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FeUerFlieGe
United States1193 Posts
I respect Damon for standing up for what he believes in. And I find it disgusting how everyone else reacted. It really is sad that it can come down to what it did. You would expect the christians to be the ones with good moral values, but it's the opposite in this case. And I find it repulsive that his parents basically excommunicated him. Out of everything that happened to Damon, this is what really hit me. I mean crap like this makes this community of people look like psychopaths. | ||
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Tschis
Brazil1511 Posts
His parents actions... I have no words to describe the disapointment. It wasn't a good decision by him, but it wasn't wrong, things really got out of control there... Unhappily.. | ||
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Popss
Sweden176 Posts
On May 27 2011 15:28 krbz wrote: Atheism is the "belief" that their is no god. Theism is the "belief" that their is a god. They are equal in that they both take faith, and they both cannot be proven. The "faith" is the issue between the two as they cannot be proven. It is fully illogical to believe either of these since you have to follow both blindly. Agnosticism is the view that certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—is unknown or unknowable. ^aka - The logical choice. Ah I keep messing up agnosticism and atheism. But yeah claiming that God does not exist feels about as ridiculous to me as claiming that he does exist. Unless you can show me proof for either. Guess that makes me agnostic. | ||
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Samurai-
Slovenia2035 Posts
On May 27 2011 23:02 Agathon wrote: We are animals too. What we call "Morals" are just community life rules to ensure the order and survey of our huge human group. Nothing more. It's not something "Higher" than animals. We are more intelligent, but we dont act much differently than other animals. Monkeys have it, lions too, and most of animals living in community. It's more complicated for humans, there are more rules and our children need more time to learn it from their parents, but it's EXACTLY the same thing. What happened in this case? A young lion dont like it that the family are breaking the rules and forcing their views on him, it's annoying for the members of the group, so he is banned from it. Nothing surprising, going against religion is like hitting a brick wall with your head. Very uncommon in nature, where luckly animals have no issues with religion, thus living a very religion free life. Is it good or bad? Bad ofcourse, cause its pretty clear to anyone who broke what rules here.. Even to a blind man.. This is not a troll, it's exactly the way i think. Because i am tired of reading more and more comments of people who cant read and cant get in their head that the boy DIDNT force his views on the school but simply reminding them that school is breaking their rules and should not force THEIR view on him, because schools should be RELIGION FREE. | ||
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UkGracken
United Kingdom129 Posts
1 miniute out of his time... what this person learnt was a valuable lesson in life its called .. "sometimes we have to do things we dont want to" thats part of being human. Now some people will say "but gracken but gracken its against the law" so is smoking weed, Statistically as far as im aware no-one has directly died from smoking cannabis but its against the law.. does that make it wrong? Conclusion : If its not negativly affecting you.. why go and mess things up for other people just because its not what you believe. If it was affecting him aka spent 30 mins doing a MASS mabye id be on his side. | ||
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mdma-_-
Nauru1213 Posts
On May 27 2011 23:25 Popss wrote: Ah I keep messing up agnosticism and atheism. But yeah claiming that God does not exist feels about as ridiculous to me as claiming that he does exist. Unless you can show me proof for either. Guess that makes me agnostic. Point is that the possibility of a god is existing is much smaller than the possibility of him non existing. Agnosticism makes it seem as if the chance would be 50:50 of the atheists or the theists being right, which is utterly ridicoulos considering all evidence points towards the non-existence of god. Thats why to me agnosticsm is a crappy choice and i rather go with atheism. (aka the possibility of there being a god is extremly unlikely) | ||
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SpecialM
Germany32 Posts
nothing constructive to say sorry TL staff and admins | ||
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TheGiz
Canada708 Posts
Gracken you are absolutely right. | ||
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ZessiM
United Kingdom232 Posts
On May 27 2011 21:58 Liquid`Jinro wrote: Can we please not compare having to listen to a prayer with racism? -.- There are degrees of wrong. I didn't say anything about racism. But both are protests against something unconstitutional. Do you want to set a precedent where people who make such protests are seen as insolent jackasses? A lot of the people posting here seen to want to. | ||
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Agathon
France1505 Posts
Because i am tired of reading more and more comments of people who cant read and cant get in their head that the boy DIDNT force his views on the school but simply reminding them that school is breaking their rules and should not force THEIR view on him, because schools should be RELIGION FREE. Did i say "Forced"? I think i said "Don't like". | ||
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mcc
Czech Republic4646 Posts
On May 27 2011 22:19 Ingenol wrote: Private ones. Then schools could decide their platform and cater to the desires of parents. Better schools would be more popular and make more money. Yes lets give parents absolute control over children, the results will be splendid. Specifically in this case parents would be forcing their atheist child to attend some fundamentalist school, where he would be ostracized even more without any chance of help from outside agents. | ||
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Syben
United States512 Posts
On May 27 2011 21:49 mcc wrote: Actually he is kind of right that you cannot base your moral code on atheism. Because atheism does not give you anything to base it on. But that is actually error on his part that he thinks atheists base their moral code on their atheism. Unlike many religious people atheists are not solely defined by them being atheists. Atheists can be humanists, communists, ..... and derive their moral codes from elsewhere, not from their atheism. And they can have absolute moral codes just as easily. Most Atheists are not true Atheists. They use that as an umbrella term to say that they do not believe in god. Personally I am a Humanist and I believe that people don't need a god to tell them to do right or they are damned for all eternity. Instead that they do right and good deeds because its the RIGHT thing to do as a human and as a part of a society for the good of the greater whole. People are foolish to think that you need a greater power to set a standard and instill fear for you to treat your fellow humans the way you want to be treated. | ||
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Dagobert
Netherlands1858 Posts
On May 27 2011 23:48 Syben wrote: Most Atheists are not true Atheists. They use that as an umbrella term to say that they do not believe in god. Personally I am a Humanist and I believe that people don't need a god to tell them to do right or they are damned for all eternity. Instead that they do right and good deeds because its the RIGHT thing to do as a human and as a part of a society for the good of the greater whole. People are foolish to think that you need a greater power to set a standard and instill fear for you to treat your fellow humans the way you want to be treated. Also, I heard a lot of Scotsmen are not true Scotsmen. | ||
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MoreFaSho
United States1427 Posts
On May 27 2011 22:05 Liquid`Jinro wrote: Its not religious bigotry to lead a prayer in school. What they did AFTERWARDS might be bigotry however and is a bigger problem. I don't think leading a prayer is religious bigotry, but I'm pretty sure leaking the student's name was motivated by religious bigotry and it's pretty well established through supreme court precedence in the United States that school sponsored prayer violates the establishment clause. The actions afterwards were ABSOLUTELY RELIGIOUS BIGOTRY though. Just imagine the exact opposite. There's some mostly-atheist school that was going to have a school-wide affirmation that "god probably doesn't exist so you should go on enjoying your life". I consider that a pretty positive message, but I could certainly understand students getting offended by that. Maybe, right or wrong, that student would get offended? If the exact same thing happened to the hypothetical religious student that happened to this student there would be a much larger outcry. | ||
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redviper
Pakistan2333 Posts
Social Sciences prove again and again that devout Christians live a healthier life and that prayer has an effect. Do you happen to have a link to this study? Perhaps a peer reviewed paper in Nature or Science? Infact the only "evidence" of this travesty of science is the study in 98 by Byrd which has not been successfully replicated. | ||
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Shiragaku
Hong Kong4308 Posts
But then, at a graduation, a girl wanted to have a prayer and some father sued the school for not having toleration. What has always disgusted me about TL is that so many people believe that believe religion is the devil and the world would be better without it. | ||
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Olinim
4044 Posts
On May 27 2011 23:33 TheGiz wrote: Why are Atheists so intolerant of religion? Just shut up and look the other way and you won't cause any problems for anyone else. This kid is just being a rebellious smartass; he could have shut his mouth and said 'these people are idiots' like every Atheist does, to himself, and it would have been over and done with. Gracken you are absolutely right. No, this is absolute bull. This is a public school, it isn't harmless, what does it say when public school officials promote a certain religion further alienating kids who do not have the same view? This is not within their rights and it isn't acceptable. There is a reason for separation of church and state, no one is telling these people they can't pray to themselves, but an institution run on taxpayer money can not respect an establishment of religion. | ||
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redviper
Pakistan2333 Posts
On May 27 2011 23:52 Shiragaku wrote: I am an Atheist here and it always makes me sad when I see religious people spit on me, treat me like shit, or even spread rumors about me because I am an evil prick with no morals. But then, at a graduation, a girl wanted to have a prayer and some father sued the school for not having toleration. What has always disgusted me about TL is that so many people believe that believe religion is the devil and the world would be better without it. Even if religion is the most wonderful thing since sliced bread and praying would give everyone unicorns and puppies, having a public school endorse and support a prayer during graduation is ILLEGAL. Having the school just have a christian prayer is even worse, its offensive and insulting and also ILLEGAL. | ||
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Promises
Netherlands1821 Posts
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Olinim
4044 Posts
On May 27 2011 23:28 UkGracken wrote: I went to a catholic school all my life (had to go to church every week..), I currently don't think god exists but this is just another example of someone opposing something that wouldn't affect him in the slightest, actually no i lie, 1 miniute out of his time... what this person learnt was a valuable lesson in life its called .. "sometimes we have to do things we dont want to" thats part of being human. Now some people will say "but gracken but gracken its against the law" so is smoking weed, Statistically as far as im aware no-one has directly died from smoking cannabis but its against the law.. does that make it wrong? Conclusion : If its not negativly affecting you.. why go and mess things up for other people just because its not what you believe. If it was affecting him aka spent 30 mins doing a MASS mabye id be on his side. It can have negative repercussions on the kids there that aren't atheists, and I guarantee these idiots would sing a different tune if they had to endure an Islamic, or non christian prayer. Does it negatively affect Christians not to pray, why go and ruin this kids day by having a public prayer during graduation? Maybe if he wanted to deny them any opportunity to pray I'd be on their side. | ||
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