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Slydie
1919 Posts
Dune 2 was the first modern RTS afaik, released before Warcraft: Orcs and Humans. Minimap, resources, tiers, counters, base building... it was all there! The controls were super clunky, though, with units moving one square a time and no group selection (I believe this was fixed later). It heavily inspired SC too, with 3 factions in space using slightly different technologies. It started it all, I think all RTS fans should try it. | ||
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Spirral
62 Posts
On August 27 2024 17:48 Slydie wrote: Dune 2 was the first modern RTS afaik, released before Warcraft: Orcs and Humans. Minimap, resources, tiers, counters, base building... it was all there! The controls were super clunky, though, with units moving one square a time and no group selection (I believe this was fixed later). It heavily inspired SC too, with 3 factions in space using slightly different technologies. It started it all, I think all RTS fans should try it. I think the original poster meant then new Dune: Spice Wars, which is blend of RTS and 4X (?). Haven't played it yet though, but it's 45% off on Steam right now. BTW, just got an email from Steam: Northgard 75% off  I might finally try it today. | ||
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gTank
Austria2564 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25333 Posts
On August 27 2024 20:31 gTank wrote: Dune Spice Wars is a lot like Northgard but not in a bad way. Lots of fun, I would suggest watching Grubby try to learn the game. I hope it develops a pro scene, with a few prominent ladies in it so we can just call them Spice Girls | ||
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gTank
Austria2564 Posts
On August 27 2024 20:37 WombaT wrote: I hope it develops a pro scene, with a few prominent ladies in it so we can just call them Spice Girls GET OUT XD (i spilled my tea on my desk because of you....) | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16710 Posts
As noted, both Dune and Northgard are deeply discounted as the new games 9 Bit Armies and Age of Mythology are being released. Northgard is something like $7. | ||
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Spirral
62 Posts
On August 27 2024 23:25 JimmyJRaynor wrote: Perhaps the RTS publishers time their discounts together when a new RTS game comes out in an attempt to under cut it? As noted, both Dune and Northgard are deeply discounted as the new games 9 Bit Armies and Age of Mythology are being released. Northgard is something like $7. Yep, that's a good observation. It seems to kind of work because I was considering buying AoM on release day (a week from now?), but now I may postpone it if I end up enjoying Northgard, which was on my wishlist for a long time now. | ||
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RogerChillingworth
2869 Posts
SG will have an editor so in my imho that should be the current priority in addition to building an in-client social function for when it arrives. Could turn the game around and be quite a bit of fun depending on the energy level of the modding community. I do not have high expectations for 3v3 atm. | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16071 Posts
On August 28 2024 10:49 RogerChillingworth wrote: I tuned into like 10 seconds of an AoM stream and lolll it looks so bad. Like just visually, I went blind. SG will have an editor so in my imho that should be the current priority in addition to building an in-client social function for when it arrives. Could turn the game around and be quite a bit of fun depending on the energy level of the modding community. I do not have high expectations for 3v3 atm. It looks like a high resolution version of the original game. Which is exactly what it was supposed to look like. They could have gone the Warcraft: Reforged route and done a complete overhaul that not only looks worse than the original game but also ruins the gameplay by not being able to differentiate between unit types. That would have been much worse. They played it safe with the aesthetic and I for one am glad they did. | ||
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RogerChillingworth
2869 Posts
Simple remasters are better i agree. Not to get too off topic but WC3 Reforged actually only removed the shit people liked, e.g. old BNet. And added nothing of value. Actually just the most insane thing. I think I blocked it all out of my mind to avoid a life-long crippling depression. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25333 Posts
On August 28 2024 12:33 Vindicare605 wrote: It looks like a high resolution version of the original game. Which is exactly what it was supposed to look like. They could have gone the Warcraft: Reforged route and done a complete overhaul that not only looks worse than the original game but also ruins the gameplay by not being able to differentiate between unit types. That would have been much worse. They played it safe with the aesthetic and I for one am glad they did. Reforged was just a bizarre fuckup of a project. Overhaul the graphics stylistically, something a lot of folks didn’t really actually want, then don’t port a metric fuckton of basic features the original had. It’s rare indeed a game release genuinely saddens and angers me but fuck me that was definitely one such occasion. I’m actually pretty pumped to play AoM, outside of maybe an evening or two at a friend’s I’ve somehow never really played an AoE game, is it a good intro/representative of how the rest of the series plays? Ancient Gods is just cool, plus aside from a brief period where seemingly every RTS was trying to bottle what WC3 did, since then it feels heroes are a bit unexplored | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25333 Posts
On August 28 2024 12:42 RogerChillingworth wrote: sorry, i tuned into Beasty's stream only and he might've been playing on potato settings. totally random comment by me, take it with a grain. I'm not an AoM guy. It just looked like someone dropped a cheesecake, for the brief second i was there. Simple remasters are better i agree. Not to get too off topic but WC3 Reforged actually only removed the shit people liked, e.g. old BNet. And added nothing of value. Actually just the most insane thing. I think I blocked it all out of my mind to avoid a life-long crippling depression. It’s genuinely terrifying that I was typing out pretty much the exact same post in parallel with you, just worded differently. I’m not sure I want to start developing psychic links with TL users :p | ||
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CicadaSC
United States1715 Posts
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Tal
United Kingdom1015 Posts
On August 28 2024 13:57 CicadaSC wrote: well... stormgate player count has dipped into the 400s... i guess the play is to just wait until 1.0 huh? its very worrying to me it hasn't stabilized yet. There just isn't much to play right now. As I've played more I've realised that by any metric, the game is in alpha. Campaign is short and terrible, Co op is fun but only with two IRL friends so can only do that now and then (plus not much content), and they are moving way, way too slowly to fix all the problems with 1vs1. Current patch just isn't fun - all the mirrors are atrocious, dogs are ridiculous, and as you play more the pathing becomes more and more annoying. Don't have to wait until 1.0, but at the least, see if the team can conjure up great updates in the next couple of months. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16710 Posts
On August 28 2024 13:57 CicadaSC wrote: well... stormgate player count has dipped into the 400s... i guess the play is to just wait until 1.0 huh? its very worrying to me it hasn't stabilized yet. you are worried? there are 87 bazillion ways to have fun in your spare time. pick one man! Its unfortunate this project is not succeeding. However, this isn't some horrible apocalypse. There are all kinds of great RTS games out there. Just pick one. https://old.reddit.com/r/Stormgate/comments/1f30uvz/stormgate_is_boring/ Units slowly gnaw away at health bars until one side has more and the other has fewer. That's it. I'm not asking for SC2 speed, but I definitely don't want to play Command and Conquer: Spreadsheets. This is hilarious. A common complaint is that SC2 combat was too fast and cut throat. Now Stormgate has longer TTK and everyone thinks that is boring. At least Frost Giant employees have time to make bogus "corrections" about Rock Climbing Walls on reddit. LOL https://old.reddit.com/r/Stormgate/comments/1f2qj0y/neuros_take_on_stormgate/lk9iwwm/ This is nasty. | ||
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CicadaSC
United States1715 Posts
but who knows. maybe they will have a FF14 moment. FF14's initial launch was a disaster and they completely revitalized it. they scrapped everything and started fresh basically. If frost giant sees this... i recommend you give this video a watch. watch from 8:00 if you are nitpicky and only want to see the most important part. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16710 Posts
I say, let 'em execute their vision and evaluate it later. On August 28 2024 14:22 CicadaSC wrote: but who knows. maybe they will have a FF14 moment. FF14's initial launch was a disaster and they completely revitalized it. they scrapped everything and started fresh basically. If frost giant sees this... i recommend you give this video a watch. watch from 8:00 if you are nitpicky and only want to see the most important part. due to the politics of making a video game in California can they get their guys to keep on crunching after they just finished crunching out the EA release? In New York you can crunch your staff into sawdust. Not so on the golden coast. Those days are long over. Paula Cole sang it best... "where have all the cowboys gone?" Also, with the Sag AFTRA thing.. how will they do voice acting in their campaign? They already pledged allegiance to that union. Western studios are getting buried... | ||
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Hider
Denmark9384 Posts
On August 28 2024 14:13 JimmyJRaynor wrote: https://old.reddit.com/r/Stormgate/comments/1f30uvz/stormgate_is_boring/ This is hilarious. A common complaint is that SC2 combat was too fast and cut throat. Now Stormgate has longer TTK and everyone thinks that is boring. This is nasty. This isn't surprising. As I wrote over 2 years ago, if they make the game slower, they need to compensate by having more impactful abilites in the game. And wasn't this clear to most of us after early gameplay was revealed? The gameplay was meh? If there is any learning to come from this (and the future failures of the other RTS that is following a similar formula) - don't take Sc2 and make it slower. If you want a slower game, fine, but then you need to rethink completely how micro is supposed to work. Game-designers need to start with micro, make micro feel awesome and rewarding. If you can't nail that your game is DOA. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16710 Posts
On August 28 2024 14:59 Hider wrote: Game-designers need to start with micro, make micro feel awesome and rewarding. If you can't nail that your game is DOA. ya, true. and this does not just apply to RTS but most other game genres. Basic second-to-second combat has to be good. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9384 Posts
On August 28 2024 15:02 JimmyJRaynor wrote: ya, true. and this does not just apply to RTS but most other game genres. Basic second-to-second combat has to be good. Yes ,but in other genres, I think game-designers genereally tend to get that (?) I feel in RTS, game-devs focusses on the wrong things and doesn't get what really matters. I look at Immortals Gates of Pyre, the graphics start to look good, the sound and they appear to focus a lot on lore and how to further expand it to more races.. But then you watch battles and they bore you to death. Zerospace is trying to be a bit more creative - but battles still seem boring there. Battleaces is fast so like Sc2 so the game still kinda works without more complex micro-interactions, but I am still reasonably confident players will get semi-bored after a while. Personally, I would be okay with a modern take on Wc3. Although what I prefer is a faster-pace game (close to Sc2-speed), but with a much larger natural defenders advantage, significant easier macro and more fighting over territories. No races but you can choose between different units prior to the game. Imagine Battle Aces but if it wasn't a micro-arena and with more creativity/micro-potential in terms of unit-design + static defenses and larger defenders advantage. | ||
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