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On November 04 2010 05:57 Wysp wrote:
except the american system is fucked and governments control the cost... exactly what you are against
edit" fucked as in profits are drawn from it on mass and uncontrolled up until Obama
ohh ohhh deeeerp
Maybe it's that misshapen brain tumor that you're unable to get fixed that's hampering your ability to comprehend English.
I've already said the American system is fucked, and I happen to agree cost controls might be better than the status quo, but as I explained, the Canadian system would never happen in the US. So thanks for your useless input.
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On November 04 2010 05:59 Wysp wrote:
MY LAST POST I AM NOT READING ANYTHING ELSE.
Read into the Clinton era attempt at healthcare reform. Millions and millions spent on lobbying to crush it and the American senators and lobbyists who were the man agents were given awesome paying jobs in insurance companies after it was quashed.
have fun I got shit to do
derp
I guess you didn't hear about ACA? Your igloos don't have TV?
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On November 04 2010 05:59 Wysp wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2010 05:58 domovoi wrote:On November 04 2010 05:55 Wysp wrote:
I totally agree, our government needs to budget more money to healthcare. The costs needed will still leave us thousands per capita behind your underclass ass I have a lot of Canadian friends and family members. They are pretty poor compared to me. The median Canadian income adjusted for PPP and government benefits would be considered poor by American standards. I lied i will say on more thing hdi that is all also your economic reasoning is not actually reflecting reality. i see you know what a big mac index is but canadians are rich as fuck
HDI is a stupid, made-up stat, but even then, Canada and the US are within the margin of error that it's basically tied. Canadians are rich as fuck compared to Africans, but they're poorer than Americans. Hope you enjoy your underclass polar bear riding nation.
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Its actually a significant gap between Canadians and Americans on HDI. Also our public is wealthy than your due to disparity of wealth.
Now I'm actually gone, but I couldn't stand that I left without saying
Derp.
and i did mention the ACA, if we're speaking about same one, in passing.
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On November 04 2010 06:10 Wysp wrote:
Its actually a significant gap between Canadians and Americans on HDI. Also our public is wealthy than your due to disparity of wealth.
Now I'm actually gone, but I couldn't stand that I left without saying
I thought you left?
HDI is silly for arbitrarily weighing life expectancy equally with income when the latter is far more important when it comes to development. But anyway, no, the gap is not statistically significant.
Also, your public is not more wealthy. The top 2/3 of Americans are richer than their Canadian counterparts. This despite having far more poor immigrants.
When you control for ethnicity/nationality, the difference is even starker.
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It's hard to talk to someone who fakes having Down Syndrome at the end of every post just to remind you that they're talking down to you and aren't actually listening to anything you have to say. It's too bad this forum doesn't seem to have an ignore feature.
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Ever since people have been polling the US population around 65% of Americans have been in favor of government run health care. How come both of the political parties have been against this all these years when health care is also one of the major issues voters care about? Even now the democrats didn't reform correctly. Isn't the US a democracy? How is it possible that politicians don't listen en voters vote against their own interest?
As for those people that still like the US health care system or somehow still want to defend it; get real. People won't even believe you are serious, even if you are. So stop it already. People won't believe that they care more about your wallet then you do. In the end you are paying and not some Canadian, Australian or Swiss.
The US system is the only private system in the industrialized world. And exactly for that reason it is the most expensive. In all other western countries the government uses it's purchasing power to negotiate a lower prize. In the US this is illegal by law, yet the government does it for everything else it needs.
The system is basically deliberately not fixed to benefit the insurance and pharmacy corporations. In the US you buy an election through marketing. You don't have real elections in the US. So private industry basically buys the politicians and they just don't reform because they don't have the support to do so.
http://www.phimg.org/V2/index.php?view=article&id=246:noam-chomsky-on-health-care-reform-and-dysfunctional-democracy&option=com_content&Itemid=57
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On November 04 2010 07:53 Xtar wrote:
Ever since people have been polling the US population around 65% of Americans have been in favor of government run health care. How come both of the political parties have been against this all these years when health care is also one of the major issues voters care about? Even now the democrats didn't reform correctly. Isn't the US a democracy? How is it possible that politicians don't listen en voters vote against their own interest?
As for those people that still like the US health care system or somehow still want to defend it; get real. People won't even believe you are serious, even if you are. So stop it already.
Lobbies. Also, I didn't know any of us were defending the current health care system in all its aspects.
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I was somewhat disappointed by the results of the election. Shame to see Mark Schauer (Michigan 7th district) go, he's a great guy and his ideology I find sane for a change. I really feel like it doesn't matter who we elect into office, its the corporations and interest groups behind them that will be controlling the policy. We need some campaign finance reform before we can truly have some democratic elections.
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The US system is the only private system in the industrialized world.
Netherlands and Singapore says hi.
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Someone just told you you were wrong. You should fix your definition.
Hi back to the Netherlands and Singapore from the Netherlands.
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On November 04 2010 08:17 Xtar wrote:
Someone just told you you were wrong. You should fix your definition.
Hi back to the Netherlands and Singapore from the Netherlands.
He was wrong. In fact, many countries use private health care systems with government subsidies/requirements. I think it's more common than the Canadian and British systems, where doctors are effectively government employees.
Unless you meant something else by "private system"?
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Yes, people mean something else than you do.
Also, the Dutch system got worse by the change they did make. They privatized a part of the health care system which introduced a lot of bureaucracy and market ideology doesn't work when it comes to health care. This was both predicted by many economic studies done, like at Duke, and this is the in practice result. Dutch health care system is not a good one and not one to copy.
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On November 04 2010 08:27 Xtar wrote:
Yes, people mean something else than you do.
Also, the Dutch system got worse by the change they did make. They privatized a part of the health care system which introduced a lot of bureaucracy and market ideology doesn't work when it comes to health care. This was both predicted by many economic studies done, like at Duke, and this is the in practice result. Dutch health care system is not a good one and not one to copy.
Well, explain what you meant then when you said the US is the only "private system" in the industrialized world?
Even before the 2006 reforms, the Dutch system was a private system with public and private funding (kind of like the US!). The Duke article predicts the changes might not do well in reducing costs, but it didn't say anything about health outcomes, IIRC. As of 2009, Dutch expenditure of healthcare is 9.3% of GDP, lower than Canada and France.
Anyway, why aren't we all advocating that we copy Singapore? It spends 3.3% of its GDP on health expenditures, but its health outcomes are extremely good. It basically requires catastrophic insurance and provides some subsidies, that's about it.
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On November 04 2010 07:53 Xtar wrote:
Isn't the US a democracy? How is it possible that politicians don't listen en voters vote against their own interest?
No, it's a republic.Though it does have many similarities, it's *supposed* to be different from a Democracy like Canada. Wiki will probably do better explaining than I.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy
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On November 04 2010 07:53 Xtar wrote:Ever since people have been polling the US population around 65% of Americans have been in favor of government run health care. How come both of the political parties have been against this all these years when health care is also one of the major issues voters care about? Even now the democrats didn't reform correctly. Isn't the US a democracy? How is it possible that politicians don't listen en voters vote against their own interest? As for those people that still like the US health care system or somehow still want to defend it; get real. People won't even believe you are serious, even if you are. So stop it already. People won't believe that they care more about your wallet then you do. In the end you are paying and not some Canadian, Australian or Swiss. The US system is the only private system in the industrialized world. And exactly for that reason it is the most expensive. In all other western countries the government uses it's purchasing power to negotiate a lower prize. In the US this is illegal by law, yet the government does it for everything else it needs. The system is basically deliberately not fixed to benefit the insurance and pharmacy corporations. In the US you buy an election through marketing. You don't have real elections in the US. So private industry basically buys the politicians and they just don't reform because they don't have the support to do so. http://www.phimg.org/V2/index.php?view=article&id=246:noam-chomsky-on-health-care-reform-and-dysfunctional-democracy&option=com_content&Itemid=57
You don't even know the US is a republic...
Noam Chomsky's is a hilarious linguist. He doesn't know another language.
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On November 04 2010 15:29 maliceee wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2010 07:53 Xtar wrote:Ever since people have been polling the US population around 65% of Americans have been in favor of government run health care. How come both of the political parties have been against this all these years when health care is also one of the major issues voters care about? Even now the democrats didn't reform correctly. Isn't the US a democracy? How is it possible that politicians don't listen en voters vote against their own interest? As for those people that still like the US health care system or somehow still want to defend it; get real. People won't even believe you are serious, even if you are. So stop it already. People won't believe that they care more about your wallet then you do. In the end you are paying and not some Canadian, Australian or Swiss. The US system is the only private system in the industrialized world. And exactly for that reason it is the most expensive. In all other western countries the government uses it's purchasing power to negotiate a lower prize. In the US this is illegal by law, yet the government does it for everything else it needs. The system is basically deliberately not fixed to benefit the insurance and pharmacy corporations. In the US you buy an election through marketing. You don't have real elections in the US. So private industry basically buys the politicians and they just don't reform because they don't have the support to do so. http://www.phimg.org/V2/index.php?view=article&id=246:noam-chomsky-on-health-care-reform-and-dysfunctional-democracy&option=com_content&Itemid=57 You don't even know the US is a republic... Noam Chomsky's is a hilarious linguist. He doesn't know another language.
Am I a shitty veterinarian if I specialize in dogs? Am I a hilarious engineer if I specialize in bridges?
No. No I am not. If linguist meant, "Know many languages" such a criticism might make sense.
As for Chomsky on buying elections, I remain unconvinced.
Does money flow to a winning candidate, or does a candidate win because money flowed to him\her? It seems chicken-and-the-egg and lacking a clear answer to me. Perhaps the evidence exists and I just haven't been confronted with it.
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maliceee, don't be a liar. I never said anything about what a republic is. Just because the US has a president rather than a king doesn't mean it isn't a democracy. Apparently you think that monarchies are democracies and republics are tyrannies?
Also, you are wrong on Chomsky.
As for the elections costing money, that's because they are marketed and marketing costs money. It's no secret that huge donations come from all kinds of corporations. It's also no secret politicians act contrary to their electorate. But the most expensive marketing is not always the best one.
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On November 04 2010 15:52 Xtar wrote:
maliceee, don't be a liar. I never said anything about what a republic is. Just because the US has a president rather than a king doesn't mean it isn't a democracy. Apparently you think that monarchies are democracies and republics are tyrannies?
Also, you are wrong on Chomsky.
As for the elections costing money, that's because they are marketed and marketing costs money. It's no secret that huge donations come from all kinds of corporations. It's also no secret politicians act contrary to their electorate. But the most expensive marketing is not always the best one.
I pledge allegiance, to the republic...
i kid i kid, i could care less what you guys want to call it... i pretty much think that these loose definitions of political structure are just that.. generalizations, each country has a vastly different political structure.. instead of trying to fit it into a group, just call it "America"
I tend to think that the United States has got some stuff right, I like checks and balances, and the 3 branches of government.. I think that is a good start..., but sometimes I dislike checks and balances(when my personal agenda gets opposed :p.. im greedy like that).. but I'm pretty upset with the 2 party system which I really don't think is working well for us, and just politics and politicians in general..
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EPT
