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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 4664

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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!

NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.

Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.


If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread
Vivax
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
22380 Posts
December 14 2024 11:33 GMT
#93261
On December 14 2024 20:18 baal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 14 2024 18:36 Simberto wrote:
On December 14 2024 18:26 baal wrote:
On December 13 2024 19:46 Liquid`Drone wrote:
I haven't watched the video


Why even engage in the topic if you are not going to take 2 minutes to watch the video?



Because some people don't want to watch people dying on video? But still care about stuff?

It's not about the time, it is about the content that you put in your brain that you cannot get out of it afterwards.


He did not die on video, he was alive and moving when Daniel and the other passengers let him go and the cops took over.

If you can't handle watching it then your opinion should be taken with a huge grain of salt since you are missing a massive chunk of information.


No one should have to watch events they couldn‘t bear to keep in mind.
Not everyone is cool with that. You can‘t erase memories.

As for charging people with terrorism because they chant the deny depose thing, that‘s a pretty US thing to do. Savage legal system.
Magic Powers
Profile Joined April 2012
Austria4478 Posts
December 14 2024 12:29 GMT
#93262
If you can't bare to watch the parts that the media is legally allowed to show you, then you don't have a place discussing whether or not Penny is guilty. I think that's a highly uncontroversial opinion.
If you want to do the right thing, 80% of your job is done if you don't do the wrong thing.
Vivax
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
22380 Posts
December 14 2024 12:44 GMT
#93263
On December 14 2024 21:29 Magic Powers wrote:
If you can't bare to watch the parts that the media is legally allowed to show you, then you don't have a place discussing whether or not Penny is guilty. I think that's a highly uncontroversial opinion.


You do have a place to say it. You don‘t have an obligation to respect the opinion when you know how it formed and that it doesn‘t fit within your standards.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22424 Posts
December 14 2024 12:44 GMT
#93264
On December 14 2024 21:29 Magic Powers wrote:
If you can't bare to watch the parts that the media is legally allowed to show you, then you don't have a place discussing whether or not Penny is guilty. I think that's a highly uncontroversial opinion.
How about no.

It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland27013 Posts
December 14 2024 13:09 GMT
#93265
On December 14 2024 20:18 baal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 14 2024 18:36 Simberto wrote:
On December 14 2024 18:26 baal wrote:
On December 13 2024 19:46 Liquid`Drone wrote:
I haven't watched the video


Why even engage in the topic if you are not going to take 2 minutes to watch the video?



Because some people don't want to watch people dying on video? But still care about stuff?

It's not about the time, it is about the content that you put in your brain that you cannot get out of it afterwards.


He did not die on video, he was alive and moving when Daniel and the other passengers let him go and the cops took over.

If you can't handle watching it then your opinion should be taken with a huge grain of salt since you are missing a massive chunk of information.

Nice sig reference!

I don’t think one needs to watch it to comment about the topic more generally, which quite a few are doing.

To comment on this very specific case, perhaps one would be better informed having done so aye
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
Magic Powers
Profile Joined April 2012
Austria4478 Posts
December 14 2024 13:18 GMT
#93266
On December 14 2024 21:44 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 14 2024 21:29 Magic Powers wrote:
If you can't bare to watch the parts that the media is legally allowed to show you, then you don't have a place discussing whether or not Penny is guilty. I think that's a highly uncontroversial opinion.
How about no.


What do you mean how about no? What's the reason that anyone should respect an uninformed opinion?
If you want to do the right thing, 80% of your job is done if you don't do the wrong thing.
BlackJack
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
United States10574 Posts
December 14 2024 13:47 GMT
#93267
It’s a bold move to tell a jury that sat through the entire trial that they got it wrong if you won’t even view the evidence yourself
Simberto
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany11894 Posts
December 14 2024 14:27 GMT
#93268
On December 14 2024 22:47 BlackJack wrote:
It’s a bold move to tell a jury that sat through the entire trial that they got it wrong if you won’t even view the evidence yourself


Did anyone do that, though?

I didn't read every post about this, but my recollection is that some people thought this should be in court, and others thought it didn't.

I don't recall anyone saying that the jury got it wrong.
BlackJack
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
United States10574 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-12-14 14:48:37
December 14 2024 14:43 GMT
#93269
On December 14 2024 23:27 Simberto wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 14 2024 22:47 BlackJack wrote:
It’s a bold move to tell a jury that sat through the entire trial that they got it wrong if you won’t even view the evidence yourself


Did anyone do that, though?

I didn't read every post about this, but my recollection is that some people thought this should be in court, and others thought it didn't.

I don't recall anyone saying that the jury got it wrong.


If people weren’t questioning the jury’s decision I doubt it would even have been brought up. People didn’t start talking about it just to disagree with my opinion that it should not have been prosecuted because I offered that after the fact. Also multiple people have clearly stated in some manner that this killing was unjustified, or not self-defense.

Also magic powers last post was simply stating that if you don’t watch the available evidence you shouldn’t be deciding that Daniel Penny is guilty and even that received disagreement.
Liquid`Drone
Profile Joined September 2002
Norway28815 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-12-14 15:23:28
December 14 2024 15:22 GMT
#93270
I specifically didn't opine on whether the ruling was right or wrong because i havent watched the video. My commentary was very generalized and not really about this specific case, again, because i didnt watch the video. If anything I was stating that there's no general approach that would be valid for all these types of scenarios because they should all be treated as individual cases and you need to have at least watched the video before you try to state whether penny was in the wrong or not.

Tbh it's not really about being squeamish either, ive just been browsing the thread in situations where watching a video wasnt really viable.
Moderator
Uldridge
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Belgium5183 Posts
December 14 2024 16:36 GMT
#93271
People dying is quite safe for work content, obviously.
Taxes are for Terrans
Jockmcplop
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom9871 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-12-14 16:40:18
December 14 2024 16:40 GMT
#93272
Yeah I didn't talk about whether the ruling was right either.
All I said was its right that he's prosecuted.
RIP Meatloaf <3
Fleetfeet
Profile Blog Joined May 2014
Canada2747 Posts
December 14 2024 22:31 GMT
#93273
On December 15 2024 01:40 Jockmcplop wrote:
Yeah I didn't talk about whether the ruling was right either.
All I said was its right that he's prosecuted.


Yeah my objection was also to claims that charging/prosecuting was wrong on the grounds that it'll discourage other civilians from murder.
BlackJack
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
United States10574 Posts
December 14 2024 23:49 GMT
#93274
I mean simply referring to it as “murder”, which both of you did, heavily implies that you believe what he did was unlawful. It doesn’t make sense to call it murder if you’re okay with a “not guilty” verdict. You can lawfully kill someone. I don’t think you can lawfully murder someone.
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24779 Posts
December 14 2024 23:51 GMT
#93275
The only way I can see that is if you commit a murder that is morally justified but legally prohibited, and then the law is changed to make the killing legal, thus freeing you from your incarceration...
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
Fleetfeet
Profile Blog Joined May 2014
Canada2747 Posts
December 15 2024 18:58 GMT
#93276
On December 15 2024 08:49 BlackJack wrote:
I mean simply referring to it as “murder”, which both of you did, heavily implies that you believe what he did was unlawful. It doesn’t make sense to call it murder if you’re okay with a “not guilty” verdict. You can lawfully kill someone. I don’t think you can lawfully murder someone.


I'm referring to the potential of others actions, not the actions of a particular in this case.

100% okay with a not guilty verdict. 86% not okay with "he should never have been charged with anything". Hope that clears things up.
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States6240 Posts
December 15 2024 19:46 GMT
#93277
George Stephanopolous of the Clinton administration and ABC are going to donate $15 million to Blumpf's presidential library to settle a lawsuit brought by the latter making up for spamming the airwaves calling him a rapist.
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
Erasme
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Bahamas15899 Posts
December 15 2024 20:37 GMT
#93278
Is there such a difference between sexual abuser and rapist ?
Like, would they have been fine calling him a sexual abuser ?
Also
In July 2023, Judge Kaplan said that the jury had found that Trump had raped Carroll according to the common definition of the word, which did not require specifically penile penetration. In August 2023, Kaplan dismissed a countersuit and wrote that Carroll's accusation of "rape" is "substantially true".

If a judge called him a rapist wouldn't that make him one ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7lxwFEB6FI “‘Drain the swamp’? Stupid saying, means nothing, but you guys loved it so I kept saying it.”
Sermokala
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States14146 Posts
December 16 2024 04:19 GMT
#93279
On December 16 2024 05:37 Erasme wrote:
Is there such a difference between sexual abuser and rapist ?
Like, would they have been fine calling him a sexual abuser ?
Also
Show nested quote +
In July 2023, Judge Kaplan said that the jury had found that Trump had raped Carroll according to the common definition of the word, which did not require specifically penile penetration. In August 2023, Kaplan dismissed a countersuit and wrote that Carroll's accusation of "rape" is "substantially true".

If a judge called him a rapist wouldn't that make him one ?

They didn't pay because they were wrong they paid because the guy they told the truth about might forget about them if they don't have an active lawsuit with them.
A wise man will say that he knows nothing. We're gona party like its 2752 Hail Dark Brandon
Magic Powers
Profile Joined April 2012
Austria4478 Posts
December 16 2024 13:29 GMT
#93280
Lesson learned: never snitch. Or if you do, gotta be part of "the system" yourself.
A quick breakdown of some of the events after the assassination.

If you want to do the right thing, 80% of your job is done if you don't do the wrong thing.
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