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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States45762 Posts
On July 06 2024 22:34 mierin wrote: I've never seen a group of people more inept than democrats. If Biden stays in the race Trump wins 100%, it's RBG all over again. 100%? Certainty? How are you so sure, or are you exaggerating? Can you please elaborate? Because Trump definitely has an advantage, but that's very different than saying 100%. | ||
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ZerOCoolSC2
9052 Posts
Someone should start a petition on whitehouse.gov and get 100k sigs for biden to step aside. /s | ||
KwarK
United States43964 Posts
On July 06 2024 23:04 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: 100%? Certainty? How are you so sure, or are you exaggerating? Can you please elaborate? Because Trump definitely has an advantage, but that's very different than saying 100%. Let’s say it’s really 60/40. The people who said 100/0 will use any victory as vindication as if there was no chance of a 60/40 event happening. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States45762 Posts
On July 07 2024 01:44 KwarK wrote: Let’s say it’s really 60/40. The people who said 100/0 will use any victory as vindication as if there was no chance of a 60/40 event happening. I'm sure some people will say that, yeah. "My prediction came true = There was a 100% chance it was going to happen, all along! I knew it!" | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23928 Posts
On July 06 2024 23:42 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote: From what I've heard, that interview Biden did, did not help him. Probably made it a lot worse. So yeah...Polls might not reflect it, but he's probably going to win this shit. Someone should start a petition on whitehouse.gov and get 100k sigs for biden to step aside. /s Even 538's poll model puts Biden at ~33%, so it's showing in the polls. The Economist model puts Biden at ~25% chance. The betting markets give Biden just a 14% chance, putting him below Kamala Harris. Combine that with Biden's clear incapacity to do the sort of unscripted town halls, press conferences, and interviews he needs to or keep up the kind of frenetic campaign pace 2024 demands, and the writing is on the wall. If the election was today I'd give Biden about a 33% chance. Forecasting what Biden v Trump would look like by November, at this pace, maybe a 10% chance Biden wins. | ||
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oBlade
United States6090 Posts
On July 05 2024 16:08 KT_Elwood wrote: That's my point. Appeal alll the way up to SCOTUS everytime and for a small "gratitude" you can make them find a way for you. What is "every time" - How many times are you planning on trying to railroad the other side in court? On July 05 2024 16:08 KT_Elwood wrote: Anyway. I get the idea that nothing "in the law" has changed, but SCOUTS planted a fundamental distrust in their restraint to not be partisan in theses sensitive topics. By disagreeing with the unbiased, nonpartisan thee? On July 05 2024 16:08 KT_Elwood wrote: Alito, Thomas and families openly supported insurrection and treason. They were onboard with a president trying to steal an election by interference, and if that doesn't work..plainly send the goons to stop yout VP from conceding and handing over the office. Do you have any evidence for this "support" besides a woman hung a flag outside her house? Like I'm trying to remember all the election cases SCOTUS jumped at the chance to hear 4 years ago under the pretense of being "fair," them declaring that elections were fraudulent, results were invalid, sending votes back to the states, and of course their conspicuous refusal to hear the case of Drumpf's attempted assassination of Pence, which definitely happened and isn't a Blueanon conspiracy. On July 05 2024 16:08 KT_Elwood wrote: They can't be removed from office they just sit there and wait to play their part, and that's fucking scary. They can be impeached, if you again take the time to read the Constitution. On July 05 2024 16:08 KT_Elwood wrote: The "Social contract" is broken. I don't think you're using this in the Rousseau sense because of the scare quotes so it's hard to figure out what you mean. If I try to apply the idea to US politics, what I get is something like this: Since the beginning, presidents have enjoyed broad immunity commensurate with the latitude you need to be the chief executive. Since the impeachment of Andrew Johnson, this has been understood as you can't just remove the guy because you don't like him or he doesn't do what you want or indeed just because he's from the wrong party and you have enough people from your own party. And this has been respected because when the pendulum inevitably shifts, you don't want the other side fucking with you in the same way. Except this time one group thought for some reason they had set up a system where they could just keep the pendulum forever, and when it started to slip the tiniest bit, they have gone completely apeshit trying to hold on to it. | ||
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KwarK
United States43964 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
And then we also have Maxine Waters doing the same thing. And Diane Feinstein. Our party has a problem with old people accumulating an empire of influence and power such that they can’t be removed. All 4 of these situations should have been avoided by a functioning mechanism of accountability | ||
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Zambrah
United States7393 Posts
The problem is the Democrats are god awful at cultivating likeable, popular candidates that speak to people. They rely on them to appear rather than foster any talent because Democrats seem to think people deserve turns at power instead of going by any real metric of popularity or competence. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
On July 07 2024 11:10 Zambrah wrote: Now, Im not one to defend Biden, I still mostly think hes a real turd, that being said, I think he would've been fine with not being the president/presidential candidate if the Democrats didnt have such a roster of unlikeable uber-turds that make Biden seem the best of the bunch. The problem is the Democrats are god awful at cultivating likeable, popular candidates that speak to people. They rely on them to appear rather than foster any talent because Democrats seem to think people deserve turns at power instead of going by any real metric of popularity or competence. It’s intentional. AOC’s first primary win told us everything we needed to know about the power accumulation dynamics in the party. They actively seek to prevent new talent. The party is not able to hold individuals accountable for toxic behavior. Feinstein, Waters, and RBG are all examples of abhorrent people who were allowed to harm the party for a very long time for personal gain and ego indulgence. If the party was functional and held individual politicians accountable, none of those situations would have festered as extremely as they did | ||
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oBlade
United States6090 Posts
On July 07 2024 04:25 KwarK wrote: The idea that there is a Blueanon with conspiracy theories comparable to QAnon is itself peak QAnon. Of course. QAnon is so fringe it had to be played up in order for anyone outside of it to know what it is, whereas Blueanon conspiracies are so common as to be widely disseminated mainstream corporate media talking points. They aren't directly comparable, it's mere wordplay that doesn't make any claim such as the one that your witticism elegantly refutes. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States45762 Posts
On July 07 2024 16:19 oBlade wrote: Of course. QAnon is so fringe it had to be played up in order for anyone outside of it to know what it is, whereas Blueanon conspiracies are so common as to be widely disseminated mainstream corporate media talking points. They aren't directly comparable, it's mere wordplay that doesn't make any claim such as the one that your witticism elegantly refutes. I'm unfamiliar with the term Blueanon. I Googled it and I received some information about how conservatives use this term to label liberal beliefs as conspiracy theories, like that the covid vaccine helped against covid (which was true, not some liberal conspiracy) and that Trump's team colluded with Russia (which was true, not some liberal conspiracy). Are there any actual conspiracy theories that liberals are pushing, that conservatives are calling Blueanon? Or is it just a way to dismiss reality with name-calling / ad hominem? I feel like conservatives may just hand-wave climate change and evolution and equity and democracy away as "Blueanon", if this is really just a meme to avoid facts and accountability. | ||
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BlackJack
United States10574 Posts
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States45762 Posts
On July 07 2024 18:17 BlackJack wrote: Joe Biden is sharp as a tack and at the top of his game; it's implausible for COVID to have leaked from a lab and/or you're racist to suggest otherwise; Hunter Biden's laptop is Russian disinformation; Jussie Smollet was attacked by a couple of MAGA white supremacists, etc. Ah okay, thanks! oBlade had incorrectly claimed that Blueanon conspiracy theories were super common and widespread, rather than the rare, niche assertions you've listed. Good to know. | ||
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oBlade
United States6090 Posts
On July 07 2024 19:09 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: Ah okay, thanks! oBlade had incorrectly claimed that Blueanon conspiracy theories were super common and widespread, rather than the rare, niche assertions you've listed. Good to know. You speak about climate change and then personally use enough gas lighting to keep the entire fossil fuel industry in business for a decade. Those were all lockstep media headlines. We lived through them. "the covid vaccine helped against covid" - This is an extremely suspect one as you've framed it. In 2020, the left said they'd never take a dangerous poison vaccine rushed through by the incompetent Trump. Biden took office and immediately his press office bragged "We're distributing a million doses per day!" We have tapes of them saying the vaccines are 100% effective at preventing transmission. We watched that number plummet and then have receipts of them revising the definition of a "vaccine." So yes it would have been Blueanon to uncritically eat up Big Pharma's miracle 100% effective vaccine claim, published in the Big Pharma-reviewed Big Pharma Weekly. It would obviously not be Blueanon to say "medicine helps" - or we can also open the books on ivermectin if you like. "Climate change" - Here is a major publication blaming a Republican for it raining in Florida in summer last month: https://www.msnbc.com/the-reidout/reidout-blog/south-florida-flooding-desantis-climate-agenda-rcna157032 "Evolution" - Nobody has talked about this as an issue for like 15 years. You are fighting yesterday's battles. Yes, it was funny to turn on the TV late and watch Jon Stewart make fun of Republicans. It's not as much fun to grow up and watch Democrats and Republicans together ruin almost everything they touch. You seem to easily accept the proposition that one side has a higher propensity for delusion, conspiracy, and groupthink. You may one day have to face the fact that side may be yours. We could talk about why, I personally think it's because the right has religion that the left is the one to search for dogmas elsewhere. They repeatedly lie to your face, and one side's answer is "Please sir, may I have some more," while the other says "Doubt it." Now - "collusion" - To have used this as an example, you may have imbibed so much Kool-Aid as to any minute break through Drumpf's border wall screaming "Oh Yeah!" - and I don't want this to become a rehash of the fact that each of our entire worldviews is wrong to the other, but if you can explain to me what you mean by "collusion" and how you know it happened, I will let you have the last word on this. I hope it can be succinct enough as to not to be a desperate wall of "where there's smoke there's fire" but also detailed enough that there's proof that I can see what you mean by this. Because from where I sit, Mueller went through everything, said there's no evidence of collusion, and the conspiracy theory almost immediately became Mueller is compromised or someone paid him off because he let Drumpf get away. Same way Comey is blamed for Clinton. Meanwhile, we have documents showing Brennan brief Obama in the White House "we have dirt on Trump" that was ordered by Clinton, paid for by the DNC, and used by the intelligence community for a FISA warrant on the lead opponent to their administration's party painting him as a Russian agent. When Drumpf met Kim Jong Un, Rachel Maddow did a 30 minute segment explaining that North Korea has a 10 mile border with Russia. 51 members of the intelligence community lied about the Biden laptop being Russian disinformation. These people are out of control - and it's a control they should never have been given to begin with. 8 years of this brazen deception and I'd be surprised if half of the scum running these scams could even muster enough intellect to beat Sarah Palin at finding Russia on a map. I think the left has an epistemological crisis, to be honest. As an example, there are things I personally believe that are outside the mold. I don't even think Covid-19 was a lab leak - I think it was an intentional release. But I don't think they rise to the level of conspiracy theory because of how I treat them - I don't claim to know them with any certainty, let alone claim that I can prove them, or even that they'd ever be able to be proven, I don't even claim they matter, I don't proselytize them like I've struck gold, I don't spam mass media or social media with them, I don't cut off relationships when people don't see eye to eye with me. Whereas Drumpf says he had a hiccup and a billion dollars in media is there to tell us it was actually a burp. The inability to assess significance has gone hand in hand with the inability to evaluate truth due to a totally dysfunctional skepticism/deference system. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States45762 Posts
But I already have my answer: Blueanon is apparently just another Republican fabrication, where they cherry-pick unpopular, niche takes and overgeneralize them to try to make Democrats appear to be just as crazy as them. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland26742 Posts
I don’t recall any particular groundswell of ‘we won’t take the vaccine because Trump rushed it through’ to take just one example. Ofc TL’s resident left-leaners aren’t ’the left’ either, part of it and perhaps not 100% representative, I seem to recall facilitating the vaccines getting to market was one of few things in Trump’s Covid response people here gave him credit for | ||
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KwarK
United States43964 Posts
On July 07 2024 18:17 BlackJack wrote: Joe Biden is sharp as a tack and at the top of his game; it's implausible for COVID to have leaked from a lab and/or you're racist to suggest otherwise; Hunter Biden's laptop is Russian disinformation; Jussie Smollet was attacked by a couple of MAGA white supremacists, etc. I think you guys are getting yourselves upset about injustices you’re telling each other about in your victim circle jerks. Nobody else is talking about Jussie and the laptop. | ||
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Ryzel
United States550 Posts
On July 07 2024 04:25 KwarK wrote: The idea that there is a Blueanon with conspiracy theories comparable to QAnon is itself peak QAnon. +1, I read BlueAnon and had to suppress a chortle. | ||
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Sohanji
1 Post
The same job the rest of your life? I didn't know that. ADAM: What's the difference? TOUR GUIDE: You'll be happy to know that bees, as a species, haven't had one day off : in 27 million years. BARRY: (Upset) So you'll just work us to death? : We'll sure try. (Everyone on the bus laughs except Barry. Barry and Adam are walking back home together) ADAM: Wow! That blew my mind! BARRY: "What's the difference?" How can you say that? : One job forever? That's an insane choice to have to make. ADAM: I'm relieved. Now we only have to make one decision in life. BARRY: But, Adam, how could they never have told us that? ADAM: Why would you question anything? We're bees. : We're the most perfectly functioning society on Earth. BARRY: You ever think maybe things work a little too well here? ADAM: Like what? Give me one example. (Barry and Adam stop walking and it is revealed to the audience that hundreds of cars are speeding by and narrowly missing them in perfect unison) BARRY: I don't know. But you know what I'm talking about. ANNOUNCER: Please clear the gate. Royal Nectar Force on approach. BARRY: Wait a second. Check it out. (The Pollen jocks fly in, circle around and landing in line) : - Hey, those are Pollen Jocks! ADAM: - Wow. : I've never seen them this close. BARRY: They know what it's like outside the hive. ADAM: Yeah, but some don't come back. GIRL BEES: - Hey, Jocks! - Hi, Jocks! (The Pollen Jocks hook up their backpacks to machines that pump the nectar to trucks, which drive away) LOU LO DUVA: You guys did great! : You're monsters! You're sky freaks! I love it! (Punching the Pollen Jocks in joy) I love it! ADAM: - I wonder where they were. BARRY: - I don't know. : Their day's not planned. : Outside the hive, flying who knows where, doing who knows what. : You can't just decide to be a Pollen Jock. You have to be bred for that. ADAM== Right. (Barry and Adam are covered in some pollen that floated off of the Pollen Jocks) BARRY: Look at that. That's more pollen than you and I will see in a lifetime. ADAM: It's just a status symbol. Bees make too much of it. BARRY: Perhaps. Unless you're wearing it and the ladies see you wearing it. (Barry waves at 2 girls standing a little away from them) ADAM== Those ladies? Aren't they our cousins too? BARRY: Distant. Distant. POLLEN JOCK #1: Look at these two. POLLEN JOCK #2: - Couple of Hive Harrys. POLLEN JOCK #1: - Let's have fun with them. GIRL BEE #1: It must be dangerous being a Pollen Jock. BARRY: Yeah. Once a bear pinned me against a mushroom! : He had a paw on my throat, and with the other, he was slapping me! (Slaps Adam with his hand to represent his scenario) GIRL BEE #2: - Oh, my! BARRY: - I never thought I'd knock him out. GIRL BEE #1: (Looking at Adam) What were you doing during this? ADAM: Obviously I was trying to alert the authorities. BARRY: I can autograph that. (The pollen jocks walk up to Barry and Adam, they pretend that Barry and Adam really are pollen jocks.) POLLEN JOCK #1: A little gusty out there today, wasn't it, comrades? BARRY: Yeah. Gusty. POLLEN JOCK #1: We're hitting a sunflower patch six miles from here tomorrow. BARRY: - Six miles, huh? ADAM: - Barry! POLLEN JOCK #2: A puddle jump for us, but maybe you're not up for it. BARRY: - Maybe I am. ADAM: - You are not! POLLEN JOCK #1: We're going 0900 at J-Gate. : What do you think, buzzy-boy? Are you bee enough? BARRY: I might be. It all depends on what 0900 means. (The scene cuts to Barry looking out on the hive-city from his balcony at night) MARTIN: Hey, Honex! User was banned for this post. | ||
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