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On November 24 2011 21:15 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Long wall with poor DT plan that doesn't adress my question.
I'd like you to answer my question.
About the DT plan: That does not help shit. First because DTs are extremelly unreliable this game, because there are 4 counter DT measures in place, which is down right crazy by the host (sanity/millers/framers/gf). DTs should definetely not claim early on since their usefulness will grow imensely as the game goes on. When early on a check by a DT is worth almost nothing in this game, several checks couple with analysis later can certainly turn a game, since statistically, the bulk of your checks are way harder to be tempered with. That means any plans trying to stablish early sanity of DTs are useless, especially when you point them to a list, allowing it to be tempered with at much more ease. What DTs should be doing is breadcrumbing their checks (that means you use a clever way to say someone is town/scum without revealing you are DT; you should be careful not to confuse town about your checks in case you die) everyday so we can have the checks in case he gets shot. We should be able to deduce the parity by seeing previous flips.
To answer some questions people asked me:
What differentiates me from other vets is that I normally have really good reads. Palmar, if town is a good scumhunter too and he does seem town to me so far. Someone asked me "what if you are scum never perform the kills?". If I was scum, at some point, even if it took being the last from the scum team, I would have to shoot. We have to kill all scum to win, so the possibility that I would never appear in the clues as scum doesn't exist, unless scum wins with more than one player left.
The fact is, were I scum I would be lynched way before that point, because I'm taking full acountability here. If I'm using dubious reasoning and getting townies lynched, I fully expect the town to lynch me, but that won't happen. I will always provide ample analysis and reasoning on the subjects I think are scum and if I used flawed logic I expect many players here to identify it.
The truth is that elected roles almost always end up being lynched before the game ends. That makes me a good mayor, because I offer accountability. Palmar is also a good option, because if he is scum, it will show soon through his actions. Other people that are running are way more suceptible of making mistakes and getting mislynched if they are town.
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Well to follow up on my previous commitment, I'm voting sandroba as your thoughts seem towny so far. I'm not running because honestly I would rather die than be invulnerable for a while and have all the solid players around me die. Plus too much effort frankly.
Also, I don't frankly think you are the kind of player who as scum could be too detrimental to town as the mayor.
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On November 24 2011 21:15 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Detectives
Regardless of if I win this election or not I will post three names during night 1 (hopefully near the start). EVERY single one of you will investigate one of these names. The reason for this is for sanity clarification process. All of you will be sitting on the information of one specific person. It will all be different. Sane people will have the person flip the natural alignment. Paranoid will have it flip scum always, insane flip in reverse (anti town as town and town as anti town) and naive always town. But mr. BC with this a mafia framer can easily fuck everything all up! This could almost be true. Except this is where the rolecop comes in. All rolecops will also check into this list. IF a rolecop spots a red in this list we lynch that person, medics now have a medic target to protect for further nights. In the event multiple reds are caught via this process we have night 2 vig targets as well.
How does the rolecop help here exactly? There's only a handful of roles that are unique to one side: DT, Vet, Hatter, Framer. If none of those are amongst the names checked, then the framer will still be able to mess things up. You also have millers to account for. On top of this, the people need to flip before it actually will help with anything.
On November 24 2011 22:02 Jackal58 wrote:
Good morning, role received, game on.
Palmar
Sandroba
BC
Decon.
Any one of you would make an excellent choice for mayor. If you're town. All 4 of you scare the hell out of me if you're scum.
If you would please tell us who or how you will determine who is the person you will lynch on day 1?
If you are a noob please consider the fact that while each of those candidates all had an 80% (That's the percentage you're looking for Palmar) probability of rolling town the probability that one of them is scum is damn near 100%.
I will lynch a veteran player who is trying to look like they are contributing without really saying anything. I've found that this is generally one of the better scumtells that even good players fall victim to. Also players who were active in the pre-game and have disappeared somewhat. Kitaman is guilty of this right now, though it still is early in the day.
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On November 25 2011 00:01 deconduo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2011 21:15 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Detectives
Regardless of if I win this election or not I will post three names during night 1 (hopefully near the start). EVERY single one of you will investigate one of these names. The reason for this is for sanity clarification process. All of you will be sitting on the information of one specific person. It will all be different. Sane people will have the person flip the natural alignment. Paranoid will have it flip scum always, insane flip in reverse (anti town as town and town as anti town) and naive always town. But mr. BC with this a mafia framer can easily fuck everything all up! This could almost be true. Except this is where the rolecop comes in. All rolecops will also check into this list. IF a rolecop spots a red in this list we lynch that person, medics now have a medic target to protect for further nights. In the event multiple reds are caught via this process we have night 2 vig targets as well. How does the rolecop help here exactly? There's only a handful of roles that are unique to one side: DT, Vet, Hatter, Framer. If none of those are amongst the names checked, then the framer will still be able to mess things up. You also have millers to account for. On top of this, the people need to flip before it actually will help with anything. Show nested quote +On November 24 2011 22:02 Jackal58 wrote:
Good morning, role received, game on.
Palmar
Sandroba
BC
Decon.
Any one of you would make an excellent choice for mayor. If you're town. All 4 of you scare the hell out of me if you're scum.
If you would please tell us who or how you will determine who is the person you will lynch on day 1?
If you are a noob please consider the fact that while each of those candidates all had an 80% (That's the percentage you're looking for Palmar) probability of rolling town the probability that one of them is scum is damn near 100%. I will lynch a veteran player who is trying to look like they are contributing without really saying anything. I've found that this is generally one of the better scumtells that even good players fall victim to. Also players who were active in the pre-game and have disappeared somewhat. Kitaman is guilty of this right now, though it still is early in the day.
What do make of my assertion that one of the four of you I listed is almost certainly scum?
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now since bc left the conversation and things are starting to chill out a bit (talking about the massive amounts of texts so far):
Someone who's not a vet willing wo discuss a bit about the candidates so far? I'd like to hear a bit of "normal" thoughts rather than thoughts from people I know are playing much better than I am and therefore could easily trick me into thinking something they want me to think.
So far we got Palmar, Sandroba and BC voted a bunch. I got to say I don't like players who are voting that early in a newby game (unless they're voting themselves) because there will probably be a bunch of guys not knowing what to do and therefore they'll just stick with who got some votes as so many people can't be wrong right? However mafia is very well able to shift things with just something like 2 votes early on to get a few new players on their candidate as well which will attract more new players because again, that guy got some votes.
That's basicly the reason I don't like to vote for Palmar right now. I think he's looking town but I don't like to get people voting on nothing but a shitload of text that noone of the new players is going to read and therefore I doubt that new players who voted for him did it because they think he's a good choice.
BC actually looks the most town to me. I like his answers as they are clear, less spammy and downright "neutral". However as people said he's a good mafia player he's probably capable of looking townie. Although I think he's looking like the best choice right now I'm kinda scared to vote for him. Also I don't like his dt plan at all. This thing got just a huge potential to go incredible wrong. I'm not saying it's likely or something like that (can't judge that right now) but I think we're pretty screwed if he's mafia and / or his plan fails.
Sandroba is the guy I have the fewest "reads" on right now. Maybe that's actually a good thing because again: I thinkall of them would have an easy time getting me to think they're town no matter if they happen to be mafia or town.
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Response
About Lynch-All-Liars
Some people are wondering why we need to lynch a person just because he lied. Townies can lie too but it is very important that they don't as they will muddy up the thread. There are very few situations where a townie should lie, but only the absolutely top players will have to lie at any point during this game. A strict Lynch-All-Liars policy shouldn't even be discussed as it might lead to some players thinking it will not be implemented, thinking that they can get away with lying. Discussing Lynch-All-Liars is counterproductive to itself. If you lie, you will get lynched.
Response to BloodyC0bbler
I didn't comment on your campaign because your detective plan was much more interesting and makes up the bulk of it. I don't think you should be mayor. To all the people who do not know who BloodyC0bbler is, he is very likely the best town and scum player in this game. I find that you being mayor is far too dangerous for town if you are scum.
Response to Jackal58
I will decide my lynch later. Right now I don't have any candidates, though I think youngminii is being weird when he argues that he will not vote Palmar because he is down playing his scum abilites, while voting sandroba who is doing just the same. I plan on figuring out a lynch candidate around 12 hours before the deadline. I plan on picking my lynch based on popular opinion, but I'm going to go out on a limb if I don't think that this person is scum. I plan to listen to everybody, but especially the veterans.
You say that there is 80% chance of a person being town. This doesn't change the fact that scum can actively push their own candidate to further their chances of getting elected. I also don't like to rely on statistics like that for elections. If any of the guys you mentioned got elected, it would be very scary. If I got elected, ... well, it would hardly be that scary now would it?
Response to xtfftc
You are clearly downplaying your town abilities in your post, I have no idea why you would do this if you weren't trying to lower people's expectations. We can all agree that a town Palmar would make a great mayor, but you are saying that you are inclined to vote for him already. This is weird to me, because Palmar hasn't proved himself to be town aligned yet, not at all. It also makes your campaign seem insincere and that makes me wonder why you even tried to run for mayor in the first place. If you can't get elected why aren't you trying to vote a candidate that fits your own platform?
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On November 24 2011 20:31 supersoft wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2011 19:45 Nokarot wrote:
Cool, thanks guys. In that case, I temporarily have voted for prplhz (in the voting thread) being as that I thought he was the most helpful to me as a new player and least aggressive one so far. However, as the game has just started, I'm certainly willing to change my vote based on what I hear between now and the deadline.
##Vote prplhz
I knew it. Prplhz has one MAGIC sentence for the newbs in his text: "If you are afraid that you might make a silly mistake because this is your first game, and scum will jump on you for it and try to get you lynched, you need to vote me for mayor."Let me explain why I strongly disagree with that sentence in so many ways: This sentence appeals to your emotions: This sentence scares you. Noone wants to get lynched for one little mistake. Town tries to be objective. We want to see the facts. The truth! We don't go the emotional way: What prplhz hasn't done is to proove what he says: Did he link any games where he defended an innocent townie who was being lynched? I can think of a game where Palmar and I defended innocent townies two days in a row. But I don't have prplhz in mind when it comes down to defend someone who's innocent. The assumption that scum jumps on you for little mistakes is wrong! In fact, everyone jumps on you for little mistakes! And that is good! We have to start somewhere. And therefor we need a healthy portion of aggression. If people jump on you, don't be afraid. Explain yourself. Defend yourself. It's part of this game. It's the only way to get informations. And last but not least, prplhz as mayor won't be able to save you! We have to lynch and he knows that as good as we all know it. One of our main goal of this game will be to separate the bad townies from scum. If we all get it wrong and we try to lynch you and you're innocent, prplhz is not the allmighty who is smarter than we all. His allegation that he is the one who's able to seperate between them is unproven so far.
Actually you should check his last game played when there where two mislynches that prp tried to stop, on new/inexperienced townies
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Im voting prplhz because i think it outlined his campaign well. And last game i played with him he did very well
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On November 25 2011 00:07 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2011 00:01 deconduo wrote:On November 24 2011 21:15 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Detectives
Regardless of if I win this election or not I will post three names during night 1 (hopefully near the start). EVERY single one of you will investigate one of these names. The reason for this is for sanity clarification process. All of you will be sitting on the information of one specific person. It will all be different. Sane people will have the person flip the natural alignment. Paranoid will have it flip scum always, insane flip in reverse (anti town as town and town as anti town) and naive always town. But mr. BC with this a mafia framer can easily fuck everything all up! This could almost be true. Except this is where the rolecop comes in. All rolecops will also check into this list. IF a rolecop spots a red in this list we lynch that person, medics now have a medic target to protect for further nights. In the event multiple reds are caught via this process we have night 2 vig targets as well. How does the rolecop help here exactly? There's only a handful of roles that are unique to one side: DT, Vet, Hatter, Framer. If none of those are amongst the names checked, then the framer will still be able to mess things up. You also have millers to account for. On top of this, the people need to flip before it actually will help with anything. On November 24 2011 22:02 Jackal58 wrote:
Good morning, role received, game on.
Palmar
Sandroba
BC
Decon.
Any one of you would make an excellent choice for mayor. If you're town. All 4 of you scare the hell out of me if you're scum.
If you would please tell us who or how you will determine who is the person you will lynch on day 1?
If you are a noob please consider the fact that while each of those candidates all had an 80% (That's the percentage you're looking for Palmar) probability of rolling town the probability that one of them is scum is damn near 100%. I will lynch a veteran player who is trying to look like they are contributing without really saying anything. I've found that this is generally one of the better scumtells that even good players fall victim to. Also players who were active in the pre-game and have disappeared somewhat. Kitaman is guilty of this right now, though it still is early in the day. What do make of my assertion that one of the four of you I listed is almost certainly scum?
I assume that mafia will probably send out their best player along with one other person to run for mayor. I wouldn't be surprised if either of those 3 are mafia, but I also wouldn't say its almost 100%. It also depends on if the mafia team was completely RNGd or selectively picked.
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On November 25 2011 00:13 Toadesstern wrote:
now since bc left the conversation and things are starting to chill out a bit (talking about the massive amounts of texts so far):
Someone who's not a vet willing wo discuss a bit about the candidates so far? I'd like to hear a bit of "normal" thoughts rather than thoughts from people I know are playing much better than I am and therefore could easily trick me into thinking something they want me to think.
So far we got Palmar, Sandroba and BC voted a bunch. I got to say I don't like players who are voting that early in a newby game (unless they're voting themselves) because there will probably be a bunch of guys not knowing what to do and therefore they'll just stick with who got some votes as so many people can't be wrong right? However mafia is very well able to shift things with just something like 2 votes early on to get a few new players on their candidate as well which will attract more new players because again, that guy got some votes.
That's basicly the reason I don't like to vote for Palmar right now. I think he's looking town but I don't like to get people voting on nothing but a shitload of text that noone of the new players is going to read and therefore I doubt that new players who voted for him did it because they think he's a good choice.
BC actually looks the most town to me. I like his answers as they are clear, less spammy and downright "neutral". However as people said he's a good mafia player he's probably capable of looking townie. Although I think he's looking like the best choice right now I'm kinda scared to vote for him. Also I don't like his dt plan at all. This thing got just a huge potential to go incredible wrong. I'm not saying it's likely or something like that (can't judge that right now) but I think we're pretty screwed if he's mafia and / or his plan fails.
Sandroba is the guy I have the fewest "reads" on right now. Maybe that's actually a good thing because again: I thinkall of them would have an easy time getting me to think they're town no matter if they happen to be mafia or town.
Your approach is slightly incorrect. I promised to call out bad logic when it is applied. I have no problem with you thinking BC looks more town than me, but if you convince yourself that we would all be able to fool you, you're not going to get anything done.
Occam's Razor is a principle that says that the simplest solution is the correct one (or well, technically it says that when selecting among competing hypotheses, you should pick the one that makes the fewest assumptions).
If you think something looks good, it's because it probably is. Now, I am obviously aware that this is a game of deceit, but that doesn't change the fact that working under the assumption that the simplest explanation must be true, is generally a fruitful strategy.
You should only question the obvious, when you have a good reason to do so. Everything said and done in a mafia game is subject to WIFOM (Wine in front of me) reasoning. (You will see this term pop up, so please read the link I provided and familiarize yourself with the idea).
Because you have no way of knowing if something is true or false, you should usually just read it critically, make a decision and run with it. The fear of being wrong leads to so many bad decisions by towns. There is nothing to fear, as long as you're wrong for the right reasons, and you listen and read with an open mind.
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The host is GM and he is strongly against RNG'ing teams.
This list of players is very likely to be mafia dense based on how GM likes to balance his games:
3.) kitaman27
4.) sandroba
13.) redFF
17.) Jackal58
19.) Palmar
26.) wherebugsgo
55.) deconduo
57.) Coagulation
63.) youngminii
68.) BloodyC0bbler
76.) Lemonwalrus
78.) syllogism
I'd expect at least 1/3 of these players to be mafia, probably more.
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Sandroba, how do you feel about lynching Youngminii?
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On November 25 2011 00:18 prplhz wrote:
Response to xtfftc
You are clearly downplaying your town abilities in your post, I have no idea why you would do this if you weren't trying to lower people's expectations. We can all agree that a town Palmar would make a great mayor, but you are saying that you are inclined to vote for him already. This is weird to me, because Palmar hasn't proved himself to be town aligned yet, not at all. It also makes your campaign seem insincere and that makes me wonder why you even tried to run for mayor in the first place. If you can't get elected why aren't you trying to vote a candidate that fits your own platform?
I have plan A and plan B. Plan A is to vote for an experienced player who I have a town read on and push for his election. In case Plan A fails (i.e. I am not convinced about any of the candidates), Plan B is to get myself elected as I am the reasonable compromise. I haven't downplayed my abilities but given a fair assessment of myself. Do you reckon that after playing two games and a half (I replaced GM once), I am any better than what I said I was?
So, please answer my questions with direct quotes.
Why did you imply that I presented myself as a "complete newbie" when I wrote that I have "some experience but not too much" and am "experienced enough to know who is who - but not enough to win the game on my own"?
What made you think that I suggested that "if I do bad, then just lynch me"?
And when did I pledge my vote for Palmar?
Again, please provide proof. Try not to paraphrase me this time; I want actual quotes.
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On November 25 2011 00:24 jaybrundage wrote:
Im voting prplhz because i think it outlined his campaign well. And last game i played with him he did very well
You should not discuss players who are still alive in ongoing games.
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On November 25 2011 00:38 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2011 00:13 Toadesstern wrote:
now since bc left the conversation and things are starting to chill out a bit (talking about the massive amounts of texts so far):
Someone who's not a vet willing wo discuss a bit about the candidates so far? I'd like to hear a bit of "normal" thoughts rather than thoughts from people I know are playing much better than I am and therefore could easily trick me into thinking something they want me to think.
So far we got Palmar, Sandroba and BC voted a bunch. I got to say I don't like players who are voting that early in a newby game (unless they're voting themselves) because there will probably be a bunch of guys not knowing what to do and therefore they'll just stick with who got some votes as so many people can't be wrong right? However mafia is very well able to shift things with just something like 2 votes early on to get a few new players on their candidate as well which will attract more new players because again, that guy got some votes.
That's basicly the reason I don't like to vote for Palmar right now. I think he's looking town but I don't like to get people voting on nothing but a shitload of text that noone of the new players is going to read and therefore I doubt that new players who voted for him did it because they think he's a good choice.
BC actually looks the most town to me. I like his answers as they are clear, less spammy and downright "neutral". However as people said he's a good mafia player he's probably capable of looking townie. Although I think he's looking like the best choice right now I'm kinda scared to vote for him. Also I don't like his dt plan at all. This thing got just a huge potential to go incredible wrong. I'm not saying it's likely or something like that (can't judge that right now) but I think we're pretty screwed if he's mafia and / or his plan fails.
Sandroba is the guy I have the fewest "reads" on right now. Maybe that's actually a good thing because again: I thinkall of them would have an easy time getting me to think they're town no matter if they happen to be mafia or town. Your approach is slightly incorrect. I promised to call out bad logic when it is applied. I have no problem with you thinking BC looks more town than me, but if you convince yourself that we would all be able to fool you, you're not going to get anything done. Occam's Razor is a principle that says that the simplest solution is the correct one (or well, technically it says that when selecting among competing hypotheses, you should pick the one that makes the fewest assumptions). If you think something looks good, it's because it probably is. Now, I am obviously aware that this is a game of deceit, but that doesn't change the fact that working under the assumption that the simplest explanation must be true, is generally a fruitful strategy. You should only question the obvious, when you have a good reason to do so. Everything said and done in a mafia game is subject to WIFOM (Wine in front of me) reasoning. (You will see this term pop up, so please read the link I provided and familiarize yourself with the idea). Because you have no way of knowing if something is true or false, you should usually just read it critically, make a decision and run with it. The fear of being wrong leads to so many bad decisions by towns. There is nothing to fear, as long as you're wrong for the right reasons, and you listen and read with an open mind.
The big deal here is that I don't believe all 3 of you are town there although all of you look to be townie (with bc > palmar > sandroba imo) I got to say that most likely one or two of you got to be mafia which changes your Occam's Razor principle A LOT.
Let's put it simple: I don't think all 3 of you are town. Even if I'm wrong here I don't care because all 3 of you = townie would be awesome for us.
I don't think all 3 of you are mafia as well. Therefore although your Occam's Razor tells me to assume all 3 of you are town because you look town imo it's wrong here because of that one added condition.
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On November 25 2011 00:13 Toadesstern wrote:
Someone who's not a vet willing wo discuss a bit about the candidates so far? I'd like to hear a bit of "normal" thoughts rather than thoughts from people I know are playing much better than I am and therefore could easily trick me into thinking something they want me to think.
All serious candidates are rather careful so far. They always are, of course, but this time it's somewhat different, like an attempt not to scare the newbies away from voting for them. There's no pressure applied, just polite strategy and policy discussions. There's nothing wrong with this but it almost feels like the game hasn't started yet. And in a way, it hasn't. I don't think that you've been tricked by anyone thus far just because no one has really made anything. BC leaves the impression of a man with a plan (although I don't agree with his DT strategy) and Youngmini appears to be doing some lame attempt to pressure Palmar. There's not much else for now.
I would once again advise everyone to base their votes on what the major candidates do when they start hunting for mafia.
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Despite disagreeing with his logic, his behaviour so far does not point towards scum. He is been way too transparent and agressive with his opinion and that is not a mafia characteristic. If you check the games ym plays as town you will see very similar behaviour and as mafia he is not as out there. So I wouldn't lynch him at this point.
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On November 25 2011 00:46 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2011 00:38 Palmar wrote:On November 25 2011 00:13 Toadesstern wrote:
now since bc left the conversation and things are starting to chill out a bit (talking about the massive amounts of texts so far):
Someone who's not a vet willing wo discuss a bit about the candidates so far? I'd like to hear a bit of "normal" thoughts rather than thoughts from people I know are playing much better than I am and therefore could easily trick me into thinking something they want me to think.
So far we got Palmar, Sandroba and BC voted a bunch. I got to say I don't like players who are voting that early in a newby game (unless they're voting themselves) because there will probably be a bunch of guys not knowing what to do and therefore they'll just stick with who got some votes as so many people can't be wrong right? However mafia is very well able to shift things with just something like 2 votes early on to get a few new players on their candidate as well which will attract more new players because again, that guy got some votes.
That's basicly the reason I don't like to vote for Palmar right now. I think he's looking town but I don't like to get people voting on nothing but a shitload of text that noone of the new players is going to read and therefore I doubt that new players who voted for him did it because they think he's a good choice.
BC actually looks the most town to me. I like his answers as they are clear, less spammy and downright "neutral". However as people said he's a good mafia player he's probably capable of looking townie. Although I think he's looking like the best choice right now I'm kinda scared to vote for him. Also I don't like his dt plan at all. This thing got just a huge potential to go incredible wrong. I'm not saying it's likely or something like that (can't judge that right now) but I think we're pretty screwed if he's mafia and / or his plan fails.
Sandroba is the guy I have the fewest "reads" on right now. Maybe that's actually a good thing because again: I thinkall of them would have an easy time getting me to think they're town no matter if they happen to be mafia or town. Your approach is slightly incorrect. I promised to call out bad logic when it is applied. I have no problem with you thinking BC looks more town than me, but if you convince yourself that we would all be able to fool you, you're not going to get anything done. Occam's Razor is a principle that says that the simplest solution is the correct one (or well, technically it says that when selecting among competing hypotheses, you should pick the one that makes the fewest assumptions). If you think something looks good, it's because it probably is. Now, I am obviously aware that this is a game of deceit, but that doesn't change the fact that working under the assumption that the simplest explanation must be true, is generally a fruitful strategy. You should only question the obvious, when you have a good reason to do so. Everything said and done in a mafia game is subject to WIFOM (Wine in front of me) reasoning. (You will see this term pop up, so please read the link I provided and familiarize yourself with the idea). Because you have no way of knowing if something is true or false, you should usually just read it critically, make a decision and run with it. The fear of being wrong leads to so many bad decisions by towns. There is nothing to fear, as long as you're wrong for the right reasons, and you listen and read with an open mind. The big deal here is that I don't believe all 3 of you are town there although all of you look to be townie (with bc > palmar > sandroba imo) I got to say that most likely one or two of you got to be mafia which changes your Occam's Razor principle A LOT. Let's put it simple: I don't think all 3 of you are town. Even if I'm wrong here I don't care because all 3 of you = townie would be awesome for us. I don't think all 3 of you are mafia as well. Therefore although your Occam's Razor tells me to assume all 3 of you are town because you look town imo it's wrong here because of that one added condition.
Don't make assumptions like that.
You have nothing to back up the statement that you don't think all 3 of us are town. We could just as well all be town and all have the same idea (we're all veteran players, we're all afraid of being hit early, we all have the confidence to lead town).
If you want my opinions, I think Sandroba looks pretty town at the moment, because he is being open and making sense, which is why I am trying to engage in a discussion about potential lynch targets. His thoughts will allow me form a better opinion on him.
BC's plan has been broken apart by several people, and most of us agree it's not useful, however his defense of it looks pretty straightforward, despite probably favoring mafia. Because of how genuinely he defended the plan, I think it may not be a case of pushing a bad plan, but rather him actually believing it's good. I'm unable to conclude anything about his alignment now, pending re-reading of his posts.
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The above post is responding to palmar.
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United Kingdom10823 Posts
On November 25 2011 00:13 Toadesstern wrote:
now since bc left the conversation and things are starting to chill out a bit (talking about the massive amounts of texts so far):
Someone who's not a vet willing wo discuss a bit about the candidates so far? I'd like to hear a bit of "normal" thoughts rather than thoughts from people I know are playing much better than I am and therefore could easily trick me into thinking something they want me to think.
So far we got Palmar, Sandroba and BC voted a bunch. I got to say I don't like players who are voting that early in a newby game (unless they're voting themselves) because there will probably be a bunch of guys not knowing what to do and therefore they'll just stick with who got some votes as so many people can't be wrong right? However mafia is very well able to shift things with just something like 2 votes early on to get a few new players on their candidate as well which will attract more new players because again, that guy got some votes.
That's basicly the reason I don't like to vote for Palmar right now. I think he's looking town but I don't like to get people voting on nothing but a shitload of text that noone of the new players is going to read and therefore I doubt that new players who voted for him did it because they think he's a good choice.
BC actually looks the most town to me. I like his answers as they are clear, less spammy and downright "neutral". However as people said he's a good mafia player he's probably capable of looking townie. Although I think he's looking like the best choice right now I'm kinda scared to vote for him. Also I don't like his dt plan at all. This thing got just a huge potential to go incredible wrong. I'm not saying it's likely or something like that (can't judge that right now) but I think we're pretty screwed if he's mafia and / or his plan fails.
Sandroba is the guy I have the fewest "reads" on right now. Maybe that's actually a good thing because again: I thinkall of them would have an easy time getting me to think they're town no matter if they happen to be mafia or town.
Honestly, I did read through the walls of texts that were thrown on there, purely because I really don't want to mess up. My initial vote was for Palmar, because while most of his campaign may have been based on his previous games, there is always the small part of me who feels that backing a veteran will really help out in this game. But after reading through everything, I decided to retract my vote because I definitely don't want to be one of those guys who jumps on a bandwagon. I really want to make a decision on the basis of what I feel, even if it turns out wrong.
So far, my feelings are thus:
youngminii's campaign feels a lot more like a smear than one based on logical reasons. I don't see a clear outline of why he should be mayor, but reason of why Palmar shouldn't. For that reason, I just don't trust him
Palmar's campaign definitely points out his veteran status :D, and I don't mind that. He's also been following through a fair few points that he's made. He's been vocal, he's been answering questions and accusations. However, I'm going to vote;
Bloodycobbler because I think he's shown almost the same levels of activeness and assistant that Palmar has, but his plan seems more transparent. Whether it works or not, it will be clear either way imo.
One question to Palmar though; you mentioned that you would be using traditional scumhunting methods. With a game this newbie-heavy, surely you know that there is a good change a fair few do not know what that totally entails. Don't you think that's an issue?
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EPT
