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Switzerland2194 Posts
On March 22 2012 02:25 Jayjay54 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 22 2012 02:19 Grackaroni wrote:
Did you see the way he walked into the thread 1/2 way through the day, offered nothing new to the discussion, jumped on the obvious 3rd party bandwagon, then disappeared again.
See? This is the foolishness case. It is wrong! He was the second player after me to vote Drazek. He didn't join the bandwagon. He started it with me. That post at that time was completely appropriate. He voted Draz for the right reasons way earlier than most of you guys.I don't know why everyone thinks that this post didn't add anything... This is what happens when you take posts out of context. Also palmar: it's sad that I have to defend you here, because you don't care.
He did?
On March 18 2012 00:56 Dirk Hardpec wrote:+ Show Spoiler +No matter how much I think about it, Drazerk's successful shooting says nothing about his alignment. It is a reasonable approach for almost every faction except for town, and town is the faction most prone to take unreasonable approaches to the game.
What I find more interesting is the fact that he claims to be third party. No matter how you look at it, the only faction I can possibly think of benefitting from being thought of as third party is mafia. It is strictly inefficient for town to be thought of as third party as that will lead to an eventual lynch of that person, you cannot go into situation where one lynch will lose the game carrying a claimed third party on your back. This is however perfectly acceptable for someone who just wants to extend his life cycle for a while, ie: mafia.
I guess it is also possible that he is indeed a third party and is trying to make an alliance with us, but it seems very unlikely as most third parties tend to be at severe disadvantage when they get figured out.
In sense, it makes no sense from a balance standpoint to create a third party in a game, and then make it possible for us to leave that third party alive, might as well be town then.
This is why I don't believe his claim, I think Drazerk is scum and I want to lynch him. I guess I can't say I disbelieve his role claim as the flavor fits, however I do disbelieve his alignment claim.
##Vote Drazerk
He voted Drazerk because he thought that Drazerk was scum and that his 3rd party claim was wrong. Barely anyone shared that train of though as far as I remember and it turned out to be wrong. Perhaps he already recognised the increasing antitown behaviour of Drazek (in hindsight, it was clearly noticeable at this point), but if so, he did not really mention it in his post.
However, I do give him credit that he came up with an original thought and not just bandwagoned blindly.
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Switzerland2194 Posts
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On March 22 2012 04:10 blubbdavid wrote:
I don't understand this. You are voting for bluelightz too.
I forgot to cast my vote after the case so I ninja'd it. But still, I am the first one to cast his vote on bluelightz (this day).
Ninja voting is very, very bad, and the fact that you admit to doing it, but didn't say so earlier without being prompted makes me very suspicious. The fact that I'm also voting for Bluelightz is not the point of contention here. Ironically enough, I'm more certain of his guilt because of his voting abnormality, and you claim that it's not a big deal? If we can't connect people's private thought processes to their public votes, then it becomes way easier to hide as scum.
For example, when Maverick ninja voted earlier, he immediately explained it the next day and provided reasoning for his vote (granted he was drunk on St. Patrick's Day, but the point stands). Things like that establish transparency, and it makes it possible to do ex post vote analysis.
While you're here, what were you trying to achieve by asking Kenpachi and Grackaroni their roles? Did you think that they would actually give you an answer?
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Switzerland2194 Posts
Current vote count:
bluelightz: 8 -- blubbdavid; Velinath; Kenpachi; zelblade; phagga; Jayjay54; MidnightGladius; Maverick32x
Dirk Hardpec: 4 -- Grackaroni; Nisani201; sinani206; Paperscraps;
Kenpachi: 2 -- Zephirdd; willz22912;
kitaman27: 1 -- Dirk Hardpec
Mr. Wiggles: 1 -- kitaman27
ghost_403: 1 -- Mr. Wiggles
sbrubbles: 1 -- Hassybaby
Majority is 12 votes!
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A Better Vote Count!
Kenpachi (2): Zephirdd, willz22912
Mr. Wiggles (1): Kitaman27
Bluelightz (8): blubbdavid, Velinath, Kenpachi, zelblade, phagga, Jayjay54, MidnightGladius, Maverick32x
Dirk Hardpec (4): Grackaroni, Nisani201, Sinani206, Paperscraps
Sbrubbles (1): Hassybaby
Kitaman27 (1): Dirk Hardpec
Ghost_403 (1): Mr. Wiggles
Ghost_403, Mementoss, Bluelightz, Adam4167 and Sbrubbles Have yet to vote!
With 23 alive it takes 12 to lynch! 3 hours and 30 minutes of testing remain!
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On March 22 2012 04:19 MidnightGladius wrote:
While you're here, what were you trying to achieve by asking Kenpachi and Grackaroni their roles? Did you think that they would actually give you an answer?
By now I've pretty much said every detail of my role lol.
Except when talking to kitaman I accidentally left out that I can't transform more than 1 lemon per phase.
We don't have much time left, if it becomes abundantly clear that I can't lynch Palmar I will switch because I would rather lynch Bluelightz than no-lynch.
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I haven't had enough time to fully read through all the cases quite yet but the thing that stood out for me the most while skimming is from the votees above is that Kenpachi has the most useless posts. All he does is push GlaDoS votes which could be terrible for everyone. So I will check back later to see if anything has developed or any cases catch my eye for now im voting Kenpachi.
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On March 22 2012 04:19 MidnightGladius wrote:Show nested quote +On March 22 2012 04:10 blubbdavid wrote:
I don't understand this. You are voting for bluelightz too.
I forgot to cast my vote after the case so I ninja'd it. But still, I am the first one to cast his vote on bluelightz (this day). Ninja voting is very, very bad, and the fact that you admit to doing it, but didn't say so earlier without being prompted makes me very suspicious. The fact that I'm also voting for Bluelightz is not the point of contention here. Ironically enough, I'm more certain of his guilt because of his voting abnormality, and you claim that it's not a big deal? If we can't connect people's private thought processes to their public votes, then it becomes way easier to hide as scum. For example, when Maverick ninja voted earlier, he immediately explained it the next day and provided reasoning for his vote (granted he was drunk on St. Patrick's Day, but the point stands). Things like that establish transparency, and it makes it possible to do ex post vote analysis. While you're here, what were you trying to achieve by asking Kenpachi and Grackaroni their roles? Did you think that they would actually give you an answer?
There is the possibility that they are not allowed to claim their party or wincondition. I got suspicious when Grack siad that he was 4th party, but later he then said that he was town.
And I should have looked around better before I asked Kenpachi if he was town, because he answered that in his second post.
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On March 22 2012 04:43 blubbdavid wrote:Show nested quote +On March 22 2012 04:19 MidnightGladius wrote:On March 22 2012 04:10 blubbdavid wrote:
I don't understand this. You are voting for bluelightz too.
I forgot to cast my vote after the case so I ninja'd it. But still, I am the first one to cast his vote on bluelightz (this day). Ninja voting is very, very bad, and the fact that you admit to doing it, but didn't say so earlier without being prompted makes me very suspicious. The fact that I'm also voting for Bluelightz is not the point of contention here. Ironically enough, I'm more certain of his guilt because of his voting abnormality, and you claim that it's not a big deal? If we can't connect people's private thought processes to their public votes, then it becomes way easier to hide as scum. For example, when Maverick ninja voted earlier, he immediately explained it the next day and provided reasoning for his vote (granted he was drunk on St. Patrick's Day, but the point stands). Things like that establish transparency, and it makes it possible to do ex post vote analysis. While you're here, what were you trying to achieve by asking Kenpachi and Grackaroni their roles? Did you think that they would actually give you an answer? There is the possibility that they are not allowed to claim their party or wincondition. I got suspicious when Grack siad that he was 4th party, but later he then said that he was town. And I should have looked around better before I asked Kenpachi if he was town, because he answered that in his second post.
Grack's claim was really obviously a joke.
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@phagga: You're right, this isn't me from most of our last game. The first few days, I beat on two players mercilessly, who both turned out to be townies. After that, I cooled down for the final day, and tried to guide the town discussion, specifically by trying to stop sloosh and DoYouHas from bickering and wasting the day. I did a lot better at finding scum the last day than the first two, which is why I've been trying to sit back a bit in this game.
Now, my sitting back has become inactivity, which is something that needs to change.
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Switzerland2194 Posts
On March 22 2012 05:01 ghost_403 wrote:
@phagga: You're right, this isn't me from most of our last game. The first few days, I beat on two players mercilessly, who both turned out to be townies. After that, I cooled down for the final day, and tried to guide the town discussion, specifically by trying to stop sloosh and DoYouHas from bickering and wasting the day. I did a lot better at finding scum the last day than the first two, which is why I've been trying to sit back a bit in this game.
Now, my sitting back has become inactivity, which is something that needs to change.
So how about you stop making excuses and actually start to post some scum reads?
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Working on it.  Trudging through all this stuff is a pain.
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I'm more comfortable with a Bluelightz lynch than a Dirk lynch at the moment. I don't think either of them are great choices, but of the two, Bluelightz is better.
The thing that I find most interesting is the fact that Bluelightz has responded to none of the recent criticizms while he has been paying attention in the thread. Of note is the fact that he posted 20min after PalmarDirk's derp moment (here), while ignoring the fact that a bandwagon was forming against him. Townie who doesn't care, or scum who knows he's going to get lynched? Either way, that makes him a pretty decent lynch target. Other than that, he's posted nothing of substance in the thread.
Out of everyone else who's currently being voted:
Kenpachi: I'm thinking 3rd party aligned with town
Bluelightz: see above
Dirk: I'm willing to trust JJ at the time being on this one, and not vote against him today. However, I would expect better play from Palmar.
Mr. Wiggles, Sbrubbles, and Kita I have null reads on at the moment, and I'm going to go fix that right now.
If I had more time, I would read into the rest of the filters, but I'm headed out in an hour or so. I think I'll just start at the top of the list and work my way down.
@Dirk: JJ says you have some kind of town aligned power or something. Care to expand on that at all?
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On March 21 2012 22:50 Mr. Wiggles wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Ok, I'm not going to have time to completely finish this, but this is what I wrote. It's pretty straight-forward, so you should be able to see the same things, just read his filter. I think ghost_403 is likely scum. A couple other people pointed him out in the thread, and I noticed the same things when I read his filter. The first thing I notice right off the bat, is that he's the one who started the silliness about Wheatley changing win conditions. On March 18 2012 00:55 ghost_403 wrote:
Just my thoughts on the Wheatly role:
I'm not ever going to trust Wheatly. IIRC, Wheatly screws over Chell in Portal 2 by taking control of Aperture, despite his best intentions. I can see this going the same way. Wheatly begins the game by helping the town, then gets a new wincon where he has to kill us all or something. The reason this is scummy, is because it has no basis in the game, and is completely based on external flavour. So, it serves only to: 1)Spread distrust 2)Cause pointless discussion and distract from the game 3) Be pointless Then he flip-flops on his reads. I'll try to post more when I get back. =/
I'll take a few minutes to respond to Mr. Wiggles' points.
Spreading distrust? Only against Wheatly. I've played portal 2. I don't trust Wheatly. Take it or leave it.
Pointless distraction? I was trying to keep the town focused on Day 1 with posts like these.
Being pointless? I am a ghost, no sharp edges here.
Flip flop? Draz was a bad lynch, then I left, then he became a good lynch. I explicitly said that he needs to go at some point. That point wasn't before I left. Then he starts acting scummy, and becomes a good lynch. I don't see that as a flip flop at all.
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A Better Vote Count!
Kenpachi (3): Zephirdd, willz22912, Mementoss
Mr. Wiggles (1): Kitaman27
Bluelightz (8): blubbdavid, Velinath, Kenpachi, zelblade, phagga, Jayjay54, MidnightGladius, Maverick32x
Dirk Hardpec (4): Grackaroni, Nisani201, Sinani206, Paperscraps
Sbrubbles (1): Hassybaby
Kitaman27 (1): Dirk Hardpec
Ghost_403 (1): Mr. Wiggles
Ghost_403, Bluelightz, Adam4167 and Sbrubbles Have yet to vote!
With 23 alive it takes 12 to lynch! 2 hours of testing remain!
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On March 22 2012 01:48 kitaman27 wrote:
I also dislike ghost_403 as a lynch candidate today. I don't think there is a very good case at all for him to be considered.
How do you know the case if bad, when I haven't even posted it? :p
I'll write it up, but with only an hour and a half left in the day, I'll probably switch my vote to one of the major candidates.
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I hate making lists. I think it's scummy. So I'm not going to. I have notes on the three remaining lynch candidates, and I think that they are all bad lynches at this point in time. If someone really wants to know what I think about one of them, ask, but I'm not going to post a list for the sake of posting a list.
I took some time to look through the first couple of filters. The only one that really stuck out to me was Zephridd's filter. I wasn't impressed with his posts thus far, they seem useless for the most part. If I had caught onto it 24hrs ago, I would have pressured him today. I'll put him on the back burner for the time being; I think bringing up cases this late in the day is counterproductive.
And now, I'm out for the next couple of hours. I leave you all with
##vote bluelightz
for the reasons detailed in my earlier post.
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Switching to Bluelightz so we can have a majority lynch today.
LOL at the Palmar smurf slip, haha. Now his play makes a lot more sense. Time to meta read his filter.
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Not gonna have a no-lynch.
##Vote: Bluelightz
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A Better Vote Count!
Kenpachi (3): Zephirdd, willz22912, Mementoss
Mr. Wiggles (1): Kitaman27
Bluelightz (11): blubbdavid, Velinath, Kenpachi, zelblade, phagga, Jayjay54, MidnightGladius, Maverick32x, Ghost_403, Paperscraps, Sinani206
Dirk Hardpec (2): Grackaroni, Nisani201
Sbrubbles (1): Hassybaby
Kitaman27 (1): Dirk Hardpec
Ghost_403 (1): Mr. Wiggles
Bluelightz, Adam4167 and Sbrubbles Have yet to vote!
With 23 alive it takes 12 to lynch! 1 hours of testing remains!
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EPT
