EPTTL Mafia LII: JubJub Mafia - Page 15
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
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Jackal58
United States4264 Posts
On March 12 2012 19:21 prplhz wrote: +1 for the Pink Floyd reference though. @EchelonTee How do you feel about Jackal58? You only say that it's fast forming, but it's not really JubJubs flocking, it was three reasonable experienced townies who are very capable of forming their own opinion who all saw the same thing. If anything is unsettling, it's the lack of people jumping on the wagon after the initial three. How the fuck do you know they are townies? I still don't understand how me calling Callers case on DocH bullshit makes me scummy. Do you agree with Callers bullshit case on DocH? Do you agree with Caller that anybody that called his case bullshit had to be scum? I guess you probably do Jub Jub. I'll bet your pants and hat sizes are the same. | ||
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EchelonTee
United States5262 Posts
On March 12 2012 21:28 Mattchew wrote: and i don't hate it means I like it. Its a common phrase used amongst me and my friends, I can see how that doesn't translate as well to a wider audience, yay for typing freely like i was on skype or gchat! shh if the hosts hear you talking like this they'll smite you  i should clarify that i'm not saying meta is completely trash; just that a case based almost solely on meta (curu's), I simply cannot support. got school. peace yall | ||
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Jitsu
United States929 Posts
And then, low and behold, Curu actually does come in and post case against Jackal. I'm not a fan of odds and probability, but seriously. I actually can't believe people are buying a bullshit excuse that prphlz just guessed Curu made the post our of everyone else here, and then Curu suddenly makes a post on Jackal. I have a midterm. I'll bed back later. | ||
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prplhz
Denmark8045 Posts
On March 12 2012 21:30 Jackal58 wrote: How the fuck do you know they are townies? I still don't understand how me calling Callers case on DocH bullshit makes me scummy. Do you agree with Callers bullshit case on DocH? Do you agree with Caller that anybody that called his case bullshit had to be scum? I guess you probably do Jub Jub. I'll bet your pants and hat sizes are the same. I don't know that they're townies, duh. I think it's more likely that they're town than scum right now because they saw the same things I saw. No, I never agreed with Caller's case on DoctorHelvetica, I made that clear in the thread multiple times, I wonder how you manage to miss that. Caller acknowledged this but he never called me scum so it's a lie when you say that Caller thinks that anybody who called his case bullshit had to be scum. No one complained about the fact that you called Caller's case bullshit, people complained about the way you called Caller's case bullshit. | ||
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Jackal58
United States4264 Posts
On March 12 2012 21:53 prplhz wrote: I don't know that they're townies, duh. I think it's more likely that they're town than scum right now because they saw the same things I saw. No, I never agreed with Caller's case on DoctorHelvetica, I made that clear in the thread multiple times, I wonder how you manage to miss that. Caller acknowledged this but he never called me scum so it's a lie when you say that Caller thinks that anybody who called his case bullshit had to be scum. No one complained about the fact that you called Caller's case bullshit, people complained about the way you called Caller's case bullshit. How exactly should I go about calling bullshit bullshit? Cow patties? Bovine excrement? Bull pockey? Cow crap? Help me out here scummy. Which method of calling bullshit bullshit do you want me to use? Your Fruit of the Loom tag is showing. It's right between your eyes. | ||
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Jackal58
United States4264 Posts
On March 12 2012 19:21 prplhz wrote: +1 for the Pink Floyd reference though. @EchelonTee How do you feel about Jackal58? You only say that it's fast forming, but it's not really JubJubs flocking, it was three reasonable experienced townies who are very capable of forming their own opinion who all saw the same thing. If anything is unsettling, it's the lack of people jumping on the wagon after the initial three. On March 12 2012 19:21 prplhz wrote: I don't know that they're townies, duh. I think it's more likely that they're town than scum right now because they saw the same things I saw. DUH!!!!!!!!! Bullcrap. Better? | ||
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Caller
Poland8075 Posts
I am concerned, though, about posts like this: Right now I'm feeling the Jackal lynch more than anything else. He says that he plays differently every game, but I feel that enough of a case has been made to show that that's not at all true (see: Curu's post). His tentative posting so far this game does remind me of his posts in Hammer Mini Mafia, where he was also scum. He also listed me as one of the "good" players, which is so utterly wrong it's hilarious. (not a real reason for voting him, but seriously, I'm terribad) I also don't think that Caller is scum, based purely on the fact that he's the first person to make a real case and get some actual discussion going. I feel scum would've been content to let the thread continue to wallow in LaL arguments and the PM debate, where no progress was being made. Hammer on end of bandwagon? Check. False modesty? Check. Discussion = good? Check. Generic assumptions about scum behavior? Check. I really don't like what I'm seeing here, Node. Nope nope nope. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
Jackal. You were the light in many games I've played and I don't want You gone. Caller should probably be ignored. He is aggressive and troll-like. If he is Mafia he loses thread presence early, if he is Town then he'll step his game up and we'll know what's going on. I agree with Jackal that Caller's case on DrH based on first "pro-town" usage is bullshit. Does this say much? Not that much, but I am more likely to believe that Jackal's town, Caller's tunnel visioned town/mafia and DrH is innocent. Also, I hope someone is making a redo of Operation Honeypot. Thing was amazing. Now let me catch up to the newest things. | ||
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
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Abenson
Canada4122 Posts
On March 12 2012 22:34 Kurumi wrote: I am against the Jackal58 lynch Day 1. He's a good player and tends to get picked off by Mafia early nowadays. Jackal. You were the light in many games I've played and I don't want You gone. Caller should probably be ignored. He is aggressive and troll-like. If he is Mafia he loses thread presence early, if he is Town then he'll step his game up and we'll know what's going on. I agree with Jackal that Caller's case on DrH based on first "pro-town" usage is bullshit. Does this say much? Not that much, but I am more likely to believe that Jackal's town, Caller's tunnel visioned town/mafia and DrH is innocent. Also, I hope someone is making a redo of Operation Honeypot. Thing was amazing. Now let me catch up to the newest things. Just ignore Caller's case on DrH completely. He's just trolling. The other stuff he posted seems to be legit though. | ||
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
Schworz is away too. Deconduo said he dislikes the way layabout plays and that's it, though he's EU so I think he'll come back in something like 4-5 hours. Bill Murray is playing a good game so far and I am really happy about that. jaybrundage, You voted Schworz really quick, then posted a list with people we should lynch and then voted Jackal, sup? You ask for cases, say other cases are bad and never make one Yourself, what's up man? | ||
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Jitsu
United States929 Posts
On March 12 2012 15:01 Bill Murray wrote: jitsu, what are your thoughts on layabout's alignment this game? I'm going to tie this into the response to ET's case against me, because I think it's important to note. I read you're case, and broke it up into two sections. The first section is a case against me that I am spewing bullshit about Lynch All Liar's policy. Whether it's useful or not to town isn't the issue. I believe it is, and when enforced, can be powerful too. Whether you agree or disagree doesn't matter. My intention was to come in, set the tone, show that no bullshit was going to be taken, and then continue on. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316574¤tpage=9#169 At this point, I was essentially finished talking about Lynch All Liars. I stressed my point many times, and felt that it was enough and didn't need to be reopened. You say that I continued to talk about the LaL policy up. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316574¤tpage=9#175 Layabout comes in and questions my reasoning on the matter, which turns into a large (albeit un-needed) blowout about two players opinions on how the game should be played. The snowball grows and we continue to bicker. Mr.Wiggles comes in, asks me a final question, and I think that's the end of the topic of LaL. Also, ET, you're first quote...: What about lying in PM's? In what situation would you use it? Can you logically and clearly explain you're reasoning to the rest of the town when the lie is brought out to the forums? If yes - yes, I would be ok with that. If no - no, don't lie. Simple. Again, calculated lies are something that could potentially have high risk/low reward. Remember that as well ...is in response to gumshoe. Go back and look at it. I didn't feel the need to add a quote because his post was one or two above mine, and was "easily" associated with it. It's not a continuation, it's a response. Don't make it out like it is. Secondly, you say that my case on prphlz is flimsy. How many games have you played? Have you ever mis-read the name of a player? It's generally the first thing I look at when someone posts. I don't "get all giddy and assume" that it's someone. You think prphlz would just go right by a nametag at the top of a post, and assume it's someone? Please. You and I both know he is better then that. For example: If I say, "Hey ET, nice case on Qatol." And then you post your case on Qatol. zzz... How does that not give outside communication? Curu already say they weren't PMing, so that kills that reason. As for LayAbout, I have no idea. I think he was more interested in trying to prove me wrong on the Accountability discussion then actually contributing to town. I've only played one other game with him, but that's something we can't discuss at this point. | ||
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
On March 13 2012 00:38 Jitsu wrote: I'm going to tie this into the response to ET's case against me, because I think it's important to note. I read you're case, and broke it up into two sections. The first section is a case against me that I am spewing bullshit about Lynch All Liar's policy. Whether it's useful or not to town isn't the issue. I believe it is, and when enforced, can be powerful too. Whether you agree or disagree doesn't matter. My intention was to come in, set the tone, show that no bullshit was going to be taken, and then continue on. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316574¤tpage=9#169 At this point, I was essentially finished talking about Lynch All Liars. I stressed my point many times, and felt that it was enough and didn't need to be reopened. You say that I continued to talk about the LaL policy up. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316574¤tpage=9#175 Layabout comes in and questions my reasoning on the matter, which turns into a large (albeit un-needed) blowout about two players opinions on how the game should be played. The snowball grows and we continue to bicker. Mr.Wiggles comes in, asks me a final question, and I think that's the end of the topic of LaL. Also, ET, you're first quote...: ...is in response to gumshoe. Go back and look at it. I didn't feel the need to add a quote because his post was one or two above mine, and was "easily" associated with it. It's not a continuation, it's a response. Don't make it out like it is. Secondly, you say that my case on prphlz is flimsy. How many games have you played? Have you ever mis-read the name of a player? It's generally the first thing I look at when someone posts. I don't "get all giddy and assume" that it's someone. You think prphlz would just go right by a nametag at the top of a post, and assume it's someone? Please. You and I both know he is better then that. For example: If I say, "Hey ET, nice case on Qatol." And then you post your case on Qatol. zzz... How does that not give outside communication? Curu already say they weren't PMing, so that kills that reason. As for LayAbout, I have no idea. I think he was more interested in trying to prove me wrong on the Accountability discussion then actually contributing to town. I've only played one other game with him, but that's something we can't discuss at this point. you didn't call out my vote on you... and spew bullshit about it even though I gave you a perfect opportunity too. also, i didn't realize that was your inference with the prplhz curu and caller situation. That was beyond me, and is actually pretty smart imma re-read that page ##unvote Jitsu | ||
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
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Jitsu
United States929 Posts
I just ignored him, just like I ignored that. | ||
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
Was it the narrative at the begin that was suppoosed to address the case against him? Was it was the "you called my case flimsy, how about i address none of your points and clarify none of my points and pretend to have refuted your criticism?" Or maybe it was the I cannot be bothered to think of somehthing to say about layabout part? | ||
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Curu
Canada2817 Posts
1. Jackal Town Jitsu Mafia = why protect Jackal with something dumb right now, should just go with it and let us case formers take the fall after flip 2. Jackal Town Jitsu Town = can explain his actions 3. Jackal Mafia Jitsu Town = can explain his actions 4. Jackal Mafia Jitsu Mafia = can explain his actions There's also the possibility that Jitsu is softly setting us up for the fall afterwards but still intending a Jackal lynch to happen, which would fall under scenario 1, but that's like Ace-level scum planning so I think pretty unlikely. It does look weird that we all came to the conclusion so simultaneously but I've provided links to posts in post-game discussion where I came to the same conclusion in a game from 4 months ago. Since the get-go I've drawn the same feeling from Jackal this game but I wanted to wait a bit to see him post more. When I saw Caller had already thrown down a case, though, I thought time was good to add in my thoughts. prplhz is someone who has also played many games with Jackal. There are two people I would say I have played enough with enough/recognize enough signs from to call Mafia based on meta tells and those are Jackal and Palmar. I also don't buy this "don't lynch him yet, he's a good player etc etc" there is only one person I would extend this rule to and that is Mig because he is a crushing Town player and an awful scum player. You lynch based on who you think has the highest probability to flip scum, way back in the day when I was on the scumteam we were able to pull out a dominating victory because people kept pushing "don't lynch Curu/chaoser/Mig/etc yet because they are good players (we were all scum)," ended up constantly lynching newbies and Palmar, who was the one pushing pretty hard for all 3 of us. was then killed. Palmar's cases faded from memory and we cruised through the rest of the game. | ||
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Curu
Canada2817 Posts
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prplhz
Denmark8045 Posts
The argument itself it quite bad. He wants to lynch me based on how he doesn't think that people misread stuff once in a while. So assuming that I didn't misread, he is conjecturing that I'm in private contact with Curu. Because Curu said that he wasn't in PM contact with anybody, he is assuming that Curu isn't in PM contact with anybody. If we are in contact, this leaves only the option that me and Curu and scumbuddies and this is Jitsu's main argument for why I am scum. I've already said why it is bad, but I'll say it again. A scum team doesn't coordinate half of their team posting the same case to get Jackal58, or anybody, lynched. That is just ludicrous. Generally, scum coordination is to stay spread out and not associate themselves too much with each other, not to orchestrate high-risk low-yield plans. Furthermore this is bad for Jitsu because; the misread argument can be applied with the exact same validity that Jitsu thinks that it has to someone who isn't me; Curu. The main argument is that Curu and I are scumbuddies. If, in Jitsu's mind, Curu and I are scumbuddies, then why the hell isn't he pushing Curu at all, but only me? Jitsu didn't even mention Curu in any of his posts outside of when he's pushing me. He doesn't even believe in his argument himself. Jitsu is scum and Jackal58 is scum with him. | ||
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