these changes for now. Especially the fact that mafia has two witch hunters. | ||
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I think you should keep the possibility for the town to vote for ”nobody” but not for ”no-one” I recommend you to threaten to count all invalid votes as votes for ”nobody” to force town players to vote. | ||
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It was not fancy play, it was just Kush and me being stupid and really pissed off at each other. I really think that Cheese was the mislynch we should have pushed D2, and there was good potential for it. Did you realize that people had to abstain and not vote for ”nobody” so your plan could work properly ? If I have to look back at this game, I would say it's not possible to win at scum if you don't play as a team. | ||
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On December 29 2012 08:12 Blazinghand wrote: OK so here's what I'm thinking for changes, having heard your suggestions: 1) townies can't abstain from witchcraft votes 2) gf + 1shot blue vigi 1shot blue vigi is the new scum setup 3) blaspheme returns red on GF, green on everything else (including miller) This should prevent shennannies, make blaspheme more useful, and also prevent scum from getting unlucky and losing both their bullets to a D1 lynch. The mason option for town, or the 1-shot masonry for scum? Both of them. Town is not going to use mason, so mafia is not going to use mason as well. You could only out yourself by using mason as a mafia because it was risky/useless to use it as a town player. | ||
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On December 29 2012 08:17 Blazinghand wrote: Oh, it occurs to me that if as town you mason a scum player you'll just get shot with a silver bullet, won't you. yes, and that's why I would have never used this as town ^^ | ||
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On December 29 2012 08:22 Blazinghand wrote: Okay, what if Masonry works differently? If you use Masonry, you don't specify a target and at daybreak you're randomly masoned with another town player (alternative: two random town players are masoned with each other, not necessarily including you). This would give it some detection power, but because you can't really aim it it's not always as useful as a DT check. Might make sense to make masonry with a godfather possible so it's detection power is strictly worse than scrying. So what is mafia counterbalancing masonery power in that case ? Just chosing a mason ? | ||
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On December 29 2012 08:36 Blazinghand wrote: The mafia power would be a 1-shot masonry between a mafia player and a target of their choice. This way, if you initiate a masonry, you know your target is town, but if you are the recipient of a masonry, you're not sure. But you have good chances to initiate a town/town masonery. The problem I see here is that you don't have as much control as you have when you use the other powers. There is no real incentive to use this power as town over the others... | ||
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On December 29 2012 08:56 DoYouHas wrote: Your scum play in thread was pretty good, the amount of genuine effort you put into the game read as townie. Sometimes your attitude got in your way, and your priorities for night actions were a bit off (wasting the shot, killing MrZ instead of Hapa). I don't know about Hapa. It kept JieXian really focused on the fact that he was still alive. I think it could have won us the game if the CC kill would have gone through. And for my attitude, I was really exhausted and about to take my plane when kush finally posted his case against me ^^ Also I got less involved cause I'm in France now. | ||
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On December 29 2012 23:40 JieXian wrote: nah dyh you played well imo I never suspected you much. The last time I did something stupid as town I commended scum's play because he fooled me well and I overlooked him. He knew what he was doing. Actually he kinda has your style too. So that's a lesson to take home. I never suspected that kush and djo were together like marv said, their distancing was really good I have to give them credit for that. Marv luckily I realised that 1 important point before I blew =( I already said why I didn't think it was a townie led plan. I learnt from my mistakes alright, which is that people may not shoot the best town to screw with 1 guy and some might actually not mind going along with a plan that would sign their GG. I learnt that it's stupid to assume people won't make stupid decisions or decisions that seem stupid to me. Hapa I seriously still find some parts of your playstyle to be scummy and I guess that's just your town style. I'd like to think that I'm not an idiotic sore loser and I'll gladly give credit to kush and djo where it's due : good distancing, screwing with my mind by not shooting hapa (though I won't play that way) but definitely not your "bluff" on Hapa's plan. Hapa's plan was not supposed to work because there was supposedely no way to abstain. Also, your vote had fucked the plan. | ||
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