EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 4739
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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
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Sadist
United States7298 Posts
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GreenHorizons
United States23513 Posts
Billionaire Elon Musk and his government efficiency team have been given access to the U.S. Treasury Department’s payment system, resolving a days-long standoff, the New York Times reported on Saturday. Musk, who chairs the newly-created Department of Government Efficiency, has been tasked by President Donald Trump to identify fraud and waste in the government and had sought access to the system Treasury uses to dole out federal funds. His efforts were resisted by a career Treasury official, David Lebryk, who was placed on leave this week and then retired. U.S. Senator Ron Wyden, a Democrat, appeared to confirm that Musk’s team has access in a post on the social network Bluesky. “Sources tell my office that Treasury Secretary Bessent has granted DOGE *full* access to this system. Social Security and Medicare benefits, grants, payments to government contractors, including those that compete directly with Musk's own companies. All of it,” Wyden, the top Democrat on the Senate Finance Committee, posted on Saturday. www.reuters.com Since Musk isn't a government official and DOGE isn't actually a department of the government (no one knows who they are really) they have quite the range for how they could potentially use that information/access. At minimum we have to just pray (I guess this is what Democrats do now?) they don't break it. Not even out of malice, just out of incompetence and hubris. | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9009 Posts
On February 03 2025 02:10 GreenHorizons wrote: Elon Musk (not a government official) and DOGE (not a department of government) has been given access to the US Treasury Department's payment system. www.reuters.com Since Musk isn't a government official and DOGE isn't actually a department of the government (no one knows who they are really) they have quite the range for how they could potentially use that information/access. At minimum we have to just pray (I guess this is what Democrats do now?) they don't break it. Not even out of malice, just out of incompetence and hubris. One day I'll understand why, no matter the news, you have to find a way to bring it back on Ds. I just don't understand this need to shit on Ds at every possible chance. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23513 Posts
On February 03 2025 02:15 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote: One day I'll understand why, no matter the news, you have to find a way to bring it back on Ds. I just don't understand this need to shit on Ds at every possible chance. I mean the basic issue is that Republicans are the face of the rise of fascism in the US while the ostensible opposition to them, Democrats, do a bunch of the legwork for them. For example: On February 02 2025 02:21 GreenHorizons wrote: This exchange between WaPo reporter Jeff Stein and Sen. Chris Murphy (D-CT) is a pretty good example of how rudderless Democrats are. They are publicly complaining about Trump/Republicans being too stupid to let them help lay the foundations for fascism and give him more power/tools to implement his/his cronies fascist plans At this point I am sorta expecting decent people to have more self-respect than is required to line up behind oBlade/capitalism and the Democrat party. The idea from libs/Dems and their supporters here/nationally was to fall in line behind Democrats (no matter what, including supporting genocide) to stop Trump and the rise of fascism in the US. That objectively failed. People don't have to try socialism but they have to abandon the Democrat party as a path for the future and find something else if they want any reasonable hope for it not to suck indefinitely. | ||
KwarK
United States43347 Posts
You keep failing to address this. Do you really think your American socialist democracy trade union Soviets aren’t rounding up immigrants? | ||
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micronesia
United States24745 Posts
On February 03 2025 02:15 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote: One day I'll understand why, no matter the news, you have to find a way to bring it back on Ds. I just don't understand this need to shit on Ds at every possible chance. It's out of love. If he loved the GOP he'd also criticize them at every turn. | ||
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Magic Powers
Austria4478 Posts
On February 03 2025 02:08 Sadist wrote: Jimmy what do you suggest to help combat climate change? More capitalisming and ignoring the problem away. I also hear Mars is a nice vacation destination for the average worker in case things get too hot on planet Earth. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23513 Posts
On February 03 2025 02:34 KwarK wrote: Democrats didn’t want the Trump border bill+ Show Spoiler + , Americans did. You keep confusing the two. In a democratic society Democrats have to sometimes try to pass legislation that the people are demanding. It was negotiated in exchange for ending a Republican majority enabling the Russian genocide of Ukraine. You keep failing to address this. Do you really think your American socialist democracy trade union Soviets aren’t rounding up immigrants? They spent the run up to the election insisting that they did, that was probably one of many mistakes that cost them the election. Trump's incompetence saved us from Democrats malice. The American people weren't begging Democrats to pass the Laken Riley Act either. On January 30 2025 04:38 GreenHorizons wrote: The first piece of legislation Trump is signing is a bipartisan anti-immigrant bill helping to lay fascist foundations by taking away people's rights to due process. www.amnestyusa.org EDIT: Reminder that Trump is aiming to break Biden's record: US deportations under Biden surpass Trump's record I dunno, one of the "downsides" (from a capitalists' pov) of a union is that they sorta do the "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs". So I think the firms where the workers councils didn't target immigrants for expulsion would see many benefits from keeping some of their hardest working and most dedicated workers around, immigrant or not. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15725 Posts
But then I realized the truth is this is politically motivated. And that’s not a bad thing. The tariffs are political. The political ideas that led to these tariffs are damaging and unacceptable. A part of me has tried to be sympathetic to republicans because I can tell all of this anger and resentment is genuine and they truly are extremely upset. These elections of anger are real to them and I am sad for them feeling that way. It’s clearly a prison and they can’t seem to escape it. But this tantrum continues to grow and damage more and more parts of society. So my conclusion is: we have reached a point where it makes sense to punish red states for harboring and fueling these political ideas. Europe and Asia are more culturally matched than California and Florida. Mainstream right wing supported this while mainstream left wing tried to prevent it for years. There is no perfect way to punish this resentment run amok. But I can’t pretend I have a better idea and I recognize the world needs to lose patience eventually. | ||
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micronesia
United States24745 Posts
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Azuzu
United States340 Posts
On February 03 2025 02:15 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote: One day I'll understand why, no matter the news, you have to find a way to bring it back on Ds. I just don't understand this need to shit on Ds at every possible chance. I recently came across a description of something called "Murcs Law" that in essence states "only Democrats have any agency or causal influence over American politics". Looking at things through that lens, I see so many examples including and especially GH's posts. https://whereofonecanspeak.com/2023/03/02/youve-probably-never-heard-of-murcs-law-but-youve-seen-it-in-action-lots-of-times/ | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9009 Posts
On February 03 2025 04:40 Mohdoo wrote: I spent a long time thinking about whether or not it was the right decision for Canada to target red states with their retaliatory tariffs. At first glance, the perceived bias or targeting red states could harm credibility or make it appear politically motivated. But then I realized the truth is this is politically motivated. And that’s not a bad thing. The tariffs are political. The political ideas that led to these tariffs are damaging and unacceptable. A part of me has tried to be sympathetic to republicans because I can tell all of this anger and resentment is genuine and they truly are extremely upset. These elections of anger are real to them and I am sad for them feeling that way. It’s clearly a prison and they can’t seem to escape it. But this tantrum continues to grow and damage more and more parts of society. So my conclusion is: we have reached a point where it makes sense to punish red states for harboring and fueling these political ideas. Europe and Asia are more culturally matched than California and Florida. Mainstream right wing supported this while mainstream left wing tried to prevent it for years. There is no perfect way to punish this resentment run amok. But I can’t pretend I have a better idea and I recognize the world needs to lose patience eventually. I couldn't agree more. 2025 is officially the "Find Out" part of "FAFO". So I agree that they need to be punished somehow for doing this. Some places in those red states are ostensibly blue, but for the Dems that didn't vote or voted elsewhere, they deserve it too. The time of patience is over and shit needs to come to a head for lot of people. They'll hurt and they'll get even angrier. But if they don't learn, then it just continues. They'll remove the hand from the stove eventually. Or they'll try another insurrection/civil war and be put down with extreme prejudice. On February 03 2025 04:55 Azuzu wrote: I recently came across a description of something called "Murcs Law" that in essence states "only Democrats have any agency or causal influence over American politics". Looking at things through that lens, I see so many examples including and especially GH's posts. https://whereofonecanspeak.com/2023/03/02/youve-probably-never-heard-of-murcs-law-but-youve-seen-it-in-action-lots-of-times/ This is a great read and precisely what we're seeing. Thank you for this link! | ||
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maybenexttime
Poland5708 Posts
On February 03 2025 02:26 GreenHorizons wrote: I mean the basic issue is that Republicans are the face of the rise of fascism in the US while the ostensible opposition to them, Democrats, do a bunch of the legwork for them. For example: The idea from libs/Dems and their supporters here/nationally was to fall in line behind Democrats (no matter what, including supporting genocide) to stop Trump and the rise of fascism in the US. That objectively failed. People don't have to try socialism but they have to abandon the Democrat party as a path for the future and find something else if they want any reasonable hope for it not to suck indefinitely. The Democrats are the only party that can realistically beat the Republicans. You've been undermining them for years. You are part of the problem, not the solution you fancy yourself to be. | ||
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micronesia
United States24745 Posts
Although, turning every (or at least, many) bad piece of news reporting (which doesn't mention the democrats) into "and let's also look at how the Democrats may have contributed to this" does get old. | ||
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RenSC2
United States1074 Posts
On February 03 2025 02:26 GreenHorizons wrote: I mean the basic issue is that Republicans are the face of the rise of fascism in the US while the ostensible opposition to them, Democrats, do a bunch of the legwork for them. For example: The idea from libs/Dems and their supporters here/nationally was to fall in line behind Democrats (no matter what, including supporting genocide) to stop Trump and the rise of fascism in the US. That objectively failed. People don't have to try socialism but they have to abandon the Democrat party as a path for the future and find something else if they want any reasonable hope for it not to suck indefinitely. People tried socialism. You tried it, right? Are you completely alone? I think there has to be some other socialists out there. So yes, Socialism was tried and it failed and it led to Trump and his fascism. It was much less of an impediment to Trump's fascism than the Democrats and likely helped push people towards fascism. I'd say it had a negative value in preventing fascism. Democrats, just didn't have enough value. Will you complain that not enough people tried Socialism? Then I'll just say that not enough people tried the Democrats. If a couple million more had voted Democrat, we would have eked out a win and wouldn't be in this mess. If the Democrats had won a supermajority, they could pass a bunch of legislation including things like Medicare for All. Hell, if 70% or more of the voters were voting Democrat, we could split the Democratic party in two between the leftists/progressives versus the moderates/neo-liberals and still not give up seats to the Republicans. However, that's not what happened. The American voters voted for Republicans a hell of a lot more than they voted for Socialists and slightly more than they voted for Democrats. Unfortunately, the Democrats just didn't have the people, just like Socialists don't have the people. On February 03 2025 02:58 GreenHorizons wrote: They spent the run up to the election insisting that they did, that was probably one of many mistakes that cost them the election. Trump's incompetence saved us from Democrats malice. The American people weren't begging Democrats to pass the Laken Riley Act either. I dunno, one of the "downsides" (from a capitalists' pov) of a union is that they sorta do the "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs". So I think the firms where the workers councils didn't target immigrants for expulsion would see many benefits from keeping some of their hardest working and most dedicated workers around, immigrant or not. Did you really just use "from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" seriously? Can you perhaps spot a flaw in incentivizing people to be the least able and most needy? I first saw that statement in an Ayn Rand novel and I thought she was putting up straw men so that she could knock them down so easily. You're literally acting like the strawman in an Ayn Rand novel. Some self reflection may be in order. | ||
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KwarK
United States43347 Posts
But in GH's idea of direct democratic worker control the camps are going to be open and the workers are still going to be very racist. His worker councils will be rounding up anyone with a Spanish sounding last name because the problem has never been the Democrats. Though even if GH had all the power he'd still be complaining about the Democrats because he can't accept that he has no solution to the problem of the radicalization of the American voting public. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland26221 Posts
On February 03 2025 05:02 RenSC2 wrote: People tried socialism. You tried it, right? Are you completely alone? I think there has to be some other socialists out there. So yes, Socialism was tried and it failed and it led to Trump and his fascism. It was much less of an impediment to Trump's fascism than the Democrats and likely helped push people towards fascism. I'd say it had a negative value in preventing fascism. Democrats, just didn't have enough value. Will you complain that not enough people tried Socialism? Then I'll just say that not enough people tried the Democrats. If a couple million more had voted Democrat, we would have eked out a win and wouldn't be in this mess. If the Democrats had won a supermajority, they could pass a bunch of legislation including things like Medicare for All. Hell, if 70% or more of the voters were voting Democrat, we could split the Democratic party in two between the leftists/progressives versus the moderates/neo-liberals and still not give up seats to the Republicans. However, that's not what happened. The American voters voted for Republicans a hell of a lot more than they voted for Socialists and slightly more than they voted for Democrats. Unfortunately, the Democrats just didn't have the people, just like Socialists don't have the people. Did you really just use "from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" seriously? Can you perhaps spot a flaw in incentivizing people to be the least able and most needy? I first saw that statement in an Ayn Rand novel and I thought she was putting up straw men so that she could knock them down so easily. You're literally acting like the strawman in an Ayn Rand novel. Some self reflection may be in order. I think many on the ‘actual’ left do get pissy, and do over-egg what would happen in various hypothetical scenarios, I think it’s a reasonable criticism. But there is some realism among most when being more sober about it, which is that yeah, they are in a minority, but they’re in theory an important component of a wider coalition. There’s a resentment on what I’ll call ‘Shrodinger’s socialist’ (I’ve probably stolen this and forgotten I have, but anyway. Namely that the left is simultaneously to blame for x election defeat, while not being worth meaningfully courting for their vote. To compound this, the electoral tactics pursued have seen Trump win two elections now. It’s one thing to be sidelined, or perceived as being so as part of a successful campaign. Quite another in yet another depressing shitshow. Now sticking on my ‘to be fair’ hat, the US’s political structures are bloody dysfunctional. Actually getting meaningful shit done is blooming difficult. People point to the GOP getting shit done, and while that’s true, it’s also partly due to the destructive nature of their agenda. It’s often just easier to go ‘we’re not doing x or funding it anymore’ given how things are structured than it is to bring in some sweeping federal reform. Policy under Biden, there’s good stuff there too, but too few people seemed au fait or enthused by it. Not everyone had a resident ball of Plasma to break everything down etc! But if it’s tricky to nail the substance in a way that pleases the quite wide spectrum of your base, come on can you at least do a better job on the style? | ||
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maybenexttime
Poland5708 Posts
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KT_Elwood
Germany1093 Posts
"beating even the inflation" The core regulatory proposition of the tech industry is "it's not a crime if we do it with an app." It's not an unlicensed taxi if we do it with an app. It's not an illegal hotel room if we do it with an app. It's not an unregistered security if we do it with an app. It's not wage theft if we do it with an app. Inflation is one of the most politically salient factors of this decade, and so much of inflation can be attributed to a crime, done with an app, with impunity for the criminals. The entire food supply has been sewn up by cartels of 2-5 giant companies, and they colluded to raise prices, and bragged about it, and got away with it, because neoclassical economists insist that it's impossible for this kind of price fixing to occur in an "efficient market." https://pluralistic.net/2025/01/25/potatotrac/#carbo-loading You might know that pretty much every packaged good in your grocery store is made by one of two companies, Unilever and Procter and Gamble. Both CEOs boasted to their investors about their above-inflation price increases... ... It may seem like your grocer's eggs department is filled with many different companies' products. In reality, a single company, Cal-Maine Foods, owns practically every brand of eggs in the case: Farmhouse Eggs, Sunups, Sunny Meadow, Egg-Land’s Best and Land O’ Lakes. They made record profits after the pandemic and through bird flu, a fact that CFO Max Bowman attributed to "significantly higher selling prices" and "our ability to adapt to inflationary market pressures" .... Big Potato controls 97% of the frozen potato market, and any sector that large and concentrated is going to be pretty cozy. The execs from these companies meet up at industry associations, lobbying bodies, and by job-hopping between companies in the cartel. But they don't have to rely on personal connections to rig the price of potatoes: they do it through a third-party data-broker called Potatotrac..... A data-broker called Agri Stats works with America's largest meat-packers to rig the price of meat – packers send Agri Stats the same kind of data that Big Potato sends to Potatotrac, and Agri Stats sends back the same "recommendations" that allow them to raise meat prices across the board, in lockstep.... .... The "price fixing is legal if we do it with an app" gambit is not just about food, either. Apps like Realpage let big corporate landlords – who've bought up a sizable fraction of all the available homes in America – collude to raise rents ... And private equity companies have rolled up all the fire truck companies, hiking the price of trucks, creating backlogs and bottlenecks for parts and service, and starving the nation's municipalities (including Los Angeles) of fire-fighting equipment This kind of price-fixing was central to the enforcement actions of the Biden administration's trustbusters at the FTC, and their investigations and actions inspired state AGs and private parties to bring their own antitrust suits. The question is, will Trump's enforcers continue this agenda? And will Trump's judges – steeped in Heritage Foundation economics that insists that monopolies are "efficient" – find in their favor if they do? Inflation has lots of causes, it's true. But when an industry is consolidated enough to take advantage of a data brokerage or just engage in tacit collusion, any source of inflation – war, disease, weather – allows whole sectors to raise prices together, and keep them high, long after the shock has passed. | ||
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Falling
Canada11378 Posts
On February 02 2025 13:33 JimmyJRaynor wrote: I feel bad for the young people living in Canada who have a fraction of the economic opportunity I had when the country was run by really smart people. Oh, spare me. You feel bad? With this kind garbage: Canada has earned this. Your sympathies are for America and the big bossman Trump, not for young Canadians. (Maybe because he reminds you (however tangentially) of your five Ontario politician mixtape that your run on repeat, Hazel and company?) You are drawing water for Trump, justifying his action in ways that even he does not. The NATO issue is separate and not even used by Trump to justify it. The fentanyl and illegal alien lies are necessary so he can bypass Congress to make the tariffs without them (security reasons). Just like the fake voter lies were necessary to bypass the will of the people in 2020. These are not anti-Trudeau mind games. These are executive power endruns to avoid going through the proper legislative bodies. Doesn't matter what we do. There is no amount of 'being friends' to America that would stop this. We've always been friends. It's MAGA America that suddenly wants to bully us because Trump got it in his head that trade deficits are bad... I guess we are at fault for selling cheap oil to you guys. Our bad. Should've charged more, I guess. Because in every other trade exchange, more Canadian money moves south than American money moves north. And for this we are 'ripping off' Americans. Yes, Trump can be flattered. But he's also impervious to fact if he's fixed on one of his moronic ideas (like fake voters). You see it with Ukraine as well. He briefly starts talking favourably about Ukraine (after Zelensky's flattery) and then soon after defaults back to how Ukraine probably shouldn't have fought back. He actually is the moron that thinks a trade deficit with Canada means America is subsidizing Canada... and that it means we owe America money. The “Tariff Lobby,” headed by the Globalist, and always wrong, Wall Street Journal, is working hard to justify Countries like Canada, Mexico, China, and too many others to name, continue the decades long RIPOFF OF AMERICA, both with regard to TRADE, CRIME, AND POISONOUS DRUGS that are allowed to so freely flow into AMERICA. THOSE DAYS ARE OVER! The USA has major deficits with Canada, Mexico, and China (and almost all countries!), owes 36 Trillion Dollars, and we’re not going to be the “Stupid Country” any longer. What a genius. Got Justin Trudeau dancing to his beat. Big moves. Much wow. Trudeau Sr, Jean Chretien, Hurricane Hazel (and whatever that other Ontario leader was that you bring up ad naseum) combined wouldn't have been able to get off this self-destructive course. The man is fixated on trade deficit=bad. Tariff walls=good. Nothing but bitter reality will make us relearn why free trade has been so beneficial. Trump has repeatedly said there is nothing that Canada can do to avoid the tariffs. Therefore, if we can't change our actions to make the tariffs go away, all we can do is fight back. Well, except he says we could avoid it by becoming the 51st State, but he can screw off all the way down to the Gulf of Mexico with that. I swear, if he was president 150 years ago, he would be gearing for war and you would be chanting 54'40" or Fight. You already took Stompin' Tom's advice, so all I'll say is enjoy Herbert Hoover 2.0 and his Smoot-Hawley Tariffs. I'm sure the results will be just as successful for your genius dear leader. | ||
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