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United States22883 Posts
On June 29 2008 21:29 HamerD wrote:fuck you!
They were a lot of fun, but from a design standpoint they're incredibly simple and user unfriendly games. The classes don't fit the story in D2 at all, the level designs are kinda annoying and you've got like 40 quests in the whole game. It's just one big mission for better loot. Not to mention every class reached a point where they became pretty much invulnerable to monsters, and none later than level 40. Sorc gets high enough mana regen, Barb/Zon/Druid/Assas get high enough health/mana leech, pally gets high enough hammers, Necro gets Blood Golem.
Blizzard North had the easiest job in the world because they never needed to tweak or balance anything. They could release patches every so often that would cause half the players to start over a and grind a different class, and then they could occasionally throw in a patch with new items.
PvP was the most important thing it had going for it. PvE was pretty much just about Meph and Cow runs so you could PvP better. The only thinking a player had to do in D1/D2 was theorycrafting while at work/school.
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On June 29 2008 20:01 ForAdun wrote:
When it comes to character classes I can only say that Diablo 2 failed overall. Barbarian was ok. Necromancer well... imo out of place... not again please. Amazon meh, the Rogue was much better, she had a lot more flair. Assassin WTF not copied at all ehh?! Druid LOL, write hundred times "I shall not take funny pills before designing characters". The Paladin was the only choice of all that I really, really liked, probably because he's so similar to the old Warrior.
And finally... the Sorceress... huge fail!!
I don't want that character to be female again, sorry! (Yes, that actually matters in an adventure/RPG game!) Ever since I played the original Diablo game it never felt right to play a Sorceress. The Mage with his magic robe is much more original and I also want him to be black simply because he was black in the first place. But this time please give him a black speaker! It was so obvious that a white guy spoke as the black Mage in Diablo, well at least to me. Imo the only reason they've decided to have a Sorceress in Diablo 2 was that they were pretty uncreative. They thought it would be more exciting to get Superwoman into the game and call her Sorceress. They were right... but Superwoman is always exciting, that got nothing to do with the game. Huge fail. She doesn't belong to the Diablo series.
Also don't ****ing give the Mage an orb and a shield, those orbs are SOOOOO out of place and SOOOOOOO not original it hurts my eyes when I see that! Can't you just modify staves so that they are equally useful??? Really, that can't be so hard, just use your brains!!
Blizzard should take a deep, a really deep look at the Diablo game. All three main characters gave the impression of being really tough fighters. Guys who earned their bread with their guild and maybe saved a kingdom once. Would you expect that from... a Necromancer? A Druid? An Assassin? Hell, no...
Flair is all in RPG-like games. Don't forget where the characters come from that you choose, Blizzard. Be careful and don't follow into the footsteps of modern everything-in-one RPG's that are so overloaded and so not original because you just don't have an idea what exactly is the theme. WoW for example. What the hell, half of the game is taken from other games, slightly modified and sold as new stuff. Don't fool the community! You can't!
wow...just wow.
i have never seen such a long rant over fucking diablo characters/sexes/race due to nothing other than "unoriginality"
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Looks cool. I'm digging the 3d. This is what I want from a game like Diablo anyways. It is Warcraftish but whatevs. WoW had good enough graphics for me.
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On June 29 2008 23:23 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2008 21:29 HamerD wrote:On June 28 2008 23:36 Jibba wrote:
Diablo 1/2 are awful fuck you! They were a lot of fun, but from a design standpoint they're incredibly simple and user unfriendly games. The classes don't fit the story in D2 at all, the level designs are kinda annoying and you've got like 40 quests in the whole game. It's just one big mission for better loot. Not to mention every class reached a point where they became pretty much invulnerable to monsters, and none later than level 40. Sorc gets high enough mana regen, Barb/Zon/Druid/Assas get high enough health/mana leech, pally gets high enough hammers, Necro gets Blood Golem.
How is it not user friendly? I cant really remember any interface problems i had since i changed my hotkeys...
And what do you mean none later than level 40? That point generally doesnt come till 80+ and you have to have decent gear.(except hammerdins, lvl 73 and you can do hell rushes lulz)
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I sold my soul to Blizzard for their upcoming 2 games...
They better deliver.
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Fucking morons. Respeccing is the one of the worst idea I've ever heard for the game.
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On June 30 2008 01:06 Constantinius wrote:
Fucking morons. Respeccing is the one of the worst idea I've ever heard for the game.
Yeah, I'm really not liking the idea of re-speccing... you can just build whatever and re-spec at later date... Everyone's just gonna end up with the same build as newer, more powerful builds are discovered... That's pretty fucking stupid
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On June 30 2008 00:53 decafchicken wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2008 23:23 Jibba wrote:On June 29 2008 21:29 HamerD wrote:On June 28 2008 23:36 Jibba wrote:
Diablo 1/2 are awful fuck you! They were a lot of fun, but from a design standpoint they're incredibly simple and user unfriendly games. The classes don't fit the story in D2 at all, the level designs are kinda annoying and you've got like 40 quests in the whole game. It's just one big mission for better loot. Not to mention every class reached a point where they became pretty much invulnerable to monsters, and none later than level 40. Sorc gets high enough mana regen, Barb/Zon/Druid/Assas get high enough health/mana leech, pally gets high enough hammers, Necro gets Blood Golem. How is it not user friendly? I cant really remember any interface problems i had since i changed my hotkeys... And what do you mean none later than level 40? That point generally doesnt come till 80+ and you have to have decent gear.(except hammerdins, lvl 73 and you can do hell rushes lulz)
The characters only became "invulnerable" because of dupe methods and everyone getting godlike items, the game wasn't supposed to be played that way obviously.
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United States22883 Posts
On June 30 2008 00:53 decafchicken wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2008 23:23 Jibba wrote:On June 29 2008 21:29 HamerD wrote:On June 28 2008 23:36 Jibba wrote:
Diablo 1/2 are awful fuck you! They were a lot of fun, but from a design standpoint they're incredibly simple and user unfriendly games. The classes don't fit the story in D2 at all, the level designs are kinda annoying and you've got like 40 quests in the whole game. It's just one big mission for better loot. Not to mention every class reached a point where they became pretty much invulnerable to monsters, and none later than level 40. Sorc gets high enough mana regen, Barb/Zon/Druid/Assas get high enough health/mana leech, pally gets high enough hammers, Necro gets Blood Golem. How is it not user friendly? I cant really remember any interface problems i had since i changed my hotkeys... The set stat and skill points. I never had a problem because I'm not retarded, but that's the sort of thing that drives casual fans away. It also meant most people never tried all the non-cookie cutter builds unless they tried it with a trainer first. The inventory was also a pain in the ass by today's standards and transferring items sucked.
Honestly, I'm against skill respecs but only because leveling in D2 was fairly easy for a hc player.
And what do you mean none later than level 40? That point generally doesnt come till 80+ and you have to have decent gear.(except hammerdins, lvl 73 and you can do hell rushes lulz)
Maybe with your first character, but after that it became pretty easy. Until they nerfed WW in favor of frenzy (which took FOREVER), as soon as you started getting into positive damage multipliers with it and had 8%+ life/mana leech you were fine. Elemental damage could still suck, but that's not really an issue until Meph's Lair.
I don't want to describe each class's op build, but I guess it really depends on what period of the game you're talking about. Everything was pretty damn standard until LoD finally came out, and even after that the basics stayed the same. Monsters were super, super easy in that game with possible exception of the Hellsmith and 3 barbs.
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United States22883 Posts
On June 30 2008 01:23 Puosu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2008 00:53 decafchicken wrote:On June 29 2008 23:23 Jibba wrote:On June 29 2008 21:29 HamerD wrote:On June 28 2008 23:36 Jibba wrote:
Diablo 1/2 are awful fuck you! They were a lot of fun, but from a design standpoint they're incredibly simple and user unfriendly games. The classes don't fit the story in D2 at all, the level designs are kinda annoying and you've got like 40 quests in the whole game. It's just one big mission for better loot. Not to mention every class reached a point where they became pretty much invulnerable to monsters, and none later than level 40. Sorc gets high enough mana regen, Barb/Zon/Druid/Assas get high enough health/mana leech, pally gets high enough hammers, Necro gets Blood Golem. How is it not user friendly? I cant really remember any interface problems i had since i changed my hotkeys... And what do you mean none later than level 40? That point generally doesnt come till 80+ and you have to have decent gear.(except hammerdins, lvl 73 and you can do hell rushes lulz) The characters only became "invulnerable" because of dupe methods and everyone getting godlike items, the game wasn't supposed to be played that way obviously.
It helped, but wasn't necessary for Amazon/Druid/Necro. Obviously Sorc got a huge boost from it as did Barbs when 90% were all using the same duped -40 lance.
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D2 wasnt always that ez, as u said it depends on what patch of the game u are at.
Duriel used to have ice AND fire immune, that fucks all the sorcs
Hellsmith used to have tele. Whenever he gets low, he will tele and regen to 33% hp. he was practically immortal.
Nithlaka used to have 100% corpse explosion in hell with minions over 4k hp. 3 explosions will kill your entire party. Considering Nithlaka was a mandatory quest, attempts at killing him without a necro/paladin in your party is suicide.
Hell difficulty in D2 is still pretty hard unless you have inventory of dupes. If you ever own a piece of equipment that has an hr in it or worth its equivalent, its prolly duped.
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On June 29 2008 23:23 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2008 21:29 HamerD wrote:On June 28 2008 23:36 Jibba wrote:
Diablo 1/2 are awful fuck you! They were a lot of fun, but from a design standpoint they're incredibly simple and user unfriendly games. The classes don't fit the story in D2 at all, the level designs are kinda annoying and you've got like 40 quests in the whole game. It's just one big mission for better loot. Not to mention every class reached a point where they became pretty much invulnerable to monsters, and none later than level 40. Sorc gets high enough mana regen, Barb/Zon/Druid/Assas get high enough health/mana leech, pally gets high enough hammers, Necro gets Blood Golem. Blizzard North had the easiest job in the world because they never needed to tweak or balance anything. They could release patches every so often that would cause half the players to start over a and grind a different class, and then they could occasionally throw in a patch with new items. PvP was the most important thing it had going for it. PvE was pretty much just about Meph and Cow runs so you could PvP better. The only thinking a player had to do in D1/D2 was theorycrafting while at work/school.
Obviously you are one of the minorities.
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United States22883 Posts
Yeah, but Sorcs had a long ass time when Static Field was the most overpowered thing in the game. It took them way too long to add cooldowns.
Obviously you are one of the minorities. In what way? I'm sure 3 will be a lot of fun just like the other 2 were. I'm saying people shouldn't complain about unoriginal design or lack of innovation, because nothing in the series has ever been about intelligent gameplay. It's a dirty and addictive hack and slash game.
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From your original post, you said D1/2 were awful.
That is what I mean you are one of the minorities.
You already pointed out the "addictive hack and slash" part, and that is exactly one of the main reasons why people love the game.
I for one, want to destroy things; So as many million others.
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Anyone who says Diablo 2 has scarier atmosphere than Diablo 1 obviously has not been stun-locked to death by goatmen.
Also Diablo 1 Succubi > LOD Succubi
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wanna know why my name is evanthebouncy? I started w/ leap/doublethrow barbarian...
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On June 30 2008 01:34 dybydx wrote:
D2 wasnt always that ez, as u said it depends on what patch of the game u are at.
Duriel used to have ice AND fire immune, that fucks all the sorcs
Hellsmith used to have tele. Whenever he gets low, he will tele and regen to 33% hp. he was practically immortal.
Nithlaka used to have 100% corpse explosion in hell with minions over 4k hp. 3 explosions will kill your entire party. Considering Nithlaka was a mandatory quest, attempts at killing him without a necro/paladin in your party is suicide.
Hell difficulty in D2 is still pretty hard unless you have inventory of dupes. If you ever own a piece of equipment that has an hr in it or worth its equivalent, its prolly duped.
Okay I think people are exaggerating the duping some... yes, it was awful in 1.11a and before, but with the release of 1.11b it fixed some of the duping methods, especially the commonly known ones. After the prices returned to normal a few months after the reset, you can see that the high runes were worth about 20x as more than they were in the previous patch.
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The biggest problem I had with the past Diablo games was the lack of a substantial endgame. Diablo II pretty much consisted of running Baal and Mephisto over and over to gain levels and gear. I spent as much time watching TV as I did looking at the screen.
Diablo 3 should take some ideas from World of Warcraft. Imagine instances and raids but with fewer people and fast-paced gameplay. An Arena system with lots of cool game modes would be great, too.
Think of Diablo with the multiplayer from Nox. It would be awesome.
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Uhm i thought D2 was challenging enough. I played a single player Barbarian, and without leet gear the game is tough until the end. The stormshield dropped for me, but that and some lower level runewords were all the good gear i had. At lvl 85, Baal still took quite a while to beat (plus like two full inventories of pots).
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United States22883 Posts
On June 30 2008 01:56 Fishball wrote:
From your original post, you said D1/2 were awful.
That is what I mean you are one of the minorities.
You already pointed out the "addictive hack and slash" part, and that is exactly one of the main reasons why people love the game.
I for one, want to destroy things; So as many million others.
I think you only read what HammerD quoted.
"Diablo 1/2 are awful, user unfriendly linear games with a community full of scammers, cheaters and assholes, and the entire thing combines to be incredibly fun and addictive.
This is like complaining that there's not enough wholesome/kid-friendly stuff to do at a dog racing track."
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EPT
