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I also still feel that we haven't pulled ourselves together enough. I'm still seeing a lot of random accusations that don't really have much force behind them. Yes, I'm aware that's what my post on Foolishness is like, but there have been enough people explaining why he is scummy that it would not do any good for me to repeat them again.
So here is how all accusations must be made in the future, in order to make things clear and understandable.
Player Name
Verdict:
Explanation and evidence. Quotes must be used here.
Player Name is mafia/town.
##Vote: Player Name
This will allow everyone to clearly see and understand what you are saying. This will provide us with stronger analysis and stronger reference after players flip. Of course this will only apply to the original accusation. If you're supporting someone else's, say so, but there is no need to go through this again.
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Sorry about all the posts, but I keep thinking of things that I didn't say in the last one.
I'm guessing there is probably 5 scum. I would say the remaining scum team is Palmar, Nisani, and Foolishness. One of the more active vocal players is probably third party. Sandroba or DropBear maybe. DB might even be faking his penalty here, it could be something completely different and he's just doing that to distract from the content in his posts.
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heist, if you're a Day Vig, please flip Nisani for me now. It'll confirm something for me.
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Actually anyone that can flip Nisani, please do it now. I don't think anyone could say he isn't a good Vig target anyways.
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On July 29 2011 21:11 chaos13 wrote:
I also still feel that we haven't pulled ourselves together enough. I'm still seeing a lot of random accusations that don't really have much force behind them. Yes, I'm aware that's what my post on Foolishness is like, but there have been enough people explaining why he is scummy that it would not do any good for me to repeat them again.
So here is how all accusations must be made in the future, in order to make things clear and understandable.
Player Name
Verdict:
Explanation and evidence. Quotes must be used here.
Player Name is mafia/town.
##Vote: Player Name
This will allow everyone to clearly see and understand what you are saying. This will provide us with stronger analysis and stronger reference after players flip. Of course this will only apply to the original accusation. If you're supporting someone else's, say so, but there is no need to go through this again.
If we're to do this, and I'm not so sure that we should, I'd suggest a more refined version, such as:
+ Show Spoiler +PlayerName I believe that PlayerName is scum, because... <evidence for points 1,2,3, with quotes> ##vote PlayerName
It's not really necessary in any format though. If people make disorganized and bad accusatory posts, they're arguments won't paid attention to. It's the burden of the accuser to make a rational, well planned argument. The last thing we want is to allow the mafia to blend in, and restricting analysis to a specific format might achieve just that.
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So Foolishness is apparently a really good player right.
His day 1 contribution consisted of randomly offered lynch targets with no desire to push or analyze any of them. Two of these have flipped Town already:
On July 26 2011 20:34 Foolishness wrote:Show nested quote +On  July 26 2011 20:16 bumatlarge wrote:I haven't read a word, someone update me? I'll try to read through this later today. Wiggles is a serial Killer, Lanaia and RedFF are good lynches but are sadly not going to get lynched. People are incapable of stepping into another persons' shoes (particularly BC's shoes) and seeing things from a different perspective. This leads to foolproof logic arguments of "you don't agree with me? you must be mafia!" which reminds me that if I don't believe in another persons' religion I'm automatically going to hell.
If he was actively Pro Town and those were his reads, he would be pushing for one of them to be lynched instead of appearing to contribute without actually contributing.
On July 25 2011 15:14 Foolishness wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 15:02 Curu wrote:Dec stated people who failed to create roles were going to be modkilled though. And, judging from my own role, people who made up roles in five minutes are not all that uncommon  . I don't see what Wiggles's issue is, can you clarify that for me Wiggles? What I said about the Hallows makes sense IMO since pure randomization really defeats the purpose of having the Hallows game sine you'd ensure they'd never be given away if they randomized into the hands of Mafia or malicious 3rd Party. Win conditions are surely not made up by the players themselves so I don't think dec would have put in an extra win condition for Voldy then made it a redundant one. @Foolishness It's already generating discussion. What behavior do we have to go off of atm? @Tackster I didn't say a thing about Jackal's claim being well founded. Can you point out to me where I ever said Jackal's claim is legit and I don't want to lynch him? All I said was I think he's 3rd Party rather than Mafia but that makes a good lynch too. And did you even bother to read OriginalName's role PM? He chooses people to Mason that changes each day, he doesn't start the game Masoned with a set someone. I don't see anyone making any arguments against Jackal based on his behavior thus far. I read through his posts and frankly there's nothing indicating that he needs to hang from the noose. I am not convinced that a mafia would roleclaim straight up on day 1, that's just an lol newbie move. Of course his responses tomorrow will greatly help us, but lynching him off of flavor text is like lynching off of day 1 clues. It never works, and inactives sit and mafia twiddle their thumbs. I decided to  Start counting the number of posts where kitaman asks a question. I gave up because I was starting to run out of fingers. It would be nice to see him make a post longer than 2 lines.
Soft defense of Jackal.
He didn't think BC was a good lynch but did nothing to try to stop the wagon. Taking a stand to save one of the more experienced and renowned players is the natural reaction from a Pro Town player that thinks BC is Town, but he was content to stay on the sidelines and post random stuff. Also his vote conveniently fell on a player that had no other votes rather than Jackal; he was content with the mislynch but didn't want to be a part of it, and also didn't want to vote Jackal in case the wagon managed to derail.
Since then his contribution has consisted of nothing but walls of text defending himself and a FoS/vote onto Nisani. Nisani is the EASIEST target to attack in the world as either Town OR Mafia, and I can't believe Foolishness's contribution is a throwaway analysis/vote like that.
Now sandroba, the information I said I could give: I was the Role Thief. I could steal someone's role, and I stole Foolishness's. His post restriction is complete and utter BS, there was no restriction. What's the motivation behind it? Likely so he could draw out his role creator to snipe him. That or derail the Town into discussing it. Either way it's not real. He doesn't have a history of purposeful trolling like Kurumi does.
He also has not publicly claimed his role was stolen and I have no idea why a Town player would withhold that information. But I can see a reason Mafia would: he's the Godfather.
My theory is that he made his role description the same as the power he originally held WITH the added caveat of a post restriction and a Townie alignment. But now he can't claim his power was stolen, because any role check on him would reveal that he still had his old role and out him as the Godfather.
One final bit of evidence, Mafia clearly tried to snipe active/vet players last night. Wiggles, Mig, and likely Amber (based on Wiggles's role and him being double stacked) were the hits last night. redFF was Lanaia's Vig shot. Why not Foolishness? If what I've heard is correct, he's senior to all of them.
##Unvote
##Vote: Foolishness
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Afaik, godfather just changes your aligment to town, not your actual role. An easier explanation is that foolishness' role creator is also mafia.
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Didn't heist point something like he has bomb on foolishness?
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On July 30 2011 01:02 sandroba wrote:
Afaik, godfather just changes your aligment to town, not your actual role. An easier explanation is that foolishness' role creator is also mafia.
This is what I thought too, but in TL Mafia apparently you can choose what you want to appear as as Godfather. Looking through a few old games, you pick what role you want to appear as as Godfather or you default to Vanilla Townie.
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On July 30 2011 00:52 Varpulis wrote:Show nested quote +On July 29 2011 21:11 chaos13 wrote:
I also still feel that we haven't pulled ourselves together enough. I'm still seeing a lot of random accusations that don't really have much force behind them. Yes, I'm aware that's what my post on Foolishness is like, but there have been enough people explaining why he is scummy that it would not do any good for me to repeat them again.
So here is how all accusations must be made in the future, in order to make things clear and understandable.
Player Name
Verdict:
Explanation and evidence. Quotes must be used here.
Player Name is mafia/town.
##Vote: Player Name
This will allow everyone to clearly see and understand what you are saying. This will provide us with stronger analysis and stronger reference after players flip. Of course this will only apply to the original accusation. If you're supporting someone else's, say so, but there is no need to go through this again. If we're to do this, and I'm not so sure that we should, I'd suggest a more refined version, such as: + Show Spoiler +PlayerName I believe that PlayerName is scum, because... <evidence for points 1,2,3, with quotes> ##vote PlayerNameIt's not really necessary in any format though. If people make disorganized and bad accusatory posts, their arguments won't be paid attention to. It's the burden of the accuser to make a rational, well planned argument. The last thing we want is to allow the mafia to blend in, and restricting analysis to a specific format might achieve just that.
trainwreck of grammatical mistakes
The Foolishness-is-godfather theory is an alluring one, going to give that some thought. I'll consider changing my vote if somebody can promise a vig hit on Nisani, because I don't want him to stick around.
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So he lied about his post restriction and did not claim that he got his role stolen by a role thief?
The creator of the role thief role would by now know who stole the role, and thus we could know both who has the role and what role it is, if foolishness was town, he'd have given us this information.
I see no way around it, he's scum
##Unvote
##Vote Foolishness
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Lynching Nisani shows nothing since he always appears as the scummiest player in the game as either Town OR Mafia. I agree with him being Vig'd.
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On July 30 2011 01:10 Curu wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2011 01:02 sandroba wrote:
Afaik, godfather just changes your aligment to town, not your actual role. An easier explanation is that foolishness' role creator is also mafia. This is what I thought too, but in TL Mafia apparently you can choose what you want to appear as as Godfather. Looking through a few old games, you pick what role you want to appear as as Godfather or you default to Vanilla Townie.
Yeah, but that's in a normal setup. Because roles and alignment are separate, I'd expect godfather would just have his alignment masked, not his role.
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Alright I'll bite then. Withholding information and inventing a post restriction don't sit well with me.
What do you guys think of asking foolishness/curu's role creator to claim to confirm this claim?
##unvote
##vote Foolishness
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Unless you think I'm insanely gambiting scum trying to get Foolishness mislynched, I have no reason to lie about my original role as Role Thief.
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I agree that foolishness role creator should claim though I doubt he will. Curu's role creator should not claaim.
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On July 30 2011 01:20 Curu wrote:
Unless you think I'm insanely gambiting scum trying to get Foolishness mislynched, I have no reason to lie about my original role as Role Thief.
good point. if foolishness is scum, his role creator is too, otherwise they would have spoken up about his bullshit post restriction.
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sure he can claim.
There is another really good point in lynching Foolishness, we get rid of a really dangerous role in the form of the role thief.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On July 30 2011 01:24 Palmar wrote:
There is another really good point in lynching Foolishness, we get rid of a really dangerous role in the form of the role thief.
...
So you're saying Foolishness became the new role thief? Curu didn't mention that. So are you in contact with either Foolishness or Curu or did you create the role?
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Foolishness is a better lynch than Nisani. Nisani needs to be vigi'd if anything. There is no information revealed upon his flip since everybody has been on his shit anyway.
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EPT
