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On September 05 2015 02:51 Simberto wrote:
A big reason that large amounts of the refugees are young males is that it is a very hard and dangerous journey to enter europe from the places they are from. Just hear some stories about what they have to go through to reach a country like Germany. And such a journey has a much higher success rate if you are young and male.
And do you really think that ONLY syria is a country that warrants escaping from? A lot of african countries have some sort of murderous situation for some parts of their population going on. Which explains why a lot of the refugees are black. They are also fleeing, just not from the war in syria, but from one of the other horrible conflicts in africa.
But of course it is a lot easier to simply say that they all just want to mooch of our social systems than to accept that there are large amounts of legitimate refugees because a large part of the world is a horrible place to be born in.
I am disgusted by the extreme egoism a lot of people display when talking about refugees.
Africa is remarkably stable compared to what how it used to be like 30+ years ago.
While I very much sympathise with everyone who ever has to go hungry, work as a child, or be in a genuinely uncomfortable personal situation I don't feel like it's "our" job to make sure all these people are taken better care of. Especially when you put this on top of a heavy sense of entitlement being displayed by many of these migrants as well as European politicians being seemingly incapable or unwilling to deal with the situation I can see why people are averse to the idea of letting people migrate freely.
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On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn.
Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do.
And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany.
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On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany.
To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives.
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On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives.
Yup, that's probably the case. But even if I don't give a shit if they die, I give a shit about the toll it's giving to the EU and european countries. You can go all SJW and say that you accept it all, but in fine it will just get your country poorer without doing anything better than satisfying your high moral ground for a bit.
Anyway, even if my individual feels are irrelevant, I'd bet that the collective feeling of half the European nation will be more than relevant enough to prove my point.
Germany, which is going full acceptance if already split in half about the issue of Immigration. http://news.yahoo.com/half-germans-worried-asylum-seekers-shows-survey-092151736--business.html
Sweden anti immigration party is the top1 party in the polling
France is having 25% of far right, and it was before the crisis.
Eastern countries are much more against the immigration than the west too. so Yeah, my fee fee doesn't mean anything, but the fee fee of half the Europe do mean something.
Btw, that's kinda hypocritic coming from an American when your countries isn't really doing jack shit when you are the n°1 responsible for the current crisis.
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On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives.
Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans.
While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders.
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On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off more and more European borders.
Thanks for calling me an idiot then half of the europe idiots and then repeating exactly my worries. You probably misunderstood me when I talk about the death toll. In my opinion we have the obligation to do the best we can about helping the refugee. The problem is that it is not possible with the current laissez-faire and denial of current leaders.
BTW I have never voted for a radical party, and never will.
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On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders.
I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas?
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On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas?
Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ?
http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html
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On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html
Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped? Because that seems like sort of a no-brainer problem that could be addressed.
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I dont understand why people are angry at countries like Hungary because they don't want to accept more refugees. Correct me if Im wrong but it doesn't matter because most of those refugees will instantly leave Hungary and migrate to richer Western Europe.
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On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped?
What the fuck man, there is a limited amount of ressource one can give. You can't save the whole world because feeling. People from the Balkans are safe and are absolutly not a priority in comparison of actually victim of an actual war.
I dont understand why people are angry at countries like Hungary because they don't want to accept more refugees. Correct me if Im wrong but it doesn't matter because most of those refugees will instantly leave Hungary and migrate to richer Western Europe.
I have a couple of friends who went in Hungary for hollidays (they booked before crisis), they are saying they can't take any train because every gare is filled with hundred of migrants and the trains are usually stopped. Yup, they try every trains possible (blocking acces for others) to reach Germany.
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On September 05 2015 03:45 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped? What the fuck man, there is a limited amount of ressource one can give. You can't save the whole world because feeling. People from the Balkans are safe and are absolutly not a priority in comparison of actually victim of an actual war.
I just said to send them back. Are you so set on arguing your points that you didn't even take the time to think about what your read?
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On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas?
http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Asylum_statistics
http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/File:Countries_of_origin_of_(non-EU)_asylum_seekers_in_the_EU-28_Member_States,_2013_and_2014_YB15_III.png
I apologise that I can't find reliable statistics for the current year, which is going to be the worst by far, yet. While Syria is the biggest single origin country, it makes up for less than 20% of the non EU member refugee total.
The cynic in me wants to point out that most of these countries are what's often called "failed states" as disgusting as that word is. It's hard to feel like you should offer shelter to everyone who is an a spot where their country isn't as cozy as they would like it to be.
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On September 05 2015 03:45 Faust852 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped? What the fuck man, there is a limited amount of ressource one can give. You can't save the whole world because feeling. People from the Balkans are safe and are absolutly not a priority in comparison of actually victim of an actual war. Show nested quote +I dont understand why people are angry at countries like Hungary because they don't want to accept more refugees. Correct me if Im wrong but it doesn't matter because most of those refugees will instantly leave Hungary and migrate to richer Western Europe. I have a couple of friends who went in Hungary for hollidays (they booked before crisis), they are saying they can't take any train because every gare is filled with hundred of migrants and the trains are usually stopped. Yup, they try every trains possible (blocking acces for others) to reach Germany.
Which is also the reason why pretty much noone from the Balkans actually gets accepted. I think in Germany the numbers of successful asylums to people from the Balkans was ~0.5%.
And with your great love for the legal ways for refugees to enter the EU, you should know that they pretty much don't exist. To demand asylum, you need to be in the country that you demand asylum from. Which means you need to enter illegally to be legally recognized as a refugee. It is a very stupid system, but this also means that it is incredibly silly to complain that people are entering illegally.
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On September 05 2015 03:48 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:45 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped? What the fuck man, there is a limited amount of ressource one can give. You can't save the whole world because feeling. People from the Balkans are safe and are absolutly not a priority in comparison of actually victim of an actual war. I just said to send them back. Are you so set on arguing your points that you didn't even take the time to think about what your read?
I misread a word, my mistake. The problem is sending people back, that's the whole problem actually. They are burning their papers, so you can't put them where they are from because you can't know for sure.
On September 05 2015 03:50 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:45 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped? What the fuck man, there is a limited amount of ressource one can give. You can't save the whole world because feeling. People from the Balkans are safe and are absolutly not a priority in comparison of actually victim of an actual war. I dont understand why people are angry at countries like Hungary because they don't want to accept more refugees. Correct me if Im wrong but it doesn't matter because most of those refugees will instantly leave Hungary and migrate to richer Western Europe. I have a couple of friends who went in Hungary for hollidays (they booked before crisis), they are saying they can't take any train because every gare is filled with hundred of migrants and the trains are usually stopped. Yup, they try every trains possible (blocking acces for others) to reach Germany. Which is also the reason why pretty much noone from the Balkans actually gets accepted. I think in Germany the numbers of successful asylums to people from the Balkans was ~0.5%. And with your great love for the legal ways for refugees to enter the EU, you should know that they pretty much don't exist. To demand asylum, you need to be in the country that you demand asylum from. Which means you need to enter illegally to be legally recognized as a refugee. It is a very stupid system, but this also means that it is incredibly silly to complain that people are entering illegally.
Germany pretty much cancelled Dublin 2 for this exact reason.
And refugees are refusing to be processed in other countries because that would mean they are "flagged" and would have no choice but to be deported to the 1st country they are. I don't really get why that's fair.
The system need to be revamp from the begining.
btw, are you sure about the fact that you absolutly need to be in the country you ask for refugee status ? I'm almost certain it isn't true, I read one refugee yesterday on Reddit saying he has to stay in Lebanon for 2 years before being processed but is now living in Sweden legally.
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On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped?
We actually have one of those innitial-admission-/reception/or whatever it's called in english- centers where I'm from ever since Wiesbaden said they can't handle the masses anymore.
We do have people from the balkans as well but the overwhelming, vast majority of refugees are from the middle east in my experience.
Not that I've looked this up or anything but from just driving past there on a daily basis when I'm at my parents place I'd say it's like... for 10 people who I see walking around that I'd put as "from the middle east" (not just Syria but people who clearly have a bit darker skincolor) there's probably not even 1 guy who's from the balkans.
Like I said, only my own experience but this whole thing about people from the balkans is really overblown. Yes we do have some, and yes 99+% of them get send back. The discussion about that in Germany is that it takes too long and it should be faster so that those people don't get false hopes.
I can make photos on Saturday for some people here so that you can see what it's really like if you want...
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On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped? Because that seems like sort of a no-brainer problem that could be addressed.
Well, if the person doesn't want them to know, they have to invest a lot of resources into finding out. I think, it would be much better if you just came out and stated your actual position. Because right now it appears to be ~worldwide welfare financed by the EU, Australia, America, and Canada.
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On September 05 2015 03:55 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped? We actually have one of those innitial-admission-/reception/or whatever it's called in english- centers where I'm from ever since Wiesbaden said they can't handle the masses anymore. We do have people from the balkans as well but the overwhelming, vast majority of refugees are from the middle east in my experience. Not that I've looked this up or anything but from just driving past there on a daily basis when I'm at my parents place I'd say it's like... for 10 people who I see walking around that I'd put as "from the middle east" (not just Syria but people who clearly have a bit darker skincolor) there's probably not even 1 guy who's from the balkans. Like I said, only my own experience but this whole thing about people from the balkans is really overblown. Yes we do have some, and yes 99+% of them get send back. The discussion about that in Germany is that it takes to long and it should be faster so that those people don't get false hopes.
It just seems like fuel to the "They just want to be free loaders on our system" argument. From the numbers above, a lot of the people fleeing seem to be coming from violent areas of the Middle East.
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On September 05 2015 03:50 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On September 05 2015 03:45 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:42 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:40 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:35 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:29 dismiss wrote:On September 05 2015 03:19 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:12 Faust852 wrote:On September 05 2015 03:08 Plansix wrote:On September 05 2015 03:04 Faust852 wrote:
The argument of Women and Children being to weak to cross the Europe is stupid as fuck.
First, why would women be weaker than man at going from Turkey to Bulgaria to Romania to Hungary to Austria to Germany ? I mean none of these countries are hostile am I right ? I don't get how a woman would find it any more difficult than a man. Children is the same, if they are >10yo, this would pose no problem whatsoever.
I do agree for crossing the sea though.
But anyway, WHY should we accept ILLEGAL people, crossing the borders without their right while MILLIONS are actually asking LEGALLY for getting the refugee status ? Why these people who can't wait their turn deserve a place before legitimate people going the legal way ? Please answer that.
They are refugees from war and violence. If you refuse because they didn't do it "legally" them, many of them will die if they return home and wait their turn. Yeah, I'll be crude, but I prefer people that refuse to pass via legal way to die than people who do follow the law. People who follow the legal process deserve to live more in my opinion than those who don't, and those who don't are indirectly killing those who do. And if they were fleeing war and violence, they would stop at the first safe country they encounter, and these are not Sweden nor Germany. To be honest, I bet the refugees could care less what you feel when they are fleeing war and violence. And you're opinion on who deserves to live and who doesn't is irrelevant to what they do. Really, I bet they care as even less about you and your feelings as you do about them and their lives. Please provide proof of all these horrible wars all those people are fleeing from, e.g. in the Balkans. While I am of the opinion that above poster in an idiot it matters very much what people like him think because they're not a small minority in the EU anymore. More and more people will vote for right wing parties which will be terrible for everyone involved, especially the refugees when they're being told to fuck off at more and more European borders. I mean, with a quick google search of Balkans and refugees, the report is the majority are coming from Syria and the surrounding countries. Are you saying they are not from Syria and surrounding areas? Yup, seems like you actually know nothing about what is happening right ? http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/western-balkan-exodus-puts-pressure-on-germany-and-eu-a-1049274.html Are you saying the Germany can't figure out the difference someone fleeing Syria and someone in the Balkans? Or that because some of them are not from war zones, no one should be helped? What the fuck man, there is a limited amount of ressource one can give. You can't save the whole world because feeling. People from the Balkans are safe and are absolutly not a priority in comparison of actually victim of an actual war. I dont understand why people are angry at countries like Hungary because they don't want to accept more refugees. Correct me if Im wrong but it doesn't matter because most of those refugees will instantly leave Hungary and migrate to richer Western Europe. I have a couple of friends who went in Hungary for hollidays (they booked before crisis), they are saying they can't take any train because every gare is filled with hundred of migrants and the trains are usually stopped. Yup, they try every trains possible (blocking acces for others) to reach Germany. Which is also the reason why pretty much noone from the Balkans actually gets accepted. I think in Germany the numbers of successful asylums to people from the Balkans was ~0.5%. And with your great love for the legal ways for refugees to enter the EU, you should know that they pretty much don't exist. To demand asylum, you need to be in the country that you demand asylum from. Which means you need to enter illegally to be legally recognized as a refugee. It is a very stupid system, but this also means that it is incredibly silly to complain that people are entering illegally.
It's actually just illegal to go "asylum shopping" or travel through a country which would be able to offer you asylum to seek it in another country. If you were to enter the EU in Germany you'd be fully within your rights to make your intentions of seeking asylum known at the border. However, this is not being enforced anymore, because politicians like to be popular.
The whole deal about the Balkans is more about those people come here knowingly that there's very little chance of them being allowed to stay. You then have to ask: Why do they undertake that arduous, ultimately fruitless journey anyway if not to take advantage of the host countries hospitality? All the resources expended on this could be put to much better use, for example helping people that actually are refugees.
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Regarding the "we can't spend more resources" argument, 1 million refugees is 0.2% of the European population. After WW II we integrated 14 million refugees in a country that was practically bombed to the ground, and in the 90's we reunified a country at the cost of about 100 billion bucks a year while we were labeled the "sick man of Europe". How the fuck are we not supposed to handle 1 refugee per 500 citizens?
I don't know if it's the media or the right-wing agitators but every time some problem occurs nowadays it's an "unsolvable crisis" and the world is supposed to end.
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EPT
