Collateral Murder - WikiLeaks - Page 16

On April 06 2010 06:15 KwarK wrote:

They won't if they're well trained. The first page in the British Army aid memoir says "win firefight".

On April 06 2010 06:18 BlackJack wrote:


It's funny you say that because I never accused anyone of not watching the video until you accused me of not watching the video, which is pretty ridiculous since I'm the one that posted screengrabs from the video. But, sure, see things they way you want.

On April 06 2010 01:58 Southlight wrote:


*When someone is killed by a murderer*

Well, apparently they don't matter as much.

It seems like your own family is like 100 times as much worth as someone else's.

This is hypocrisy at its best and most disgusting level.

It just pisses me off to fucking hell when it's a drama when your own family gets killed by when like 1000 other people get killed it doesn't matter (to you) at all.

On April 06 2010 06:29 m0rra wrote:
What KwarK said. A civilian will try to go and help someone, a soldier will first try to clear the area, then give aid.

About the video - the soldiers were extremely trigger happy and just looking for an excuse to light something up. Misrepresenting the number of weapons (there were just 2 machineguns), shooting the van trying to help wounded people on the street, laughing at running over bodies with vehicles, denying medic aid to wounded children. I can't even understand the RPG scare by those guys. The bullets from the apache take about 2 seconds to reach the target, so that's at least 1,5 km away. RPG is a VERY unreliable weapon and you'd need to be ultra lucky to hit anything with that after 300 meters. Hitting a flying helicopter more than 1,5 km away? Seriously, not gonna happen in real life.

But the coverup is bigger than the story itself. Many high-ranked officials lying about the incident, then trying to get the video removed and now a shitstorm has erupted. Heads will roll and that lt. col. probably won't ever get full bird.

On April 06 2010 04:07 KissBlade wrote:



Iraqi's are wounding and killing their own countrymen because the US displaced the dominant majority population (the Sunni's) to put the minority faction (Shiites) in power all in the farce of democracy. Did you honestly think the Iraqi election was anything fair considering a Sunni will NEVER vote for a Shiite pres and yet the Shiites hold all the position of political power now? Honestly, learn a little bit about the situation before posting next time.

On April 06 2010 01:56 Liquid`NonY wrote:
I don't see reason for outrage here.

On April 06 2010 07:13 Z3kk wrote:
I admit I haven't actually seen the video, so I don't know the actual extent of the soldiers' disregard for civilian lives (trigger-happiness, etc.), and what I do know is drawn completely from your guys' observations.

I believe that soldiers who must consistently go out into the battlefield are impacted extremely negatively. I've read some of TIME's articles about PTSD and war in general, and a lot of those returning soldiers commit atrocious, cruel acts of crime. They are all mentally impacted, and almost all soldiers are worse off. After fighting day after day against some--mostly--unseen enemy you know to be callous and very dangerous, you probably would become quite trigger-happy and ready to shoot at anything you think could kill or hurt you or your friends, however unlikely it would appear to a "normal" American sitting in the relative comfort of his/her home.

I'm just saying. >_____<

On April 06 2010 07:24 endGame wrote:


Yes, they are put under stress. And yes, that to some degree can explain their abhorrent behavior. But just because you are capable of rationalizing the reasoning of their actions doesn't excuse their gross irresponsibility. No matter what stress they are under they are wielding immense power, the power to take one's life away. Whats more is that they have been sanctioned by the government as mentally capable of rendering the decision of who gets to live and who gets to die. A decision like that shouldn't be placed in the hands of, to be completely honest, a moronic trigger happy scumbag.

I'm just saying.

On April 06 2010 07:24 endGame wrote:


Yes, they are put under stress. And yes, that to some degree can explain their abhorrent behavior. But just because you are capable of rationalizing the reasoning of their actions doesn't excuse their gross irresponsibility. No matter what stress they are under they are wielding immense power, the power to take one's life away. Whats more is that they have been sanctioned by the government as mentally capable of rendering the decision of who gets to live and who gets to die. A decision like that shouldn't be placed in the hands of, to be completely honest, a moronic trigger happy scumbag.

I'm just saying.

On April 06 2010 07:27 Wr3k wrote:


Keep in mind its the guys job to do exactly what he did. Lets pretend for a moment that it wasn't journalists and the camera was an RPG (what the crew thought they saw). It would be grossly irresponsible for them to not fire upon these people, because with friendly ground troops in the area, you are risking our soldiers lives by not doing so.

Obviously none of this really excuses the commentary from the crew, but I wouldn't be surprised if this kind of talk among pilot/gunners isn't common. Remember that these are the same guys getting shot at on a regular basis and losing friends and family on the same soil they are flying over.

On April 06 2010 07:32 endGame wrote:


I guess I take more of an issue with the way they treat the situation than the actions themselves. And its unfortunate that the lives of those killed weren't respected by those who took them, considering they're making these decisions with such limited information.

On April 06 2010 07:19 Wr3k wrote:


Agreed, based on the video it looked as if they were carrying weapons. It's these apache pilots jobs to keep our troops safe by watching over the entire area, and blowing anyone away who is armed and looking suspicious near our ground troops. It's unfortunate that these journalists were mistaken for insurgents, but these guys were just doing their job, and I honestly have to say, if I saw what they saw, I couldn't tell you whether or not it was an RPG or a camera, and it definitely looked like some of them were armed. This situation (spotting armed people on the ground, and gunning them down) is common for apache crews, and they simply made the wrong call this time. It's war, and unfortunately this stuff happens.