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On January 20 2016 05:44 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On January 19 2016 14:24 WhiteDog wrote:On January 19 2016 09:29 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:PARIS (AP) — French President Francois Hollande pledged Monday to redefine France's business model and declared what he called "a state of economic and social emergency," unveiling a 2-billion-euro ($2.2 billion) plan to revive hiring and catch up with a fast-moving world economy.
The measures he proposed, however, are relatively modest, and he said they would not "put into question" the 35-hour workweek. With his country under a state of emergency since extremist attacks in November, Hollande did not seek to assume any new emergency powers over the economy.
In an annual speech to business leaders, Hollande laid out plans for training half a million jobless workers, greater use of apprenticeships, and aid for companies that hire young workers.
Hollande's Socialist government has struggled to boost long-stagnant French growth or reduce chronic unemployment, which has been around 10 percent for years. His chances of winning a potential second term may hinge on whether jobs pick up before next year's presidential vote.
Hollande stressed the urgency of updating France's labor-friendly business model in an increasingly border-free, online economy. The measures included a loosening of France's rigid working time rules, and a bonus of 2,000 euros to small businesses that hire young people.
He stressed the need to integrate youth from France's troubled suburbs, including minorities who face job discrimination, into the global economy. High unemployment in France's North African and African communities is seen as one of the factors driving some youths to violent extremism or the drug trade. Source I'm amazed at the fact that this scam actually passed the frontier and that foreign reporter take the time to write anything about it. The guy saw an increase of 500 000 unemployed since he's in office (and that's just talking about pure unemployment, not part workers and the likes) so he decided, after four years of completly useless endeavour that did nothing aside from increasing the overall profit for big firms (which is his real goal after all) to create a "plan" to put 500 000 people in formation. He hope that people, in their retardness, will not understand that with 500 000 people getting from unemployment to formation, the unemployment will drop by 500 000 - statistically. And this crap about worker friendly... ridiculous. I agree, that's clearly a scam as he's not even putting the 35 hours work week into question.
https://stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=ANHRS
http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2011/dec/08/europe-working-hours
it's all about productivity, in term of work per hours it's more or less the same as germany
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Zurich15365 Posts
This is terrible and shows once again how large the influence is of the established parties on public television - which to prevent public TV was created for in the first place!
However, it should also be noted that this decision has been criticized throughout the rest of the German political and media landscape, and does not reflect the general German attitude on issues of free speech.
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It's ridiculous how mainstream politics and seemingly also the media play into the hands of crazy right wing nuts. The only thing the FDP did right while still relevant was their willingness to engage people with radical opinions in discourse.
"Oh I think you're a nazi therefore I won't talk to you" is not the way to win a debate and convince anyone, instead they're just fueling the ever growing sentiment that politicians are ignoring public opinion. Or with the words of our vice chancellor we're all: "Pack", das sich herumtreibt und dem man klar sagen müsse, dass es nicht zu dieser Gesellschaft gehört"
Now that's a fascist opion if I ever heard one. 
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Yeah, I never understood that position.
I mean, if those "lost souls" in PEGIDA have a government that doesn't talk to them at all and right wing idiots who embrace them with open arms, who are they more likely to respond to positively?
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the irony. for the same reasons(a media takeover) they sued Poland.
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On January 20 2016 20:36 xM(Z wrote:
the irony. for the same reasons(a media takeover) they sued Poland.
Well, it's hardly a full scale takeover of all media.
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On January 20 2016 05:58 corumjhaelen wrote:
Agreed, we need to go much lower.
You can already do that. It's called a part time job.
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Don't worry about me, I'm a teacher, agrégé even, soi'm already paid for doing nothing. I just hate other people getting rich through hard work.
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On January 20 2016 20:44 dismiss wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2016 20:36 xM(Z wrote:
the irony. for the same reasons(a media takeover) they sued Poland. Well, it's hardly a full scale takeover of all media.
It itches me to post this http://www.l1.nl/audio/stemming-over-aanrandingen-en-berovingen-keulen-17-jan-2016
If you understand dutch have fun. It's the interview Claudia Zimmermann retracted afterwards and said she talked rubbish under pressure of a live interview... For all non-dutch speakers, she said public broadcasting in Germany - specifically WDR - was told by government to emphasize positive aspects of the refugee crisis.
I think government influence on public broadcasting in Germany is undeniable. There also is this site http://forum.publikumskonferenz.de/viewforum.php?f=30 where some people list cases with issues in objective journalism. For example several cases concerning Russia and Greece.
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On January 20 2016 21:53 corumjhaelen wrote:
Don't worry about me, I'm a teacher, agrégé even, soi'm already paid for doing nothing. I just hate other people getting rich through hard work.
One of the quirks of education: The highest your knowledge is, the lowest your teaching hours are because your research time is too valuable to spend on students 
Note that the ones that make full hours cry because even their spare time is full of correcting copies and preparing courses, while the ones that are down to 2-4 hours a week complain it's a waste of a time they could be spending on their projects.
Agrégé is a nice in-between. 15 declared teaching hours a week ?
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Is that 15 * 60 minutes of teaching? Because that is nearly a full-time job already. My job goal is to be a full-time school teacher, which is about 23*45 minutes of actually standing in front of a class leading to ~45 (full) hours of work load in total during a week according to teachers i spoke to.
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A friend of mine is teacher and has 2 afternoons "freetime"... If he does the math he works 130% of "normal" teacher hours.
He's friggin sportsteacher, he doesn't do shit when there are no pupils around (his words, not mine  ).
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On January 20 2016 05:44 OtherWorld wrote:Show nested quote +On January 19 2016 14:24 WhiteDog wrote:On January 19 2016 09:29 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:PARIS (AP) — French President Francois Hollande pledged Monday to redefine France's business model and declared what he called "a state of economic and social emergency," unveiling a 2-billion-euro ($2.2 billion) plan to revive hiring and catch up with a fast-moving world economy.
The measures he proposed, however, are relatively modest, and he said they would not "put into question" the 35-hour workweek. With his country under a state of emergency since extremist attacks in November, Hollande did not seek to assume any new emergency powers over the economy.
In an annual speech to business leaders, Hollande laid out plans for training half a million jobless workers, greater use of apprenticeships, and aid for companies that hire young workers.
Hollande's Socialist government has struggled to boost long-stagnant French growth or reduce chronic unemployment, which has been around 10 percent for years. His chances of winning a potential second term may hinge on whether jobs pick up before next year's presidential vote.
Hollande stressed the urgency of updating France's labor-friendly business model in an increasingly border-free, online economy. The measures included a loosening of France's rigid working time rules, and a bonus of 2,000 euros to small businesses that hire young people.
He stressed the need to integrate youth from France's troubled suburbs, including minorities who face job discrimination, into the global economy. High unemployment in France's North African and African communities is seen as one of the factors driving some youths to violent extremism or the drug trade. Source I'm amazed at the fact that this scam actually passed the frontier and that foreign reporter take the time to write anything about it. The guy saw an increase of 500 000 unemployed since he's in office (and that's just talking about pure unemployment, not part workers and the likes) so he decided, after four years of completly useless endeavour that did nothing aside from increasing the overall profit for big firms (which is his real goal after all) to create a "plan" to put 500 000 people in formation. He hope that people, in their retardness, will not understand that with 500 000 people getting from unemployment to formation, the unemployment will drop by 500 000 - statistically. And this crap about worker friendly... ridiculous. I agree, that's clearly a scam as he's not even putting the 35 hours work week into question.
In fact he did (look at what he said about time management and overtime hours). But as always in France, right people will hate on left people whatever they do (and conversely). I mean, this "left" gvt did more right things than Sarko ever dreamt of. And what Macron said this morning, no people on the right side would have said it.
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On January 20 2016 22:58 Simberto wrote:
Is that 15 * 60 minutes of teaching? Because that is nearly a full-time job already. My job goal is to be a full-time school teacher, which is about 23*45 minutes of actually standing in front of a class leading to ~45 (full) hours of work load in total during a week according to teachers i spoke to.
He is ironic I think, as it is common stuff in France to bash teacher for their "low" amount of hours in front of students (like politicians do it, media do it, etc.). Bashing coming from people that dunno shit about teaching, obviously.
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On January 20 2016 22:38 Oshuy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2016 21:53 corumjhaelen wrote:
Don't worry about me, I'm a teacher, agrégé even, soi'm already paid for doing nothing. I just hate other people getting rich through hard work. One of the quirks of education: The highest your knowledge is, the lowest your teaching hours are because your research time is too valuable to spend on students Note that the ones that make full hours cry because even their spare time is full of correcting copies and preparing courses, while the ones that are down to 2-4 hours a week complain it's a waste of a time they could be spending on their projects. Agrégé is a nice in-between. 15 declared teaching hours a week ?
Yes, I have to take 16 though. The thing is that I don't have to do research, and I have normal 12 yo pupils, so it doesn't make much sense...
As for whether it is a lot, it depends, time you can spend preparing your class has no real limit.
Still, in the school I am, it's near impossible not to spend at least 5+h per week trying so solve various problems mainly having to do with discipline, and one hour with those kids is already draining, making it a pretty fair trade even if you want to do the bare minimum.
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On January 20 2016 20:04 dismiss wrote:"Oh I think you're a nazi therefore I won't talk to you" is not the way to win a debate and convince anyone, instead they're just fueling the ever growing sentiment that politicians are ignoring public opinion. Or with the words of our vice chancellor we're all: "Pack", das sich herumtreibt und dem man klar sagen müsse, dass es nicht zu dieser Gesellschaft gehört" Now that's a fascist opion if I ever heard one.
No, the term Sigmar Gabriel used was quite fitting, a society doesn't need to tolerate intolerance. If the Pegida people and the likes were open to rational discourse they wouldn't be Pegida people in the first place. There's nothing you can do to change their opinion. They think that the evil media cabal is manipulating the public opinion, that Dresden is going to be 'Islamized' although practically no Muslims even live in East Germany and so on. What else are you going to say besides, "nope sorry that's bs"?
It's like talking to conspiracy theorists, there's no hope in debating with them. You honestly just can ignore them and move on.
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On January 21 2016 02:26 Nyxisto wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2016 20:04 dismiss wrote:"Oh I think you're a nazi therefore I won't talk to you" is not the way to win a debate and convince anyone, instead they're just fueling the ever growing sentiment that politicians are ignoring public opinion. Or with the words of our vice chancellor we're all: "Pack", das sich herumtreibt und dem man klar sagen müsse, dass es nicht zu dieser Gesellschaft gehört" Now that's a fascist opion if I ever heard one. No, the term Alexander Gauland used was quite fitting, a society doesn't need to tolerate intolerance. If the rapists of colognian people and the likes were open to rational discourse they wouldn't be rapists of colognian people in the first place. There's nothing you can do to change their opinion. They think that the evil Western cabal is manipulating their muslim purity, that woman want to be raped because they wear more revealing clothing than a burka. What else are you going to say besides, "nope sorry that's bs"? It's like talking to conspiracy theorists, there's no hope in debating with them. You honestly just can ignore them and move on.
Fixed that for you.
I hope I adequately displayed to you why your line of reasoning is about the dumbest thing that has been said in this thread for a while. Again, you are discarding people with different political opinions as unintelligent, nazi idiots not worth talking to. I wonder why more and more people who disagree with the government sympathise with them since no one presents a different opinion.
Apart from that it's intellectually dishonest and just so, so dumb when contrasted against the backdrop of their wild fantasy claims of media tampering, refugee rape groups, etc. coming true.
Now I would also point out the irony in your reasoning regarding tolerance. The stance that tolerance against intolerance only helps those who are intolerant has, in German media, been primarily championed by Henryk Broder: Bild columnist , islamophobe just right of Thilo Sarrazin, and fascist defender of Israel extraordinaire and thus has become somewhat of a mainstay of the political rights arguments against migrants. But the implications of it would probably be lost on you.
Really liberal, engaging and world open views you have there, at least if you immediately disregard any position that might challenge them.
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I'm not going to talk to people who protest with self-made gallows and depictions of Merkel in a headscarf lol. These people have lost their fucking minds collectively and that's a fact. And to your question why they only have 10% support, because their narrative is nonsense and there is no silent majority going to 'turn the tide' in Germany. They're a bunch of afraid old people who use every incident possible to agitate and in two weeks they'll have forgotten what they were upset about anyway.
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Oh, they're in 3rd place in the polls, representing about 6.5 million people right now. Dang they must be incredibly irrelevant. I suppose you did add afraid, old people to the list of stupid nazis as well now.
I mean, they claimed there would be incidents like the one in Cologone, which came true, they claimed that Politicians and the police would cover it up, which came true, and they claimed that there groups of criminal asylum seekers which Germany won't get rid of, like the 5500 Moroccans which are ausreiseverpflichtet but can't be deported.
Yet they have "lost their fucking minds and that's a fact". Do you even realise how dismissive that sounds in addition to being demonstrably wrong?
But let's get back to the fallacy of why we should be tolerant with raping idiots because they're refugees but not those who don't share your personal political ideology. Y'know can't be tolerant of intolerance, so why do people who don't want to adapt to our societal values get an exception?
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On January 21 2016 03:24 dismiss wrote:
But let's get back to the fallacy of why we should be tolerant with raping idiots because they're refugees but not those who don't share your personal political ideology. Y'know can't be tolerant of intolerance, so why do people who don't want to adapt to our societal values get an exception?
Except that's not true. Nobody is tolerating rape. At least nobody I've ever met, and nobody's getting an exception.
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EPT
