Liquid City Mafia - Page 55

One more thing that I don't like is VisceraEyes's case history. Spends a billion posts tunneling annul, based on a "trying to spot clues" (?) read. Then suddenly feels that his emotions got the better of him, and reconsiders. Which is funny, because VE started the attacks. It's not like he was attacked and got emotinal.



Then in this post:



He finally addresses shady sands and proposes to vote on him. Now look at how he addresses kingjames. In this same post, he goes from a "not a scum read", to a "someone I want dead". At first I thought it was understandable because he was referring specifically to KJ's input on scumhunting in an inactivish environment.
However, it's the bolded underlined part that gets to me.
What I understood here is that if KJ only had the one post, he would be better than those who haven't posted at all. But then he goes to say that KJ is not commenting on stuff going on in the game (when, ironically, he himself had only just addressed shady sands, which is the first big issue) plus a bunch of other confusing stuff I don't follow, thus putting KJ as a bigger scum read than the rest.
I'd like him to clarify this.

This concludes the people I don't like so far. Out of those, VE seems the scummiest to me, because his play doesn't make sense for me from a town perspective, his conflict with annul seemed too fake.

##FOS VE

so apparently this started

I'm caught up to about halfway through pg 11 at the moment so forgive me if someone has already said this:

VE is scum

basically he has a cold hard activity tell on him that I don't think he's shook yet. see this post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=352668&currentpage=73#1442 If I have time I'll make a pretty graph later. And he's made 11 posts in 24 hours in this game, right on target with his scum pace. His posts are qualitatively similar as well - they all tend to be of medium length with few of the quick one-off responses and conversational feel that his town play has.

combine this with the fact that he's doing a couple of things similar to what he did in mad men:

--Being a little inflammatory. He accidentally riled up annul, calling him a little bitch. He then said that he didn't mean it that way. Yet you clearly don't say someone is doing something "like" a little bitch without implying that they in fact are similar to a little bitch. His explanation was contorted and reads to me like he was goading annul more thereby shitting up the thread (might have worked had drH not stepped in). He did this in mad men as well ( http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=352668&currentpage=46#906 )

--spending day one going after "low-hanging fruit" discussion-wise. I give him some credit for being original with annul, but the rest of his posts are just harping on the usual early day one controversies (kj, shady). I know VE is good enough to know that this post is incredibly optimistic:



How is he really "pretty sure"? I'd say it's a trap or bait or something but he never follows it up as such. Instead I smell pre-justification.

##Vote: VisceraEyes

Agreed. VE also didnt reply to any questions I asked him afterwards, nor did he reply to me calling him out for a very weak vote-switch to Node (left it to marv to do the dirty work by agressively defending my accusations while also clogging up the thread with plenty of posts?).

He has also, should he be town, been either terribly bad or terribly unlucky in his scumhunting. Lets look at a few people he has touched on:
1)
2 confirmed town flips.
2) Then the attack on annul - confirmed town flip.
3) After dropping annul, posting this

while placing his vote on Shady. 2 confirmed town.
4) Voted Node - no flip on him yet though.
5)
Going back to annul (confirmed town) after mislynch. With very little motivation (and refused to explain himself when I questioned it).
6)
Calling for a medic on a confirmed (yea, he is) scum, calling vig shot on a confirmed town.

He is either scum or just randomly managed to call out about every single confirmed player (except Risen) the wrong alignment. VE is my top scum read atm.

Alright, I'm going to be getting a bit more rest since I woke up for Code S. Current thoughts:

I could definitely see VE being scum. His unfortunate scumhunting is a big piece of the puzzle, but his interaction with annul keeps nagging at me.


It took me a while to figure out why I was so annoyed by these posts, but I think I've figured it out. VE first emphasizes that as scum annul can become "scary" (which I assume means that he can appear to become a good contributor, though VE never actually says how annul becomes "scary"), but leaves out the fact that he might do the same exact thing as town. It doesn't feel like VE is trying to inform the town of annul's apparent meta, as much as emphasize the scummy aspects of annul's meta and attribute it entirely to scum-annul.

It would feel the same way if marv came in and said that I can be incredibly wishy-washy as scum. He's emphasized in previous games that I am the master of wishy-washiness regardless of alignment (though I've only ever been scum once, for little over a day). If he were to come into this game and try to convince everyone that I'm only wishy-washy when I'm scum, then I would be incredibly suspicious of him (In fact, I believe that's part of why he avoided talking about me at all despite my case being in the same post as the Node one).

In VE's case, it looks like he tried to do a similar thing, and then when annul called him out on it he tried to minimize the effect. Why say that scum-annul can be "scary" if town-annul can also be "scary" unless you're trying to make vigis take the shot without a proper reason? It seems like a pretty scummy interaction from VE.

I'd really like to hear thoughts from others, as this is the first thing I feel pretty confident about this game.


Finally, I'm still waiting on input from mementoss... I know that 15 pages is a lot to go through, but I'm not going to put him aside just because one of the people who was calling him out is going to flip scum. There are other lurkers, but he's promised more contributions twice now, and we've seen nothing from it.