No, you are delusional about the Heat. You seem to believe the hype that LeBron and Wade are together God's gift to basketball and to suggest that an extremely shallow team, even if they are on it, is fallible is heresy. I bring up various statistics and metrics as support for but not as the basis of my arguments, and there has yet to be a post that summarily refutes any of my theses without resorting to a fallacious argument (most commonly argument ad hominem, but there have been others).]
That is the structure of the Heat, though. Besides, the playoffs have always featured slower paces with tightened rotations. This essentially ends up giving Wade, James, and Bosh (or any top contributors for any of the other teams for that matter) more burn and less time for utility players.
You make it seem as if it's going to be an easy task to stop a team that features 3 guys who are in the top 20 of producing wins. (James with 15.6 Win shares, Wade at 12.8, and Bosh at 10.3) Their reliance on these 3 is exactly the strength of the Heat. Regardless,the Bulls are a team that's more than capable of handling the Heat, seeing as they're statistically the best defensive team in the L (and have beaten them in the season).
Now, putting win shares metrics into perspective, Miami's 3 are obviously an integral part of the team's offense (though I don't think anyone would need to point out any offensive metric to tell you that, lol). And they're not just any offense, they were the 3rd best offense (statistically) at 111.7 points per 100 possessions. That's not bad for an unbalanced team. Considering the best offensive teams in recent years have been more balanced (Lakers, Suns, Nuggets, Jazz, just to name a few) And it's not as if the team is a terrible defensive team, since they hold their opponents to 103.5 points per 100.
For comparisons sake, however, the Bulls are a better team defensively, leading the league (tied with Boston) at a defensive eff. of 100.3 points per 100. Offensively, not as stellar as the Heat, but still solid at 108.3 off. efficiency. Both teams play at a similar pace, approximately running games @ 90 possessions.
But if we must compare using this small (but nonetheless relevant) sample size of the playoffs, the Heat have posted offensive and defensive efficiencies at 108.4 and 101.7 per100, respectively. The Bulls have posted slightly better numbers, but only by really small margins: 108.6 on offense and 100.4 on defense.
Point being, I don't think it's much of a wash as you've sort of been stating it to be. It's much closer, given the consistency they've performed. That's really a good thing for all us NBA fans -- isn't it?
No, you are delusional about the Heat. You seem to believe the hype that LeBron and Wade are together God's gift to basketball and to suggest that an extremely shallow team, even if they are on it, is fallible is heresy. I bring up various statistics and metrics as support for but not as the basis of my arguments, and there has yet to be a post that summarily refutes any of my theses without resorting to a fallacious argument (most commonly argument ad hominem, but there have been others).]
That is the structure of the Heat, though. Besides, the playoffs have always featured slower paces with tightened rotations. This essentially ends up giving Wade, James, and Bosh (or any top contributors for any of the other teams for that matter) more burn and less time for utility players.
You make it seem as if it's going to be an easy task to stop a team that features 3 guys who are in the top 20 of producing wins. (James with 15.6 Win shares, Wade at 12.8, and Bosh at 10.3) Their reliance on these 3 is exactly the strength of the Heat. Regardless,the Bulls are a team that's more than capable of handling the Heat, seeing as they're statistically the best defensive team in the L (and have beaten them in the season).
Now, putting win shares metrics into perspective, Miami's 3 are obviously an integral part of the team's offense (though I don't think anyone would need to point out any offensive metric to tell you that, lol). And they're not just any offense, they were the 3rd best offense (statistically) at 111.7 points per 100 possessions. That's not bad for an unbalanced team. Considering the best offensive teams in recent years have been more balanced (Lakers, Suns, Nuggets, Jazz, just to name a few) And it's not as if the team is a terrible defensive team, since they hold their opponents to 103.5 points per 100.
For comparisons sake, however, the Bulls are a better team defensively, leading the league (tied with Boston) at a defensive eff. of 100.3 points per 100. Offensively, not as stellar as the Heat, but still solid at 108.3 off. efficiency. Both teams play at a similar pace, approximately running games @ 90 possessions.
But if we must compare using this small (but nonetheless relevant) sample size of the playoffs, the Heat have posted offensive and defensive efficiencies at 108.4 and 101.7 per100, respectively. The Bulls have posted slightly better numbers, but only by really small margins: 108.6 on offense and 100.4 on defense.
Point being, I don't think it's much of a wash as you've sort of been stating it to be. It's much closer, given the consistency they've performed. That's really a good thing for all us NBA fans -- isn't it?
The expression to say that something "is a wash" between two things is to say that it is practically even and that no marked gain nor loss can be determined by choosing one over the other so I also believe that it is very close, yes. I fully expect this to be an exciting and entertaining playoff series, barring some horrible event (injury to Rose, Wade, or James).
I didn't mean to say that it would be easy to stop them on a mechanical or execution level, but that solving the Heat offense from an X's and O's standpoint would not be difficult at all because it is so simple, i.e. Thibodeau's job in this regard is quite easy. But knowing is only half the battle, and it will be up to the Bulls to execute the defensive game plan and do their best to slow or shut down Miami's terrible trio.
Tim Duncan (4), Isiah Thomas (2), Walt Frazier (2), Hakeem Olajuwon (2), and Moses Malone (1) all won titles as the only great player on a team with a good supporting cast, to name a few. The Pistons won the title in 2005 with no great players..
Duuuuuuude, how can you take away David Robinson from two of Duncan's championship? If he's not a great player than your standards are waaaaaaay too high!
And Hakeem's second title came with Drexler on his team!
EDIT: I messed up the quote function ;D
Robinson was only good the first championship and was definitely in his late years. The second one he was a role player.
The expression to say that something "is a wash" between two things is to say that it is practically even and that no marked gain nor loss can be determined by choosing one over the other
LOL you're right. I meant to say something else. Obviously I'm a Heat fan and therefore am not very intelligent. (jokes).
The expression to say that something "is a wash" between two things is to say that it is practically even and that no marked gain nor loss can be determined by choosing one over the other
LOL you're right. I meant to say something else. Obviously I'm a Heat fan and therefore am not very intelligent. (jokes).
On May 13 2011 18:47 jmbthirteen wrote: yes, my wade/ lebron hat is on... im a pacers fan dude. i am way more unbias than you are. chicago winning would make the pacers look even better, but its not gonna happen. you said the deng/lebron match up is close. not a single person in the world who knows about the nba would agree with that. im done with this argument. you can believe what you want, but by the end of the series you will see Miami moving on to the Finals.
Well yea he is wrong about that, the matchup isn't close at all. But Deng is one of the few guys I'd ever pick to defend Lebron if my life is on the line. Sure he gets killed by Lebron at times but Lebron doesn't have it easy.
Likewise, Pierce has actually been one of Lebron's thorns for his entire career. Pierce can and has defended him well or even made him work hard on defense to try and even things out.
But the fanboyism in this thread is clouding a lot of rational thought. Miami is not worried about defending Derrick Rose as much as people think. A PG that had a 35% FG vs Indy, and 2 good games vs Atlanta that relied on penetration and not jump shots isn't going to kill them. Miami is more worried about what happens if Rose becomes a playmaker and starts shredding their help D.
Chicago on the other hand is very worried about stopping Wade and Lebron. More so Wade after watching what he did to Boston. Keith Bogans is no Ray Allen so I don't see him getting tired.
Interesting series coming up but it's closer than people think.
im lmfao at all the bulls fanboys that think the theyre gonna crush the heat. dont give me stats, did u watch the actual games during regular season? do u know how close they all were? the heat is playing even better now, with an even better starting lineup except for bibby. big z was playing more minutes and hes playing like a scrub so we got anthony in more often, miller was playing more minutes and now jones is taking up the slack since hes fucking CLUTCH, and chalmers is coming in for bibby and he is MR CLUTCH. noah was injured who cares, hes good but anthony has his fucking number dude. and lebron was out one game where they lost by three. get real, miami wins in 6.
pffft all miami needs is for wade to keep this up lebron to keep it up and bosh to not scrub it out and they should have the series with the bench doing as good as they have been. i guess results will speak for themselves
On May 14 2011 06:50 blizzind wrote: yeah it's pretty lol that bulls fanboys are using their regular season record over the heat to determine what will happen
Lol yeah because theories count more than actual games played on the basketball court. Also saying that Atlanta hawks and Indiana Pacers suck based on their regular season performance is not being hypocritical at all.
Atlanta and Indiana were terrible in the playoffs and that's where the scrutiny against Chicago comes in. They played 2, perhaps the 2 easiest opponents out of the 16 in the field and had trouble. Whereas Miami played Boston and Philly who both played better than Atlanta and Indiana. Miami looked dominant in both rounds whereas Chicago didn't. However no one should be using that as "proof" that Miami will win - just an indicator that Miami is playing better than Chicago is.
On May 14 2011 07:22 Ace wrote: Atlanta and Indiana were terrible in the playoffs and that's where the scrutiny against Chicago comes in. They played 2, perhaps the 2 easiest opponents out of the 16 in the field and had trouble. Whereas Miami played Boston and Philly who both played better than Atlanta and Indiana. Miami looked dominant in both rounds whereas Chicago didn't. However no one should be using that as "proof" that Miami will win - just an indicator that Miami is playing better than Chicago is.
I don't even
Atlanta and the Pacers weren't even arguably the two worst teams in the field
but ok
@people who lack reading comprehension: none of my posts about the Bulls vs Heat have said anything as asinine as "bulls won regular seasonz 3-0 lulz so they win playofs!" It's depressing that there isn't a legitimate Heat fan in this thread who is bringing well-thought and well-supported discussion to the table.
On May 14 2011 08:10 TieN.nS) wrote: That Memphis/KU game broke my damn heart, haha. Rooting against D-Rose this time around though!
So you're a Memphis/Miami fan??
Kings fan, nuff said right there. Good news in recent weeks of course, but still not much going on this time of year. :x
Was a big fan of D-Rose ever since I watched him beat the Jordan brothers in high school, but Wade's been my favorite player in the league since 03 and I wouldn't mind seeing him drop 34.7 on the Mavs again in an 06 rematch~
EPT
so I also believe that it is very close, yes. I fully expect this to be an exciting and entertaining playoff series, barring some horrible event (injury to Rose, Wade, or James).
