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On August 10 2012 19:06 FFGenerations wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2012 18:59 ramon wrote:
from what i have heard in university (2 lessons specifically about sleep) almost every person (90%~) between the age of 20-60 (after that need for sleep has a big variance especially in females) don't have any sort of deterioration of performance if they sleep between 4.5 and 5.5 hours a day if they have an extremly consistent sleep schedule (e.g go to bed every day at the same time not varying more than 20 minutes) for over 2 weeks this is great but does it apply to people who are stressed out and worn to pieces by their job and by going to the gym? probably not
Probably yes, however you will have to expect the worst week of your life.
This is interesting, though, not adjusting step-by-step, but instead just slam into it. I will try to read up on that.
Thanks ramon, do you have a link to an article or something like that?
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Every sleep thread on TL, someone always wants to bring up polyphasic sleep when that shit doesn't work unless you have some fucked up gene expression patterns.
As for the OP, napping in the afternoon is really your best option here. Even if its just for 15 minutes. There are other things you can manage to get better quality sleep, namely lights/lighting and temperature. I have gotten noticeably better sleep when I installed black-out curtains in my bedroom despite arguably getting less sleep. Temperature refers to your body temp right before you sleep as a certain range (escapes me right now) helps you get to into sleep better (this is why a warm shower and/or warm glass of milk helps you slip into sleep).
Others have mentioned timing your sleep so you don't wake up in REM which is also useful. Keep in mind that does not mean you can shave cycles off and expect it to not catch up to you...which brings back the importance of those naps in the afternoon.
Food/digestion also plays a role in this as there are sleep genes expressed in mammalian (mouse) digestive tracts and also expressed in similar patterns. Humans who work weird schedules like midnight to morning shifts on some days and 9-5 shifts on others will often feel like utter shit when it comes to eating and this is one of the reasons why. So you will have adjust your eating patterns in accordance to your adjusted sleeping schedule, aka don't have an active digestive system when trying to go to sleep.
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Sure, there are supplements and diets that can help you reduce sleep time and still feel energetic (I'm not going to list them seeing as they've already been listed above). But, I do have to say, if you find your job so completely miserable that it is not a life for you during the 8 hours of work, why do you do it? Why not find something you enjoy, and make it a part of your life. I mean, of course, jobs don't just grow on trees, but the way you write you seem to believe that you'll spend the next 50 years doing what you're doing now. That just doesn't seem like a legitimate solution to your problem. I'm not going to say that you should quit right now and look for something else to do (although many people I've known have done that and feel great now), but try to gradually strive towards something that you enjoy doing.
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You mentioned you got a progressive alarm clock, what type might I ask?
Also, some other suggestions I have for exercise and diet are, try crossfit for your exercise. You mentioned you like to lift and yet realise that cardio is quite important, crossfit is a good mix of both and works great for me personally. Also sessions don't need to last that long for them to be effective. Also as far as diet goes, I found that juicing for dinner/supper is not only very nutritious but also leaves you feeling more energetic in the morning and is much lighter on the stomach. Also if you get a good centrifugal juicer, juicing time and clean up is actually quite fast. Additionally you can drink your juice while doing activities such as browsing the web or even playing SC if you are able to take your hand from your mouse for a second or two without messing up.
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Enjoy the sleep you have, I sure as hell wish I could sleep 6 to 9 hours a night, it'd be a godsend.
Otherwise try modafinil.
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Hi, I'm not sure if my input will be a "happy" solution but the first thing I would do is take a look at your diet. My lifestyle isn't comparable to yours in terms of free time as I am a university student but I do bodybuilding full-time alongside my studies and free time etc.
Bodybuilding makes me very tired so I have problems staying awake also and concentration is also an issue to I would certainly recommend eating complex carbohydrates and these are released into your system over longer periods of time compared to simple sugars which will give you a short burst of energy but leave you feeling drained and fatigued afterwards.
I would say small frequent meals is the best way to feed your body to give yourself the energy required to get through the day with a lesser amount of sleep along with good hydration of course.
You also mentioned about exercises for an hour a day would leave you with only 1.5hours of freetime. What kind of exercises are you doing and what are your goals? if you simply want to keep healthy and get toned up without much of the bulk, I would recommend working out for only 0.5hours doing a routine such as: 10 Press Ups, 7 Pull Ups, 10 Bodysquats followed by 10 situps. Repeat this circuit for the 0.5hours and you get the best of both worlds with some form of resistance training along with improving your cardiovascular health.
Now you have 2 Hours personal time to yourself. I wanted to ask:
Do you really consider exercise a neccessity or can it be counted as free time? Because you don't really need to exercise everyday and if you just wanted to stay trim, the diet is the most important aspect in my opinion.
I hope my input is of some use to you.
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On August 10 2012 02:23 Nevermind86 wrote:
Well from personal experience (not the best indicator) I know how to reduce sleeping hours, I sleep normally only 7 hours, a lot of the times only 6 but then I cannot perform as good when studying russian or reading books or something, because I cannot concentrate as good, but sometimes I decide to only sleep about 6 hours because I stay late watching something or play videogames with friends. What I'm going to say I've discussed with friends and readed articles, etc.
HOW TO REDUCE SLEEPING HOURS
-It really helps to sleep 5-6 at night and about 1 hour in the afternoon, I heard it is natural to get sleepy at about noon, so take a nap, even if it's only 30 minutes it is better than nothing.
-Cardio. I run when I have the time, which is most of the time about 5-6 miles 3-4 days a week, this is important, having good cardio helps to sleep better and you get a better rest. Swimming is better, any type of good cardio will do.
-Don't eat too much at dinner, because the digestive system needs to put an extra effort so it becomes harder to have a good sleep, I usually don't eat much at dinner, only a little bit. Half of what could be a normal dinner.
Now obviously the hours you "win" with sleeping 1/2 hours less you have to spend on cardio, so you won't likely have more free time, but I obviously think it is better to use those hours in cardio than in just sleeping. It is good to plan how to sleep and when to sleep, the important thing is, if you're sleepy take a nap!
Edit: I don't think sleeping less through monday-friday then "catching up" on weekends is any good, because you will not perform as good in the first 5 days and then in the weekend you will be dead tired and sleep more than you need, which is a recipe for lazyness. I used to do that out of necessity, I had to sleep about 6 and a half hours because of a job that I had to go at 7 am but then couldn't sleep early at night, it was terrible, I tried everything, but the catching up on weekends it's just bad I usually wasted my time just sleeping on sunday, not good.
I've heard this too, and I can really vouch for sleeping having your REM cycles in mind.
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lol, just wait until you have a kid. Then 7 hours will be golden.
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On August 10 2012 16:50 rEalGuapo wrote:
However, I ordered a progressive alarm clock yesterday and am now striving to reduce my sleep time by a quarter of an hour every week until I feel it is too little.
I will carefully consider other options and try to explore what works best for me.
I cannot take naps due to working hours and changing the rest of the day is hardly possible, I will try to do stuff more time efficient but that is hard. A dishwasher would probably be golden, have to look into my options of getting one.
you basically gave yourself the answer. you can try and reduce sleep little by little, then wait another week and see, if tha is okay for you (you are your best judge)
imo you shouldn't overcomplicate this and go this route
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For me, I don't know what the problem is. But for whatever reason, when I know i have something to do early the next morning and sleep early, i still am very tired(9hours sleep). But when I do not have anythin to do the next morning I can sleep late and wake up early and be less tired.
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Hey rEalGuapo,
I can totally relate to your problem. My situation is even worse cause my travel time is even bigger. I get up at 6:30 and I come home at 19:30 - 20:30 depending when I leave from work. I prepare dinner and start eating at 22:00 and then of course there are some choirs in the house and I go to bed at 1 if I am lucky. Some times I go to bed past 2 o'clock. Sleeping 4 - 5 hours during the week is a killer. I feel like zombie all the time, especially after 16:00. Even though I have been doing this for the past half an year I cannot get used to this regiment. I have no free time during the week => no going out, no gym, etc. and during the weekend I sleep 10 - 12 hours and have choirs to do at home => not much free time as well. I am so amazed how people can do this all their lives. I am currently looking for a new place to live where the transport will be less or maybe getting a driver's license. Although I am not very happy about driving.
You can read this interesting article about a German chronobiologist Till Roenneberg.He has written a whole book on biological clock and the war with social clock. + Show Spoiler +http://www.brainpickings.org/index.php/2012/05/11/internal-time-till-roenneber/
I personally dont think you will be able to get used to less sleep or it will take years and it goes against your biological needs. Some people may need only 4 hours and some 10 hours of sleep.
My advice is if you have the possibility maybe arrange to work from home a day or two.(This depends on your field of work) What you can do else is reduce the working hours of your contract, unless you need the extra money.
Good luck!
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EPT
