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TL Mafia XXXVI - Page 33

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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BrownBear
Profile Joined March 2010
United States6894 Posts
January 25 2011 23:33 GMT
#641
Ok, I guess I'll bite.

1.
SUNSFANNED
LunarDestiny
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States4177 Posts
January 25 2011 23:34 GMT
#642
On January 25 2011 08:13 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
Sorry for /outing, i just couldn't bring myself to care about TL mafia for the time being. I promise not to join any more games until I'm really thirsting to play again.

On January 26 2011 08:26 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
This seems short and interesting. If this is a clue focused game then maybe I'll /in. Mini games are neat.

I'll /in for now actually. If you can elaborate a bit more on how this game will work (you can PM me if you prefer) then I'll make a decision but the "picking a person" sounds awesome if it is what I think it is.

Anyway, I'll choose Thom Yorke (lead singer, guitarist, and songwriter from the band Radiohead)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thom_Yorke

WTF. Dr.H can't resist mafia for a day? Don't know how you can analysis this.
Jackal58
Profile Joined November 2010
United States4264 Posts
January 25 2011 23:34 GMT
#643
On January 26 2011 08:30 bumatlarge wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 26 2011 08:21 Jackal58 wrote:
On January 26 2011 08:12 bumatlarge wrote:
A scum mayor is the worst scenario by far, regardless of anything else. This means we will never get information on town numbers. False-claims will be rampant, and it will turn into a clue-crapshoot. I want to avoid this at all cost. For this reason, I believe one of RoL or Kav is scum. It's just way to strong an opportunity to pass up. If we are luky, dr.H was the mafia claim, but seeing as how he had relatively no votes, I don't think this is a viable outcome to put your hopes in.

I feel we should RNG our mayor :/ as right now we have a 50% shot at picking a scum mayor, or we can take a <25% chance at one. I'd like to hear thoughts.

On a BG plan
+ Show Spoiler +
We want to use the census as long as possible because it's basically 1/2 of a coroner everyday. I've been thinking this through and I believe the best option is to splice 4 and 5.

Option 4: Vetclaim: Two Veterans claim, they are chosen as bodyguards.
Upside: Vets are tough to kill, make excellent bodyguards. Essentially make mayor invulnerable for at least 3-4 cycles.
Downside: Reds can STILL claim to mess it up (and they will.) Vets more useful hidden amongst the town, to soak hits. No guarantee this setup has two vets.
Verdict: If it wasn't for the fact that reds can claim, I'd be in support of this idea. I personally think vets would be more useful ensuring we have census for basically the entire game than sitting in the silent majority, hoping they can soak up a hit. However, there's no way a smart mafia team wouldn't have a goon claim vet, with no way to prove/disprove it, and that's a 66% chance we run into the 1 town-1 scum setup. So no.

Option 5: Mayoral preference: Mayor picks his bodyguards, they accept.
Upside: Kav/RoL are both good players, can probably select two greens.
Downside: Kav/RoL aren't infallible, scum mayor can basically screw town over with this by intentionally selecting blues (bluesniping) and making it look accidental when they die, gives all the power to the mayor, something we want to avoid.
Verdict: I don't like it, despite Kav kind of softly pushing for it. I'd vote against this plan.


We have only 1 veteran claim. We should tell him to refresh the thread to avoid multiple claims. He will be first choice. Yes, mafia can claim it, but I'm not entirely sure mafia wants to which I will get to in a minute. The next BG will be chosen by Mayor. He will make the person is believes is most likely a vanilla town. If he is scum, then we can't be sure what he will do, but a mafia BG leaves a nice SK target on his back.

So this would ultimately lead to how badly the other factions want the mayor to die. With 30 people in the game, I believe there are several set-ups.

5 mafia, 2-3SKs.
6-7 mafia, 1-2 SKs
7-8 mafia, No SKs (8 seems highly unlikely)

With a rough 25% of players being non-town, BG chosen by mayor has a good chance of being town. With more mafia then veterans, statistically mafia will be more likely to be 2nd BG. I believe SK has no real purpose in trying to kill mayor within first 3 days. As a lone-wolf, he benefits from information brought to town, and he can blend well until medics and vets start getting counted. He can't really fake why he survived a hit if a mafia about to get lynched accuses him of being an SK. Ultimately, SK wants mayor to state how many mafia, SKs, one other blue role to keep his clam safe. SK should be preoccupied with DT and mafia sniping. For this reason, I do not like censusing DTs til later on, so SKs won't feel safe enough to hit mayor.

Mafia then will take a stab at non-townie mayor very early on. Medics should take a high-priority in protecting BGs, and if both die and mayor is alive, I don't think you should take it off him.

On January 16 2011 15:03 Node wrote:

Mayor
You are the elected leader of the town. Elections will take place on day 1. When elected, you will publicly select two bodyguards to protect you for the rest of the game. While bodyguards are alive, you cannot be targeted by night hits or the roleblocker. Role checks on you will return “Mayor”.

Don't think that's an option.


What isn't? RNG mayor? There are ways, as in everyone posts a number between 1-2, and we add them up. The probability of scum landing a mayor this way is miniscule, and attempting to tamper with it will most likely get screwed. Here I'll start.

2

I cannot change it, and now d3 will be our choice until the next person posts a number. If we set a deadline, mafia can't wait til the last minute.

Our deadline is up in another couple of hours or so. I believe it's a bit late to get the changes in. Maybe not though but we don't have much time left.
Life can only kill you once.
bumatlarge
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States4567 Posts
January 25 2011 23:37 GMT
#644
Let's just see how many people do it. Current number is 3, and numbers don't count after 8:00 est which is in 1&1/2 hours. GMarshal will be our mayor! :D
Together but separate, like oatmeal
Impervious
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada4198 Posts
January 25 2011 23:42 GMT
#645
Getting a Mafia as the mayor is by far the worst situation possible - it'll almost guarantee the victory to them..... I'd rather go for the RNG mayor tbh..... But it's definitely too late for that. And, with the way you're going about it, it's possible for the mafia to influence it.....

Right now, the only person I can really trust is myself, so myself as mayor would be ideal (at least from my point of view, however, it would also paint me as a target which would mean that it's likely that I'll die before the end of the game, so it's probably best that I don't have the position). But I doubt that is gonna happen (a number of reasons). So it's just gonna have to rely on luck for now, and hopefully we don't fuck ourselves over from the start.
~ \(ˌ)im-ˈpər-vē-əs\ : not capable of being damaged or harmed.
ilovejonn
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
Canada2548 Posts
January 25 2011 23:43 GMT
#646
RNGing mayor is the stupidest idea I've ever heard. Look at the amount of work put into RoL and Kav's posts. They are literally on the death toll if they go back on ANYTHING they said. They HAVE to and they are willing to put their words into actions. If not we know something is up for sure.

Okay, let's RNG a mayor. Oh look now we have an inactive mayor that probably won't listen to town opinions/effectively use census.

Sorry but RNGing mayor is just dumb.
Snowflakes in January, Heart warm like February, I wouldn't ordinarily..
ilovejonn
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
Canada2548 Posts
January 25 2011 23:46 GMT
#647
The only thing that would have fucked us over from the start are people that are trying to make themselves mayor RIGHT BEFORE THE DEADLINE. If you guys were thinking about being mayor, why didn't you guys start your campaign earlier instead of letting it go to other people's hands? Okay we voted for a guy that sounds pretty pro-town for mayor, wait it suddenly sounds bad at the last second possible. Really?
Snowflakes in January, Heart warm like February, I wouldn't ordinarily..
Kavdragon
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States1251 Posts
January 25 2011 23:50 GMT
#648
Responses incoming. Please think about how stupid RNG'ing something like this would be this late in the game. Just don't do it.

Also, the BG discussion is taking up WAY too much time. The mafia are deliberately trying to keep it going, so that we waste valuable time not doing analysis. Again, more to come. I'm heading off on my commute, and I don't expect to be back in till about half an hour before the vote, but I'll have more to say on this once I get to an internet connection.
I'm currently on an indefinite hiatus from TL =(
ilovejonn
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
Canada2548 Posts
January 25 2011 23:52 GMT
#649
Also, why the change all of sudden? Even if your vote stayed on Doc. H it wouldn't have mattered. Hmm..?
On January 26 2011 03:09 Amber[LighT] wrote:
the vote should have transferred to the replacement t.t

i dont want RoL or Kav so I'm not voting for either.

On January 26 2011 06:31 Amber[LighT] wrote:
##vote: Kavdragon

Snowflakes in January, Heart warm like February, I wouldn't ordinarily..
ilovejonn
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
Canada2548 Posts
January 25 2011 23:54 GMT
#650
Going to head out to a ball game, won't be back until probably 11 pm EST.
Snowflakes in January, Heart warm like February, I wouldn't ordinarily..
Meapak_Ziphh
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States6785 Posts
January 26 2011 00:03 GMT
#651
Ahem in terms of BGs I think the mayor should pick inactives. I'm dead serious because it forces a mafia choice whether to go for the mayor or an expereinced townie. The last thing we want are people like RoL or BB to be BGs because if the mafia take them out not only do they kill experienced players they also get a shot at the mayor. By picking inactives means the mafia can't have it both ways.

Also RNGing the mayor is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Yes it is possible to influence the vote, you just have to predict which person it will land on. By making the RNG public the mafia will be able to push the number around as much as they like by decideing when to "RNG" in.
Forti et Fideli ~ TL Mafia Forum: Come play with us! ~ Go Samsung KHAN, Stork, JangBi , Shine, Grape, and TurN Fighting!~ wat
CubEdIn
Profile Blog Joined April 2006
Romania5359 Posts
January 26 2011 00:11 GMT
#652
I'm going to sleep, so no more posts from me for about 8 hours.

That being said, I dislike the option of RnG-ing mayor as well.
Sorry, but it sounds like something a scum would come up with when their choice of a mayor is not winning.

Now, I'm not saying that RoL is red, but maybe both candidates are blue and Mafia is desperately trying to come up with a plan to get a red on the hot chair. I'm not liking it.
Maybe if the idea came out sooner, it would work, but now when there are only a few hours left, a good deal of the players won't even have time to catch up.

That being said:
If the majority decides to follow this, just pretend I picked 2, but I strongly suggest we just take our chances with Kav or RoL.

You are right on one behalf though, Mafia would have a FCKTON to gain if they got a red mayor, and the census ability is so so sooooooo easily forged, as it can only truly be verified by mafia. Other numbers won't really come up 'till the very end of the game.

To the more experienced players, a question: Were there mafia games where mayor was revealed as scum soon after he was elected? Or does it usually end in tears like when DrH was mayor/scum last time?
Im not a n00b, I just play like one.
Kenpachi
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States9908 Posts
January 26 2011 00:11 GMT
#653
On January 26 2011 09:03 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
Ahem in terms of BGs I think the mayor should pick inactives. I'm dead serious because it forces a mafia choice whether to go for the mayor or an expereinced townie. The last thing we want are people like RoL or BB to be BGs because if the mafia take them out not only do they kill experienced players they also get a shot at the mayor. By picking inactives means the mafia can't have it both ways.

Also RNGing the mayor is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Yes it is possible to influence the vote, you just have to predict which person it will land on. By making the RNG public the mafia will be able to push the number around as much as they like by decideing when to "RNG" in.

Yea this is a good idea. (not being sarcastic)

I nominate myself to the position of body guard cause im a useless townie
Nada's body is South Korea's greatest weapon.
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
January 26 2011 00:11 GMT
#654
Nfi and tube must vote or will be forcefully replaced
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
bumatlarge
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States4567 Posts
January 26 2011 00:13 GMT
#655
On January 26 2011 08:46 ilovejonn wrote:
The only thing that would have fucked us over from the start are people that are trying to make themselves mayor RIGHT BEFORE THE DEADLINE. If you guys were thinking about being mayor, why didn't you guys start your campaign earlier instead of letting it go to other people's hands? Okay we voted for a guy that sounds pretty pro-town for mayor, wait it suddenly sounds bad at the last second possible. Really?


I never said either of the candidates was pretty pro-town, I'm saying I underestimated mayor, and I expected more candidates. Since I don't see why mafia wouldn't give it a shot, that leaves one of the two candidates as mafia. I came here as early as I could, and everyone is putting focus on the BGs when we have a lot of time for that.

I would like to extend the voting time for mayor if that is possible.

Then we can have more time to see if this is really what we want to do. If people really want to pick kav or RoL, then I guess we will take our chances. At least consider it. And no one is making themselves mayor... If someone like amber who likes neither candidate doesn't really have much of a choice, considering the other mayor wants to lynch him, he has to pick kav. If I can't extend it then it's not like I could upset e votes anyway. If I'm distracting the conversation from your precious BG discussion, then I'll take my chances lol.
Together but separate, like oatmeal
SiNiquity
Profile Joined April 2010
United States734 Posts
January 26 2011 00:17 GMT
#656
Annd all caught up again. RNG mayor is as dumb as you can be, though part of the reason I like Kav is for that "RNG" aspect. Could've been a plant and when he rolled mafia he followed up with it. But statistically speaking the odds are as good as RNG without the downsides.

Stop with the body guard nonsense. All of the plans suck because no one knows who's red and who's green and who's blue. Suggesting that we pick "1 red / 1 green" or "1 vet / 1 mafia" etc. is just stupid. Suggesting that ~25% of the game volunteers to identify themselves is green is even dumber. It's up to Kav to pick people he believes to be green. Volunteering isn't any good because we're nearly guaranteed to get 1 Mafia that way if we restrict it to a very small # (2-4). If we take too many volunteers then it gives too much information to Mafia about who's willing to die (i.e. vets/greens) and allows for blue sniping.

As for the Census, I've already stated we need to be checking Mafia #'s every night. Here's why:
  • Deaths. Every night about 3-4 people are going to die (at most). There will be a lynch as well, so that's 4-5 players dead. If we alternate mafia days, on bad days we could have up to 10 people die in between mafia # checks. That tells us very little.
  • Mafia > SK. Mafia cannot kill SKs, so they may shoot them and waste a shot. SKs may accidentally kill Mafia. All in all, it's in the town's best interest to kill mafia before SKs. Now when we're clue hunting / analyzing behavior, will we know if it's a Mafia or an SK (or even a vig)? No. But when it comes to the census, we should use it to watch Mafia #'s. Because the SKs can only be killed by lynches. A Vigilante may hit a Mafia. An SK may hit a Mafia. Or we might lynch a mafia. Checking SK #'s means you are willing to bet that the last lynch (or one of the last 2 lynches, if alternating) was an SK. Statistically that's a terrible bet. Don't waste it.


Now, there are certain times that census is useful aside from checking mafia #'s. But nearly all these situations are late game (e.g. mafia #'s are low so use census to get a beat on SKs, or use a blue-count to verify that some of the 10 people claiming to be DTs are liars).
'i' before 'e' except after 'c' ~ it's scientifically proven.
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
January 26 2011 00:17 GMT
#657
On January 26 2011 09:13 bumatlarge wrote:
I would like to extend the voting time for mayor if that is possible.

Sorry, no extensions are allowed
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
SiNiquity
Profile Joined April 2010
United States734 Posts
January 26 2011 00:24 GMT
#658
On January 26 2011 09:11 Kenpachi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 26 2011 09:03 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
Ahem in terms of BGs I think the mayor should pick inactives. I'm dead serious because it forces a mafia choice whether to go for the mayor or an expereinced townie. The last thing we want are people like RoL or BB to be BGs because if the mafia take them out not only do they kill experienced players they also get a shot at the mayor. By picking inactives means the mafia can't have it both ways.

Also RNGing the mayor is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Yes it is possible to influence the vote, you just have to predict which person it will land on. By making the RNG public the mafia will be able to push the number around as much as they like by decideing when to "RNG" in.

Yea this is a good idea. (not being sarcastic)

I nominate myself to the position of body guard cause im a useless townie

I... Don't even know what to say... Other than... TOO inactive.
'i' before 'e' except after 'c' ~ it's scientifically proven.
bumatlarge
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States4567 Posts
January 26 2011 00:24 GMT
#659
Ok then, Stupid idea. Crossing my fingers on Kav. Mostly my fault for not being here for a bit.
Together but separate, like oatmeal
Nemesis
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Canada2568 Posts
January 26 2011 00:26 GMT
#660
On January 26 2011 09:24 bumatlarge wrote:
Ok then, Stupid idea. Crossing my fingers on Kav. Mostly my fault for not being here for a bit.

Or you can always vote RoL
Lee Young Ho fighting! KT P are just CHINTOSSTIC.
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