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the drawback of blue ez is lack of damage in the early game around the time the other adc has bf ez has a tear and a bunch of small items. when crit starts to matter ez has catched up in damage. a ie pd lw cait has more dps but can't due a blue ez. Also blue ez tends to deal tons of damage overall in lategame because he can kite about everything while taking minimal damage.
also we've seen builds that go ad+arpen heavy on ability focussed carries like graves, sivir etc. there was a time when you didn't see alot of PDs when ez and corki had their time with trinity force builds.
Thats enough variety for my taste on a role that is about autoattacking, if we had items that scale up autoattacks differently than crit builds then that would be purely cosmetic anyways. I like how the crit build is the correct answer to: how do you get the highest autoattack dps, istead of: you can have all kinds of colors of swords so you can feel unique.
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Yeah I think there's a lot of ADC versatility right now, both in champ options and builds.
Doesn't mean Vayne isn't still too strong though.
Edit: In other news, I don't understand why they haven't fixed the RNG element of crits. It would be so easy to remove RNG from crits altogether.
Instead of having it be: 10% crit = a 10% chance for an autoattack to do 100% extra damage.
You just have it be: 10% crit = a 100% chance for an autoattack to do 10% extra damage.
Would be really simple and remove random RNGey crits from the game. Only real requirement would maybe be balance edits to champion passives and runes/masteries.
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Man, if only Triforce could make a comeback
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The difference is that LoL AD items, for the most part, add "%increase in dps", obviously they alter slightly in perks, but fundamentally they don't change anything about the way the champion is used. While DotA has the straight PD/IE equivalents, most of its end-game AD items provide other substantial benefits instead of '%increase in dps", while riot did go this route to an extent with the addition of hydra/botrk/hurricane etc in S3, the normal progression and dps of most ADs aside from blue EZ and their impact on the game remain more or less the same.
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On August 11 2013 00:22 Dark_Chill wrote:
Man, if only Triforce could make a comeback
I think Triforce could def. use a small buff. Not a big one. Personally I think it'd be cool if they put 5% CDR on the finished item, but that's just me. I want it to have every stat lololololol
They said they're screwing with Phage for S4 though, so we may see it making a comeback.
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On August 11 2013 00:15 Ketara wrote:
Yeah I think there's a lot of ADC versatility right now, both in champ options and builds.
Doesn't mean Vayne isn't still too strong though.
Edit: In other news, I don't understand why they haven't fixed the RNG element of crits. It would be so easy to remove RNG from crits altogether.
Instead of having it be: 10% crit = a 10% chance for an autoattack to do 100% extra damage.
You just have it be: 10% crit = a 100% chance for an autoattack to do 10% extra damage.
Would be really simple and remove random RNGey crits from the game. Only real requirement would maybe be balance edits to champion passives and runes/masteries.
that is not crit. sorry, I'm sure there are people that agree with you, but crit being a linear function is not a necessity.
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As far as item diversity for ADC, I've always wanted Riot to create a singular crit item, so PD/Shiv wasn't always necessary.
So an item that gave like 60% Crit Strike, and 10% lifesteal. ~2800 gold.
Or something like 60% crit strike and 5% ms. Or something of the sort.
What this opens up is items that give AS but no crit strike. Like Zephyr/Wits End/etc.
Or create alternatives to crit strike being a multiplier.
All auto attacks deal 125% damage (hurricane deals this extra damage).
Auto attacks can no longer crit.
+25% life steal.
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Crit really isn't an obnoxious version of RNG. The thing is, if you take out crit and replace it with %increase auto damage, you are left with something REALLY BORING. The RNG from crit is already forcibly smoothed, that should be enough.
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On August 11 2013 01:15 sylverfyre wrote:
Crit really isn't an obnoxious version of RNG. The thing is, if you take out crit and replace it with %increase auto damage, you are left with something REALLY BORING. The RNG from crit is already forcibly smoothed, that should be enough.
The idea is to open up item builds that include AS items without the crit. So your not always forced to build PD/Shiv.
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On August 11 2013 01:17 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 01:15 sylverfyre wrote:
Crit really isn't an obnoxious version of RNG. The thing is, if you take out crit and replace it with %increase auto damage, you are left with something REALLY BORING. The RNG from crit is already forcibly smoothed, that should be enough. The idea is to open up item builds that include AS items without the crit. So your not always forced to build PD/Shiv.
That's entirely a problem with PD and Shiv, than with Crit being an RNG stat. I'm quite alright if they make the crit items 'no seriosuly this is a CRIT item, not an AS item with crit.' - I'm not ok if they remove crit from the game like they removed dodge.
(My comment was more in response to Ketara)
I actually think changing the itemization of crit would do a lot of good things, cause you're right - right now it's too intrinsically tied with AS. Even just flipping some numbers and make PD 30% AS / 40% crit and build out of zeal/cloak/brawler instead of zeal cloak dagger would make it a more interesting item (and also make it more distinct from Shiv... I dislike how those two items are SO similar in stat spread right now.)
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United States1291 Posts
So like a buffed version of the old executioner's calling?
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It might be nice for crit itemization if executioner's calling and youmuu's were buffed to be more slot-efficient items (more stats, higher cost). Crit is tied to AS but there are plenty of items that give crit but not AS, they just suck for AD carries (besdies IE)
On August 11 2013 01:26 Ghost-z wrote:
So like a buffed version of the old executioner's calling?
Old exec's was awkward because while it was very cost-efficient, crit and lifesteal are multiplicative stats that you want to get after a damage item or two, but exec's is too slot-inefficient to buy later in the game.
There should be a cost to getting Grevious wounds -- currently you pay with slot efficiency but I feel like the cost is too high at the moment. I do like the AD+crit combo better than the old LS+crit though.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
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But your no longer challengers... hue.
GL.
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
On August 11 2013 01:17 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 01:15 sylverfyre wrote:
Crit really isn't an obnoxious version of RNG. The thing is, if you take out crit and replace it with %increase auto damage, you are left with something REALLY BORING. The RNG from crit is already forcibly smoothed, that should be enough. The idea is to open up item builds that include AS items without the crit. So your not always forced to build PD/Shiv.
So uhh Blade of the Ruined King.
Right??
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On August 10 2013 20:48 JazzVortical wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 20:37 mr_tolkien wrote:On August 10 2013 19:36 nafta wrote:On August 10 2013 19:20 mr_tolkien wrote:On August 10 2013 18:19 JazzVortical wrote:On August 10 2013 17:27 NeedsmoreCELLTECH wrote:On August 10 2013 17:17 gtrsrs wrote:On August 10 2013 16:28 sylverfyre wrote:
I feel like since talon is melee you should be able to farm against him pre6. You CAN get a silence in the air when he blinksilences you to disrupt his combo, and once you're 6, all bets are off (dont get dunked by his ult, just go be kassadin, go double kill his bot lane a few times or something.)
I'd be a lot more scared of pantheon or other AD casters with longer range.
Oh and for the love of god, put armor runes on all your pages if you're playing kass. Even Morgana will auto harass the hell out of you. talon can literally just walk up and auto attack you out of lane at level 1 so can jayce panth a little less so but kinda i just ban talon so i don't have to worry about it What elo are you? I have literally seen one talon on gold level NA games in the last 100~ games. No reason to pick Talon when Zed exists. http://www.lolking.net/champions/zed®ion=all&map=sr&queue=1x1#statisticshttp://www.lolking.net/champions/talon®ion=all&map=sr&queue=1x1#statisticsObjectively, Talon is better. I personnaly prefer him because his burst his way faster, and he deals way more AoE damage. Why would you look at overall soloq winrate when you compare champs lol? Talon is too jungler dependant imo.You WILL get camped most likely and if your jungler doesn't cover your ass you can barely farm. Dunno, being used to play Panth and other escape-less champs in the way less forgiving top lane, I don't see how you would be unable to farm mid as a character with ranged wave clear. Talon is underrated and a very good assassin. He's just not FotM like Zed is (for pretty much no reason since his E nerf). Talon is certainly a good assassin. But Zed offers so much more to a team then just assassination ability. No professional team is going to pick Talon over Zed. Like I said earlier, Talon IMO is the best designed assassin in the game. Zed is just... too much.
Lemondogs used Talon to counter Froggen's Kassadin iirc.
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
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Wow, I didn't know that this was in a LAN environment. What happens if you win? Money? Fangirls?
On August 11 2013 01:41 Roffles wrote:Which white guy are you?
The guy with the long hair.
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On August 11 2013 01:41 Roffles wrote:Which white guy are you?
big lips flowing long black hair glasses
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On August 11 2013 01:38 Roffles wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2013 01:17 wei2coolman wrote:On August 11 2013 01:15 sylverfyre wrote:
Crit really isn't an obnoxious version of RNG. The thing is, if you take out crit and replace it with %increase auto damage, you are left with something REALLY BORING. The RNG from crit is already forcibly smoothed, that should be enough. The idea is to open up item builds that include AS items without the crit. So your not always forced to build PD/Shiv. So uhh Blade of the Ruined King. Right??
Everyone still follows ups BotRK with PD/Shiv.
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EPT
