• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:17
CET 17:17
KST 01:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros9[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting10[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3
Community News
Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win52025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales!10BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION2Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams10Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest5
StarCraft 2
General
RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win Weekly Cups (Oct 13-19): Clem Goes for Four DreamHack Open 2013 revealed
Tourneys
Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia Kirktown Chat Brawl #9 $50 8:30PM EST 2025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales! Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace Mutation # 494 Unstable Environment
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Ladder Map Matchup Stats Map pack for 3v3/4v4/FFA games BW General Discussion SnOw's ASL S20 Finals Review
Tourneys
BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION [ASL20] Grand Finals Small VOD Thread 2.0 The Casual Games of the Week Thread
Strategy
PvZ map balance Current Meta How to stay on top of macro? Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
The Perfect Game Beyond All Reason Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread The Big Programming Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 2024 - 2026 Football Thread NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Career Paths and Skills for …
TrAiDoS
KPDH "Golden" as Squid Game…
Peanutsc
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1677 users

Magic: The Gathering - Page 368

Forum Index > General Games
Post a Reply
Prev 1 366 367 368 369 370 665 Next
bobbob
Profile Joined December 2009
United States368 Posts
May 04 2013 11:13 GMT
#7341
Really enjoyed the DGM/GTC/RTR draft, I was able to play a 4-color goodstuff deck, the curve of turn 2 Shambleshark into turn 4 white Gatekeeper against a slower deck is brutal. Gonna have to play it more to see just how good the format is, but the first draft was certainly enjoyable. Making 4c manabases is hard.
Risen
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States7927 Posts
May 04 2013 18:27 GMT
#7342
Idiot lgs owner did sealed for fnm, which would have been awesome had he seen fit to do 2/2/2. Nope, enjoy 6 dgm. It was a shit show. Oh, removal is nonexistent? Bummer! I won with naya splash black off two guild gates for toil and willing (16 land, 3 clue stones). I had one two drop. Opened the best bombs and won. Very unsatisfying.
Pufftrees Everyday>its like a rifter that just used X-Factor/Liquid'Nony: I hope no one lip read XD/Holyflare>it's like policy lynching but better/Resident Los Angeles bachelor
Audemed
Profile Joined November 2010
United States893 Posts
May 04 2013 20:05 GMT
#7343
6 DGM? Lol, that does sound painful! Did standard at my shop, went 4-1 with my american control (not flash, too poor), and only lost one because I totally fucked it up. Assemble the legion is amazing vs control, and Ral ults basically for free vs esper if he lands.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -George Orwell
MCMcEmcee
Profile Joined April 2008
United States1609 Posts
May 05 2013 05:51 GMT
#7344
Played Esper at FNM and went x-0, split finals. Warped Physique and Far//Away were insane all night; Notion Thief'd a big Revelation but I am not convinced that card is that great; AEtherling was quite good the games I ended up playing it. Could see making space for 1-2 Renounce the Guilds in the 75.
AEtherling is so good against midrange and control, but Esper tends to do well against those kinds of decks to begin with so I dunno how necessary it is.
[iHs]MCMcEmcee@UFO | のヮの
Audemed
Profile Joined November 2010
United States893 Posts
May 05 2013 09:48 GMT
#7345
How does esper typically deal with UWR control? I'm rather new to my american (no flash) control, and I've simply roflstomped every esper I've gone up against, so something has to be wrong with what they're doing. I even ulted ral on one on T7 last night, which was a pretty easy game ender with aurelia on the field.

OTOH, I'm dying to half the aggro decks out there still, and barely lost the one set I dropped to junk tokens. Intangible virtue makes staticasters so useless :/

Also, fun fact for the day: You can't mortar your own reckoner to deal dmg to the face, didn't even realize that until it came up and I got called on it :o
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -George Orwell
spinesheath
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany8679 Posts
May 05 2013 10:23 GMT
#7346
On May 05 2013 18:48 Audemed wrote:
Also, fun fact for the day: You can't mortar your own reckoner to deal dmg to the face, didn't even realize that until it came up and I got called on it :o

All the Overload cards restrict the target either to your own or not your own stuff. Otherwise overloaded Mortars would hit your creatures too since you replace "target" with "all" in the card text.
If you have a good reason to disagree with the above, please tell me. Thank you.
Kinie
Profile Joined December 2011
United States3106 Posts
May 05 2013 19:17 GMT
#7347
So I missed basically all of SCG's Standard event from yesterday, and I'm not gonna bother watching for Team Sealed today. After looking at the top 16 decklists and reading through some comments on Reddit, I've got a few questions.

1. Why is Deadbridge Chant spiking in price? Is it because Owen and Reid played some in their SB and Owen managed to get 2nd?

2. I knew Bant Hexproof would be a thing again, but is it worth changing around Junk Reanimator's SB to deal with it?

3. How did Ral Zarek work out in the UWR Flash deck that took third?

4. Is the Esper Control list in 10th a decent enough starting point to include in the gauntlet of testing?

Some of these questions I can probably answer if I re-watch SCG's archives, which I plan to do throughout the day, but if someone could save me some time I'd appreciate it.
MCMcEmcee
Profile Joined April 2008
United States1609 Posts
May 05 2013 19:53 GMT
#7348
Esper just waits till it has actual control of the game before it starts milling uwr. Uwr pretty much has to steal wins. Uwr improves quite a bit post-board but esper is probably still favored, just have to play patiently.
[iHs]MCMcEmcee@UFO | のヮの
Diks
Profile Joined January 2010
Belgium1880 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-05 22:21:48
May 05 2013 22:21 GMT
#7349
sry wrong thread :/
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
May 05 2013 22:30 GMT
#7350
Esper is probably underdog to UWR flash if they understand the match up, games 1 and 2+. The biggest thing for UWR is to not save their Searing Spears on their early turns, there's nothing worth saving it for. Just EoT Spear them in the face, apply pressure and go after their life points. You'll find that Esper has very little to handle the shortening of the game. If you can just keep an Augur and a Snapcaster hitting their lifepoints, even if the game goes long, if they're at low life (at 10), you can lock their Sphinx's anyways since they can't risk getting Reckoner comboed, getting burned out with Sphinx on the stack, etc.

There's really not that much play for Esper early on. The match was overanalyzed for a long time, with people trying to do cute stuff like Assemble the Legion, but it's more like just make the turn 4-6 decisions difficult for Esper, and generally UWR can come out with a win. People were saving their Spears for no real reason, where 3 to the face mattered more than 3 to an Augur.

Snapcaster/Augurs are probably your best bets because they can do enough damage to put them low before Sphinx's become back breaking, They're more or less Charm proof, and if they wrath they'll just eat an EoT Restoration hit. Stuff like that. It's kind of like get them to 15-12 or so by turn 4, then just make them respect the Angel lines and blank their Charms.

Most players don't take these lines though and want to somehow out-attrition Esper with 1 for 1s.
Get it by your hands...
Merany
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
France890 Posts
May 06 2013 18:04 GMT
#7351
Hi TL!

So, I'm gonna attend my first competitive tournament since I'm back into magic. Format is going to be Modern and I will play Affinity (was already playing affinity right before I quit back in 2005, when artifact lands were still legals, ha, good times :D).
Problem is, I have no idea whatsoever about the metagame (aside from having a look at mtgtop8 but that doesn't help me a lot).

Here is my list:
+ Show Spoiler +

Main deck :

1 mountain,
1 island,
4 inkmoth nexus,
4 blinkmoth nexus,
4 darksteel citadel,
2 glimmervoid,
4 thoughtcast,
4 memnite,
4 ornithopter,
4 vault skirge,
3 signal pest,
4 arcbound ravager,
4 mox opal,
4 cranial plating,
2 master of etherium,
2 steel overseer,
2 etched champion,
1 tezzeret, agent of bolas,
3 springleaf drum,
3 welding jar

As for the side, I have available:
2 galvanic blast,
2 spellpierce,
1 springleaf drum,
1 welding jar,
1 signal pest,
2 torpor orb,
2 shrapnel blast,
2 tormod's crypt,
1 illness in the ranks,
1 surgical extraction,
3 deglamer,
4 whipflare => ordered, not sure I'm gonna have them for next sunday



Which is, as far as I know, pretty standard, at list the main deck.
So, do you guys have any advice given the current state of modern:
- What can I tweak in my main deck to make it more robust?
- Any good idea for my side deck?
- Most importantly, what can I side against what type of deck? I have very few experience playing with side and during my tests against friends, I usually stick to my main deck, which I know is a mistake...
- General advice maybe?
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
May 06 2013 18:58 GMT
#7352
On May 07 2013 03:04 Merany wrote:
So, do you guys have any advice given the current state of modern:
- What can I tweak in my main deck to make it more robust?
- Any good idea for my side deck?
- Most importantly, what can I side against what type of deck? I have very few experience playing with side and during my tests against friends, I usually stick to my main deck, which I know is a mistake...
- General advice maybe?

Current big players in Modern you want to know about:
  • Jund (as always)
  • WUR (comes in 3 flavours: Wafo-Tapa Draw Go, Midrange Geist and Exarch-Twin Hybrids)
  • Tron (GR Ramp, Mono-U and UW)
  • Birthing Pod (Kiki Jiki and Project Melira variants)
  • Aggro (GR Gruul Zoo, Domain Zoo, RDW, Goblins)
  • Other Midrange (Kibler Big Zoo, Junk, Aggro Loam, Bant)
  • Scapeshift Valakut
  • White Lifegain (Soul Sisters, Martyr Proc)
  • Boggles (Enchantments on Hexproof dudes)
  • Combo Elves
  • BW Tokens
  • Infect
  • Gifts Ungiven (4CC Control and Combo variants)
  • Misc (GW or Mono-W Hatebears, UR Faeries, RUG Eternal Command, Merfolk)
  • Rouge (Soldier WW aggro, Cherios, Nivmagus Combo, Reanimator, Mana Tide, Superfriends, Gargageddon-Balance, Grixis Delver)


Sideboard and Deck Advice:
I don't play Affinity so I don't have a lot to say. But trying to cast both Tezzert and the burn in your sideboard seems really rough? Dunno, it seemed okay goldfishing it but not sure if you're trying to stretch the deck in too many directions? I'm not sure about the thought process behind your sideboard either. Also if you're going so many 0 mana artefacts Steelshaper's Gift for Cranial Plating number five and up might be worth a try.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
Merany
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
France890 Posts
May 06 2013 19:43 GMT
#7353
Thanks for the answer!
As far as the side go, yeah you're pretty right, there's no thought process behind it It's more or less a mix of left over cards and cards I thought "could be useful" but really, that's just me not knowing how to build and use a side...
The only opportunity I had to test the deck outside of my friends was at the DGM pre-release, the guy was playing mono white tokens / lifegain and I simply had no answer to Lingering Souls / Spectral Procession with +1/+1 enchants. So that's where the 4 whipflare come from but that's pretty much it...
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
May 06 2013 19:46 GMT
#7354
Apostle's Blessing for random Cranial Plating wins (like on Inkmoth Nexus) maybe?
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
Louuster
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada2869 Posts
May 06 2013 20:21 GMT
#7355
To be fair lingering souls is one of the strongest cards vs affinity, outside of direct hate cards like creeping corrosion or stony silence. Whipflare is definitely maindeckable if you expect to see a lot of them.
Kim Taek Yong fighting~
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
May 06 2013 21:12 GMT
#7356
On May 07 2013 04:46 MoonBear wrote:
Apostle's Blessing for random Cranial Plating wins (like on Inkmoth Nexus) maybe?


Not familiar with Modern, but seems a bit awkward since you almost always would use your Blessing first (to avoid blockers), and thus giving them a chance to respond.
Get it by your hands...
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
May 06 2013 21:21 GMT
#7357
On May 07 2013 06:12 Judicator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 07 2013 04:46 MoonBear wrote:
Apostle's Blessing for random Cranial Plating wins (like on Inkmoth Nexus) maybe?


Not familiar with Modern, but seems a bit awkward since you almost always would use your Blessing first (to avoid blockers), and thus giving them a chance to respond.

The idea in my head is that it works similar to Infect decks where you have random pump from Cranial Plating and use Apostle's Blessing to protect against removal or force against an empty hand. Etched Champion might help perhaps. BW Tokens only has Path as its instant speed removal iirc. The idea is that it's a flexible enough card that you can shore up multiple matchups with it while Whipflare is much more narrow. Maybe Echoing Truth as an alternative flex card? Dunno.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
May 06 2013 21:47 GMT
#7358
On May 07 2013 06:21 MoonBear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 07 2013 06:12 Judicator wrote:
On May 07 2013 04:46 MoonBear wrote:
Apostle's Blessing for random Cranial Plating wins (like on Inkmoth Nexus) maybe?


Not familiar with Modern, but seems a bit awkward since you almost always would use your Blessing first (to avoid blockers), and thus giving them a chance to respond.

The idea in my head is that it works similar to Infect decks where you have random pump from Cranial Plating and use Apostle's Blessing to protect against removal or force against an empty hand. Etched Champion might help perhaps. BW Tokens only has Path as its instant speed removal iirc. The idea is that it's a flexible enough card that you can shore up multiple matchups with it while Whipflare is much more narrow. Maybe Echoing Truth as an alternative flex card? Dunno.


I assume we are talking post-board games? Apostle seems a bit loose for mainboard unless you have a terrific read on the meta.
Get it by your hands...
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
May 06 2013 21:53 GMT
#7359
On May 07 2013 06:47 Judicator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 07 2013 06:21 MoonBear wrote:
On May 07 2013 06:12 Judicator wrote:
On May 07 2013 04:46 MoonBear wrote:
Apostle's Blessing for random Cranial Plating wins (like on Inkmoth Nexus) maybe?


Not familiar with Modern, but seems a bit awkward since you almost always would use your Blessing first (to avoid blockers), and thus giving them a chance to respond.

The idea in my head is that it works similar to Infect decks where you have random pump from Cranial Plating and use Apostle's Blessing to protect against removal or force against an empty hand. Etched Champion might help perhaps. BW Tokens only has Path as its instant speed removal iirc. The idea is that it's a flexible enough card that you can shore up multiple matchups with it while Whipflare is much more narrow. Maybe Echoing Truth as an alternative flex card? Dunno.


I assume we are talking post-board games? Apostle seems a bit loose for mainboard unless you have a terrific read on the meta.

Yeah, post-board as a flexible card. It only works mainboard for Infect haha.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
Judicator
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States7270 Posts
May 06 2013 21:58 GMT
#7360
Like I said, I am not familiar with the Modern scene and what cards are played, but the match up seems more problematic due to the tokens themselves and not so much the instant-speed removal, not sure how Affinity can fit through damage without exposing themselves to the aforementioned spot removal (not sure how many BW Tokens would play after board).

How's Arc Trail/Corrosive Gale over Whipflare?
Get it by your hands...
Prev 1 366 367 368 369 370 665 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
SC4ALL
14:00
SC4All Day 1
LiquipediaDiscussion
SC4ALL
14:00
SC4ALL - Day 1
Artosis735
RotterdaM505
ComeBackTV 472
IndyStarCraft 188
CranKy Ducklings116
SteadfastSC103
LiquipediaDiscussion
BSL Team A[vengers]
14:00
Day 3
Dewalt vs ZeLoT
UltrA vs ZeLoT
LiquipediaDiscussion
Epic.LAN
12:00
Epic.LAN 46 Playoffs Stage
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Artosis 735
RotterdaM 505
IndyStarCraft 188
SteadfastSC 103
ProTech55
Codebar 33
Vindicta 29
BRAT_OK 26
MindelVK 8
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 8192
Barracks 436
PianO 366
Last 171
zelot 91
Dewaltoss 88
Rock 50
ToSsGirL 28
sas.Sziky 19
HiyA 12
[ Show more ]
910 9
Dota 2
Gorgc5108
qojqva2730
syndereN225
LuMiX1
League of Legends
Reynor114
Counter-Strike
fl0m1519
PGG 85
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor360
Other Games
singsing1541
B2W.Neo1003
Lowko376
Hui .317
KnowMe133
XcaliburYe102
QueenE88
nookyyy 52
Mew2King52
Trikslyr34
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL15902
Other Games
gamesdonequick995
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 55
• Adnapsc2 16
• iHatsuTV 10
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki57
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV404
• Ler91
League of Legends
• Nemesis3600
Upcoming Events
BSL 21
2h 43m
BSL Team A[vengers]
21h 43m
Cross vs Sobenz
Sziky vs IcaruS
SC4ALL
22h 43m
SC4ALL
22h 43m
BSL 21
1d 2h
Replay Cast
1d 16h
Wardi Open
1d 19h
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
CranK Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

BSL 21 Points
BSL 21 Team A
C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
SC4ALL: Brood War
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025

Upcoming

YSL S2
BSL Season 21
SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.