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My idea would be by changing warp gate too.
You change the warpgate tech so it's still an upgrade to the gateway, still available at the cyber core, but the change would be that once the research is done a gateway can either produces normally as it was a unupgraded gateway or they can warp .
Now the change would be that producing as a "normal" gateway would take less time than actually is (and maybe even less than a warpgate in HOTS) and producing units by warping would take more time. In my opinion, it would be good because it solve different problems with one single change :
1. Using warp would be a trade : you gain the possibility to defend and attack at different in exchange of production time. A nerf to "cheeky" play but would still be possible, a buff to macro player.
2. It helps protoss against early attack, as it produces faster the first units. This is important, especially if we are keeping overlord drops pre-Lair, which might be too good to skirt building wall, and thus hardcounter fast expand builds.
3. I don't play the match up, but it would fix a lot of the crazy early game in PvP, by giving back the defender advantage to the attacked player, as he will more production efficiency.
3. Proxy gating would be problematic with this change in HoTS, but with LoTV and their 12 worker at start I don't think so.
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On June 28 2015 09:21 Vanadiel wrote:
3. Proxy gating would be problematic with this change in HoTS, but with LoTV and their 12 worker at start I don't think so.
Well I don't agree with changing Waprgate, the nerf to 2 gate proxy which is an annoying, blind and stupid cheese that adds nothing to the game is simple: Units built from Gateways begin with no shields. After you build a Cybercore, units built from Gateways have shields.
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Everybody proposing buffs to the Zealot, you cannot possibly be serious. After 5 years of watching competitive SC2, you cannot honestly mean what you are saying.
The unit has a skill floor and a skill cap of fucking zero, and you want to make it more powerful NOT in the hands of expert players, but BY DEFAULT? Why even have micro in this game? Why not just build Hatcheries/Gateways/Barracks and then uncontrollable army units will spawn out of your production buildings and run toward each other and fight on their own? The Zealot as it exists is one step removed from that. FFS.
The only stat buffs the Zealot would ever see, in a benevolent universe, would be lower damage point/faster movement (with lower HP/shields/DPS to compensate). Option for manually cast Charge would be great, not sure if that would require a stat nerf to compensate.
Past that, if you want the Zealot to be better than it is now... hell, if you want it to be as good as it is now... it needs to achieve that through a Protoss player's mechanical execution. And that means new synergies with other Protoss units. Not free freaking stat boosts.
Guys. Come on, guys. Come on.
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On June 28 2015 10:07 pure.Wasted wrote:
Everybody proposing buffs to the Zealot, you cannot possibly be serious. After 5 years of watching competitive SC2, you cannot honestly mean what you are saying.
The unit has a skill floor and a skill cap of fucking zero, and you want to make it more powerful NOT in the hands of expert players, but BY DEFAULT? Why even have micro in this game? Why not just build Hatcheries/Gateways/Barracks and then uncontrollable army units will spawn out of your production buildings and run toward each other and fight on their own? The Zealot as it exists is one step removed from that. FFS.
The only stat buffs the Zealot would ever see, in a benevolent universe, would be lower damage point/faster movement (with lower HP/shields/DPS to compensate). Option for manually cast Charge would be great, not sure if that would require a stat nerf to compensate.
Past that, if you want the Zealot to be better than it is now... hell, if you want it to be as good as it is now... it needs to achieve that through a Protoss player's mechanical execution. And that means new synergies with other Protoss units. Not free freaking stat boosts.
Guys. Come on, guys. Come on.
Every argument you just listed doesn't matter. Any melee unit has the problems you mentioned, the Ling, the Ultra, the DT, even the Hellbat... they are close to 1 A units, but that doesn't mean they should be underpowered.
And the micro you can do, is surrounds and flanks through good positioning. That is a much better form of micro than point on click spells like Abduct or Photon Overcharge.
Sadly, right now the Zealot is underpowered, in HOTS the Ultra was, relative to the other units. We don't need useless units in the game.
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On June 28 2015 12:04 BronzeKnee wrote:Show nested quote +On June 28 2015 10:07 pure.Wasted wrote:
Everybody proposing buffs to the Zealot, you cannot possibly be serious. After 5 years of watching competitive SC2, you cannot honestly mean what you are saying.
The unit has a skill floor and a skill cap of fucking zero, and you want to make it more powerful NOT in the hands of expert players, but BY DEFAULT? Why even have micro in this game? Why not just build Hatcheries/Gateways/Barracks and then uncontrollable army units will spawn out of your production buildings and run toward each other and fight on their own? The Zealot as it exists is one step removed from that. FFS.
The only stat buffs the Zealot would ever see, in a benevolent universe, would be lower damage point/faster movement (with lower HP/shields/DPS to compensate). Option for manually cast Charge would be great, not sure if that would require a stat nerf to compensate.
Past that, if you want the Zealot to be better than it is now... hell, if you want it to be as good as it is now... it needs to achieve that through a Protoss player's mechanical execution. And that means new synergies with other Protoss units. Not free freaking stat boosts.
Guys. Come on, guys. Come on. Every argument you just listed doesn't matter. Any melee unit has the problems you mentioned, the Ling, the Ultra, the DT, even the Hellbat... they are close to 1 A units, but that doesn't mean they should be underpowered.And the micro you can do, is surrounds and flanks through good positioning. That is a much better form of micro than point on click spells like Abduct or Photon Overcharge. Sadly, right now the Zealot is underpowered, in HOTS the Ultra was, relative to the other units. We don't need useless units in the game.
All of the units you listed, outside of the DT which is essentially a chargeless invisible zealot with more DPS, require a lot more micro than a zealot ever could. Once you have charge you tell your zealots where to go and...that's it. They automatically charge and hit whatever it is they run into first no micro required. All of the other units require some form of additional use micro wise to be that effective
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On June 28 2015 12:18 chipmonklord17 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 28 2015 12:04 BronzeKnee wrote:On June 28 2015 10:07 pure.Wasted wrote:
Everybody proposing buffs to the Zealot, you cannot possibly be serious. After 5 years of watching competitive SC2, you cannot honestly mean what you are saying.
The unit has a skill floor and a skill cap of fucking zero, and you want to make it more powerful NOT in the hands of expert players, but BY DEFAULT? Why even have micro in this game? Why not just build Hatcheries/Gateways/Barracks and then uncontrollable army units will spawn out of your production buildings and run toward each other and fight on their own? The Zealot as it exists is one step removed from that. FFS.
The only stat buffs the Zealot would ever see, in a benevolent universe, would be lower damage point/faster movement (with lower HP/shields/DPS to compensate). Option for manually cast Charge would be great, not sure if that would require a stat nerf to compensate.
Past that, if you want the Zealot to be better than it is now... hell, if you want it to be as good as it is now... it needs to achieve that through a Protoss player's mechanical execution. And that means new synergies with other Protoss units. Not free freaking stat boosts.
Guys. Come on, guys. Come on. Every argument you just listed doesn't matter. Any melee unit has the problems you mentioned, the Ling, the Ultra, the DT, even the Hellbat... they are close to 1 A units, but that doesn't mean they should be underpowered.And the micro you can do, is surrounds and flanks through good positioning. That is a much better form of micro than point on click spells like Abduct or Photon Overcharge. Sadly, right now the Zealot is underpowered, in HOTS the Ultra was, relative to the other units. We don't need useless units in the game. All of the units you listed, outside of the DT which is essentially a chargeless invisible zealot with more DPS, require a lot more micro than a zealot ever could. Once you have charge you tell your zealots where to go and...that's it. They automatically charge and hit whatever it is they run into first no micro required. All of the other units require some form of additional use micro wise to be that effective
The DT requires a decent amount of micro to target fire what you want to kill.
As for the Zealot, if you change FF into a small Time Warp that does 40% ms reduction, you'll see Zealot micro and surrounds and such. FF made Zealot micro easy. And I still think the Ultra requires the least micro.
Regardless, the fact these units don't require a lot of micro (like the Battle Cruiser) doesn't mean they should be underpowered, that was my point. And that's why we can buff the Zealot.
Not every unit needs to require the micro of a stimmed Marine or Blink Stalker.
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On June 28 2015 12:29 BronzeKnee wrote:Show nested quote +On June 28 2015 12:18 chipmonklord17 wrote:On June 28 2015 12:04 BronzeKnee wrote:On June 28 2015 10:07 pure.Wasted wrote:
Everybody proposing buffs to the Zealot, you cannot possibly be serious. After 5 years of watching competitive SC2, you cannot honestly mean what you are saying.
The unit has a skill floor and a skill cap of fucking zero, and you want to make it more powerful NOT in the hands of expert players, but BY DEFAULT? Why even have micro in this game? Why not just build Hatcheries/Gateways/Barracks and then uncontrollable army units will spawn out of your production buildings and run toward each other and fight on their own? The Zealot as it exists is one step removed from that. FFS.
The only stat buffs the Zealot would ever see, in a benevolent universe, would be lower damage point/faster movement (with lower HP/shields/DPS to compensate). Option for manually cast Charge would be great, not sure if that would require a stat nerf to compensate.
Past that, if you want the Zealot to be better than it is now... hell, if you want it to be as good as it is now... it needs to achieve that through a Protoss player's mechanical execution. And that means new synergies with other Protoss units. Not free freaking stat boosts.
Guys. Come on, guys. Come on. Every argument you just listed doesn't matter. Any melee unit has the problems you mentioned, the Ling, the Ultra, the DT, even the Hellbat... they are close to 1 A units, but that doesn't mean they should be underpowered.And the micro you can do, is surrounds and flanks through good positioning. That is a much better form of micro than point on click spells like Abduct or Photon Overcharge. Sadly, right now the Zealot is underpowered, in HOTS the Ultra was, relative to the other units. We don't need useless units in the game. All of the units you listed, outside of the DT which is essentially a chargeless invisible zealot with more DPS, require a lot more micro than a zealot ever could. Once you have charge you tell your zealots where to go and...that's it. They automatically charge and hit whatever it is they run into first no micro required. All of the other units require some form of additional use micro wise to be that effective The DT requires a decent amount of micro to target fire what you want to kill. As for the Zealot, if you change FF into a small Time Warp that does 40% ms reduction, you'll see Zealot micro and surrounds and such. FF made Zealot micro easy. And I still think the Ultra requires the least micro. Regardless, the fact these units don't require a lot of micro (like the Battle Cruiser) doesn't mean they should be underpowered, that was my point. And that's why we can buff the Zealot. Not every unit needs to require the micro of a stimmed Marine or Blink Stalker.
You're entire argument about zealot micro hinges on your own suggested changes to the race. Zealots are in no way underpowered and because of their lack of skill floor/ceiling buffing them would do more harm than good. Zealots already (after charge) are guaranteed to hit an opponents units. Why on earth should that get buffed?
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That is all good and well but it is the production of Toss units that fruit them up...cant have buffed units warping in outside the opponents base...
My wife suggested this to me the other night.. (and yes she is Korean).
After the Twilight is built, closed gateways can train 'Dark' Toss units.
They would look like beefier gateway units; a little scarier (darker colors and a little blue green shimmer coming off them) and they would have better stats than norm gateway units.
She also suggested that as the Dark units increase in rank they increase in stats slightly (like C&C units). This I am not sure about it..But could be interesting!!!
I liked it cos it solved the problem of gateway units being hopeless late game, whilst keeping the now essential 'warp in' mechanic and maintaining the balance of early gateway units v Z and T early units. It also adds a use to the function of closing gateways post Warp Research. I think it would be very interesting to have to balance how many gates you have open vs how many you have closed...and to toggle the gates regularly.
This is similar to Vanadiel's post but different evough to consider.
Thoughts???
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On June 28 2015 13:04 chipmonklord17 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 28 2015 12:29 BronzeKnee wrote:On June 28 2015 12:18 chipmonklord17 wrote:On June 28 2015 12:04 BronzeKnee wrote:On June 28 2015 10:07 pure.Wasted wrote:
Everybody proposing buffs to the Zealot, you cannot possibly be serious. After 5 years of watching competitive SC2, you cannot honestly mean what you are saying.
The unit has a skill floor and a skill cap of fucking zero, and you want to make it more powerful NOT in the hands of expert players, but BY DEFAULT? Why even have micro in this game? Why not just build Hatcheries/Gateways/Barracks and then uncontrollable army units will spawn out of your production buildings and run toward each other and fight on their own? The Zealot as it exists is one step removed from that. FFS.
The only stat buffs the Zealot would ever see, in a benevolent universe, would be lower damage point/faster movement (with lower HP/shields/DPS to compensate). Option for manually cast Charge would be great, not sure if that would require a stat nerf to compensate.
Past that, if you want the Zealot to be better than it is now... hell, if you want it to be as good as it is now... it needs to achieve that through a Protoss player's mechanical execution. And that means new synergies with other Protoss units. Not free freaking stat boosts.
Guys. Come on, guys. Come on. Every argument you just listed doesn't matter. Any melee unit has the problems you mentioned, the Ling, the Ultra, the DT, even the Hellbat... they are close to 1 A units, but that doesn't mean they should be underpowered.And the micro you can do, is surrounds and flanks through good positioning. That is a much better form of micro than point on click spells like Abduct or Photon Overcharge. Sadly, right now the Zealot is underpowered, in HOTS the Ultra was, relative to the other units. We don't need useless units in the game. All of the units you listed, outside of the DT which is essentially a chargeless invisible zealot with more DPS, require a lot more micro than a zealot ever could. Once you have charge you tell your zealots where to go and...that's it. They automatically charge and hit whatever it is they run into first no micro required. All of the other units require some form of additional use micro wise to be that effective The DT requires a decent amount of micro to target fire what you want to kill. As for the Zealot, if you change FF into a small Time Warp that does 40% ms reduction, you'll see Zealot micro and surrounds and such. FF made Zealot micro easy. And I still think the Ultra requires the least micro. Regardless, the fact these units don't require a lot of micro (like the Battle Cruiser) doesn't mean they should be underpowered, that was my point. And that's why we can buff the Zealot. Not every unit needs to require the micro of a stimmed Marine or Blink Stalker. You're entire argument about zealot micro hinges on your own suggested changes to the race. Zealots are in no way underpowered and because of their lack of skill floor/ceiling buffing them would do more harm than good. Zealots already (after charge) are guaranteed to hit an opponents units. Why on earth should that get buffed?
Well you've done nothing to counter the argument I've made, which is regardless that Zealots don't require a lot of micro (or lack of skill floor/ceiling) doesn't mean they should be underpowered.. except deny it.
And of course my argument hinges on my own suggested changes... anyone that makes any argument, it hinges on what they are suggesting... that is blatantly obvious.
But the argument between us is whether or not Zealots are underpowered, which isn't the point of this thread, and isn't really something I want to debate.
We are talking about Gateway units being buffed. If we had to pick one, I'd say the Adept, Stalker and Sentry are just fine and far more dangerous to buff without other corresponding nerfs. FF is already so strong, Adepts are very strong, and Blink all-ins are strong. So that leaves the Zealot basically. Do you disagree?
The other option is a list of changes, buffs and nerfs, which will include Zealot buffs in one way or another if you change FF which is the limiting factor because Zealots are so reliant on it. And how else can you can buff Protoss Gateway units meaningfully? Seriously think about it. So either way you buff the Zealot. Now my problem is the poster above doesn't want any buffs to the Zealot for a bad reason.
It actually does matter if low skill units are underpowered. That is a problem. No unit should be underpowered or overpowered.
I have a feeling you think Gateway units are fine no matter what... so... maybe you just shouldn't be here. But the way the Adept is balanced is very poorly done.
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A purpose to use gateways that aren't warpgates.
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Just make warp gate units more effective against air. Give Storm Heroes of the Storm Tassadar crit stacks, psy warp, and barrier wall.
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On June 28 2015 12:04 BronzeKnee wrote:Show nested quote +On June 28 2015 10:07 pure.Wasted wrote:
Everybody proposing buffs to the Zealot, you cannot possibly be serious. After 5 years of watching competitive SC2, you cannot honestly mean what you are saying.
The unit has a skill floor and a skill cap of fucking zero, and you want to make it more powerful NOT in the hands of expert players, but BY DEFAULT? Why even have micro in this game? Why not just build Hatcheries/Gateways/Barracks and then uncontrollable army units will spawn out of your production buildings and run toward each other and fight on their own? The Zealot as it exists is one step removed from that. FFS.
The only stat buffs the Zealot would ever see, in a benevolent universe, would be lower damage point/faster movement (with lower HP/shields/DPS to compensate). Option for manually cast Charge would be great, not sure if that would require a stat nerf to compensate.
Past that, if you want the Zealot to be better than it is now... hell, if you want it to be as good as it is now... it needs to achieve that through a Protoss player's mechanical execution. And that means new synergies with other Protoss units. Not free freaking stat boosts.
Guys. Come on, guys. Come on. Every argument you just listed doesn't matter. Any melee unit has the problems you mentioned, the Ling, the Ultra, the DT, even the Hellbat... they are close to 1 A units, but that doesn't mean they should be underpowered.
The Ling rewards an infinity of micro over the Zealot, the Ultralisk is a shitty unit but it's seen in like 1 out of 50 TvZs and zero of the other MUs so it's not a big deal, the DT is OK and the Hellbat (without being a braindead unit) offsets the crazy micro requirements of the rest of the Terran army.
And the micro you can do, is surrounds and flanks through good positioning. That is a much better form of micro than point on click spells like Abduct or Photon Overcharge.
Zealots are used to surround and flank in, what, 1 game out of 100? It's like mech vs Protoss, or unicorns prancing around the countryside - not an actual real thing that happens. They're like moving brick walls, they're just too god damn slow to do it and too easy to evade if they even succeed.
The solution isn't to buff them to godhood, it's to fix them so they're not such shitty units.
Sadly, right now the Zealot is underpowered, in HOTS the Ultra was, relative to the other units. We don't need useless units in the game.
How did you arrive at the conclusion that the Zealot is underpowered? The Adept making it redundant isn't proof, the Adept might simply be absurdly OP.
Regardless, the fact these units don't require a lot of micro (like the Battle Cruiser) doesn't mean they should be underpowered, that was my point. And that's why we can buff the Zealot.
I reiterate: if the Zealot really does suck, the solution isn't simply to buff him. That is what results in a shitty game and "Terran elitism." The solution is to change the unit. Not superficially. Fundamentally. Make it reward skill. I've brought up solutions on how to do this before, and I'd be happy to do it again if I thought that someone was actually listening and cared (meaning Blizzard, not you).
Not every unit needs to require the micro of a stimmed Marine or Blink Stalker.
I have to laugh when you say Marines and Blink Stalkers in the same sentence, implying that the Zealot is the Hellbat counterpart or something, and therefore T and P are actually, really pretty even. Blink Stalkers are capable of godly plays, and once in a blue moon, watching PartinG, Zest, herO, or HerO, you'll actually see it happen. But it's not required of them. TvP isn't balanced around Stalkers blinking all over the map all the time (in fact, deathballs pretty much preclude it outright). But TvZ is balanced around Marines splitting all over the map all of the time. Asking "what's a unit theoretically capable of?" is disingenuous. You cannot forget to ask "how often is a player required to use it to its fullest potential, and failing that will begin to accrue a steady deficit over the course of the game?"
We are talking about Gateway units being buffed. If we had to pick one, I'd say the Adept, Stalker and Sentry are just fine and far more dangerous to buff without other corresponding nerfs. FF is already so strong, Adepts are very strong, and Blink all-ins are strong. So that leaves the Zealot basically. Do you disagree?
The other option is a list of changes, buffs and nerfs, which will include Zealot buffs in one way or another if you change FF which is the limiting factor because Zealots are so reliant on it. And how else can you can buff Protoss Gateway units meaningfully? Seriously think about it. So either way you buff the Zealot. Now my problem is the poster above doesn't want any buffs to the Zealot for a bad reason.
I can't speak for chipmonklord17, but I disagree passionately.
The notion that Protoss Gateway units need straight buffs is absolutely contrary to everything we've seen of the race in the last 5 years. Gateway units need changes.
More specifically, they need straight nerfs and conditional buffs, buffs which someone like Paralyze or Terminator wouldn't have the mechanical genius or multitasking to take advantage of, and therefore, due to the nerfs, they would never grace Code S ever again for as long as they live... but someone like PartinG could use to make his Gateway units as powerful, or even more powerful, than they are at present.
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The sentiment to buff Gateway unit stems from the fact that early game revolves around using Sentries correctly. On the opposite end those against it worry about further abuse of the warp in mechanic. These 2 key mechanics has attracted much derision, but regardless both have become a staple of SC2 and in my opinion should stay.
The call for a beefier Gateway unit to substitute P dependency on the Sentry can be done with another unit already in the Protoss arsenal. The idea is to have the Immortal swap production facility with the Sentry. Immortals are really good defensive unit in a choke while not being overpower without Sentry support. Sentry being a Robo unit is a big nerf to FF in general but this is compensated by the early access of Immortals. The goal here is to have less binary outcome in engagements where one army fails completely while the other come out unscathed. Much would depend on the control, composition of the army and in a later stage, good placements of limited FF in the hands of a good player.
With this change and the current LotV economy, Warp-ins might not need much of a change after all. Having powerful units at your doorstep early is a scary thought, but without FF the scenario of getting beaten to death without returning damage is unlikely to happen. If warp-in Immortals prove too much I would suggest warp-in cooldown of all unit be the same length at its longest. This does 2 things: massing units by warp in takes significantly longer for cheaper units such as Zealots and Stalkers, and to prevent the instant reinforcements snowballing out of control. This would also mean vanilla Gateway mode can make units quicker in base.
Elements of these ideas can be seen across TL from time to time. These changes also doesn't introduce anything new or too convoluted to the game and the ideas are very much understood, and from a development point of view, are relatively easy to implement.
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On June 26 2015 02:41 BronzeKnee wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2015 22:41 ZergLingShepherd1 wrote:
The most popular thing that could help protoss is the following idea.
Buff all the warp gate units, to the point of holding their own.
Nerf the warp in ability to balance the all ins, the warp in needs a huge nerf.
I hate the idea of nerfing Warp Gate because it makes Protoss unique and interesting. Also the real problem with Protoss balancing early game isn't Warp Gate, it is the Sentry and Forcefield. Eventually I'll probably make my own version of SC2, but my solution to this specific issue is the following: -Increase Zealot attack speed and shields by ~10. -Increase Stalker damage versus armored by ~1 (to help versus mass Roach specifically) and attack speed. -Increase Blink cooldown from 10 to ~14 seconds. -Increase Sentry damage by ~1, and increase their hitpoints and shields by ~10. -Make FF similar to Time Warp (though with an AOE similar to FF, Time Warp would also be removed) and reduce movespeed of units inside the FF by ~40%. Show nested quote +On June 26 2015 01:55 _indigo_ wrote:On June 26 2015 01:05 Salteador Neo wrote:
I'd simply improve the DPS of stalkers and sentries, because they are pretty bad and the protoss ground to air damage has always sucked. Zealots are fine. Let's all forget about 7gate, blink allins, 4 gate etc where mostly stalkers are utilised. You seriously think those strongest allins in SC2 would not get disgustingly OP with simple dmg increase? It has to be in a way of upgrading in lategame. The above changes can't be done alone, they have to done in conjunction with other minor changes to other races, but obviously an increase in Blink cooldown mitigates Blink all-ins to some extent and the 7 Gate is weakened by FF changes. Changes to other races would mitigate the power of the 4 gate.
Maybe the weakness of Gateway units is due to a combination of Warpgate and Forcefield. I would prefer to see both the Warpgate being a more niche or late game tool and Forcefield removed.
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On June 28 2015 19:52 pure.Wasted wrote:
and I'd be happy to do it again if I thought that someone was actually listening and cared (meaning Blizzard, not you).
That made me laugh. I'm imagining you breaking into tears while saying it.
But you're right nobody cares what you think, not me or Blizzard. And no one cares what I think (even me), but that isn't the point here.
This is a place to discuss things, that is what a forum is, not a place to give Blizzard ideas. If you want Blizzard to listen to you, then this isn't the place to do that, because Blizzard listens to no one but themselves regardless of how good the ideas are.
But if you don't value sitting here and theorycrafting because it won't matter, then don't waste your time. But then coming in here and telling me not to theorycraft about Gateway unit buffs in the "How do we buff Gateway units?" thread also wastes your time, because you can't choose not to participate by participating. Especially when you don't actually take the time to read what I wrote before making an emo appeal, because I'm not suggesting straight buffs.
Value your time.
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With Marauders nerfed i think any direct buffs to GW units is off the table.
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It is really simple. Warpgates are an extremely powerful mechanic. It means Gatway units need to be weak without it to be 100% of the strength required by balance with it.
Same with speed bonus on creep. It sounds like a cool idea lore-wise, but in terms of game mechanics all it means is that zerg can't fight off creep.
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zealots are already pretty good and have good dps and can tank well. its the really low stalkers/sentry dps that needs to be changed
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EPT
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