What are some debatable accounts of history? - Page 18

On February 11 2011 04:50 SonuvBob wrote:

Feel free to post anything about 9/11 that hasn't been posted on TL before.

Good luck.

On February 11 2011 04:47 Treemonkeys wrote:


Yes of course, you are right. Even if you don't look between the lines, just looking at the face value of what the US already admits to, fire bombing Tokyo, using atomic weapons, attacking civilian infrastructure, as well as various sanctions used to starve out opposing nations.

On February 11 2011 04:50 Sm3agol wrote:

Maybe you've missed out on all the crap Japan was doing to deserve things like an oil embargo. You know, little things like being in an undeclared war with our ally China?

On February 11 2011 04:53 Sm3agol wrote:

Because war is nice?
Wtf treemonkey, move to Russia. You seem to spend 99% of your free time discussing how much the US sucks and why its the worst country on the face of the earth. I seriously think if someone gave you an article on how the US paid Hitler $20 for every jew he killed, you would believe it without question.

On February 11 2011 04:50 Sm3agol wrote:

Maybe you've missed out on all the crap Japan was doing to deserve things like an oil embargo. You know, little things like being in an undeclared war with our ally China?

On February 11 2011 04:54 Tralan wrote:
Why arent the people saying the American government was behind the 9/11 attacks getting temp bans like the people jokingly bringing up holocaut deniers. Both groups of people are idiots, not the sarcastic people <3

Also Hitler is hated more than Stalin or Mao for a number of reasons. Firstly Hitler caused the deaths of 50 million people which from all corners of the globe. The fact that it affected America and Britain where a large amount of historians and political theorists came from meant that Hitler was vilified in the memory of western history to a greater extent. Stalin and Mao on the other hand only comitted genocide on their own people in the case of Mao, and behind the Iron curtain in the case of Stalin. The lack of any entry inot the secretive Soviet regime meant that historians were unable and some even unwilling to discover the attrocities that went on there. After WWII many academics felt that the west was indebted to the soviets and some were communists themselves.

I cant speak with the same authority on Mao since I have never studied him but I would imagine the same things apply. The secrecy of Mao's regime had a similar effect to information getting out, and not only that but no one in the west really cared about what was going on. Oriental peoples were still looked down upon by many in the west as an inferior race and few in the west were interested in an insular country that didnt pose a threat to the world like the Soviets did. They were even less important after they split from Comintern.

Also to the Mao apolagist above, by your logic a father who doesnt feed his son isnt complicit in the boys death. The regime and the secret police probably millions and by trying to create an agrarian paradice comitted genocide. The devices used are just semantics; genocide through the use of famine is just the same as genocide at the barrel of a gun. If a man creates policy that leads to the deaths of tens of millions of his people, that man is evil.

On February 11 2011 04:54 RoosterSamurai wrote:

China deserved to be declared war on.
YELLOW RIVER FLOOD (1938)

During the Sino-Japanese war, as Japanese forces moved west towards the railroad junction of Chengchow, there to meet up with other Japanese units advancing on Hankow, the Chinese Nationalists blew up the flood dykes of the Yellow River. The resulting flood inundated three provinces and forty-four counties. Between four and five thousand villages and eleven towns were flooded. A total of 3,911,354 people were displaced. Altogether 893,303 lives were lost through drowning. The Chinese Nationalists blamed this atrocity on the Japanese.

If that's not enough for you, you can brush up on your pre-Mao era Chinese history here.
http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/NOTE2.HTM

Then you'll realize that China killed, literally, more of it's own citizens than Japan ever did.

On February 11 2011 04:56 Treemonkeys wrote:


It would seem strange to me to ban people for debating history in a thread that is about debating history.

On February 11 2011 04:57 Sm3agol wrote:


I'm not saying China was guiltless, but they were our ally at the time, and Japan was clearly...INVADING THEIR COUNTRY??? I'm pretty sure the Chinese weren't blowing crap up in Japan.

On February 11 2011 04:57 Sm3agol wrote:


I'm not saying China was guiltless, but they were our ally at the time, and Japan was clearly...INVADING THEIR COUNTRY??? I'm pretty sure the Chinese weren't blowing crap up in Japan.

On February 11 2011 04:58 Tralan wrote:


Debating history, not conspiracy theories.

On February 11 2011 05:00 RoosterSamurai wrote:

The Chinese and Japanese had been at war for THOUSANDS OF YEARS prior to this. Anyone can see that the United States only allied with China to try and keep the Japanese in check (just as we've done with the South Vietnamese, South Koreans, and Afghans). If America were truly so holier-than-thou and actually cared about Human well-being they wouldn't have allied a country that killed millions of it's own citizens just because. The Chinese and Russians killed FAR MORE INNOCENTS THAN THE NAZIS EVER DID.

On February 11 2011 04:59 Treemonkeys wrote:


The point is that it was NOT presented to the american people in a way of "we had to back up our ally so now japan is retaliating". They were acting like they were completely caught off guard when in reality they were expecting if not waiting for it to happen.

On February 11 2011 04:56 Treemonkeys wrote:


It would seem strange to me to ban people for debating history in a thread that is about debating history.

On February 11 2011 05:03 Sm3agol wrote:

Maybe.............but that's hardly damning. In breaking news, the government doesn't always tell the truth. And anyone that reads anything knows that the US was very aware of the Japanese threat, but they knew that their people would never agree to a preemtive strike. So they just sat back and waited for Japan to make the first move. Not exactly rocket science or the subject of some huge debate.

On February 11 2011 04:37 PiousMartyr wrote:




That hole is NOT small. The hole is wider than the firetruck near it, and a firetruck is about 25-30 feet long. Besides, the plane traveled 310 feet through the building... most of the damage was done inside the building.

The engines on a 757 are very close to the fuselage, and the majority of the wing is lightweight aluminum and titanium. Most of the wing would have just broken up immediately when it hit the building, the fuel in the wings scorched the side of the building, but the very thin aluminum is just not string enough to punch through think concrete reinforced with steel.

Since all the weight is so localized in the middle of the plane, it makes sense that it punched a deep hole through the building rather than take down a wide area of the first wall.

The Pentagon is built to withstand bombs and attacks, a plane wing is meant to withstand air. I'd be surprised and disappointed in the engineers who designed a military building that could be brought down by hollow aluminum.

On February 11 2011 05:03 Sm3agol wrote:

Maybe.............but that's hardly damning. In breaking news, the government doesn't always tell the truth. And anyone that reads anything knows that the US was very aware of the Japanese threat, but they knew that their people would never agree to a preemtive strike. So they just sat back and waited for Japan to make the first move. Not exactly rocket science or the subject of some huge debate.