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[Patch 4.5] Rune Rework General Discussion - Page 11

Forum Index > LoL General
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New Article: Interview with Chobra (OGN)
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17922 Posts
April 03 2014 16:57 GMT
#201
Wonder if Flare will be better on Vi than lizard, i guess you'll be trading damage off for getting rid of the mana/health sustain? which with ehr shield i dont guess you'll need anyway
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
April 03 2014 16:59 GMT
#202
On April 04 2014 01:57 arb wrote:
Wonder if Flare will be better on Vi than lizard, i guess you'll be trading damage off for getting rid of the mana/health sustain? which with ehr shield i dont guess you'll need anyway

That would require her to farm and not gank, which is where she's pretty stronk. I don't think the farm damage is worth the lanes not getting her ult as often.
It's your boy Guzma!
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17922 Posts
April 03 2014 17:01 GMT
#203
On April 04 2014 01:59 Requizen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 04 2014 01:57 arb wrote:
Wonder if Flare will be better on Vi than lizard, i guess you'll be trading damage off for getting rid of the mana/health sustain? which with ehr shield i dont guess you'll need anyway

That would require her to farm and not gank, which is where she's pretty stronk. I don't think the farm damage is worth the lanes not getting her ult as often.

Well with the nerf on her ult, you can still have time to do some farming while charging it up, plus the attackspeed is pretty good with her W
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
April 03 2014 17:01 GMT
#204
I think the flare vs lizard debate is just exposing the folly of jungle items as an idea.
Freeeeeeedom
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
April 03 2014 17:10 GMT
#205
On April 04 2014 02:01 cLutZ wrote:
I think the flare vs lizard debate is just exposing the folly of jungle items as an idea.


The jungle items are great. It solved a lot of the problems with laners taxing the jungle, and hugely diversified junglers. The current symptoms of single target carry junglers running amok are due to lizard being overtuned and (like Yango suggested) the Wright camp.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17922 Posts
April 03 2014 17:16 GMT
#206
Shouldnt buying scaling armor yellows mean with the base armor buff you overtake flat yellows @ lvl 4 onward?
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
April 03 2014 17:19 GMT
#207
feral flare, will shen jungle be a thing now?
liftlift > tsm
canikizu
Profile Joined September 2010
4860 Posts
April 03 2014 17:21 GMT
#208
I remember the Diamond 1 Korea Master Yi guy tested the Flare on PBE on stream and he thinks that it needs a nerf.
While that item is different from Lizard and a lot of current junglers can't make use of it, for those carry junglers who can make use of it, that item is way too good for now.

kongoline
Profile Joined February 2012
6318 Posts
April 03 2014 17:26 GMT
#209
why the hell feral flare doesnt provide mana sustain?
Mikau
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Netherlands1446 Posts
April 03 2014 17:37 GMT
#210
On April 04 2014 02:16 arb wrote:
Shouldnt buying scaling armor yellows mean with the base armor buff you overtake flat yellows @ lvl 4 onward?

You overtake pre rework flat yellows from level 4 onwards, but post rework flat yellows at level 9 (I think?). You can't just compare it to the old values.
Ghost-z
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1291 Posts
April 03 2014 17:55 GMT
#211
The runes rework should balance them to equal out at level 6.
Fairy Tales when you're a child begin with "Once upon a time" and when you're an adult begin, "If elected I promise..."
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
April 03 2014 18:00 GMT
#212
On April 04 2014 01:59 Requizen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 04 2014 01:57 arb wrote:
Wonder if Flare will be better on Vi than lizard, i guess you'll be trading damage off for getting rid of the mana/health sustain? which with ehr shield i dont guess you'll need anyway

That would require her to farm and not gank, which is where she's pretty stronk. I don't think the farm damage is worth the lanes not getting her ult as often.

As long as she has mana, she farms pretty fast (Q and maybe one E wrecks little monsters, and her W lets her clean up quite nicely), which is why my concern was the lack of mana.
You lack damage compared to lizard upon completion obv., and you also sacrifice a source of CDR while it's very good for her Q (and to a lesser extent ult), but it looks like in terms of dps it can overtake lizard very fast for her, especially for soloing drake and shit.

I think it's mostly going to depend on the flow of the game (purchase timing) and also how mana intensive she'll end up being. In terms of clear speed I'm pretty sure it's better in a vacuum because Lizard has been nerfed to 20% bonus monster damage and the AS is more important for her killing big monsters.
When I get the time to play I'll hop into team builder to try Flare Vi.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17922 Posts
April 03 2014 18:08 GMT
#213
On April 04 2014 03:00 Alaric wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 04 2014 01:59 Requizen wrote:
On April 04 2014 01:57 arb wrote:
Wonder if Flare will be better on Vi than lizard, i guess you'll be trading damage off for getting rid of the mana/health sustain? which with ehr shield i dont guess you'll need anyway

That would require her to farm and not gank, which is where she's pretty stronk. I don't think the farm damage is worth the lanes not getting her ult as often.

As long as she has mana, she farms pretty fast (Q and maybe one E wrecks little monsters, and her W lets her clean up quite nicely), which is why my concern was the lack of mana.
You lack damage compared to lizard upon completion obv., and you also sacrifice a source of CDR while it's very good for her Q (and to a lesser extent ult), but it looks like in terms of dps it can overtake lizard very fast for her, especially for soloing drake and shit.

I think it's mostly going to depend on the flow of the game (purchase timing) and also how mana intensive she'll end up being. In terms of clear speed I'm pretty sure it's better in a vacuum because Lizard has been nerfed to 20% bonus monster damage and the AS is more important for her killing big monsters.
When I get the time to play I'll hop into team builder to try Flare Vi.

I think attack speed is really good on her, this also offers AD and a wits end like proc which isnt bad either.

The CDR hurts though, but damage wise i th ink it should end up being alot better on her tbh. more attacks means more denting blows procs which means more damage overall
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
Diamond
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States10796 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-03 18:14:46
April 03 2014 18:10 GMT
#214
On April 04 2014 01:57 arb wrote:
Wonder if Flare will be better on Vi than lizard, i guess you'll be trading damage off for getting rid of the mana/health sustain? which with ehr shield i dont guess you'll need anyway


Idk I never really thought Vi was that amazing as a powerfarmer. She just needs too use too much mana and cooldowns neither of which Fearal Flare provides. Like yes she CAN destroy camps very quickly (on par with anyone) but the issue has always been the mana/e charge c/d. Where using an example like Nocturne that does it with just his Q. Shyv and others can do it with just cooldowns.
Ballistix Gaming Global Gaming/Esports Marketing Manager - twitter.com/esvdiamond
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
April 03 2014 18:20 GMT
#215
Thing is in the early game Vi is much more about burst (and lockdown, her ult alone isn't enough to get a decent Nidalee killed for example, needs the Q follow-up) than dps, so if Feral doesn't provide enough damage from the AD + 1-2 autos, Lizard will be better in the early game, a part pretty important for her since she's better at picks and skirmishes than full-blown teamfights.
Which is why the timing at which you can get items and be strong enough to make stuff happen is an important part.

^ Vi doesn't need cooldowns to farm, only a Q and maybe an E per camp is enough to clear decently fast, and even E's base cooldown is almost enough for that (esp. since you don't need to use it on wraiths past some point). Mana expanditures on the other hand...
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Wolfstan
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada605 Posts
April 03 2014 18:20 GMT
#216
Can't wait to see diamondprox break out the shyvanna jungle again. Feral flare seems tailor made for her after introducing the machete gave her no viable itemization in the jungle. Build in ward to put deep for counterjungling, AS=CDR on her, able to use extra gold income for her good scaling and picking up stacks from both jungles.
EG - ROOT - Gambit Gaming
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
April 03 2014 18:21 GMT
#217
On April 04 2014 03:20 Wolfstan wrote:
Can't wait to see diamondprox break out the shyvanna jungle again. Feral flare seems tailor made for her after introducing the machete gave her no viable itemization in the jungle. Build in ward to put deep for counterjungling, AS=CDR on her, able to use extra gold income for her good scaling and picking up stacks from both jungles.

Is it really enough to bring her back to jungle over top lane tho?
It's your boy Guzma!
Diamond
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States10796 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-03 18:24:31
April 03 2014 18:23 GMT
#218
On April 04 2014 03:21 Requizen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 04 2014 03:20 Wolfstan wrote:
Can't wait to see diamondprox break out the shyvanna jungle again. Feral flare seems tailor made for her after introducing the machete gave her no viable itemization in the jungle. Build in ward to put deep for counterjungling, AS=CDR on her, able to use extra gold income for her good scaling and picking up stacks from both jungles.

Is it really enough to bring her back to jungle over top lane tho?


To me she seems like the best fit for the item, but damn is she good in top lane, sort of wonder the same thing you do. Her pre-6 is so meh which does not help in the early gank heavy jungle atm.
Ballistix Gaming Global Gaming/Esports Marketing Manager - twitter.com/esvdiamond
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
April 03 2014 18:25 GMT
#219
On April 04 2014 03:23 Diamond wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 04 2014 03:21 Requizen wrote:
On April 04 2014 03:20 Wolfstan wrote:
Can't wait to see diamondprox break out the shyvanna jungle again. Feral flare seems tailor made for her after introducing the machete gave her no viable itemization in the jungle. Build in ward to put deep for counterjungling, AS=CDR on her, able to use extra gold income for her good scaling and picking up stacks from both jungles.

Is it really enough to bring her back to jungle over top lane tho?


To me she seems like the best fit for the item, but damn is she good in top lane, sort of wonder the same thing you do. Her pre-6 is so meh which does not help in the early gank heavy jungle atm.

it allows her to be flex pick though. can first pick shyv, and still have option of picking something like renekton top.
liftlift > tsm
MattBarry
Profile Joined March 2011
United States4006 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-04-03 18:28:36
April 03 2014 18:27 GMT
#220
oops wrong thread lel
Platinum Support GOD
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