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[Patch 3.10: Yimake Patch] General Discussion - Page 93

Forum Index > LoL General
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No more bad posting
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
August 03 2013 18:54 GMT
#1841
On August 04 2013 03:49 UniversalSnip wrote:
So is it correct to think they've just written off the current warmogs as a failed experiment?

I have to think so. Even against balanced comps it is rare.

I don't know why or to fix it.
Freeeeeeedom
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
August 03 2013 18:57 GMT
#1842
On August 04 2013 03:49 Alaric wrote:
Grats, you probably have a fourth of an army now. Not accounting for paint cost and stuff.

Well, it was just a pack of Hormagaunts >.> Them claws and teeth too cool. I was up between that and a pack of Immortals, but as a Zerg player I was drawn to the swarm. The Codex was fucking expensive, but it's ok because I like lore stuff like that.
It's your boy Guzma!
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
August 03 2013 19:05 GMT
#1843
On August 04 2013 03:10 sylverfyre wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 03:01 Shikyo wrote:
On August 04 2013 02:50 obesechicken13 wrote:
On August 04 2013 02:45 Porishan wrote:
On August 04 2013 02:35 obesechicken13 wrote:
On August 04 2013 02:29 zer0das wrote:
Man, Spectre's Cowl is pretty awesome against Elise. Always had massive problems against her as Renekton, but now its like, get spectre's cowl, watch her run out of mana. Laugh while she has to cs under tower. Kind of makes me wonder how popular Elise would be if FoN were still around.

Riot: "FoN is useless. We're going to remove it"
Later Riot: "AP ranged tops are too strong and we need to introduce spectre's cowl"

It's fine to be wrong, but it's good to recognize the use of items :p

iirc Riot said FoN was removed because of imba

Nah, the league wiki says Riot was saying that FoN's stats didn't synergise with each other. It's not that efficient of an item, and if they just gave FoN a better build path and health, it'd be indistringuishable from cowl->sv.

I love FoN. When I wanted a tanky build I always went FoN + armor. FoN was everything I could ever want of a MR item for a bruiser(tons of regen, movespeed, tons of mres). The reasons make no sense..

"not that efficient of an item" yeah sure, run the math

For example if you had 3000 hp FoN alone gave you 17 hp regen per second not to mention the valuable movespeed

If we look at base item values currently, 1 hp/5 is worth 36 gold. That means that the 85 hp/5 alone was worth over 3000. FoN was 2600.
ONE HP5 IS NOT FUCKING WORTH 36 GOLD. Nobody buys rejuv beads for HP5. Nobody even bought Regrowths just for HP Regen.

HP5 is literally the WORST stat to look at gold/stat comparison because it doesnt have a linear effect over the course of the game. It also doesn't have a linear cost/stat ratio. Other stats get SLIGHTLY more efficient as the quality of item improves. HP5 doesn't even care what the regen on the bead is, you literally get more of it for free. And the thing is, the freeness of it isn't OP cost-effectiveness, it's basically required to keep HP5 even remotely relevant at all.

You have to sit on a rejuv bead for 12 minutes of not-100%-health time (so in actuality, a lot longer than 12 minutes) in order for it to be merely cost-even with a health potion. Rejuv beads are not cost-efficient.

Despite yangos hate of spending money on hp5. Scaling hp5, especially at the rate fon gave you, was actually so significant that it was worth gold.
liftlift > tsm
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-03 19:14:09
August 03 2013 19:12 GMT
#1844
On August 04 2013 03:54 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 03:49 UniversalSnip wrote:
So is it correct to think they've just written off the current warmogs as a failed experiment?

I have to think so. Even against balanced comps it is rare.

I don't know why or to fix it.


The problem with Warmog's is that you don't need to itemize for Health on tanks. Practically every other tank item in the game gives Health (except Thornmail), so buying an item which is essentially nothing but Health isn't that useful. Why buy Warmog's + Thornmail when you can buy Randuin's + Spirit Visage and have almost as much Health in addition to CDR, resists, and super useful passives/actives?
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
August 03 2013 19:17 GMT
#1845
Realistically the most practical use case for Warmog's was always as a single survivability item for squishier heroes like an AD carry. The problem is that in that case the HP regen component is basically irrelevant because they generally will have Lifesteal as their primary source of sustain anyway. Which means the item has to sell itself on the HP alone and give the passive for free (which it did at release). Once they killed the "HP-only" cost-effectiveness, it simply was not compelling anymore, especially with BotRK in the game.
Moderator
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-03 19:19:24
August 03 2013 19:18 GMT
#1846
On August 04 2013 04:12 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 03:54 cLutZ wrote:
On August 04 2013 03:49 UniversalSnip wrote:
So is it correct to think they've just written off the current warmogs as a failed experiment?

I have to think so. Even against balanced comps it is rare.

I don't know why or to fix it.


The problem with Warmog's is that you don't need to itemize for Health on tanks. Practically every other tank item in the game gives Health (except Thornmail), so buying an item which is essentially nothing but Health isn't that useful. Why buy Warmog's + Thornmail when you can buy Randuin's + Spirit Visage and have almost as much Health in addition to CDR and super useful passives/actives?

Well, because it just gives that many more stats. It wouldn't be hard to get people buying it again, there's no theorycrafting reason it would be difficult, they just don't view it as a good decision.

I think a big part of the item's philosophy was having scaling regen, and I think that's what they've given up on getting out of it.

Edit: ninja yango D:
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
August 03 2013 19:20 GMT
#1847
Barrier+locket just by themselves make warmog not that good on ad-s.Resists are really good with those 2.
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
August 03 2013 19:25 GMT
#1848
On August 04 2013 03:54 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 03:49 UniversalSnip wrote:
So is it correct to think they've just written off the current warmogs as a failed experiment?

I have to think so. Even against balanced comps it is rare.

I don't know why or to fix it.

I think it might be good if they change the hp regen to 1.5% instead of 1%
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-03 19:26:58
August 03 2013 19:26 GMT
#1849
I think what we can learn from this page is that there are a billion reasons why Warmog's sucks.

Edit: 0.5% more regeneration isn't going to fix it.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
August 03 2013 19:32 GMT
#1850
Giving it the 0.5% regen back wouldn't be bad, though.

It seems a little weird to me that it went from all Warmogs on everyone all the time at the beginning of season 3 to it being a crap item with such small nerfs. Seems like it was more differences in armor penetration and teamcomps than changes to Warmogs that killed it.

It's probably still a strong item if the enemy team is Jarvan Renekton Khazix MF Taric
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
August 03 2013 19:33 GMT
#1851
On a tank maybe.But not on squishies.Randuins/zhonya are simply better defensive items.
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-03 19:34:54
August 03 2013 19:34 GMT
#1852
On August 04 2013 04:26 Seuss wrote:
I think what we can learn from this page is that there are a billion reasons why Warmog's sucks.

Edit: 0.5% more regeneration isn't going to fix it.

That might be correct, it could help if it instead gained health/health regen from minion kills or over time and had a lower starting hp and higher ending hp, just so that rushing it didn't make you totally impossible to kill and so that it scales well into lategame.

Oh wait -.- the old WM was way better

On August 04 2013 04:32 Ketara wrote:
Giving it the 0.5% regen back wouldn't be bad, though.

It seems a little weird to me that it went from all Warmogs on everyone all the time at the beginning of season 3 to it being a crap item with such small nerfs. Seems like it was more differences in armor penetration and teamcomps than changes to Warmogs that killed it.

It's probably still a strong item if the enemy team is Jarvan Renekton Khazix MF Taric

I think it was the BotRK change actually
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
August 03 2013 19:36 GMT
#1853
The biggest reason why Warmogs sucks is what it brought to Olaf. >>
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Phunkapotamus
Profile Joined April 2010
United States496 Posts
August 03 2013 20:39 GMT
#1854
On August 04 2013 04:34 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 04:26 Seuss wrote:
I think what we can learn from this page is that there are a billion reasons why Warmog's sucks.

Edit: 0.5% more regeneration isn't going to fix it.

That might be correct, it could help if it instead gained health/health regen from minion kills or over time and had a lower starting hp and higher ending hp, just so that rushing it didn't make you totally impossible to kill and so that it scales well into lategame.

Oh wait -.- the old WM was way better

Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 04:32 Ketara wrote:
Giving it the 0.5% regen back wouldn't be bad, though.

It seems a little weird to me that it went from all Warmogs on everyone all the time at the beginning of season 3 to it being a crap item with such small nerfs. Seems like it was more differences in armor penetration and teamcomps than changes to Warmogs that killed it.

It's probably still a strong item if the enemy team is Jarvan Renekton Khazix MF Taric

I think it was the BotRK change actually


And liandrys buffs. And cost reduction for other giants belt items.
"Do a barrel roll"
Feartheguru
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada1334 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-03 20:43:56
August 03 2013 20:43 GMT
#1855
On August 04 2013 04:12 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 03:54 cLutZ wrote:
On August 04 2013 03:49 UniversalSnip wrote:
So is it correct to think they've just written off the current warmogs as a failed experiment?

I have to think so. Even against balanced comps it is rare.

I don't know why or to fix it.


The problem with Warmog's is that you don't need to itemize for Health on tanks. Practically every other tank item in the game gives Health (except Thornmail), so buying an item which is essentially nothing but Health isn't that useful. Why buy Warmog's + Thornmail when you can buy Randuin's + Spirit Visage and have almost as much Health in addition to CDR, resists, and super useful passives/actives?


This is just not true. Warmogs has always just given health and was super popular for YEARS. New items and nerf to it made it unpopular. Your reason is completely made up logic that on the surface seems intelligent but is nevertheless B.S.
Don't sweat the petty stuff, don't pet the sweaty stuff.
Diamond
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States10796 Posts
August 03 2013 20:47 GMT
#1856
You guys got it all wrong.

Step 1: Pick Volibear
Step 2: Buy Warmogs & Spirit Visage
Step 3: Acquire Baron buff.
Step 4: Activate passive
Step 5: ????
Step 6: Laugh as everyone tries to kill you when you are regen'ing 250+ HP per second.
Ballistix Gaming Global Gaming/Esports Marketing Manager - twitter.com/esvdiamond
sylverfyre
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8298 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-03 21:15:27
August 03 2013 21:05 GMT
#1857
Die to BORK because you have no armor and take 250+ from each auto attack.

On August 04 2013 05:43 Feartheguru wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 04 2013 04:12 Seuss wrote:
On August 04 2013 03:54 cLutZ wrote:
On August 04 2013 03:49 UniversalSnip wrote:
So is it correct to think they've just written off the current warmogs as a failed experiment?

I have to think so. Even against balanced comps it is rare.

I don't know why or to fix it.


The problem with Warmog's is that you don't need to itemize for Health on tanks. Practically every other tank item in the game gives Health (except Thornmail), so buying an item which is essentially nothing but Health isn't that useful. Why buy Warmog's + Thornmail when you can buy Randuin's + Spirit Visage and have almost as much Health in addition to CDR, resists, and super useful passives/actives?


This is just not true. Warmogs has always just given health and was super popular for YEARS. New items and nerf to it made it unpopular. Your reason is completely made up logic that on the surface seems intelligent but is nevertheless B.S.

Clarification of what he means: You don't need to devote an item slot +1000 health 0 resists when you can have +400 health and lots of resist on multiple item slots.
mr_tolkien
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
France8631 Posts
August 03 2013 21:29 GMT
#1858
Bored of LCS ? Come watch Teut with Fiora mid while I play Karma top with Scip having Skarner jungle.
http://www.twitch.tv/mr_tolkien
The legend of Darien lives on
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
August 03 2013 21:41 GMT
#1859
Nice try, but Alternate's playing, you won't get me like that.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
smOOthMayDie
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States997 Posts
August 03 2013 21:48 GMT
#1860
Does anyone know how the salary is disbursed for the LCS players? For instance, do the better players on a team get paid more than the lacking players, or is it all evenly distributed?
twitch.tv/TKSaga twitter.com/TKSagaTV YT: Tinyurl.com/TKSaga
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