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On October 31 2011 21:37 LoCicero wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 21:31 Shikyo wrote:
Ok seriously, more mobile? Just how is sion more mobile? Because of the extra 10 movespeed?
Truth is he's a 1v1 melee burster, he doesn't have nearly the AoE most good AP carries do and you seem to love using mobility as a reason despite that making no sense. Also, if Sion is your only AP that's going to be pretty tough for him. Also how about Malzahar, mobility again right? Are you serious? He has a decent range player based AoE nuke with a 1:1 AP ratio on a 5-6 second cooldown with blue buff which also shields him for a ton of damage as well. He has strong AoE potential.
He has a good AoE damage, but lacks utility, compared to other more classic mids. He is a beast in lane, but once straight up and well prepared 5v5 happen, he begins to fall off. But as you should be monstruously ahead since you demolished your opponent in lane it doesn't really matter :p
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I don't really understand how people get destroyed by Sion 1v1 that much. His real strength is the ability to instantly clear a wave and run off to gank while the enemy is busy cleaning up minions.
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On October 31 2011 20:41 Bwaaaa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 20:26 Shikyo wrote:On October 31 2011 20:13 -Zoda- wrote:On October 31 2011 20:03 Shikyo wrote:
Discuss. He's not new. :| On October 31 2011 20:01 Bwaaaa wrote:
Jungle heimerdinger on saint's stream LOL. Easiest jungle ever. lol Throw skill, put turret, go away, camp cleared. The new OP. . . He's seen as a shit champion and everyone calls you anoob if you pick him. However he's OP. That's what I mean. But if you walk too far away from a camp you don't get exp so it isn't THAT auto pilot.
Actually if you get the killing blow on something you get the exp regardless of distance (e.g. Malzahar puts Malefic Visions on a creep wave and backs, Ezreal ults a creep wave on the other side of the map etc.).
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On October 31 2011 23:07 spinesheath wrote:
I don't really understand how people get destroyed by Sion 1v1 that much. His real strength is the ability to instantly clear a wave and run off to gank while the enemy is busy cleaning up minions.
ranged on-demand targeted stun making it the best gank assist of any ap
good burst along with that stun
deceptively tanky early
He can trade with you all day with 4 sec shield cd. Activate shield, stun you and pop shield, run away. If you try to retaliate he's already got shield off cd again, making trades favorable for him. Meanwhile his harass is pushing the lane at the same time, which makes it very hard for slow pushers to keep up. He's also incredibly easy to farm with and hard to deny.
The fact that he's been picked by multiple teams in high level competitive play should say something about how viable and gimmicky he is as a champion. He's TERRIFYING to play against.
He's ridiculous in duo queue too. Have your friend jungle and gank your lane, pick up mobility boots and some ap, and duo roam the entire game (coming back to blow up mid waves between ganks).
On October 31 2011 22:49 mr_tolkien wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 21:37 LoCicero wrote:On October 31 2011 21:31 Shikyo wrote:
Ok seriously, more mobile? Just how is sion more mobile? Because of the extra 10 movespeed?
Truth is he's a 1v1 melee burster, he doesn't have nearly the AoE most good AP carries do and you seem to love using mobility as a reason despite that making no sense. Also, if Sion is your only AP that's going to be pretty tough for him. Also how about Malzahar, mobility again right? Are you serious? He has a decent range player based AoE nuke with a 1:1 AP ratio on a 5-6 second cooldown with blue buff which also shields him for a ton of damage as well. He has strong AoE potential. He has a good AoE damage, but lacks utility, compared to other more classic mids. He is a beast in lane, but once straight up and well prepared 5v5 happen, he begins to fall off. But as you should be monstruously ahead since you demolished your opponent in lane it doesn't really matter :p
Compare him to the tankier ap's: ryze, swain, gragas (to some extent). He may not have team ability like morgana/orianna, but he definitely brings a lot to the team. Gragas in ideal situations is definitely more game changing, but sion's burst is much easier to land on a consistent basis.
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The only downside to Sion is that if they pop your shield then all your damage just disappeared, and it's not that hard to pop after the midgame. Sion has a bit of utility in the game between his stun and ult, but he doesn't bring as much to the table as any other AP carry imo.
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United States47024 Posts
On October 31 2011 23:18 Sandster wrote:
ranged on-demand targeted stun making it the best gank assist of any ap
good burst along with that stun
deceptively tanky early
He can trade with you all day with 4 sec shield cd. Activate shield, stun you and pop shield, run away. If you try to retaliate he's already got shield off cd again, making trades favorable for him. Meanwhile his harass is pushing the lane at the same time, which makes it very hard for slow pushers to keep up.
The fact that he's been picked by multiple teams in high level competitive play should say something about how viable and gimmicky he is as a champion. He's TERRIFYING to play against.
Lolwut? 8 second cooldown after shield explodes--that's a huge window for someone to retaliate.
Also, the #1 thing that everyone ignores about Sion is that his spell ranges are abysmal. 550 range means he gets outranged by pretty much every other AP carry.
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On October 31 2011 23:29 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:
The only downside to Sion is that if they pop your shield then all your damage just disappeared, and it's not that hard to pop after the midgame. Sion has a bit of utility in the game between his stun and ult, but he doesn't bring as much to the table as any other AP carry imo.
I thought the same thing but then realized this:
Sion is a tanky ap with very short cd on his shield. Let's say you have a typical solo queue team of Akali/Talon top, Udyr/Noc jungle, and ad/support bot. By "after midgame", Sion has 300+ ap with dorans, deathcap, and ap runes, making his shield absorb for 600+ damage on a 4 sec cd (not counting cdr), PLUS his passive mitigating even more damage, and his E gives him extra health so he doesn't die easily. If your team blows their load on a Sion in a team fight, then you negate his damage for only 6 seconds or so, and in the meantime the rest of his team engages and he stunned a guy on your team anyway.
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imo the real way to play sion is to go AD. Stun a guy and put the smack down on him with an IE and Phantom Dancer.
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4 sec cooldown. lol.
It takes 4 seconds until the shield can be exploded. AFTER it's gone, you still have an 8 second cooldown, down to 4.8 sec with 40% cdr.
If your enemies pop the shield immediately, you have that shield every 5 seconds but no damage. Otherwise you can explode it every 9 seconds.
Being able to shut the enemy's burst down by simply damaging him is way better than having to drop a CC on him, in case that wasn't obvious.
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On October 31 2011 21:37 LoCicero wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 21:31 Shikyo wrote:
Ok seriously, more mobile? Just how is sion more mobile? Because of the extra 10 movespeed?
Truth is he's a 1v1 melee burster, he doesn't have nearly the AoE most good AP carries do and you seem to love using mobility as a reason despite that making no sense. Also, if Sion is your only AP that's going to be pretty tough for him. Also how about Malzahar, mobility again right? Are you serious? He has a decent range player based AoE nuke with a 1:1 AP ratio on a 5-6 second cooldown with blue buff which also shields him for a ton of damage as well. He has strong AoE potential.
Strong AoE potential? In the same way AP Amumu does? Mostly he can't even get the shield off before it's broken, he'd need to stay away from a team for 4 seconds until he can even pop it. And wow, a singletarget nuke on a 5-6s cooldown with bluebuff, while things like Annie have the same on 2.4s cooldown o_o
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Sion's early-mid game is so ridiculous that you really can't say he has weak AoE potential - the Sion player determines how effective his shield is. You don't walk into the middle of the enemy team and then activate your shield. For the most part you prep up your shield beforehand and then walk in when it's approximately ready to blow. This forces the difficult choice of whether they want to attempt to break sion's shield only to have it pop for full damage anyways (since Sion has the potential to pop it just before it breaks) , or ignore Sion. Most other AP carries don't have this whole "it's better if you ignore me" factor. Again, it's not easy to break that shield early.
On another note, there's some talk on reddit about starting a donation fund for sending Dyrus to Korea. I'm pretty psyched about this idea since I really like Dyrus; anyone has any lead on how to get this started?
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If you can't get his shield off and your team is losing the fight, you're doing something horribly wrong.
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Do you only meet retarded Sions or something?
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Just gonna leave this here
On January 16 2011 01:45 Chrispy wrote:
Sion's an asshole don't teach others how to play this asshole champion.
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Speaking of which, how 'bout that Tryndamere...
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United States47024 Posts
On November 01 2011 00:15 Juicyfruit wrote:
Sion's early-mid game is so ridiculous that you really can't say he has weak AoE potential - the Sion player determines how effective his shield is. You don't walk into the middle of the enemy team and then activate your shield. For the most part you prep up your shield beforehand and then walk in when it's approximately ready to blow. This forces the difficult choice of whether they want to attempt to break sion's shield only to have it pop for full damage anyways (since Sion has the potential to pop it just before it breaks) , or ignore Sion. Most other AP carries don't have this whole "it's better if you ignore me" factor. Again, it's not easy to break that shield early.
Again, your shield has 550 range. You're outranged by several relevant AD carries, and pretty much every AP carry. Popping your shield early is likely to result in you popping it on 1-2 tanky melee guys, and not "full damage" in that you won't hit any of the high-value targets.
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But you're referring to a large organized 5v5. Sion no likey that any more than Akali likes diving into 5v5's. While I think that ultimately, he CAN hit high-priority targets depending on how he goes about doing it (and whether the enemy team responds to his positioning properly), the big message is that unless you play properly vs sion as a team, he's going to be a pain.
The right amount of damage to throw at Sion is "just enough to break his shield". Any more than that and you're wasting damage unless you can outright kill Sion. Any less than that and you aren't breaking his shield.
Sion's much stronger in small skirmishes, and he can't poke at all, and at most he can deter poking if he's ahead enough. Not really calling Sion overpowered by a long shot, but his strengths is really irrelevant from how people suggest beating him.
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Being in bot lane and seeing Sion run out of the bushes with his shield up is just about the most terrifying thing in this game.
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Which is the best jungler for a non-level 30 (level 24 so I can max one mastery tree)? I have enough RP for WW, Noct, Mumu, and Fiddle.
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On November 01 2011 00:15 Juicyfruit wrote:
Sion's early-mid game is so ridiculous that you really can't say he has weak AoE potential - the Sion player determines how effective his shield is. You don't walk into the middle of the enemy team and then activate your shield. For the most part you prep up your shield beforehand and then walk in when it's approximately ready to blow. This forces the difficult choice of whether they want to attempt to break sion's shield only to have it pop for full damage anyways (since Sion has the potential to pop it just before it breaks) , or ignore Sion. Most other AP carries don't have this whole "it's better if you ignore me" factor. Again, it's not easy to break that shield early.
On another note, there's some talk on reddit about starting a donation fund for sending Dyrus to Korea. I'm pretty psyched about this idea since I really like Dyrus; anyone has any lead on how to get this started?
The thing is that Sion really needs to Weave a lot more than most AP carries would like to. His gameplay in teamfights is basically precharge shield -> stun -> blow shield -> run away -> useless for 10+ seconds. That's a pretty big deal if your first burst isn't enough to destroy them. Also you really need to charge the shield away as it's pretty easy to burst assuming the sion isn't extremely fed.
Btw Vlad >>>> Sion ganks, Vlad OP.
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EPT
