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On August 16 2014 22:02 Doublemint wrote:
man hoped for a better game there by Epsilon. It's almost as ugly as VP vs. IBP there on Inferno.
It was on cache.
On August 16 2014 21:28 MyrMindservant wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2014 20:59 Zergneedsfood wrote:On August 16 2014 20:57 Kotreb wrote:On August 16 2014 20:21 Zergneedsfood wrote:On August 16 2014 20:09 Numy wrote:On August 16 2014 19:58 Kotreb wrote:
I don't know if it has been discussed before, but what do you guys feel about bo1 format? It's shit and has always been shit. Kind of a necessary evil though. :/ Well i think there are better ways to solve the time problem. This way you play 2 maps and boom, you're gone. Doesn't benefit anyone i think. What teams have dropped out that didn't deserve to advance to the quarters over any other team that's there? That's the point: we do not know. BO1 is a terrible way to decide which teams are better, it has been proven many many times that BO1 matches can't be used as a good indication of teams' skill. On top of that, they also added a random map selection system which only exacerbates the issue. And if that wasn't enough, they also forced teams to play new untested maps on a short notice, so teams didn't have enough time to properly prepare.
So what's the alternative? If they have a short tournament, they don't have the time to do extensive round robins where each group plays each other twice or bo3 formats.
You can criticize it, but at the end of the day, what's the better option here?
I like double elim brackets though.
And I think we do know. The teams that made it out are better. I don't think a single team that dropped out deserved to make top 8. I can't name a single one.
On August 16 2014 21:23 Kotreb wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2014 20:59 Zergneedsfood wrote:On August 16 2014 20:57 Kotreb wrote:On August 16 2014 20:21 Zergneedsfood wrote:On August 16 2014 20:09 Numy wrote:On August 16 2014 19:58 Kotreb wrote:
I don't know if it has been discussed before, but what do you guys feel about bo1 format? It's shit and has always been shit. Kind of a necessary evil though. :/ Well i think there are better ways to solve the time problem. This way you play 2 maps and boom, you're gone. Doesn't benefit anyone i think. What teams have dropped out that didn't deserve to advance to the quarters over any other team that's there? I did not say that the exits were undeserved. I am talking about that there is an elemnt of chance involved there (which imo should not be present in the 250k tournament) and teams like wolf or similar don't get almost any experience.
I mean...almost any sports tournament has some element of chance and often times have even greater prize pools, and I don't think that element of chance is so unjustified that people have to say that it's the worst thing ever.
Sure Bo1s are toss ups because it's easier to gauge which team is better when you play a longer extended series, but then again, the more prepared team is obviously going to win the Bo1s. Plain and simple.
To make a case study: NiP have always been shit in group stages. They legit do not play well in groups and sometimes scrape by (see Gfinity for instance). Those are Bo1s, but they're also the most consistent team in CSGO history. If the chance was so bad, then why haven't NiP been knocked out of numerous majors because of how badly the Bo1 fucks up people's chances?
I'll agree the Bo1 format is not particularly favorable, but what tournament has robbed a team that deserved to go further?
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It was on cache.
I am aware. I mean just how dominant one team is playing.
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Ah okay. Was just a grammar thing.
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2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
On August 16 2014 20:08 MyrMindservant wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2014 19:47 Souma wrote:
Na`vi are so retarded. They threw Inferno so hard and then they threw the last couple rounds on Nuke. Credit to fnatic for actually capitalizing on Na`vi being dumb, but I don't think fnatic will be able to make it past semis with that showing. It looks like you are the one being dumb now, or maybe just angry. Do you know what throw is? They never had a lead significant enough to throw. Nowadays, people are spamming the "throw" word without even realizing what it means. Also, if you are new to CS, different teams are good at different maps. And maps usually give advantage to one of the sides, CT or T. Inferno is Fnatic's best map and it is a CT-sided map. It's not a surprise that they came back and won after switching sides. Nuke is Na'Vi's worst map. They had to play it because of Valves random map selection process and actually did better than anyone could expect from them.
Are you an idiot? Na`vi was up 9-1 on Inferno - if they didn't let up and start playing like idiots just because they had a huge lead they woulda 2-0'd fnatic and it woulda been done. As far as Nuke is concerned, they could have at least tied it if they just stuck together last round instead of trying to 1v1 flusha twice. That's what you call a throw - when you know, throw your chance at winning. You can throw individual rounds just like you can throw entire games (they did throw Inferno if you actually watched their play after the 10th round).
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On August 16 2014 22:22 Souma wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2014 20:08 MyrMindservant wrote:On August 16 2014 19:47 Souma wrote:
Na`vi are so retarded. They threw Inferno so hard and then they threw the last couple rounds on Nuke. Credit to fnatic for actually capitalizing on Na`vi being dumb, but I don't think fnatic will be able to make it past semis with that showing. It looks like you are the one being dumb now, or maybe just angry. Do you know what throw is? They never had a lead significant enough to throw. Nowadays, people are spamming the "throw" word without even realizing what it means. Also, if you are new to CS, different teams are good at different maps. And maps usually give advantage to one of the sides, CT or T. Inferno is Fnatic's best map and it is a CT-sided map. It's not a surprise that they came back and won after switching sides. Nuke is Na'Vi's worst map. They had to play it because of Valves random map selection process and actually did better than anyone could expect from them. Are you an idiot? Na`vi was up 9-1 on Inferno - if they didn't let up and start playing like idiots just because they had a huge lead they woulda 2-0'd fnatic and it woulda been done. As far as Nuke is concerned, they could have at least tied it if they just stuck together last round instead of trying to 1v1 flusha twice. That's what you call a throw - when you know, throw your chance at winning. You can throw individual rounds just like you can throw entire games (they did throw Inferno if you actually watched their play after the 10th round).
Throwing games is only used colloquially to say "losing a game that should've been won". But in the real world "throwing a game" means losing a game on purpose for match fixing. Players and teams losing their cool and team cohesion falling apart is not actual throwing. If you need further explanation, people have been saying X team or Y player is throwing and the "joke" is that X or Y is playing so badly that it can only be intentional.
Alternatively the guy is just talking about the fact that 9-1 leads are turned around all the time and it can have something to do with the other team waking up to to speak.
I like how you guys call each other idiots though it's kind of endearing.
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On August 16 2014 22:04 Zergneedsfood wrote:
So what's the alternative? If they have a short tournament, they don't have the time to do extensive round robins where each group plays each other twice or bo3 formats.
You can criticize it, but at the end of the day, what's the better option here?
I like double elim brackets though.
And I think we do know. The teams that made it out are better. I don't think a single team that dropped out deserved to make top 8. I can't name a single one.
They do have a time for better format. They just don't want to use it because it would make them less profit. Or because they are stubborn, don't know for sure.
See this article for a more detailed explanation on formats and time. Lurppis may be a jerk and I disagree with him on many things, but he does have a point that they can afford a better group stage format.
Previously, during EMS Katowice, they played all of the group stage in one day, the format was the same as now. This time they had two days for the group stage, twice as much as before. They certainly could increase the number of maps played or use some other format, they just choose not to.
As for teams that deserved to make it into playoffs, this is very subjective. Nothing you say will be more "true" than what I can say and vice versa. In theory, "better" teams should advance, but it all depends on tournament format and sometimes pure luck. New maps, random map selection process and poor group stage format are all contributing to the problem here. So lets drop this silly argument.
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On August 16 2014 22:04 Zergneedsfood wrote:
Sure Bo1s are toss ups because it's easier to gauge which team is better when you play a longer extended series, but then again, the more prepared team is obviously going to win the Bo1s. Plain and simple.
You would have a point if not for the new veto system and new maps. The map played in BO1 was selected randomly from the 3 maps left. And you should know how much maps mean in CS, that random selection could change the outcome completely.
You may try to argue that teams should just ban maps they are bad at, but this is not feasible when Valve forced two new ones into the map pool just a month before the tournament.
On August 16 2014 22:49 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2014 22:22 Souma wrote:On August 16 2014 20:08 MyrMindservant wrote:On August 16 2014 19:47 Souma wrote:
Na`vi are so retarded. They threw Inferno so hard and then they threw the last couple rounds on Nuke. Credit to fnatic for actually capitalizing on Na`vi being dumb, but I don't think fnatic will be able to make it past semis with that showing. It looks like you are the one being dumb now, or maybe just angry. Do you know what throw is? They never had a lead significant enough to throw. Nowadays, people are spamming the "throw" word without even realizing what it means. Also, if you are new to CS, different teams are good at different maps. And maps usually give advantage to one of the sides, CT or T. Inferno is Fnatic's best map and it is a CT-sided map. It's not a surprise that they came back and won after switching sides. Nuke is Na'Vi's worst map. They had to play it because of Valves random map selection process and actually did better than anyone could expect from them. Are you an idiot? Na`vi was up 9-1 on Inferno - if they didn't let up and start playing like idiots just because they had a huge lead they woulda 2-0'd fnatic and it woulda been done. As far as Nuke is concerned, they could have at least tied it if they just stuck together last round instead of trying to 1v1 flusha twice. That's what you call a throw - when you know, throw your chance at winning. You can throw individual rounds just like you can throw entire games (they did throw Inferno if you actually watched their play after the 10th round). Throwing games is only used colloquially to say "losing a game that should've been won". But in the real world "throwing a game" means losing a game on purpose for match fixing. Players and teams losing their cool and team cohesion falling apart is not actual throwing. If you need further explanation, people have been saying X team or Y player is throwing and the "joke" is that X or Y is playing so badly that it can only be intentional. Alternatively the guy is just talking about the fact that 9-1 leads are turned around all the time and it can have something to do with the other team waking up to to speak. I like how you guys call each other idiots though it's kind of endearing.
The latter one is correct.
Comebacks happen all the time, it's not something new. Na'Vi had a round advantage after the first half, but they started at the strong side of the map. Fnatic are better at Inferno, so it's not surprising that they were able to come back and win after the side switch.
Calling it a throw is silly to say the least.
Also, I did not call him an idiot. I've just said that he is being unreasonable. It's not my fault that he can't take criticism and resorts to insults.
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I'm surprised this of all matches is so close. 0_o
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WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT KQLY
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DAT HEADSHOT!#mlg360noscope
And yeah, it has been really even!
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Kelly you're a fuckign legend
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Best ending ever for LDLC vs VP map1.
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Man that was one intense map.
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nice first map.
Gogo VP on mirage!
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Netherlands45349 Posts
I try to get a little bit of CSGo in(extremly fun to watch) but I thought VP were heavy favourites in that matchup?
Is there a place where I can check results, check the new maps(appearently they added 2 to the pool or something)? Also who are the favourites here, all I remember is that nip, c9, vp, navi, Titan and ibp were pretty good I think.
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On August 16 2014 23:56 Kipsate wrote:
I try to get a little bit of CSGo in(extremly fun to watch) but I thought VP were heavy favourites in that matchup?
Is there a place where I can check results, check the new maps(appearently they added 2 to the pool or something)? Also who are the favourites here, all I remember is that nip, c9, vp, navi, Titan and ibp were pretty good I think.
None of these teams are really heavily favoured in these games. Everyone can take maps off everyone else.
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On August 16 2014 23:56 Kipsate wrote:
I try to get a little bit of CSGo in(extremly fun to watch) but I thought VP were heavy favourites in that matchup?
Is there a place where I can check results, check the new maps(appearently they added 2 to the pool or something)? Also who are the favourites here, all I remember is that nip, c9, vp, navi, Titan and ibp were pretty good I think.
Scroll down for results http://www.esl-one.com/csgo/
Match line-ups (under HOT - MATCHES) http://www.hltv.org/ (this match: http://www.hltv.org/match/2292371-ldlc-virtuspro-esl-one-cologne-2014)
Favorites to win are Dignitas and VP in my opinion. Fnatic has played well too.
Oh and the new maps are Overpass and Cobblestone
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EPT
