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On September 07 2014 21:27 AlterKot wrote:
Balls continues to be the most overrated toplaner in na history. Or Dyrus the most underrated im not sure.
dude, Balls like hard carried c9 in spring 2014 split.
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United States35160 Posts
On September 07 2014 22:16 Shiznick wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2014 21:27 AlterKot wrote:
Balls continues to be the most overrated toplaner in na history. Or Dyrus the most underrated im not sure. dude, Balls like hard carried c9 in spring 2014 split.
Yeah, and SKTK was the best team in the world in Champions Winter. Old results are old.
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Ugh, I'd say that Spring is when Sneaky was already becoming a top adc, Hai was probably in his best shape and Meteos started putting more pressure on map, so I'm not sure if I'd give it all to Balls. Plus I'm not saying he's not a great player, I just don't think he's head above dyrus or ackerman.
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He's consistent. Dyrus... not so much. And in Bo series, consistency and resilience to tilting are very important skills.
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United States35160 Posts
On September 07 2014 22:34 Alaric wrote:
He's consistent. Dyrus... not so much. And in Bo series, consistency and resilience to tilting are very important skills.
Real? If Dyrus is hyped up about any part of his play, it's him being consistent. Only times I've remembered Dyrus tilting hard was S3WC.
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can somebody explain whats up with fiddle being almost perma banned in high elo kr soloQ, is he incredibly underrated on west right now?
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On September 07 2014 21:25 IamPryda wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2014 13:21 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 13:01 GolemMadness wrote:On September 07 2014 11:03 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 08:56 Sufficiency wrote:On September 07 2014 08:50 PrinceXizor wrote:
LCS teams are like vultures picking the bones of the players that got popular early on in leagus history, while in korea teams seek new talent regularly. riot doesn't like a lot of roster changes as players leaving the scene may take fans with them, so the rules prevent turnover at a high rate, and everyone just takes each others scraps. to fill holes. no development of new talent happens in NA anyway, so whats the point of limiting imports if there is no NA development either way. Look, SKT picked up Faker and his crew and all of a sudden they are world champion in ~1 year. While Faker's talents are definitely there, his crew were just that, Korean Challenger soloQ players. SKT built this team from scratch and became a winning team. C9 is pretty similar to be honest. Someone assembled a team of Challenger players with very little competitive experience (what the fuck was Meteos doing before C9?) and made it the undisputed best team in NA. C9 didn't win World's (and probably never will), but C9 definitely demonstrated that NA has good players out thee. C9 was a freak accident imo, they just happen to have extremely good team chemistry. Their team individually aren't that amazing. Sneaky, Balls and Meteos are all top 3 players at their positions. TSM: Dyrus, Bjerg, Lustboy, all best in position. WT is a fucking dice roll which shows up, Amazing is middle of pack. LMQ: Ackerman (top 2-3), Noname (either a god, or retard, still not sure), XWX #2, Vasili #1, Mor is top 4. C9: Balls (3rd, but not significantly better than 4th/5th), Meteos #1, Hai's like 5th or 6th best midlaner, LemonNation is mediocre, and Sneaky started off being the Cop of LCS, probably #2-3 now. No name is trash, balls is a lot better then dyrus and mor is about as good of a support to vasili as space is an adc to madlife. And I am wondering if you ever actually watched a cloud 9 game if you think he is 5th or 6th. If you want berg and xyx 1 and 2 I'll give you it cuz hai champ pool is smaller but who else in na is better voyboy? I don't think so
xwx, bjerg, pobelter, link. That being said. Hai too integral to how c9 works, impossible to replace.
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On September 07 2014 23:56 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2014 21:25 IamPryda wrote:On September 07 2014 13:21 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 13:01 GolemMadness wrote:On September 07 2014 11:03 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 08:56 Sufficiency wrote:On September 07 2014 08:50 PrinceXizor wrote:
LCS teams are like vultures picking the bones of the players that got popular early on in leagus history, while in korea teams seek new talent regularly. riot doesn't like a lot of roster changes as players leaving the scene may take fans with them, so the rules prevent turnover at a high rate, and everyone just takes each others scraps. to fill holes. no development of new talent happens in NA anyway, so whats the point of limiting imports if there is no NA development either way. Look, SKT picked up Faker and his crew and all of a sudden they are world champion in ~1 year. While Faker's talents are definitely there, his crew were just that, Korean Challenger soloQ players. SKT built this team from scratch and became a winning team. C9 is pretty similar to be honest. Someone assembled a team of Challenger players with very little competitive experience (what the fuck was Meteos doing before C9?) and made it the undisputed best team in NA. C9 didn't win World's (and probably never will), but C9 definitely demonstrated that NA has good players out thee. C9 was a freak accident imo, they just happen to have extremely good team chemistry. Their team individually aren't that amazing. Sneaky, Balls and Meteos are all top 3 players at their positions. TSM: Dyrus, Bjerg, Lustboy, all best in position. WT is a fucking dice roll which shows up, Amazing is middle of pack. LMQ: Ackerman (top 2-3), Noname (either a god, or retard, still not sure), XWX #2, Vasili #1, Mor is top 4. C9: Balls (3rd, but not significantly better than 4th/5th), Meteos #1, Hai's like 5th or 6th best midlaner, LemonNation is mediocre, and Sneaky started off being the Cop of LCS, probably #2-3 now. No name is trash, balls is a lot better then dyrus and mor is about as good of a support to vasili as space is an adc to madlife. And I am wondering if you ever actually watched a cloud 9 game if you think he is 5th or 6th. If you want berg and xyx 1 and 2 I'll give you it cuz hai champ pool is smaller but who else in na is better voyboy? I don't think so xwx, bjerg, pobelter, link. That being said. Hai too integral to how c9 works, impossible to replace.
No way link is better, and pobelter is questionable due to throwbelter.
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On September 08 2014 00:09 Shiznick wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2014 23:56 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 21:25 IamPryda wrote:On September 07 2014 13:21 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 13:01 GolemMadness wrote:On September 07 2014 11:03 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 08:56 Sufficiency wrote:On September 07 2014 08:50 PrinceXizor wrote:
LCS teams are like vultures picking the bones of the players that got popular early on in leagus history, while in korea teams seek new talent regularly. riot doesn't like a lot of roster changes as players leaving the scene may take fans with them, so the rules prevent turnover at a high rate, and everyone just takes each others scraps. to fill holes. no development of new talent happens in NA anyway, so whats the point of limiting imports if there is no NA development either way. Look, SKT picked up Faker and his crew and all of a sudden they are world champion in ~1 year. While Faker's talents are definitely there, his crew were just that, Korean Challenger soloQ players. SKT built this team from scratch and became a winning team. C9 is pretty similar to be honest. Someone assembled a team of Challenger players with very little competitive experience (what the fuck was Meteos doing before C9?) and made it the undisputed best team in NA. C9 didn't win World's (and probably never will), but C9 definitely demonstrated that NA has good players out thee. C9 was a freak accident imo, they just happen to have extremely good team chemistry. Their team individually aren't that amazing. Sneaky, Balls and Meteos are all top 3 players at their positions. TSM: Dyrus, Bjerg, Lustboy, all best in position. WT is a fucking dice roll which shows up, Amazing is middle of pack. LMQ: Ackerman (top 2-3), Noname (either a god, or retard, still not sure), XWX #2, Vasili #1, Mor is top 4. C9: Balls (3rd, but not significantly better than 4th/5th), Meteos #1, Hai's like 5th or 6th best midlaner, LemonNation is mediocre, and Sneaky started off being the Cop of LCS, probably #2-3 now. No name is trash, balls is a lot better then dyrus and mor is about as good of a support to vasili as space is an adc to madlife. And I am wondering if you ever actually watched a cloud 9 game if you think he is 5th or 6th. If you want berg and xyx 1 and 2 I'll give you it cuz hai champ pool is smaller but who else in na is better voyboy? I don't think so xwx, bjerg, pobelter, link. That being said. Hai too integral to how c9 works, impossible to replace. No way link is better, and pobelter is questionable due to throwbelter.
link is better throughout regular season. not sure if playoffs was due to choking, or terribad team atmosphere.
also, hai's ability to throw is just as bad as pobelter.
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On September 07 2014 23:53 kongoline wrote:
can somebody explain whats up with fiddle being almost perma banned in high elo kr soloQ, is he incredibly underrated on west right now?
tons of fiddle mains in diamond 1 and challenger he just isnt banned here. def not underrated hes one of the junglers that can be 0-8 and still have a huge impact on the game with his massive amount of CC/damage
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I feel there might be some bugs with Fiddle tbh. He is doing way too much damage these days.
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On September 07 2014 23:53 kongoline wrote:
can somebody explain whats up with fiddle being almost perma banned in high elo kr soloQ, is he incredibly underrated on west right now?
I guess its the same as rumble kinda. Even if you are behind you can WRECK in team fights/skirmishes pretty fcking hard. And against a good fiddle it is pretty damn annoying to play around his ult
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United States35160 Posts
On September 08 2014 00:10 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2014 00:09 Shiznick wrote:On September 07 2014 23:56 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 21:25 IamPryda wrote:On September 07 2014 13:21 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 13:01 GolemMadness wrote:On September 07 2014 11:03 wei2coolman wrote:On September 07 2014 08:56 Sufficiency wrote:On September 07 2014 08:50 PrinceXizor wrote:
LCS teams are like vultures picking the bones of the players that got popular early on in leagus history, while in korea teams seek new talent regularly. riot doesn't like a lot of roster changes as players leaving the scene may take fans with them, so the rules prevent turnover at a high rate, and everyone just takes each others scraps. to fill holes. no development of new talent happens in NA anyway, so whats the point of limiting imports if there is no NA development either way. Look, SKT picked up Faker and his crew and all of a sudden they are world champion in ~1 year. While Faker's talents are definitely there, his crew were just that, Korean Challenger soloQ players. SKT built this team from scratch and became a winning team. C9 is pretty similar to be honest. Someone assembled a team of Challenger players with very little competitive experience (what the fuck was Meteos doing before C9?) and made it the undisputed best team in NA. C9 didn't win World's (and probably never will), but C9 definitely demonstrated that NA has good players out thee. C9 was a freak accident imo, they just happen to have extremely good team chemistry. Their team individually aren't that amazing. Sneaky, Balls and Meteos are all top 3 players at their positions. TSM: Dyrus, Bjerg, Lustboy, all best in position. WT is a fucking dice roll which shows up, Amazing is middle of pack. LMQ: Ackerman (top 2-3), Noname (either a god, or retard, still not sure), XWX #2, Vasili #1, Mor is top 4. C9: Balls (3rd, but not significantly better than 4th/5th), Meteos #1, Hai's like 5th or 6th best midlaner, LemonNation is mediocre, and Sneaky started off being the Cop of LCS, probably #2-3 now. No name is trash, balls is a lot better then dyrus and mor is about as good of a support to vasili as space is an adc to madlife. And I am wondering if you ever actually watched a cloud 9 game if you think he is 5th or 6th. If you want berg and xyx 1 and 2 I'll give you it cuz hai champ pool is smaller but who else in na is better voyboy? I don't think so xwx, bjerg, pobelter, link. That being said. Hai too integral to how c9 works, impossible to replace. No way link is better, and pobelter is questionable due to throwbelter. link is better throughout regular season. not sure if playoffs was due to choking, or terribad team atmosphere. also, hai's ability to throw is just as bad as pobelter.
Keep in mind that during the regular season, he was coming back from a COLLAPSED LUNG.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
I guess that explains all the choking
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On September 08 2014 00:19 Sufficiency wrote:
I feel there might be some bugs with Fiddle tbh. He is doing way too much damage these days.
No, he just happens to have good enough base damage that more releases haven't rendered him obsolete.
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On September 08 2014 00:19 Sufficiency wrote:
I feel there might be some bugs with Fiddle tbh. He is doing way too much damage these days.
I think he just old and hasn't been tweaked in awhile.
Keep in mind this is a jungler that was competitive against stuff like Oldschool GP, Oldschool Olaf, Oldschool Eve Innervating Locket Udyr, Triple HoG -> 6 items for free Poppy, Release Xin Zhao (Well, post his first round of nerfs), Doulbe E-Bug Lee Sin.
The only reason he fell out of favour in the first place is because the S3 jungle changes kinda fucked single target junglers. But sice then they have increased being behind jungle XP, nerfed AoE jungling, buffed single target jungling, and nerfed the crap out of all those things while Fiddle has been kept identical to how he was before.
Makes sense that he would be hella strong.
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On September 08 2014 01:03 Scip wrote:
I guess that explains all the choking
Took the words right from my mouth.
If you guys are you gonna argue who's the best and who isn't, and proceed to get really worked up over it, then use some evidence! This last page has just been people throwing around names with almost nothing to back it up.
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On September 07 2014 22:59 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2014 22:34 Alaric wrote:
He's consistent. Dyrus... not so much. And in Bo series, consistency and resilience to tilting are very important skills. Real? If Dyrus is hyped up about any part of his play, it's him being consistent. Only times I've remembered Dyrus tilting hard was S3WC.
Dyrus also tilted super fucking hard vs C9 in the spring split. Like, he went 1-7-1 as a Renekton in game 2 of the spring split vs C9 (about 2x as much as anybody else on his team). The thing about Dyrus is that when he tilts, he's like the biggest feeder ever.
I think Balls is much more consistent than Dyrus, and the reason Balls had no lane pressure in these recent games of C9 vs TSM isn't because Balls is bad. It's because C9's whole strat was "Let's fuck over balls to give sneaky farm :D."
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Scip #1 jungler world
5HIT #1 MF NA
Come at me
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On September 08 2014 01:35 ghrur wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2014 22:59 Gahlo wrote:On September 07 2014 22:34 Alaric wrote:
He's consistent. Dyrus... not so much. And in Bo series, consistency and resilience to tilting are very important skills. Real? If Dyrus is hyped up about any part of his play, it's him being consistent. Only times I've remembered Dyrus tilting hard was S3WC. Dyrus also tilted super fucking hard vs C9 in the spring split. Like, he went 1-7-1 as a Renekton in game 2 of the spring split vs C9 (about 2x as much as anybody else on his team). The thing about Dyrus is that when he tilts, he's like the biggest feeder ever. I think Balls is much more consistent than Dyrus, and the reason Balls had no lane pressure in these recent games of C9 vs TSM isn't because Balls is bad. It's because C9's whole strat was "Let's fuck over balls to give sneaky farm :D."
Its not even farm, it was levels.
High Level Kog > High Level Lulu was the idea.
I think it smart. Just need top not have balls in a hard lose matchup as well. TSM was smart, because that strategy had Sneaky being a monster the whole playoffs and no other team picked well enough top make Balls look bad.
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EPT
